Know when to hold ‘em know when to fold em

[Aggie06]

OP, I would look at the cost of replacing the transmission, rebuilding the front end, etc. when deciding if it’s worth sinking money into your truck or upgrading.

Personally, a buddy bought a 6.4 truck with a 100k on it and has put that many trouble free miles on it. He used it to pull a tractor, planter, and small plot combine.

 

[06h3]

I’m late to the party and I have seen a few “go the MDT truck route” and I say no. I’m assuming they are not talking ford/ram/Chevy MDT routes but a “true” MDT route. They will make no more power then the new trucks and weigh more so your slower up hills.

TFL truck did a video on a “true” freight liner medium duty truck and it was slower then an F450 pick up doing the same load. Sure, the brakes and suspension are better but it seems most MDT trucks are tuned for idiot employees who use the pedal as an on off switch and still make it last 500k.

Now that I’m off my MDT topic I say keep the truck, throw new turbos on it and rock out.

 

[ParadisePWoffrd]

I’d roll the dice on that. Say it ends up costing $5000 and it gets you another 50k miles you’ve done pretty good. If it goes another 100k you’ve done really good. And if it remembers it’s a 6.4 next week and blows up you’re only out an extra $5000.

Unless the turbos get trashed when it blows, you arent really out the $5k. He is currently considering replacing the engine, so you are really just out the labor to pull the turbos/pipes/cab a 2nd time to swap the engine.

Cutlerfab rebuilt a 6.4 or 2, I believe. It has been a few years, but might have suggestions on that rabbit hole and what to/not to use

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I’m late to the party and I have seen a few “go the MDT truck route” and I say no. I’m assuming they are not talking ford/ram/Chevy MDT routes but a “true” MDT route. They will make no more power then the new trucks and weigh more so your slower up hills.

TFL truck did a video on a “true” freight liner medium duty truck and it was slower then an F450 pick up doing the same load. Sure, the brakes and suspension are better but it seems most MDT trucks are tuned for idiot employees who use the pedal as an on off switch and still make it last 500k.

Now that I’m off my MDT topic I say keep the truck, throw new turbos on it and rock out.

MDT can be hotrodded just as easy, if not more easy than a pick up.

 

[Projectjunkie]

I'd go common rail cummins and not look back.



Or, since you've got some sort of ford factory racing sponsorship deal on the trailered rig, I imagine you could make a phone call to a guy that would make a couple phone calls and get you a "fair" deal on trading in that truck on something that's gonna get their race truck to the races.


I'm not saying ask for a freebie, I'm saying from their perspective, a sponsored ford on a trailer on the side of the freeway with a blown up ford tow rig isn't a good look. Or being pulled in by a fummins, or a borrowed tbi 454 gmt400 extra cab


I'm saying it's a reasonable ask

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I'd go common rail cummins and not look back.



Or, since you've got some sort of ford factory racing sponsorship deal on the trailered rig, I imagine you could make a phone call to a guy that would make a couple phone calls and get you a "fair" deal on trading in that truck on something that's gonna get their race truck to the races.


I'm not saying ask for a freebie, I'm saying from their perspective, a sponsored ford on a trailer on the side of the freeway with a blown up ford tow rig isn't a good look. Or being pulled in by a fummins, or a borrowed tbi 454 gmt400 extra cab


I'm saying it's a reasonable ask

I wonder if there would be a demo truck available temporarily? Like the ones the magazine youtube pass around.

 

[Projectjunkie]

"Hey Ford rep, so I'm planning on towing this bronco on an open trailer to the races with my six fo...."

 

[JR4X]

"Hey Ford rep, so I'm planning on towing this bronco on an open trailer to the races with my six fo...."

I don’t know who to ask. But that kind of stuff was part of the fantasy when we took on this bronco project.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I don’t know who to ask. But that kind of stuff was part of the fantasy when we took on this bronco project.

I'm starting to learn that a lot of times the people who end up with stuff just keep asking and asking until they get what they want. There is a guy like that at my work. He just got a $350k peterbuilt, then a nice aluminum deer guard, ridgid lights, highway products tool boxes. All while I'm over here debating if I should asked for a new sawzall

 

[Snowy]

I don’t know who to ask. But that kind of stuff was part of the fantasy when we took on this bronco project.

Never hurts to ask. Worst someone can say is no.

If it were my money, I’d get a 6.7 at the age and mileage like the one you linked in FL. Prices are falling FAST on steel bodied 6.7’s right now too if you’re willing to be a little patient.

I tow a gooseneck race trailer about 12-15k annually that grosses right at 26k as and am super happy with my emissions intact 2012 F350. When I’m hooked, it’s working hard enough that the DPF stays at 0% full and does not need to regen until it’s commanded automatically every 4 or 500 miles by the PCM. Bought at 61k for $37k and now at 96k, only non-routine maintenance so far has been a RF wheel bearing and a DEF doser.

I’ve come to accept after treatment being a part of owning a diesel anymore. With Forscan, issues aren’t difficult to diagnose and common parts like NOx sensors or DEF dosers are on shelves if you need them. The inconvenience of those things outweighs the penalties of being caught without emissions or being stranded out on the road with a big non emissions related issue (like a turbo) because fewer and fewer shops by the day will touch a deleted truck after the EPA enforcement push.

 

[DannyK]

Unless the turbos get trashed when it blows, you arent really out the $5k. He is currently considering replacing the engine, so you are really just out the labor to pull the turbos/pipes/cab a 2nd time to swap the engine.

Cutlerfab rebuilt a 6.4 or 2, I believe. It has been a few years, but might have suggestions on that rabbit hole and what to/not to use

Didn't he swear off diesels after that and decide to just buy big block gas powered trucks?

 

[Provience]

Didn't he swear off diesels after that and decide to just buy big block gas powered trucks?

Well, for 5k you can just drop in a whole new solid gasser rather than pay diesel premiums on stuff, so there's that.

Just gotta slow down a hair on the big grades

 

[ridered3]

Didn't he swear off diesels after that and decide to just buy big block gas powered trucks?

Yeah he swore off diesels for a long time after constant 6.0 and 6.4 issues. Last I saw him, he was using a newer Duramax as a tow rig.

 

[arse_sidewards]

most MDT trucks are tuned for idiot employees who use the pedal as an on off switch and still make it last 500k.

Now that I’m off my MDT topic I say keep the truck, throw new turbos on it and rock out.

There's something to be said for that. Nice being able to just plant your foot and not think.

 

[What?]

Hmmm

So I had a thought and followed up on it. Checked in with the service department at the local ford dealership to ask about wait times. 3 weeks before they can get any vehicle no matter who’s it is in the shop to start diagnostics. If it needs an engine, 6 months or more. If It needs a transmission it’s 3 to 4 months.

Having a warranty isn’t going to be worth a fawk right now.

I must've missed it. Thought you're going to local reputable shop instead of dealer for turbo replacement?

Wait time is nuts though

 

[ridered3]

I must've missed it. Thought you're going to local reputable shop instead of dealer for turbo replacement?

Wait time is nuts though

Think that was just an example of wait time at a dealer for Warranty work.

 

[JR4X]

I must've missed it. Thought you're going to local reputable shop instead of dealer for turbo replacement?

Wait time is nuts though

I will be taking it to a known local reputable shop.

The comparison was between fixing my old one on my own. Vs buying a new/newer one with the unrealistic expectation that having a truck with a warranty being a better option.

There’s no reason to take my old truck to the Ford dealership ever. If I was trying to use or keep a warranty with a replacement truck I’d have to.

 

[rockdog57]

It looks to me like you’ve pretty much made up your mind which way you want to go. I’d think you will get plenty more miles out of the truck you have if you don’t drive it like an oil patch truck.😜

 

[YotaAtieToo]

The wait time is absolutely ridiculous. I lost my heater on my work truck in December and the dealer still hasn't gotten the part in. Luckily it decided to start working again. My in laws exploder has been at the dealer for at least a month waiting for one idler bearing or something to replace a water pump.

Ford seems to be really bad for that right now. No idea on others.

The only saving grace would be if your dealer will issue a usable loaner. I asked the closest dealer about that when they were practically begging me to buy a newer truck from them. They told me they had a Fiesta rental that ford would cover the cost of if it was warranty work. I straight up said, "so if I buy a $40, 50, 60k truck today and it breaks down, all I get to use is a Fiesta?" they guy looked baffled that I had that thought.

 

[JR4X]

It looks to me like you’ve pretty much made up your mind which way you want to go. I’d think you will get plenty more miles out of the truck you have if you don’t drive it like an oil patch truck.😜

I think I have made up my mind. Just need some days off from destroying this work truck every day so I can get going on it.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I think I have made up my mind. Just need some days off from destroying this work truck every day so I can get going on it.

The warranty has almost no value to me anymore. It seems like stuff either breaks before like 30k miles or after 100k, so it's either suck it up and buy brand new or just bank the cash and buy with 100k miles. To me it's pretty obvious the trucks that had a super easy life to 100k, but they still drop the value, so it seems like the best bang for the buck imo.

I do think you're making a good call just tossing turbos on it. Like others said, you kinda have to in order to get anything out of it. So at least now if the truck isn't giving you the warm and fuzzy reliable feeling, you'll have a running truck to trade in or sell. Also buys you time to find the right deal.

Or even better, it runs another 100k miles

 

[DMG]

It looks like you you made up your mind but one thing i have noticed with peoples 6.0 a d 6.4 trucks is that they are fine until something goes wrong like a turbo or egr cooler. Then they always have something wrong with them until they trade them in or replace everything.

 

[Steve300xcw]

It looks like you you made up your mind but o e thing i have noticed with peoples 6.0 a d 6.4 trucks is that they are fine until something goes wrong like a turbo or egr cooler. Then they always have something wrong with them until they trade them in or replace everything.

Had a 6.0 crummy that did that. It was an awesome truck till about 170k an then you couldnt keep that thing outta the shop

 

[WaterH]

People put on rose colored glasses when they talk about the reliability of older trucks. They don’t compare new trucks to old, they compare new trucks to the old trucks that didn’t self destruct early. My granddad had a ‘90 Dodge that wouldn’t run right and then thrashed an injection pump before it hit 10k. Dodge ended up giving him a new pickup and the transmission was never worth a shit. There have always been junk vehicles. They just sell a shit load more pickups now that accountants and dentists require crew cab diesels to go to work and you hear about problems more now because of the internet.

My 2017 F350 has 278,000 trouble free miles. Did the front end around 215,000. Other than that just brakes and tires. This week I’ve driven 500 miles loaded 26k gross and 500 with the empty trailer at 15k. Last week I did a 400 at 18k, the week before that I did 250 at 30k and 250 at 15k. That’s been pretty typical since I got it in December of 2016. Before that I had a 2011 that I drove until 220,000 miles and then an employee drove to 340,000. It had a radiator problem under warranty and also a shift solenoid problem fixed under warranty. Turbo self destructed at 340,000.

I’m not sure what my point is, but people either get lucky or they don’t when a bunch of moving parts spin back and forth really fast.

I think your point is in your last line. People get lucky or they don’t with a new truck. They also get lucky or don’t with an old truck. Remember, all old trucks were new at one time. I will say two good things about old trucks.

1. You never get lucky on price of a new truck. (Even if you think you make a good deal)
2. You do have some idea of the reliability of certain things on an old truck. (Like the 6.4) We would like to think they get more reliable, but we have been proven wrong many times.

I have bought one new car in my life (Corvette) I found out that I hate all the dealers with in a 100 miles of me. You would think they would cater to a ”high end” buyer. (They don’t) The car has a transmission problem that is all over the Corvette forum. If you were to buy a used vet my model now, you could research that and buy a different year automatic or go standard. (No way to know when we bought ours)

 

[Ranchtruck]

Always another wrinkle. Not worth anything with an audible turbo leak and the check engine light saying “turbo charger boost system performance”.

It has an audible boost leak? So it may be a blown coupler not actually a failed turbo.

Also looking up those codes brings up a bunch of stuff about clogged exhaust back pressure sensor tube or failed sensor. Has the truck been properly diagnosed yet or it just lost power and you assume turbos are done?

 

[DMG]

It has an audible boost leak? So it may be a blown coupler not actually a failed turbo.

I think that code is for vane position. It sounds like the OP runs it hard enough to not stick the vanes so it may just be worn out.

 

[JR4X]

It looks like you you made up your mind but one thing i have noticed with peoples 6.0 a d 6.4 trucks is that they are fine until something goes wrong like a turbo or egr cooler. Then they always have something wrong with them until they trade them in or replace everything.

I’m not saying you’re wrong. I’ve seen that scenario play out many times. Here’s the things I’m weighing and the amount of weight those have to me. I’m not in a position to buy a brand new one right now, that’s off the table.

Buy a used truck.
Have to finance it: heavy
Full coverage insurance and taxes: heavy
Get it deleted: very heavy
Get it built for use, air bags, B&W turnover: very heavy

Fix old truck.
No payment no new tax burden
It’s already built out for the job it needs to do
for the cost of a couple years payments on a used truck I can completely rebuild this one.
The devil I know. Loved this truck the whole time I’ve had it.

 

[JR4X]

It has an audible boost leak? So it may be a blown coupler not actually a failed turbo.

Also looking up those codes brings up a bunch of stuff about clogged exhaust back pressure sensor tube or failed sensor. Has the truck been properly diagnosed yet or it just lost power and you assume turbos are done?

Sort of properly. I took it to a “diesel shop” to have it diagnosed. All they did was Dick me around for 9 days and charge me a few hundred bucks for nothing helpful.

So I took it home and did what diagnosis I could given the google searching I could. The variable vanes aren’t stuck. But the problem is with the variable van turbo. Anyone who can hear high pitch sounds can hear a whistle from somewhere. But using soapy water you can’t find a leak anywhere. So google foo has you remove the bolt from the actuator arm and at idle cycle the VVT. I can make it make the whistle sound by manually manipulating the VVT on the turbo. Whatever is leaking high pressure to low pressure is internal.

These have one fixed vane turbo and one variable vane turbo sequentially.

 

[JR4X]

I think that code is for vane position. It sounds like the OP runs it hard enough to not stick the vanes so it may just be worn out.

Definitely not stuck, see above. But some of the forums say that when that comes up it can be the actuator that is causing the problem. I know turbos live a rough life and don’t last forever.

If one has any issue I’m replacing both and the actuator while I’m at it. I think I’m going to have the turbo and actuator replaced. The boost reference sensor and line. New EGT probe. And take a serious look at manifolds and up pipes. If anything has evidence that it’s been leaking it’s getting replaced.

 

[Ranchtruck]

So the hiss is when the vanes are held in the fully shut position. Not necessarily an issue.

The codes mean it's not seeing the boost/back pressure numbers it expects for the commanded vane settings. If it's not getting good data from those sensors that can set a code with nothing mechanically wrong with the turbo.

Check the exhaust back pressure sensor line and make sure it's clear all the way through into the exhaust. One guy talked about having to ream the line out with a coat hanger because of soot buildup.