Project: I have no idea what I'm doing (Moved from p4x4)

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slobrorunner Even if the shaft wasn't getting bent, wouldn't your spring contact the tower pretty hard or is it just the view from the photo?

yep, way too far inboard to actually work. I think the main issue is that I was drinking lots of beer when I did the driver's side and was super worried about spring clearance to the caliper, so I didn't even bother to look at the shock tower. Then yesterday I copied what I did to the passenger side.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockwood If it's binding on the tabs like it appears to be: wider spacers will help.

Do they make ones that go wider than 1.5"?

 

[Sandy Johnson]

I kept hurting my brain trying to figure out how much I needed to angle my shock towers, so I finally decided to have a computer do it.

Drew existing and proposed shock towers out in FreeCAD. Looks like if I just angle both towers inward 5*, I should be good to go. Easier said than done of course. To keep my ride height, I need to move the back of the tower inboard 1.5 inches and up 1 inch on both sides.

Black lines are the existing tower, green are new angle, blue is shock fully compressed and extended, and red lines are the minimum distance I need to have from the back of the shock tower to the centerline of the shock.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockwood Well, now you get to fire one back to your JK buddy...

True. Except I'm way too lazy to try and take the whole tub off first, so it's not going to be as impressive of a pic.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Hackery happened last night.

I don't want to make a new cross-member wit body mounts because I'm lazy, but to get my shock towers in far enough, I'm going to have to cut the section of the frame that it connects to out.

I decided I would try to make it temporarily float there with a couple piece of scrap tubing while I cut the frame out and put the shock towers in place:

Earlier in the day I also was reminded that apparently my kid is watching everything I do. Trying not to cuss is the hardest part.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

I went full retard last night and cut the frame out on one side to french my towers in at a 5-degree angle rather than straight up and down.

Rocking this out solo, it turned out that holding the tower in place at the correct angle while tacking it was not going to happen. Dang thing is heavy and the difference between 0 degrees and 5 degrees is a slight twitch of my arm. I stood back staring at it with my mouth open until I had an idea.

Perfect. I jimmy-jacked around with the whole thing for a bit- moving hoist back, whacking it in place with a large hammer, etc until finally...

Perfect. Somehow my math had paid off and everything was sitting flush at 5.5 degrees AND the shock eyelet was in the same location that I had it when everything was straight up and down. Ride height will stay the same!

I tacked that bitch in place and called it a night.

Here's what the other side that I still need to change looks like for comparison:

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockwood What's the plan for gusseting the frame? Cracks like vertical joints.

I was thinking about that as I cut my nicely fishplated frame extension ends off.

Probably going to do the biggest gussets I can to the shock tower. Either make some out of the old shock towers I botched up, or just get lazy and order genright's:

https://genright.com/products/1-4-th...sset-pair.html


I guess also, technically they're not completely verticle what with the tower angling in, but I need to figure out something.

I think I also want to try and make some sort of gussett that will go across the inside of the frame, across the tower and onto the cross member upfront. We shall see how industrious I get.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Got the other side done over the weekend. I was able to used my cardboard aided drafting file in the garage from the driver's side and copy what was happening for the passenger side:

This side actually went faster since I had the numbers from the other side.

Got everything in and was able to cycle the suspension. Finally clears!

...just barely

I'm a little sketched out on how the whole back half of the jeep depends on my ability to put some strong welds on those shock towers. I'm going to make some creative gusseting from the frame to the tower to the crossmember upfront, and also throw some genright gussets on the towers(just ordered them this morning). I can't do much from the cross-member to the back part of my frame since I still need to fit a gas tank there.

Next up I'm going to pull everything off, clean it up, and do final welds on all my link brackets and shock towers.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

After realizing that my new REALLY frenched in shock towers were going to be a major structural piece of the entire back of my jeep, I decided it's probably a good idea to get someone who actually welds for a living to do it right.

I have a buddy who does just that, I called him up Friday and he told me he'd be over the next day. Oh shit, I guess I better pull everything out and prep it for him.

Once we were good to go, he came by and busted out some hard to reach welds like it was no big deal. I even saw him do one left-handed like it happens all the time.

While he was under there, he noticed I hadn't done my frame side control arm brackets, so he busted those out too. Purty

Afterwards, my hack self welded some gussets on and painted everything. (Don't look too closely at those welds. I have no idea what I'm doing

)

After that, I figured since I've got everything out of the way down there, it would be a good time to start fitting up my genright gas tank. It's sitting a little low because the forward bracket on the passenger side was hitting the stock cross member a little bit. No big deal, going to notch that out with grinder tonight.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slobrorunner I think you've done what you can. If you were really concerned I'd maybe reconsider your cage being mounted with bushings and make a cage tube hit behind the shock tower and in front.

What's the pros/cons on that? I see a ton of people running with no bushings, and then I see just as many with bushings. Is there more vibration? Does it make my crappy old body mount bushings pointless? In all honesty, my life would be easier if I could just slap some tube in there and stop worrying about bushings and brackets.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by YJUnlimited If you solid mount then solid mount every attachment point. If not you will have a stress concentration at the solid ones because the bushed ones can move.

I'm much too lazy to redo all my body mounts. Bushings it is

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by YJUnlimited I meant the cage mounts. If you solid mount the cage in 6 points it will be fine.

Ah, I see. Wouldn't that just make the cage the new body mounts?

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gt1guy Are you going to keep the basic shape of your cage from the B-pillar back? As in the above pic? Run a bar from the B straight back to the C, on each side, that goes over the shock tower. Then just drop a bushed connection on top of the tower.

Good call. B to C on each side was in the plans, had not thought about connecting to shock tower. It's going on the to-do list.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Still screwing around with the TJ genright tank.

Got the new fancy fuel pump in

But ran into a small issue with it. I'm using the genright automotive adaptor, with a genright tank and automotive fuel pump. Bought everything from genright, so they're all supposed to work together.

The inlet, outlet, and vent all use AN-6 fittings. Only problem is, AN-6 fittings won't thread in without hitting the stock TJ ring

I noticed there was a groove cut into the adaptor plate and that my ring doesn't line up with it at all. Wondering if I need a different ring, or a different plate. Sent something to genright, waiting to hear back. You can seen on the pic below where the clean spot on the plate is vs where the little step is cut in

Meanwhile, I got back to cutting things off the frame to get my tank to fit up. Looks like I just about got it

Super close, but it works

Aaaand I ran out of time for the weekend because toddler.

Next up will be to drill some more holes in this poor frame

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by the freeak Is that fuel pump manifold a new option for Genright's tanks? Overall looks good.

It's part of an aeromotive in tank solution. Not sure if you can order it on its own, but it does have a part number on it if you want me to send it your way:

https://genright.com/products/aeromo...le-system.html

Genright makes this plate to adapt areomotive's stuff to their tank:

https://genright.com/products/aeromo...p-adapter.html

Looking around, it appears that maybe I need genright's fuel pump ring?

 

[Sandy Johnson]

So I talked to the folks at genright. It turns out that aeromotive adapter plate is made for new LJ and JK tanks and was never supposed to fit my tank. It's always something

To quote the genright dude: "You missed it by thaaaat much".

I decided I didn't want to miss it and I'm lucky enough to live somewhere that I get stuff from summit next day, so I ordered up a small collection of their AN-6 fittings to see what I could make work. Here's where I ended up:

45* male to female AN-6. I tried one from the summit brand, and two others, and this was the only one that threaded around just enough to tighten down AND clear. For those looking to follow in my dumbass footsteps(I don't recommended it), it's a Vibrant Performance Union Fitting 10772. Summit's part number is: VPE-10772. From there I threaded on a AN-6 to AN-8 adaptor since everything back to the motor is AN-8:

After all that, I thought I'd take a break from gas tank land for a while and get the jeep back on all fours, so I painted all my links:

After that, I threw the calipers back on the axle, swung it under the jeep again, and bolted everything back up (hopefully for the last time).

She's sitting about 2.5 inches too hight at the moment, but she is also missing a tail gate, back half of cage, back seat, rear bumper and tire carrier, spare tire, tools, and of course gas tank. I'm thinking it should be pretty close to where I want it once everything is loaded up.

Heading inside to eat dinner, I had to shake my head. It feels like this thing has come a long way, and yet not gone anywhere at all.

May 10, 2020

May 19, 2018

There are a lot of days I wonder if I'm a moron for cutting up a perfectly good jeep.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by the freeak Looks damn good. What's next?

I need to buy myself a bender, some 1.75 .120 wall and make the back half of my cage.

I put this part off because I keep hoping I'm going to find a deal on a bender or a 1.75" die, but I should probably just sack up and buy a new one.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slobrorunner Did you find that tank used or did you buy a TJ one specifically? I've been looking at genright tanks to move mine back under the tub, but dang they're pricey. I get why though.

Found a guy selling it on the facebook marketplace for $800. Unless you want to make your own skid and straps for other tanks, they're pretty much the only game in town. I had a motobilt 18gal in the tub before, but that pretty much defeated the point of stretching the whole jeep for more kid and cargo space. I always had my eye on the TJ tank though, since the TJ tank is wider than the YJ(YJ version has to clear leaves and shackles.)

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slobrorunner Yeah I'm not attempting to make my own. Guess I more meant why a TJ one over a YJ one, but those reasons make sense.

Yep. I think the TJ one holds one more gallon (18 vs 17). It was slightly more of a pain in the as to get the TJ tank to fit since the holes on on the back didn't line up with anything and I had to clearance part of the rear cross-member to clear the tank straps. After that I debated between trying to make my own carriage bolt holes and ghetto welding some nuts in there. Making carriage bolt holes seemed hard, sooo...

Bottom line though, I would have probably bought whichever one I found a deal on first.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

The wife gave me a big chunk of time this weekend to work on this thing. We've got a new baby due in less than a month, so we both know not much is going to get done once that happens. My goal is to at least get this jeep moving under its own power before thing.

To do that of course, I need a gas tank, so first thing's first- I gotta get that thing in there. Like I said above, there was some BS I had to do to the rear cross-member to get the TJ tank to fit in a YJ:

Then I had to drill the standard holes in the frame and sleeve it to bolt up the front of the tank. Somewhere a long time ago, I found some published Genright directions on what drill bit size to use and all that... I lost that info, so I sort of eyeballed it and it looked like a 5/8" would work. In my laziness, I kinda sorta didn't want to spend a lot of time working my way up to 5/8. So I messaged my conscience for permission. My conscience apparently was not amused:

The hole was perfect... except it turns out 9/16" was what I needed

whatever, I welded everything in place and you couldn't tell anyway.

The other side came out great using a 9/16 bit

It was almost time to swing the tank in, but before I did, I figured I'd add a trick little fuel pump access panel that I found on Genright's site:
Step 1- lets cut some more holes in our already full-of-holes tub.

Step 2- do some stuff and paint it

Step 3- beer (no picture)

Step 4 - add gas tank

Step 5- done

 

[Sandy Johnson]

That night, my wife rust-shamed me. So that combined with Rockwood shaming me here was enough straw to break the camel's back. I decided to pull my corner arm and start cutting some holes to make myself feel like a man again(if you look closely you can see my teardrops on the ground after all that rust-bullying took its toll):

Kidding, I don't have any feelings left to hurt. Any wetness on the ground was from a rainstorm moving in, so I did what any smart person would do right before a rainstorm- I flap disc'd all the rust off and tried to paint some things(primer only, I didn't have any adult supervision):

That was boring, time-consuming, and my fingers got all paint-y, so I'm probably going to put off doing the other side for a while. Next up is to re-run all my brake lines, fuel lines, electrical lines, DMV lines, cocaine lines etc.

Once those are done, I pretty much need a new battery, some gas, and a rear driveline and I can drive this thing around the block again... oh, and some seats I guess.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Just moved everything over from pirate during their great update. Wasn't sure what was going to happen to the old site, so I figured I would copy-pasta what could here in case it all gets hosed.

One thing I can't figure out when moving over, is why some of my stuff shows up as "Unapproved" and others do not:

 

[Rangerrod]

I’ll be moving mine as well. Did you just copy paste each post one at a time? Then add the pictures? Or what.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

I’ll be moving mine as well. Did you just copy paste each post one at a time? Then add the pictures? Or what.

I just went to each post, highlighted the whole thing (including pictures) and tried pasting it into a post here. It worked somehow. Not sure if the pics are now hosted here or where I was hosting them before, but if they ever disappear, I can get them back.

 

[Chkn]

Are you going to update both sites, or is it a complete adios from the Canuks?

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Are you going to update both sites, or is it a complete adios from the Canuks?

Not sure yet. I have a hatred of white backgrounds when actually reading anything on a computer, so I'll have to see if I can deal with that. I'll probably update both until I either get sick of the white background or updating two becomes annoying.

 

[The Freeak]

Happy to see this over here. I also hate white backgrounds.

 

[gt1guy]

Wow, that's a lot of work you got done in a day

There is a dark mode you can use on Pirate. Click on the three vertical dots in the top right on the page, right next to your little account box.
I feel like the last little bit of soul was just sucked out of that place, JKO too.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Wow, that's a lot of work you got done in a day

So now I just realized I was so focused on getting the links, coilovers, and gas tank done that I hadn't really planned much after that. I went out to work on the thing after work and realized I was just standing there trying to figure out what to do.

So here's a quick check-list mainly for my own sanity and in no particular order because that would require more thinking that I'm willing to do right now:

• Fuel lines re-run (Output, return, and breather). Also the genright tank appears to have come with a stock looking breather thingy on it? I'm gonna cap that.
• Brake lines. Plan is to go hard line on the frame, flex hose jump to either upper or lower link arm(haven't decided), hard line down the link arm, flex hose jump to axle into T, then hard line out to each caliper hose
• Wiring- Tail light, fuel pump, gas gauge sending unit, and rock lights. All pretty straight forward. Fuel pump and tail light wires are too short, I think I want to extend them rather than re-run the whole thing.
• Put a sending unit in the gas tank. Forgot about that until yesterday. Derp. Ordered a cylinder version from summit last night.
• Rear drive line. Currently working one out with Steve from South Bay Driveline. This guy knows everything
• Steve reminded me I need to ditch my weenie 1310 yoke for on the atlas. Going to swap to 1350 so I only need to carry one size spare for rear driveline.
• Reverse lights. This jeep never had any. I got a winters shifter back up light switch. Need to install and do wiring.
• Fender toppers. I decided it was worth it for me to order motobilt's toppers rather than jimmy-jack around with trying to make my own since I have huge holes cut to clear coilovers and corner armor wheel cutout.
• clearance for fuel bezel. There's sheet metal in the way. Imma cut that shit out when my bezel shows up and install it.
• Cage. Need to rebuild back half. Plan is for family style cage that ties in mounts for the rear bench (maybe some car seat latch system hooks too). Also need to make sure it's tied in to the frame at the B and C pillars (A pillars are done).
• Tailgate. I wanted to have it swing down, but I've got all the stuff for swing-out already and my bumper spare tire carrier swings out anyway. Someone talk me into doing more work for a proper drop-down tailgate.
• Paint. yeah, at some point I need to paint stuff. Inside and out. I have no idea how to do paint stuff, so putting this off as long as possible.
• Replace in tank fuel pump- long story full of fail. Replacement pump is in the mail
• Put rocker protection back on
• Put fender flares back on
• Buy a damn LJ top and figure out how to make it fit. I already have the TJ seal for the windshield. Need to figure out TJ rails for the rear.

...I think that's it. Maybe? Ugh, that's a big list without much detail.


Anyway, here's a picture of where I'm at with the jeep ratchet-strapped down to ride height so I could send my driveline measurements to Steve:

 

[backchat]

Glad to see this come over. Gracias.