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Prepare for the "second wave" hoax. Fauci advocating federal mask mandate.

NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE said:
You do realize the city states would globally source their needs. your american manufacturing would instantly need to compete on the international market where now domestic production is essentially hassle free to get to its main consumer base, the cities.
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yes.

you do realize that people value freedom over simple gross economics, right?

i.e. just because jefferson would become a poor state with low per capita is not defensible grounds for denying their right to liberty from the tyranny of the combined big city mentality controlling CA and OR.

If SF wants to buy chinese rice raised by slaves and washed with the blood of the oppressed rather than rice raised by free fellow americans at a higher price, then so be it. Enjoy your unhealthy lifestyle fraud with lead recalls :flipoff2:
 
Provience said:
yes.

you do realize that people value freedom over simple gross economics, right?

i.e. just because jefferson would become a poor state with low per capita is not defensible grounds for denying their right to liberty from the tyranny of the combined big city mentality controlling CA and OR.

If SF wants to buy chinese rice raised by slaves and washed with the blood of the oppressed rather than rice raised by free fellow americans at a higher price, then so be it. Enjoy your unhealthy lifestyle fraud with lead recalls :flipoff2:
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wait so the economy isnt the most important thing?
 
NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE said:
wait so the economy isnt the most important thing?
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lemme quote myself here and you can have at responding to it in a different way :flipoff2:

it's a comical ironing that the big city democratic peoples at once denounce evil corporate globalism, and instantly decry any potential loss of tax revenue or raw degradation of capital.
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but i'll ask you, is the economy the most important thing?

Personally, i decided years and years ago that amassing wealth (economy) was not the most important thing.
 
Since we have a large family, and some of them feel the need to be idiots and do retarded shit in a pandemic like go to restaurants as soon as the now 2 week long shutdown is (possibly) over in two more weeks, the wife and I, as well as her brother (who is the ceo of one of the largest German companies), have decided to cancel Thanksgiving and Christmas today.

The shit show is awesome to watch. People are so dumb is actually funny, not sad. All these emotions!!!

"Nobody can tell me not to see my grandchildren!!!"
"I alone decide if I go to a restaurant!"
"Your breaking traditions, you selfish people!!!"

Say old people with a bunch of preexisting conditions - even a flu could be very dangerous for them

Yea... And if you die alone, you can't do anything anymore ya idiots...

At least they wear masks. Some grudgingly. If there were someone in the family that would say "no masks", I'd instantly and completely break with them.


This just for perspective.
 
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Provience said:
lemme quote myself here and you can have at responding to it in a different way :flipoff2:



but i'll ask you, is the economy the most important thing?

Personally, i decided years and years ago that amassing wealth (economy) was not the most important thing.
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so you're not for capitalism? sounds like you're a commie to me.
 
ev13wt said:
Since we have a large family, and some of them feel the need to be idiots and do retarded shit in a pandemic like go to restaurants as soon as the now 2 week long shutdown is (possibly) over in two more weeks, the wife and I, as well as her brother (who is the ceo of one of the largest German conpanies), have decided to cancel Thanksgiving and Christmas today.

The shit show is awesome to watch. People are so dumb is actually funny, not sad. All these emotions!!!

"Nobody can tell me not to see my grandchildren!!!"
"I alone decide if I go to a restaurant!"
"Your breaking traditions, you selfish people!!!"

Say old people with a bunch of preexisting conditions - even a flu could be very dangerous for them

Yea... And if you die alone, you can't do anything anymore ya idiots...

At least they wear masks. Some grudgingly. If there were someone in the family that would say "no masks", I'd instantly and completely break with them.


This just for perspective.
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wow, you'd seriously break up with a family member if they didn't want to wear a mask?

and you are also shitting on people who know their risk and would rather visit with people and live in the now than be condemned to isolation?

that's pretty fucking weird, man. whatever happened to live and let live? You don't have to go, but who are you to dictate what others can or cannot do?
 
Provience said:
wow, you'd seriously break up with a family member if they didn't want to wear a mask?

and you are also shitting on people who know their risk and would rather visit with people and live in the now than be condemned to isolation?

that's pretty fucking weird, man. whatever happened to live and let live? You don't have to go, but who are you to dictate what others can or cannot do?
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Of course they can do as they wish. Traditionally my wifes brother was the one offering the location and paying for the party. So he's getting flak... He's one of the smartest people I know and we fully agree this is the correct decision.


And yes I'd break. Maybe if it was a brother of mine I'd try dialog. It's a teamwork thing to me.

I understand old people and the "I'm old and might die I wanna live now..." arguments on the emotional side. But logic says one could die in two weeks.
 
Provience said:
no, i'm absolutely for capitalism and fully committed to being against communism.

do you not understand what capitalism is? or communism?

I'd like your definitions for those two words. whatever you are using to frame those concepts on.
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He passed economics, so this should be good....
 
ev13wt said:
Of course they can do as they wish. Traditionally my wifes brother was the one offering the location and paying for the party. So he's getting flak... He's one of the smartest people I know and we fully agree this is the correct decision.


And yes I'd break. Maybe if it was a brother of mine I'd try dialog. It's a teamwork thing to me.

I understand old people and the "I'm old and might die I wanna live now..." arguments on the emotional side. But logic says one could die in two weeks.
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so if gramma said "we should have a party but no masks" even knowing there will be no party...and for that you'd cut her off.

fuck, might as well just kill her know :confused: what the hell is her purpose in life, if not to simply wither away in alone at this point :shaking:
 
Provience said:
so if gramma said "we should have a party but no masks" even knowing there will be no party...and for that you'd cut her off.

fuck, might as well just kill her know :confused: what the hell is her purpose in life, if not to simply wither away in alone at this point :shaking:
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i mean masks in the public (shopping, malls, banks and so on)
The start of the arguments was "Let's all make sure we don't do anything dumb like visiting restaurants two weeks before Christmas, and zero unmasked contact with anyone", so we can have a family Christmas "normally".
People said no.
Decisions happened.

edit: "wither alone"??? Nobody is close to dying, they can hold out till next summer without a fucking problem. Also: facetime ...
 
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Provience said:
no, i'm absolutely for capitalism and fully committed to being against communism.

do you not understand what capitalism is? or communism?

I'd like your definitions for those two words. whatever you are using to frame those concepts on.
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you said you dont like the idea of amassing wealth.
 
NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE said:
you said you dont like the idea of amassing wealth.
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Correct; Personally I decided that amassing wealth is not a life goal of mine.

Personally, i decided years and years ago that amassing wealth (economy) was not the most important thing
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guess i can easily quote myself here so there is no confusion.

edit: i'm still curious about your basis for capitalism/communism is/are
 
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ev13wt said:
i mean masks in the public (shopping, malls, banks and so on)
The start of the arguments was "Let's all make sure we don't do anything dumb like visiting restaurants two weeks before Christmas, and zero unmasked contact with anyone", so we can have a family Christmas "normally".
People said no.
Decisions happened.

edit: "wither alone"??? Nobody is close to dying, they can hold out till next summer without a fucking problem. Also: facetime ...
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nobody is close to dying? Well then, they are likely in the 99% group than the 60% group for survivability. so WTF is your problem then :confused:

and yes, if you are going to cut them out of your life and ostracize them over this kind of bullshit, then what is the difference between them being alive or dead?
 
Provience said:
Correct; Personally I decided that amassing wealth is not a life goal of mine.



guess i can easily quote myself here so there is no confusion.

edit: i'm still curious about your basis for capitalism/communism is/are
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if you're not for mass accumulation than capitalism isnt the system for you. capitalisms basic rules revolve around amassing the most amount of capital in the least amount of time.
 
NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE said:
if you're not for mass accumulation than capitalism isnt the system for you. capitalisms basic rules revolve around amassing the most amount of capital in the least amount of time.
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interesting. can you please expound on how capitalism is rules based that amassing the most in the least?

I disagree with your foundations, that must be why you cannot understand me.

I've always been lead to believe that capitalism was based on the fundamentals of private property and respect for the individual, respect of the rights of that individual to enter into legal binding contracts and the liberty of domain over the property under their responsibility.
 
ev13wt said:
Bullshit. They can demonstrate all they want. But with masks and distancing.

Like the restaurant and small independent musicians are doing.
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right, they can demonstrate all they want....as long as they do it in the fashion you agree with, even though if their chosen fashion in no way infringes the rights of others :rasta:

I have 5 apples, you can pick any of them you would like....as long as you only choose the first or second one.
 
Provience said:
right, they can demonstrate all they want....as long as they do it in the fashion you agree with, even though if their chosen fashion in no way infringes the rights of others :rasta:

I have 5 apples, you can pick any of them you would like....as long as you only choose the first or second one.
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99% of Germans support masks and the measures and just want to make these conspiracy theorists, idiots, yoga teachers and nazis (all marching together, so its obvious they are dumb as a rock) go away.

So yea. Break it up. They have a new chance every weekend. ;)
 
ev13wt said:
99% of Germans support masks and the measures and just want to make these conspiracy theorists, idiots, yoga teachers and nazis (all marching together, so its obvious they are dumb as a rock) go away.

So yea. Break it up. They have a new chance every weekend. ;)
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yes, i understand that you and many germans (i disagree with your 99% claim, based on your covid rates :flipoff2: ) do not support the same level of freedoms that we enjoy here in the USA, such as the freedom to assemble peacefully
 
Provience said:
interesting. can you please expound on how capitalism is rules based that amassing the most in the least?

I disagree with your foundations, that must be why you cannot understand me.

I've always been lead to believe that capitalism was based on the fundamentals of private property and respect for the individual, respect of the rights of that individual to enter into legal binding contracts and the liberty of domain over the property under their responsibility.
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https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/capitalism


Capital is wealth—that is, money and goods—that's used to produce more wealth. Capitalism is practiced enthusiastically by capitalists, people who use capital to increase production and make more goods and money. Capitalism works by encouraging competition in a fair and open market. Its opposite is often said to be socialism. Where a capitalist economy encourages private actions and ownership, socialism prefers public or government ownership and control of parts of the economy. In a pure capitalist system, there would be no public schools or public parks, no government programs such as Social Security and Medicare, and maybe not even any public highways or police. In a pure socialist system, there wouldn't be any private corporations. In other words, there's just about no such thing as pure capitalism or pure socialism in the modern world.
 
ev13wt said:
Of course they can do as they wish. Traditionally my wifes brother was the one offering the location and paying for the party. So he's getting flak... He's one of the smartest people I know and we fully agree this is the correct decision.


And yes I'd break. Maybe if it was a brother of mine I'd try dialog. It's a teamwork thing to me.

I understand old people and the "I'm old and might die I wanna live now..." arguments on the emotional side. But logic says one could die in two weeks.
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You can't mention "logic" while arguing the benefits of shutdowns and masks. They have not prevented a damn thing so far. Logic suggests we stop with them both and live. Virus is gonna virus. No people shortage and nothing wrong with thinning .01% of the herd. Better than bankrupting 25% of the herd in a futile effort to put an end to death.
 
NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE said:
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/capitalism


Capital is wealth—that is, money and goods—that's used to produce more wealth. Capitalism is practiced enthusiastically by capitalists, people who use capital to increase production and make more goods and money. Capitalism works by encouraging competition in a fair and open market. Its opposite is often said to be socialism. Where a capitalist economy encourages private actions and ownership, socialism prefers public or government ownership and control of parts of the economy. In a pure capitalist system, there would be no public schools or public parks, no government programs such as Social Security and Medicare, and maybe not even any public highways or police. In a pure socialist system, there wouldn't be any private corporations. In other words, there's just about no such thing as pure capitalism or pure socialism in the modern world.
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alright, so if we accept that neutral and reasonable third party definition, you were not correct in your foundation.

If we boil down that definition, capital = money (which we can even use the very labor theory view of a representative means of labor/work/effort) and goods (which is simply any and every thing )

so capitalism is a system that allocates effort and things to private ownership to be used as private actions see fit.

That aligns pretty well with what my view of capitalism is, that is why i consider myself a rabid capitalist and also why i long ago decided i have no desire to seek wealth accumulation as the greatest of goals.

so what does your neutral third party source consider to be communism so that we can fully explore your claim that i am a communist and not a capitalist
 
Provience said:
alright, so if we accept that neutral and reasonable third party definition, you were not correct in your foundation.

If we boil down that definition, capital = money (which we can even use the very labor theory view of a representative means of labor/work/effort) and goods (which is simply any and every thing )

so capitalism is a system that allocates effort and things to private ownership to be used as private actions see fit.

That aligns pretty well with what my view of capitalism is, that is why i consider myself a rabid capitalist and also why i long ago decided i have no desire to seek wealth accumulation as the greatest of goals.

so what does your neutral third party source consider to be communism so that we can fully explore your claim that i am a communist and not a capitalist
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you gotta expand on that. capitalism rules means the goal is to acquire as much as possible. thats the game. thats the system. it rewards those who do the most.


thats a baseless claim made by anyone who questions the purity of capitalism by the right. Anything that is not how rural 1950s white america sees it is communism.
 
NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE said:
you gotta expand on that. capitalism rules means the goal is to acquire as much as possible. thats the game. thats the system. it rewards those who do the most.


thats a baseless claim made by anyone who questions the purity of capitalism by the right. Anything that is not how rural 1950s white america sees it is communism.
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while i'm waiting for your definition of communism....


there is no rule listed in that definition other than privatization of goods and effort :confused: that is why it defines capitalism by illustrating it in opposition to socialism, i.e. public ownership of the things.

yes, capitalism absolutely rewards those who "do the most". Those who take what is under their control and are able to use it to generate more, in greater ways than others, will by default acquire more than those who take the same thing (that which is under their control) and do not do with it in the same way as another.

i'm confused what the "baseless claim" you are referring to in the second line :confused: rural 1950's white america is a myth, and i agree that people often label things wrongly as communist, simply as a pejorative

I maintain that I am a capitalist because I value using what i have under my control to generate/leverage for the things and stuff that I desire and value. Simply acquiring things for the sake of things or simply generating the "most amount of $$" is not a goal that i value, but that doesn't make me now a capitalist.


edit: your statement "that's the game, the goal is to acquire as much as possible" is NOT supported by the definition you shared.
 
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