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Used car market changes

welndmn said:
Wait, this guy talked about a dealer taking a trade in, then a dealer just offering a loan.
This guy is nuts.
It's normal for someone to have two open car loans.
A dealer would not take a trade in and not pay off that note.
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Yeah, that doesnt make a whole lotta sense. At best they would be either ignoring the fact the person has exceeded their debt-income ratio or you could be offering a personal loan to pay off the difference, which the consumer then defaults on - but isnt tied to their car loan. So in theory the dealership gets the used car. The consumer gets 2 loans, one of which if they default on doesn't loose them their car.

But with the second there is someone left holding the note for the personal loan. I don't see a bank doing this unless they are making so much on the primary loan to write the debt off.
 
What he is saying is they are selling the car owner a car with the expectation that they will let the previously owned car be repossessed. Maybe there is a lending rule that you can't write a loan when you know a person plans on defaulting on another loan. He is pointing out that '23 will have a shit ton of repos. The repos will be the overpriced vehicles that the customers owned previously.
 
welndmn said:
Wait, this guy talked about a dealer taking a trade in, then a dealer just offering a loan.
This guy is nuts.
It's normal for someone to have two open car loans.
A dealer would not take a trade in and not pay off that note.
Click to expand...

he's not nuts, he's perfectly sane. This happens all the time with the "no credit, no problem car lots". ive got a buddy who owns one. he dealer finances them, they pay a downpayment, 5-6 months of payments, he takes in back in 6 months, and because its already a 20 year old Isuzu he sticks it back on his lot for $5k and starts the cycle again.

lenders want to make loans, collect down payments and fees, make a few months of payments and then take it back. car is still a used car, they make out or break even, they screw the customer.

they literally did the exact same thing back pre-2008 with home loans.
 
welndmn said:
A dealer would not take a trade in and not pay off that note.
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I don't think they are trading anything in. They are just financing another car totally ignoring the fact that the buyer has another car loan. They are betting that the new car loan will be paid, and the old loan will just be defaulted on.

In normal times the buyer wouldn't qualify because someone that makes 3k a month can't afford 1500 a month in car loans. But they can afford $500 if they stop paying the other $1000
 
Void_of_Light said:
I don't think they are trading anything in. They are just financing another car totally ignoring the fact that the buyer has another car loan. They are betting that the new car loan will be paid, and the old loan will just be defaulted on.

In normal times the buyer wouldn't qualify because someone that makes 3k a month can't afford 1500 a month in car loans. But they can afford $500 if they stop paying the other $1000
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But that has nothing to do with the number of car loans. Its all about debt to earning ratio, which takes into account other types of loans, normal living costs, rent/mortgage, etc. 36% is the normal

So if you make 10k a month (easy math). Your mortgage is $1500, you have a car payment of $500. You are at 20% Debt to income. Most places would have no issues loaning you up to a $1500/month payment more. Regardless if that was 1 stupid brodozer or 4 econoboxes. It doesn't matter to them (except the econboxes may hold their value better if you did default)

I don't think there is anywhere that says a consumer can only have X number of auto loans. There are sort of limits in mortagages but they are fuzzy and more along the "How many mortgages are there before you are a real estate business and need a different type of loan"
 
kf4zht said:
But that has nothing to do with the number of car loans. Its all about debt to earning ratio, which takes into account other types of loans, normal living costs, rent/mortgage, etc. 36% is the normal
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Agreed, what I'm getting at is they are simply ignoring debt because they assume it will be defaulted on and it's not their problem. I don't know about legal, but it's certainly morally wrong, but if they had morals, they wouldn't be working with car dealerships.
 
Void_of_Light said:
Agreed, what I'm getting at is they are simply ignoring debt because they assume it will be defaulted on and it's not their problem. I don't know about legal, but it's certainly morally wrong, but if they had morals, they wouldn't be working with car dealerships.
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your statement is correct.

I am the exception, I have morals. :flipoff2:
 
crispins said:
Why, I do not understand you thoughts here.

Are you just a hater of a company trying to change the way cars are bought.

I've seen this shit a few times here and not once from anyone who has actually delt with them.
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:flipoff2:
 
used market is weird AF.

listed my 3rd gen 4runner last saturday. Sold it for more than I thought I should in 20 hours

Buyer just listed it for 4500 more than I sold it to him 7 days ago. On the same listing sites i used.
Part of me is annoyed... the other part of me knows I still made $ on it over 5 years of ownership and I chose the selling price i was comfortable with.
 
rockota said:
used market is weird AF.

listed my 3rd gen 4runner last saturday. Sold it for more than I thought I should in 20 hours

Buyer just listed it for 4500 more than I sold it to him 7 days ago. On the same listing sites i used.
Part of me is annoyed... the other part of me knows I still made $ on it over 5 years of ownership and I chose the selling price i was comfortable with.
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Had a guy do that with a boat I sold. He did some work but didn't do anything with the motor, which it needed to increase its value. Plus it needed new tires on the trailer, which he didn't replace

He had it listed for 2x what he paid me. Last I looked it was down to about 1K more than he paid and sitting. This was a few months ago before the market was really getting flooded with used toys so I'm betting its still sitting.
 
I've seen an uptick in repo's, but they're 99% ghetto trash. It's all cars that have little to no inherehent value that are wrecked, used as a dumpster, etc. Things I wouldn't waste time hauling across the scales. No $60k cars, yet.

What I have found interesting is the dramatic increase is floorplan repo's. Dealers are finally getting what was coming to them, I love it. A lot of these overzealous clowns need to go belly up.
 
TRINDU said:
I've seen an uptick in repo's, but they're 99% ghetto trash. It's all cars that have little to no inherehent value that are wrecked, used as a dumpster, etc. Things I wouldn't waste time hauling across the scales. No $60k cars, yet.

What I have found interesting is the dramatic increase is floorplan repo's. Dealers are finally getting what was coming to them, I love it. A lot of these overzealous clowns need to go belly up.
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What's a floorplan repo
 
Clemson13 said:
Sounds like floorplan repos should be good for tanking prices?
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Yes .. in the short term. Longer term, less dealers, less competition, higher prices. I think the next year is going to weed out a lot of weaker dealers.
 
I just picked up a 23 chevy 3500, so hoping it doesnt tank fast. I got employee pricing so at least that takes 10% off. Probably trading it 3 months from now for the 24 i ordered and hoping there will be strong enough demand for HD trucks for an even trade.
 
brantb said:
I just picked up a 23 chevy 3500, so hoping it doesnt tank fast. I got employee pricing so at least that takes 10% off. Probably trading it 3 months from now for the 24 i ordered and hoping there will be strong enough demand for HD trucks for an even trade.
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seems like a good bet ..
 
Interesting deal with Carvana. Guess I got lucky. All the inspections were there, (plus I've had it up on my lift and the car is clean all the way around) carfax was clean and my title stuff came within 2-3 weeks. I'm definitely starting to see the market fall.
 
Trying to decide if I want to trade in my 2012 Lexus IS250 and for what. Just got a big ass dog (Cane Corso) and this fool can't even sit up right back there. I would like a tow rig but don't really need one (8k capacity for a 1-ton+40's 78 f150).

If not for towing then I'm thinking Tahoe/Yukon, Lexus GX460/470.. smart/sensible move is to just keep the car.. but that's boring.
 
holdmypocket said:
Trying to decide if I want to trade in my 2012 Lexus IS250 and for what. Just got a big ass dog (Cane Corso) and this fool can't even sit up right back there. I would like a tow rig but don't really need one (8k capacity for a 1-ton+40's 78 f150).

If not for towing then I'm thinking Tahoe/Yukon, Lexus GX460/470.. smart/sensible move is to just keep the car.. but that's boring.
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holy clown car situation! :laughing:
 
xr-nut said:
pretty obvious to me, that none of the commentors here have been to a dealer auction in the last 24 months.
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Enlighten us, I'm curious.
That said, I always thought the dealer auctions were kind of their own market considering how many states have exclusive agreements that ensure only licensed dealers can participate.
Give us the rundown, fuck the thread derail:flipoff2:
 
IowaOffRoad said:
Enlighten us, I'm curious.
That said, I always thought the dealer auctions were kind of their own market considering how many states have exclusive agreements that ensure only licensed dealers can participate.
Give us the rundown, fuck the thread derail:flipoff2:
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cliff version:

shit is still selling HIGH. like giraffe pussy high. take you nada/jdpower numbers and stick them where the sun doesn't shine. plus, right now is tax season. you want to see vehicles sell for above book? show up during tax season. I agree its a bunch of retards, but its the game. And I either get in the mud and wallow with them or I go broke. :laughing:
 
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