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Barndominium or Shopdominium Steel Building Experience?

BDK said:
You don't think that home made man cage unsecured on the forks, 20' off the ground with no safety gear would pass?:flipoff2:

They used it to place the beams. Two guys in the cage with a 35' long beam resting on top of the rails. Bent the shit out of the rails. The boss was too cheap to send out his crane. Watching that made me a little nervous. I stayed a healthy distance away.
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When we were walking around, I wondered how they got those big-ass beams in place. I assumed a crane, but I guess if a sketch method works and nobody died, I guess it's OK. Hope their insurance is paid up. :laughing:

Thanks again for the peeler post cuttoffs.
 
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Thank you Roc Doc for letting me shoot your suppressed .22. And here I thought I was done buying gun stuff for a while. At least I'll have to wait for a Arizona ID before I get a supressor for my .22 bolt rifle.

The framer has his own crane, but he was too cheap to send it out there. Nobody died so I guess it worked out fine. You should see the electricians monkey walking through the trusses running wire. I got them all screeching like monkeys until the boss yelled at them to shut the fuck up.

I'll be moving out to the property tomorrow (Friday). It's cooling off here and I'm out there most every day anyway. I'm also getting tired of the RV park lifestyle.
 
ridered3 said:
No critique at all, but genuine curiosity. Why did you elect to go with a hybrid approach for insulation? Also, Open Cell or Closed Cell spray foam?

Seems like the majority of the barndo style builds here in Tennessee only use spray foam (least the ones posted in a very popular FaceSpace group anyway), with a small minority using fiberglass, and smaller minority using the hybrid approach.
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I don't remember if it's open or closed spray foam. It was decided to do it this way after a sit down with the insulation guy, the HVAC guy, the contractor and myself. I know nothing about insulation, so when they all agreed this was the best way to insulate the house, I agreed.

This is what they said as far as I can remember: It doesn't get hot or cold enough here for all spray foam. With fiberglass in the walls, the HVAC guy said he won't have to add a pump to bring in fresh air because the house won't be sealed tight like with 100% spray foam. With the patios on three sides, the walls of the residence part never get sun on them. This is a very low humidity area. There was more to it, but this is all I can remember offhand.

As for as covering the wood and not being able to see termites, that's not a issue here. There are only subterranean termites here, no flyers. The slabs and any wood that touches the slabs are treated. That's all anybody here does.

I'm the first to admit, I'm not a home builder. I build homes, but I partner with a GC. He does all the thinking.

With my house build, I've been out there almost every day deciding with the subs the thousands of little details that will make the house mine. The choosing of the subs is the GC's job.

I've had a very good working relationship and friendship with my GC for several years. He's a good guy and very well respected by the subs. He also demands a reduced price to use them on the spec houses, and is getting the same deals for my house. He is saving me thousands, and charging me less than half the going rate for custom house builds.
 
BDK said:
Thank you Roc Doc for letting me shoot your suppressed .22. And here I thought I was done buying gun stuff for a while. At least I'll have to wait for a Arizona ID before I get a supressor for my .22 bolt rifle.
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Don't let Roc Doc talk you into spending a bunch of money on frivolous shit with his 'gated neighborhood on the private lake' .22lr- those of us that work for a living know the Fram PH373 is the best .22lr suppressor made.

House is coming along awesome. Keep us updated. :grinpimp:
 
BDK said:
I don't remember if it's open or closed spray foam. It was decided to do it this way after a sit down with the insulation guy, the HVAC guy, the contractor and myself. I know nothing about insulation, so when they all agreed this was the best way to insulate the house, I agreed.

This is what they said as far as I can remember: It doesn't get hot or cold enough here for all spray foam. With fiberglass in the walls, the HVAC guy said he won't have to add a pump to bring in fresh air because the house won't be sealed tight like with 100% spray foam. With the patios on three sides, the walls of the residence part never get sun on them. This is a very low humidity area. There was more to it, but this is all I can remember offhand.

As for as covering the wood and not being able to see termites, that's not a issue here. There are only subterranean termites here, no flyers. The slabs and any wood that touches the slabs are treated. That's all anybody here does.

I'm the first to admit, I'm not a home builder. I build homes, but I partner with a GC. He does all the thinking.

With my house build, I've been out there almost every day deciding with the subs the thousands of little details that will make the house mine. The choosing of the subs is the GC's job.

I've had a very good working relationship and friendship with my GC for several years. He's a good guy and very well respected by the subs. He also demands a reduced price to use them on the spec houses, and is getting the same deals for my house. He is saving me thousands, and charging me less than half the going rate for custom house builds.
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Thanks for the detailed response and glad to read that the major parties had a say in the decision to go with the hybrid approach.
 
45acp said:
Don't let Roc Doc talk you into spending a bunch of money on frivolous shit with his 'gated neighborhood on the private lake' .22lr- those of us that work for a living know the Fram PH373 is the best .22lr suppressor made.

House is coming along awesome. Keep us updated. :grinpimp:
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I should be getting a commission for all the cans I've sold by letting folks shoot mine. It's super fun, no ear pro and we were dinging his 100yd target no problem. I would in theory, like to try the Fram or Wix thing sometime, most likely outside of US territorial waters.
 
BDK said:
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This is old school desert design. Keep the solar load off the exterior walls goes a long ways towards cooling. My house is all 2x6 construction, with extra insulation, with the South side shaded by trees, but the East side gets a lot of sun from 10 to noon, and you can definitely feel the difference. I keep threatening to put awnings over the East door and windows, but will probably move first.
 
vtdigger.org

'I wanted to cry': Devastating risks of spray foam insulation hidden from Vermont homeowners - VTDigger

When asked how a homeowner could assess whether they’re hiring a high-quality insulation installer, Brent Ehrlich, a products and materials specialist at BuildingGreen, said, “I don't really have a good answer to that.”
vtdigger.org vtdigger.org

Might want to look into some of the downsides to foam before committing, it's still developing that it's causing lenders to deny mortgages, or requiring removal and replacing

I'm getting close to this stage, I think I'm going fiberglass ymmv
 
Yeah,
Get that place closed up ASAP!!
Honestly, you should have roofed it and at least lathed it before starting your MEP rough-ins. I also like to have the framer shim and shave prior to Sparky starting his rough-in.
 
How do you rough in plumbing after the roof is on? It's not done like that here. Roof is after HVAC, plumbing and electrical rough ins. It stopped raining 30 minutes ago and it's already mostly dried out.
 
BDK said:
How do you rough in plumbing after the roof is on? It's not done like that here. Roof is after HVAC, plumbing and electrical rough ins. It stopped raining 30 minutes ago and it's already mostly dried out.
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Usually papered in, or we would if shingled just run them and then send a guy out after the plumber drilled through his pipes. Or the builder would have the framers paper the roof
 
Grnjp92 said:
Usually papered in, or we would if shingled just run them and then send a guy out after the plumber drilled through his pipes. Or the builder would have the framers paper the roof
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They don't do it that way here. I'm going to guess that if they papered the roof without the shingles, the wind would peel the paper off. They don't use asphalt shingles here because a wind storm will peel them off and that's not covered by a warranty.
 
BDK said:
They don't do it that way here. I'm going to guess that if they papered the roof without the shingles, the wind would peel the paper off. They don't use asphalt shingles here because a wind storm will peel them off and that's not covered by a warranty.
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Even with tile, paper it and load the tile (in stacks). It will keep the paper down. My neighbor just had his roof redone. Demoed, papered and stacked, sat for about 4 weeks. 40 mph winds on the regular during that time.
Plumber can always stub his vent stacks through and come back to tie them in, if he's worth a shit.
If A/C is going on the roof he should have been there the day after sheathing was done.
I know you said "It stopped raining 30 minutes ago and it's already mostly dried out." Check the insulation on your ductwork. Get a moisture meter and check the lumber BEFORE you shim and shave.
 
It's one of those perfect, quiet nights here. There is a cool breeze coming out of the mountains that smells like wet pine. Temp is 75 degrees. One of the reasons I love this area is the weather. It changes by the hour.

I need to get a spa faster than I planned. I was going to have it pre-wired and then get one in a year or so. One of the electricians said I could shoot at my rifle targets from the spa. Now, I can't get it out of my head.
 
BDK said:
How do you rough in plumbing after the roof is on? It's not done like that here. Roof is after HVAC, plumbing and electrical rough ins. It stopped raining 30 minutes ago and it's already mostly dried out.
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schedule roofer the day plumbing starts and commuciate so they all on same page

In commerical with flat roof its much easier, we do round about the same. and typically any additional pentrations you silicone until roofer comes back to boot those in.
 
Plumbing, electrical and framing combo inspection passed on Friday. Outside doors and windows installed. Used a generator to fill the water lines and drains from my own well. We are thinking I'll need a water tank and pressure pump at the house due to the distance from the well. Next is the roof and the concrete tiles were ordered last week. Garage door guy was over Friday, cabinet guy was here Thursday.
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Daughter stayed last night on the first leg of a road trip to an international dressage show in Oklahoma. She talked about moving here and I showed her where she could build a house on the property.
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Buddy from Whitman passed through and overnighted.
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I knew the contractor sent the right door installer when a gray haired wrinkled dude with a cigarette hanging out of the corner of his mouth showed up.
 
BDK said:
Plumbing, electrical and framing combo inspection passed on Friday. Outside doors and windows installed. Used a generator to fill the water lines and drains from my own well. We are thinking I'll need a water tank and pressure pump at the house due to the distance from the well.
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Keep in mind that if you go to a tank that is above ground, you'll not have any cool water in the summer. I went through that with the house we rented in Goodyear. The copper pipes gave out, and the homeowner had it replumbed in PEX going through the attic, it used to annoy the shit out of me that I couldn't get a cool shower in the summer. On our current well we have two (one for me, and one for my neighbor), 40g pressure tanks that are above ground, but it's pretty quick to get cool water, especially if the dishwasher has been run.
 
There is space in the garage that I don't have any plans for that could easily fit a 1,000 gallon water tank. It already has the plumbing loop there for a filter and softener because the water line enters the house on that corner. I should have thought about it before and had the garage bathroom walls and ceiling engineered to take the weight of a tank. It would be 10' off the ground and out of the way. Propane insta-hot is going to be above the bathroom, which is why all that plumbing and electrical are there. One circuit for the insta-hot, one switched circuit for the hot water recirculation pump.
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BDK said:
There is space in the garage that I don't have any plans for that could easily fit a 1,000 gallon water tank. It already has the plumbing loop there for a filter and softener because the water line enters the house on that corner. I should have thought about it before and had the garage bathroom walls and ceiling engineered to take the weight of a tank. It would be 10' off the ground and out of the way. Propane insta-hot is going to be above the bathroom, which is why all that plumbing and electrical are there. One circuit for the insta-hot, one switched circuit for the hot water recirculation pump.
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Even a pump house with shade is better than full sun. I built a shader out of 1x1box tube and corrugated steel for a roof to keep the direct sun off of the pressure tanks. I don't know if it makes a big difference, but it must help.
 
BDK progress looks awesome and cool that you are having some company swing by on their way to/from places. Just start a little $ drop box for overnight fees to help offset building costs :lmao:
 
Bogus One said:
If you're putting 7K lbs. of water up there your Structural Engineer would have broke your bank with footings and structural steel
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Eh I think putting some steel in that room would be no big deal, in design cost or materials.
 
BDK said:
There is space in the garage that I don't have any plans for that could easily fit a 1,000 gallon water tank. It already has the plumbing loop there for a filter and softener because the water line enters the house on that corner. I should have thought about it before and had the garage bathroom walls and ceiling engineered to take the weight of a tank. It would be 10' off the ground and out of the way. Propane insta-hot is going to be above the bathroom, which is why all that plumbing and electrical are there. One circuit for the insta-hot, one switched circuit for the hot water recirculation pump.
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Bit late now but

When I designed our house I built in a cistern below the mechanical room. In case I had to carry water. When we struck water - 620’ deep, I did not build the cistern. I regret not doing so

What is your area like for wild fires? I now have 5000 gallons on hand for such issues.

We have a 40 gallon(maybe) pressure tank as our well produces 1.25 gal per minute so the tank acts as buffer / storage.
 
Well is over 50 GPM, pump is 28 GPM. Wildfires are a issue here, there have been four this year in the mountains behind the house, one was a few miles north but headed away from here. Since I have the house farthest back in the canyon, mine is one of the most vulnerable of the five houses here. I have taken more steps than anyone to give me a buffer. Pad extends a minimum of 75' behind the house, cut a fire/access road from the pad over to a old easement road, and cleaned up the easement. Driveway is over 20' wide, splits around the bottom of the pad. There is a 20' deep 50' wide wash on the north side. It's high desert; grass, cactus, mesquite, junipers, palo verde's. Slope rapidly increases in elevation behind the house, where theres pines and lots of junipers, and the highest peaks in the Cerbat Mountains. Retired fire chief buddy said I have done enough that a fire should pass on by.

Now, if that rich asshole who lives five miles south of here would quit using surplus AP ammo in his M2... He started two of the largest fires here two years in a row. When they went after him, he paid for the damages and costs associated with fighting the fires.
 
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BDK said:
Well is over 50 GPM, pump is 28 GPM. Wildfires are a issue here, there have been four this year in the mountains behind the house, one was a few miles north but headed away from here. Since I have the house farthest back in the canyon, mine is one of the most vulnerable of the five houses here. I have taken more steps than anyone to give me a buffer. Pad extends a minimum of 75' behind the house, cut a fire/access road from the pad over to a old easement road, and cleaned up the easement. Driveway is over 20' wide, splits around the bottom of the pad. There is a 20' deep 50' wide wash on the north side. It's high desert; grass, cactus, mesquite, sycamores, palo verde's. Slope rapidly increases in elevation behind the house, where theres pines and lots of sycamores, and the highest peaks in the Cerbat Mountains. Retired fire chief buddy said I have done enough that a fire should pass on by.

Now, if that rich asshole who lives five miles south of here would quit using surplus AP ammo in his M2... He started two of the largest fires here two years in a row. When they went after him, he paid for the damages and costs associated with fighting the fires.
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Sounds like a mighty good job of making of a defensible perimeter!

Pretty interesting on the two wildfires. Think that's a lesson I'd of learned the first time though. :shaking:
 
I thought the combo inspection passed on Friday, but framing failed. Some of the fire blocks got knocked out by the other trades, and they forgot a few anchor bolts. The big fail was the framer looking at the original patio design page and not the engineered page, missing custom made brackets that were supposed to bolt to each patio post and connect them to the beams. They instead bolted through the beams from the top with 1" x 24" lag bolts. Contractor and me spent about an hour Monday trying to figure out how we could fix it without taking apart half the patio truss to get the bolts out and the brackets in. We figured the best solution was to talk the engineer into letting it stay the way it is, or we would be dead in the water for several weeks, and the framer would lose money on the job.

The engineer has been hard to get a hold of, so I drove over to his house. With plans in hand I knocked on his door. He got out a few books, and his calculator. I showed him pictures of how the patio rafters were tied into the trusses with 2x10's and how much cleaner it looks without the brackets. I also mentioned the day prior we had 50-60 MPH wind gusts and I walked around with my hand on the walls and posts. Didn't even feel a shudder. This house is solid. He figured out what we did was four times the required lift load. He wrote up a addendum calculations paper, stamped it and we were back in business.
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Outside doors were installed. Electrician came over today and rewired all the garage door openings for jackshaft openers. They left the wiring in place for traditional chain or belt drive openers so we have options. The 10x20' door will definitely have a jackshaft opener, but the two 12x14' doors won't really matter. With a jackshaft opener, the 10x20'' door will run up the wall above the opening and only hang into the garage a few feet, and won't cover the lights.

Spec house is coming along. Should have the drywall finished today.
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