Do New Ford Trucks Suck, or are My Expectations Too High?

[Gbkeith]

The old stuff sucked too. Worse in some ways. There’s a real tendency to only remember the stuff that lasted and not the ones that shit the bed. It usually didnt take as long to get them fixed and it didn’t cost as much.

Any truck from back in the day has forums or magazine articles full of power steering frame braces or tips on the easiest way to swap in a new disc brake axle. Every forum back in the day had three threads on the first page about which transmission cooler to install before you hooked onto anything.

My 2017 F350 has 320k miles on it and my 2024 has 25k. Hook onto a trailer, set the cruise and go and it does not give a shit if it’s 107 degrees out.

 

[arse_sidewards]

The old stuff sucked too. Worse in some ways. There’s a real tendency to only remember the stuff that lasted and not the ones that shit the bed. It usually didnt take as long to get them fixed and it didn’t cost as much.

Any truck from back in the day has forums or magazine articles full of power steering frame braces or tips on the easiest way to swap in a new disc brake axle. Every forum back in the day had three threads on the first page about which transmission cooler to install before you hooked onto anything.

My 2017 F350 has 320k miles on it and my 2024 has 25k. Hook onto a trailer, set the cruise and go and it does not give a shit if it’s 107 degrees out.

The 4spd manual shit was pretty good for what it was. Didn't cruise the highway well or make for a good daily driver though. You couldn't really hurt anything with a 200hp engine wheezing through a 2bbl and a 30" tire.

 

[Gbkeith]

The 4spd manual shit was pretty good for what it was. Didn't cruise the highway well or make for a good daily driver though. You couldn't really hurt anything with a 200hp engine wheezing through a 2bbl and a 30" tire.

And then they decided to make the nv4500 to address that, with bolts that backed out and all that. 700r4, aod, e4od. Whatever dodge had, I’m sure it was a winner. We honestly had good luck with e4od’s but a lot of people cuss them.

There was a time in the 80’s when you could get a four speed or a C6 or turbo 400 and more or less be ok as long as you adjusted things and kept them cool and didn’t mind screaming down the highway in direct with 4.11’s. And those were handling 170 horse 350’s. I don’t know what a pickup 454 or 460 was, 210? And a 350/3500 tow rating was maybe 10k.

 

[SLOWPOKE693]

So, would all those who voted "New Fords suck" please tell me what brand new trouble free 1 ton truck I should be buying?

Fords = CP4

Duramax = broken cranks and IFS = super ghey

Dodge = great engine with a pile of shit wrapped around it. And are the engines even that great anymore?

 

[Aggie06]

So, would all those who voted "New Fords suck" please tell me what brand new trouble free 1 ton truck I should be buying?

Fords = CP4

Duramax = broken cranks and IFS = super ghey

Dodge = great engine with a pile of shit wrapped around it. And are the engines even that great anymore?

I voted too high of expectations.

Literally everything sucks now, especially for what they cost up front.

 

[Gbkeith]

I voted too high of expectations.

Literally everything sucks now, especially for what they cost up front.

Glass of tea at the cafe is $3.59.

 

[Aggie06]

It’s also hard to get a #5 at Whataburger for less than $12 now.

 

[06h3]

Some things that have drastically improved compared to old stuff. I think AC and cooling systems are so much better.

Things don’t overheat and AC blows colder than ever.

Dollar for dollar though I think things are much bigger piles of shit today. Key word is dollar for dollar.

 

[350TacoZilla]

Big thing is it's easier for me to be like oh look my $5,000 truck needs work and spend the $500 fixing it up VS oh look my $75,000 needs a new motor\transmission and its $5,000-15,000 to repair. When we got my wifes current 2003 ram 1500 from a family member it was "well maintained" and running driving on the rd. But the PO thought that his dealers free oil changes, tire rotations and the occasional air filter were all that was ever needed so the truck needed balljoints, bushings, tierods, tires (great tread but dry rotted), rotors, pads etc. Yeah you could start it and drive it but there were problems lurking. Now do I consider it a POS because it needed work? no because everything that isn't looked after needs work.

it's not JUST that new fords suck, on the whole NEW TRUCKS SUCK. You think in 40 years the touch screens are going to work?

Also you guys are comparing trucks from 70s-80s that cost how much brand new to these new tech laden mansions on wheels? Use all new parts and build yourself a $70k squarebody then compare the AC or ride or cruise control.

 

[What?]

While older trucks have their quirks, they didn't break down or major issue in same time frame as modern newer trucks do.

 

[Gravy]

What's funny to me.

You would think after years of experience, they would know how to make door handles from breaking.

But here we are in 2024, plastic, broken, door handles.

Vehicles are tissue paper.

 

[SLOWPOKE693]

What's funny to me.

You would think after years of experience, they would know how to make door handles from breaking.

But here we are in 2024, plastic, broken, door handles.

Vehicles are tissue paper.

If you think that's by accident I have some bad news for you....

 

[SLOWPOKE693]

While older trucks have their quirks, they didn't break down or major issue in same time frame as modern newer trucks do.

They also couldn't do a 1/4 of what a new truck can. My 22 6.7 Ferd pulls my 38' 21,000 GVW race car trailer like it's not even there no matter what the terrain is like and can maintain 75-80mph while doing so.

I hook my 97 7.3 truck to the same trailer and it can barely move the thing from a stop and I'd probably die and kill a bus load of nuns at the same time trying to drive down the highway at 75. If it would even get going that fast.

 

[SLOWPOKE693]

Also you guys are comparing trucks from 70s-80s that cost how much brand new to these new tech laden mansions on wheels?

My 1997 F250 HD 4x4 XLT extended cab with a 7.3/auto combo had a sticker price of $34k back then. What's that in today's money? New non 1500 series yuppie trucks are really not much more expensive in today's money, unless you need the "Big swinging dick" top o the line neighbor impresser model, yet their performance is 100X better.

You know how you build a good old reliable workhorse that can compete with a new truck? You take a brand new truck, remove the body and install an old cab and bed on it and that's the only way it's happening. If I put my 22 6.7 drivetrain in my 97 the power and torque the new engines make would twist the frame up like a pretzel and slowly wreck the truck over time. Minus the stupid electronic gizmos we can all live without, new trucks are far superior.

 

[SLOWPOKE693]

And this is coming from a guy that was completely against buying a new truck because of the high prices. I gave in and bought one and I don't regret a single second of the decision.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

They also couldn't do a 1/4 of what a new truck can. My 22 6.7 Ferd pulls my 38' 21,000 GVW race car trailer like it's not even there no matter what the terrain is like and can maintain 75-80mph while doing so.

I hook my 97 7.3 truck to the same trailer and it can barely move the thing from a stop and I'd probably die and kill a bus load of nuns at the same time trying to drive down the highway at 75. If it would even get going that fast.

Most guys who say the 90s and 00s truck were better than the new ones have never actually towed with an older truck.

I pulled a 7500lb skid steer on a small equipment trailer (maybe 10k total?) from 100' elevation up to Tahoe with my 97 7.3/5spd. It had the typical, intake/turbo back exhaust/chip but no intercooler yet. It was screaming for mercy in 3rd gear on every hill, and even had to pull over at one point because everything just got so heatsoaked I couldn't hardly touch the throttle without egt's going over 1200*

Then at the top I had to drop to 2nd fucking gear. With 4.10s and 33s that's like 25 mph at 3k rpm.

I did do it without any actual issues, but I can't imagine doing that often with good results like everyone seems to think those trucks will do.

Not too long ago I put my buddies cat 299d in my dump trailer ~13k lbs + 4k lbs. Truck was hating life and even had to put it in low range after I stopped on a hill and couldn't get going without smoking the clutch.

People here like to give me shit for it, but I'm confident my wifes 2.7 ecoboost would have handled it better, up and down the hills. My 16 6.7 doesn't even flinch with that type of wieght behind it and my 19 6.7 work truck grosses 35k lbs every single day with out issue. A 7.3, 12v or whatever glorified shit would absolutely hate life, not to mention the trans, frame, brakes, ect. No one talks about how an 05+ superduty will go 300k with hardly any suspension, axle, tcase or trans issues. Try that with your 46re

I do like those old trucks, and don't plan to sell mine, but people should give the new trucks credit where it's due. I also believe they're not as shitty as everyone says. Just lots of guys out there using them without bragging around the internet.

I have a buddy who is creeping up on 300k in his 2014 6.7 ford. Says it's been great since new. He's had 37s on it since the first few weeks, and uses it for logging type work. Not a highway princess.

Father in law has 230k on his 2017 6.7 ford. Just ate a cp4, but he said he couldn't remember when he last changed the filter

I also remembered a member on here talking about a 7.3 excursion he bought new being a total lemon. Blew the engine at like 30k, then maybe a trans early on also. I think the QC is just worse these days, so they either blow at 30k miles, or last till 300k+

 

[SLOWPOKE693]

Most guys who say the 90s and 00s truck were better than the new ones have never actually towed with an older truck.

I pulled a 7500lb skid steer on a small equipment trailer (maybe 10k total?) from 100' elevation up to Tahoe with my 97 7.3/5spd. It had the typical, intake/turbo back exhaust/chip but no intercooler yet. It was screaming for mercy in 3rd gear on every hill, and even had to pull over at one point because everything just got so heatsoaked I couldn't hardly touch the throttle without egt's going over 1200*

Then at the top I had to drop to 2nd fucking gear. With 4.10s and 33s that's like 25 mph at 3k rpm.

I did do it without any actual issues, but I can't imagine doing that often with good results like everyone seems to think those trucks will do.

Not too long ago I put my buddies cat 299d in my dump trailer ~13k lbs + 4k lbs. Truck was hating life and even had to put it in low range after I stopped on a hill and couldn't get going without smoking the clutch.

People here like to give me shit for it, but I'm confident my wifes 2.7 ecoboost would have handled it better, up and down the hills. My 16 6.7 doesn't even flinch with that type of wieght behind it and my 19 6.7 work truck grosses 35k lbs every single day with out issue. A 7.3, 12v or whatever glorified shit would absolutely hate life, not to mention the trans, frame, brakes, ect. No one talks about how an 05+ superduty will go 300k with hardly any suspension, axle, tcase or trans issues. Try that with your 46re

I do like those old trucks, and don't plan to sell mine, but people should give the new trucks credit where it's due. I also believe they're not as shitty as everyone says. Just lots of guys out there using them without bragging around the internet.

I have a buddy who is creeping up on 300k in his 2014 6.7 ford. Says it's been great since new. He's had 37s on it since the first few weeks, and uses it for logging type work. Not a highway princess.

Father in law has 230k on his 2017 6.7 ford. Just ate a cp4, but he said he couldn't remember when he last changed the filter

I also remembered a member on here talking about a 7.3 excursion he bought new being a total lemon. Blew the engine at like 30k, then maybe a trans early on also. I think the QC is just worse these days, so they either blow at 30k miles, or last till 300k+

I agree 100%

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Meant to say "never actually towed with a newer truck" or really never towed the same wieght.

 

[arse_sidewards]

If you think that's by accident I have some bad news for you....

This. They've got cube farms of Bebops trying to shave grams of plastic out of shit, simplify tool and die costs, etc, etc. They don't care if it breaks consistently as long as it makes it out of warranty consistently enough.

Most guys who say the 90s and 00s truck were better than the new ones have never actually towed with an older truck.

Or they're not a hired hand who's sole measure of better is how comfortably they can get from A to B in a truck they don't have to pay for.

I completely understand that new new trucks are the right move for commercial users who will be slapping some ditch digger in the driver's seat and crossing their fingers that it doesn't all get wadded up. When you start talking about towing 7-10k every day and 20k twice a month and paying for it with your own money the old trucks make a lot of sense.

I pulled a 7500lb skid steer on a small equipment trailer (maybe 10k total?) from 100' elevation up to Tahoe with my 97 7.3/5spd. It had the typical, intake/turbo back exhaust/chip but no intercooler yet. It was screaming for mercy in 3rd gear on every hill, and even had to pull over at one point because everything just got so heatsoaked I couldn't hardly touch the throttle without egt's going over 1200*

You did a bunch of power mods without supporting cooling mods. I know you're stupid but what did you expect?

I did do it without any actual issues, but I can't imagine doing that often with good results like everyone seems to think those trucks will do.

They sandwiched SM465s between 454s and 1480 drive shafts in grain trucks that grossed god knows how much and people still didn't break them. You have almost the same rear axle as a newer (10.5 vs 10.25 for Ford and 11.5 14b vs AAM 11.5 for GM) and you're one or two U-joint sizes up (1410/1480 vs 1350) on the newer truck vs the 80s-90s truck. Doesn't take a lot to keep a 200hp engine cool.

I don't think you'll actually break much on the older truck stock vs stock. You'd probably have leaf wrap related suspension longevity issued though and it'll take a much smaller bottom out to bend a frame if you're bumper pulling.

The real problem is it will be slow, uncomfortable and far from stupid proof and you will eventually get sick of the amount of conscious effort it takes to move a combo like that down the road if you have to do it regularly.

They also couldn't do a 1/4 of what a new truck can. My 22 6.7 Ferd pulls my 38' 21,000 GVW race car trailer like it's not even there no matter what the terrain is like and can maintain 75-80mph while doing so.

Next time you're at a race take a picture of the pits and trailer parking for us.

We've all been to races. We all know there's still tons of 90s and early 00s DRW 1-tons pulling shit.

Some things that have drastically improved compared to old stuff. I think AC and cooling systems are so much better.

Things don’t overheat and AC blows colder than ever.

Dollar for dollar though I think things are much bigger piles of shit today. Key word is dollar for dollar.

I think cooling systems are mostly the result of the SAE towing test standardizing on a grade pull and they're a pretty cheap thing to make better so the OEMs always make them good enough they're not the bottleneck if they care about towing capacity for that vehicle. Not that that is a bad thing.

 

[JD Mark]

Had an '87 W350 won ton dually back in the day for work. My dad ordered it with the 360 and 4.56 gears. 65 was tops for that thing and screaming.

Ended up with a dump box and undertailgate spreader on it. For a good 7 winter seasons, that thing would leave the shop with 4 tons of salt and a plow. Never had issues with the frame, steering, suspension. Finally talked my dad into an F800 to replace it.

DOT didn't give a crap back in those days.

 

[Levigarrett76]

I also understand everything new is junk. After discovering the truck needed a trans, I looked at some Rams and GMCs, but there really didn't seem to be much of an upside. I've always been a Ford guy and the peace of mind in the northeast of an aluminum body is cool. I think it just rubs me the wrong way because these trucks are so expensive. If it was a used truck, I wouldn't mind putting money into it or having down time. Buying it new and having it fail just outside of warranty is a different story. Especially when they can’t at the very least give you a loaner.

This...too complicated, thank the fed .gov for much of it.

I had a 17' f150 5.0 and 17' f350 6.7 between both put about 150k combined on them problem free.

I had a 19' f150 platinum that my dad left me when he passed, I've documented its severe oil use issues here before, tsb's done etc, and got it down to a manageable" 2-3 qts in 5k miles....with under 60k mile son truck. Oh and VCT sensors causing engine knock and stalling, changed two of those...Truck had electrical gremlins, trans that banged and squealed, and howling front end. I did not want to get rid of it, planned on keeping it, especially being payed for... but i saw the writing on the wall.

Replaced it with a 4k miles demo xl stx 22' f150 that has been great so far, my wife loves it but i hate the new additional nanny bullshit features. Motherfucker is constantly dinging, flashing warnings, it has a motor in the gear shift lever on column that will put itself in park if you piss it off...stupid headlights default to auto, electric ebrake bullshit etc.. Rides noticeably better than 15-20's, handles good and the 2nd gen 10 speed shifts great with the 2.7.

I personally would not buy anything made with a build date of 3/2020 thru the end of 2021ish....I feel like that just compounds the issues.

I hit a deer with my 01' f250 7.3 last winter, ive now repaired it, but when it developed a windshield leak and a random rattle i cant track down i found a 2020 f250 XLT 7.3 (build date 2/2020) optioned just like i wanted in MS for sale with 33k and went and scooped it up. I like this "older" style interior much better than the new....but I'm waiting for bruce jenner issues...I cut the oil filters to check for glitter every change enow. Its up to 46k miles. I love the damn truck other than the derate with rear locker enaged off road. Tows great, handles a load solid.


I just wonder how these 2018ish up trucks are going to fair when they are 20ish years old like my 01' f250....This truck still drives and rides like new and i can get in it and go. No it doesnt pull like a new 6.7 ford or dodge. Amazing how tight the heavy ass doors still close and feel, compared to my 97 f350 which i had to replace the damned hinge pins & striker bushings on at 50k less miles. Yea I've replaced parts on the 01', front end rebuilt couple times etc.

But these trucks with 15 miles of wires, screens and 25 computers, I'm genuinely curious how they will hold up being 15-20 yrs old.

Thanks for sharing.

Theres so much more fragile technology that goes into these trucks, I think its just luck of the draw really?

 

[What?]

They also couldn't do a 1/4 of what a new truck can. My 22 6.7 Ferd pulls my 38' 21,000 GVW race car trailer like it's not even there no matter what the terrain is like and can maintain 75-80mph while doing so.

I hook my 97 7.3 truck to the same trailer and it can barely move the thing from a stop and I'd probably die and kill a bus load of nuns at the same time trying to drive down the highway at 75. If it would even get going that fast.

100% they make up for 6.0 and 6.4 issue to much better motor on 6.7. The power is insane even with 10 speed that is much faster and tow better than my tuned 8.1.

 

[Bebop]

This. They've got cube farms of Bebops trying to shave grams of plastic out of shit, simplify tool and die costs, etc, etc. They don't care if it breaks consistently as long as it makes it out of warranty consistently enough.

Yeah.

And like I say all the time, if people wouldn't buy them, they wouldn't make them.

Money rules everything. If everyone was buying a base model work truck with crank windows and complaining about the plastic door handles they would make beefier handles. Same for the CP4 and other known issues.

Instead, people buy the Platinum models and complain the gas mileage is poor and the ride is too stiff so you end up with asses that squat when you load them and active front spoilers.

I don't give a shit, people like that pay my salary so I can buy paid for shit boxes and laugh at the fools who have $1000+/mo insurance + truck payments.

 

[Levigarrett76]

Is there a TSB out there for the earlier 7.3 10 speeds?

 

[CarterKraft]

New stuff sucks...

Ford may suck more than the average but IMO they still have a premium package in comparison to the other 2.

To your transmission problem I would want to know what specifically happened.
"filled with metal" doesn't mean much to me, I am more interested in "failed thrust bearing' etc.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Not sure why I respond to a guy who's probably never towed over 10k lbs in actual mountains, but here we are

This. They've got cube farms of Bebops trying to shave grams of plastic out of shit, simplify tool and die costs, etc, etc. They don't care if it breaks consistently as long as it makes it out of warranty consistently enough.



Or they're not a hired hand who's sole measure of better is how comfortably they can get from A to B in a truck they don't have to pay for.

I completely understand that new new trucks are the right move for commercial users who will be slapping some ditch digger in the driver's seat and crossing their fingers that it doesn't all get wadded up. When you start talking about towing 7-10k every day and 20k twice a month and paying for it with your own money the old trucks make a lot of sense.

You're not doing that in the mountains with an older truck without hurting something. Flats and hills, sure.

You did a bunch of power mods without supporting cooling mods. I know you're stupid but what did you expect?

"a bunch of power mods" you mean a chip that was turned to stock mode while towing?

Intake and exhaust are supporting mods

They sandwiched SM465s between 454s and 1480 drive shafts in grain trucks that grossed god knows how much and people still didn't break them. You have almost the same rear axle as a newer (10.5 vs 10.25 for Ford and 11.5 14b vs AAM 11.5 for GM) and you're one or two U-joint sizes up (1410/1480 vs 1350) on the newer truck vs the 80s-90s truck. Doesn't take a lot to keep a 200hp engine cool.

I don't think you'll actually break much on the older truck stock vs stock. You'd probably have leaf wrap related suspension longevity issued though and it'll take a much smaller bottom out to bend a frame if you're bumper pulling.

Smoked brakes and trans, or clutch is pretty likely If towing heavy a lot.

The real problem is it will be slow, uncomfortable and far from stupid proof and you will eventually get sick of the amount of conscious effort it takes to move a combo like that down the road if you have to do it regularly.

Can agree there

Next time you're at a race take a picture of the pits and trailer parking for us.

We've all been to races. We all know there's still tons of 90s and early 00s DRW 1-tons pulling shit.


I think cooling systems are mostly the result of the SAE towing test standardizing on a grade pull and they're a pretty cheap thing to make better so the OEMs always make them good enough they're not the bottleneck if they care about towing capacity for that vehicle. Not that that is a bad thing.

The point is that the older stuff isn't as great as everyone says. "my 12v would pull a house" no it won't, it was just the first DI diesel to be put in a light truck and compared to a smog laden small block it was awesome. But they had plenty of issues like the kdp, shit transmissions, general dodge falling apart.

Now people glorified them so much, they've gone absolutely bonkers on value.

 

[BroncoJoe96]

Wow, lot of responses here. I'll go through all these when I get back from wheeling but just wanted to drop these in.

Is there a TSB out there for the earlier 7.3 10 speeds?

Not for my year, but previous years with the 10 speed. Sounds like the same issue.

New stuff sucks...

Ford may suck more than the average but IMO they still have a premium package in comparison to the other 2.

To your transmission problem I would want to know what specifically happened.
"filled with metal" doesn't mean much to me, I am more interested in "failed thrust bearing' etc.

The trans wasn't opened up, so I can't tell you for sure, but the code I got, P07F7 normally is caused by this:

"The vehicle may also exhibit harsh engagements and poor shift quality. This may be due to the sleeve in the CDF clutch cylinder shifting axially causing hydraulic circuit leaks. To correct the condition, follow the Service Procedure to replace the CDF clutch cylinder."

Sounds like that sleeve shifts. I'm not sure if the newer ones have some sort of retaining snap ring or a revamped press tolerance.


Overall, I'm pretty sure I'm just going to keep rocking the truck. There doesn't seem like theres any better of options out there, and I'll check the replaced trans near the end of it's warranty to make sure it's not starting to fail

 

[DannyK]

So, would all those who voted "New Fords suck" please tell me what brand new trouble free 1 ton truck I should be buying?

Fords = CP4

Duramax = broken cranks and IFS = super ghey

Dodge = great engine with a pile of shit wrapped around it. And are the engines even that great anymore?

If you hadn't said 1 ton, then I would say the previous generation Tundra. I have never owned a Tundra, but those were supposedly very trouble free. They just drank a lot of gas.

 

[CarterKraft]

If it makes you feel any better...

When people ask me about trucks/brands/problems to try and pick the best one my response is always I'd pick the one that doesn't have big fancy dealership repair facilities . They usually act confused and say they all do, and I say yep

I am service tech for the premier heavy equipment manufacturer in the world and we see a lot of broke shit.
Years ago I was a shop tech specializing in skid steers, I had 15-20 in my bay at all times, to the point I was thinking we had a bunch of junk...

I caught the #1 skid steer salesman in the world one day to question him if are stuff was not very good.
He responds without hesitation when you sell as many machines as we do you it looks like a lot of failures but rest assured our failure rate is right inline with the industry and we have 55% market share so you are gonna see a lot of broke shit.

Lastly have you thought about a Ford ESP?
IMO they are actually fairly affordable when bought outside the dealer.

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[CarterKraft]

If you hadn't said 1 ton, then I would say the previous generation Tundra. I have never owned a Tundra, but those were supposedly very trouble free. They just drank a lot of gas.

A lot of gas...