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Cheap bastard TinyHome design, need some direction

Come awn sparky

Education hour
Look up line footings, thickened slab, and yes perimiter footings on a slab pour.:flipoff2:
I'm in the feild workin:beer:
 
Ok jobs done.
A perimiter footing for a slab is often done for load, like a second story.
Or lateral forces/sloap stabilization.
So you just dig the footers at callout, form the outside to finish grade andtie the steel from the slab into the footings.
A line footing usually goes under a wall.
Thickened slab is a home cheapo way of adding extra support.

Op shout if this is a highjack, I'll hgtd it:flipoff2:
 
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Clb said:
Ok
I missed the roll/ membrane roofing bit.
So disregard the wind direction part completely.
Shed the water away as needed.

.16 pitch is like 3/16 rise per foot ...
2 in 12 would be 48" of rise.
Check the minimum sloap for your choice of roofing first...


The no floor part.
If you just do a vapor barrier shit will dig under, granted @ 3' dept those footings would deter it.
But you said dig till I'm tired and say that's good nuff:laughing:

I don't do " frost heave" but a floating slab would crack pdfq. I feel.

It's $$$ but I'd do the perimiter footings and line footing down the center.

A framed floor will most likely cost more than a slab.

Rafters
This is ALL on snowload calks, BUT...

Doing a half lap/scarf joint is gunna want at least a perlin.
You will build in a sag in the lid otherwise.
Perhaps you sister 2 say 18' rafters?
( side by side, overlapping in center)

fenstration ( doors winders)
You need a door seal of some sort.
Barn doors just keep livestock IN.
Look at low pitch skylight framing first...

Eta
Now you said get an address....
Can o worms time.

Check with mortgage brokers and county thieves about what's the minimum you need first...
Click to expand...


GAF liberty SBS roll roofing membrane, it's what home depot [the nearest place I can think of that has roofing stuff, ace hardware doesn't seem to have any] has on hand and is good for 1/2:12 thru 6:12. Seems like 3 tab wants more slope, which means more lumber, which is the reason i'm shying away from it.

0.16 is what 2:12 pitch equals something about needing a 10% something or other at some point was important. Don't remember what at the moment :homer: if the roof slopes along the short 16' side, that'd give me a 2-1/2 ish foot difference between the walls. That sounds pretty manageable.

maybe wire and then rock instead of vapor barrier to discourage badgers and possibly large mice. the field mice are tiny, or they're moles or voles or something...oh yeah, the not plants was the purpose of the plastic.

slab no time soon, there's no way it can compete with whatever size rock I can get at a cheap price from the rock store. Road base? i dunno, that sounds cheap. Doesn't need to be particularly comfortable. Just needs to be not plants.

for the rafters, looks like the math a page back says 2x10 @24" o/c will span my 16' gap acceptably for the ~60psf snow load, no scarf joint required running them that way. that seems easier than making any sort of other thing, but I guess I can go back and look at what lumber would do half that distance and use that for the rafter instead. Guess i'll brew up a pitched and a mono option and see what the material looks like

the cheap-o poly skylights seem to be as narrow as 14-1/2" rough opening, probably need to box a couple of those in, not sure if they would need to be sistered or what for doing that. Skylights are the superior option compared to windows for brightening the place up. other option would be to cheat the 12" spacing to 14-1/2" spacing across the whole roof.....probably be fine



as for the address, the county claims they won't issue a permit without an address. They won't assign and address until you have a permit requested and approved.


fee schedule, if I'm reading that table right, should be $80 for ag exempt building. more than zero, but less than the double whatever they decide if I go on my own and they add it in. It will also hit my property taxes, and hopefully not very much.

Example: my neighbor to the north has 2 halves of a construction modular on his land, he gets taxed as having however many square feet of residential and pays triple, last i checked, for what I pay. The 2 halves were clearly never connected and just drug there and left. Harder to tell that from the air or the county road though, it was in place before permits were required, so the assessor, i'd imagine, just made up some shit and assigned value, never got contested because it's all been pretty cheap (all things considered until the last 2 years)

Applying for the permit SHOULD keep the county from deciding that my car-house is a people house and taxed at that level instead.

That's my goal anyways.

no mortgage people to deal with

once I get an address, I will also be able to change over some residency stuff and register vehicles. That'd be neat if possible. If not possible or worthwhile, it would help with trying to get estimates from the power company
 
Clb said:
Ok jobs done.
A perimiter footing for a slab is often done for load, like a second story.
Or lateral forces/sloap stabilization.
So you just dig the footers at callout, form the outside to finish grade andtie the steel from the slab into the footings.
A line footing usually goes under a wall.
Thickened slab is a home cheapo way of adding extra support.

Op shout if this is a highjack, I'll hgtd it:flipoff2:
Click to expand...
i'll need to do some maths on concrete volumes and such.

can we compromise and i'll dig and pour some 16" rounds ~36" deep for the post footings and then do a 8x8 (or just use block and mortar) to go between those, knowing they will crack, just to fill in the gap and discourage the voles?
 
alright, going to bed and i'll see if I can get the plywood installed and painted on this tomorrow :homer:

the concrete is 40" tall, 36" buried and then 4" proud, to contain the gravel on the inside. Mostly because it was easier to make a box on the computer. the "poles" are 4x6 at close to 48" on center. The Outside of the concrete square is 16x24, concrete is 8" thick, this puts it being reasonably short for the 2x10x16 rafters to span across at 9* slope (just under 2:12) so that i've got a 7.5' tall wall on the near/short side and 10' tall wall on the far/tall side.

Need to shrink the footprint down to 14' wide to have any sort of overhang from the roof.

shed pole three quarter.png


here is a sectioned view of the "tall" wall, is this something that is doable? are the rafters good to sit on a header board (probably the wrong term) without a post directly under them? using 2x10 in the example to support it. Putting this board on the inside of the posts, and then have 2x6 around the outside to attach the siding to. That could probably reasonably be turned into 2x4 now that I think about it.

shed pole section.png
 
Maths. 40" tall footer at 8" wide gives me 2.25 cubic feet per linear foot. 24'x14' footprint gives me 76 linear feet.

Nets me 7 [6.5] yards, need to call and find out what the going rate is, probably between 1100 and 1500.

8x8x16 concrete block is about .6 cubic feet. Runs about 285 blocks, plus mortar. 5 blocks tall gives me 40" height.

Blocks might be the easier to deal with in exchange for time

Here is a mostly there list for the below drawing using online prices from Home Depot in Utah.

Shed Price List Cut.png


and here is the updated drawings, redone with 14x24 footprint and 10' wide lift up door. Not shown are the big door, man door, trim, window, roof window.

shed pole three quarter.png


This is the inside little over half, only going for 1 pole in the center of the far left wall. 2x4 strips that go around would obviously need to be lined up with siding/plywood joints

shed pole front.png


This one is a bit more difficult to look at, it is looking up from underground at an angle. This is my question if I can do this with the rafters, have them space every 12" while the poles are every 48". The 2x10 supports the rest of the rafters in between. Should be good :confused:

shed pole upskirt.png
 
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Is the 32x80 prehung door steel / wood or fiberglass?
 
PAE said:
Is the 32x80 prehung door steel / wood or fiberglass?
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steel, because it comes with windows and is cheaper than buying the cheapest possible door and window. just a door from home depot online for price making of things. Same as the Simpson post-bases, i'm not sure I can swallow $400 for those brackets :laughing: I can make some pretty miserable to way cheaper

currently looking into lexan and just making my own "clear panels" to pretend to be windows. Glue a saw and some 1x4 to trim it would be just as effective.
 
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Lots of changes, figured I'd see if I can do updates here to keep track of where I'm at.

Shrunk down to a 10x24, ace hardware will sell me low qty of metal roof, so going to go with that instead of membrane. With the reduced size, going to 2x8 rafter ls at 16" o.c. and 6x6 posts at 8' o.c. and 1" lap siding.

Current plan is to have both ends open and see what materializes :rasta:

20240620_181205.jpg


Rented a 10" auger, it's better than nothing I guess. Every time it hits something too much like rock it stops. Process is currently auger, shovel out what it makes, then 35lb demo hammer with clay spade, then auger etc. 30" bit seems to be able to net me a little over 24" of hole.

Rented auger for 1 day, I'll get all these to 24" and then return it. Then it'll be demo hammer and shovels to get the corners closer to 36"
 
Yesterday, got all the holes dug

20240621_152531.jpg


And put about half a small sack [60lb] of concrete in each. Tamped down and mixed in the hole

20240621_152440.jpg


And this is what a hole looks like.

20240621_152451.jpg



Also got my permit and talked to the county guy when he came out. Now the only thing holding up the address is which direction do the existing "roads" go, are we off one of those or do they all turn and we'd be a "new" road. He is going to have to do some further research on his end. Many years ago, everybody was given address based on the last county road. Apparently they decided it was getting hard to sort and started naming the spider webs of driveways and such for anything that passed through other private lots before the county road.

Going to see if I can get all my framing lumber this morning and try to set some poles & see how far we get.
 
Well, lumber yard was a bit of a mess. Didn't have the stuff they claimed, so made some more on the fly changes to the plan. The 1 guy working didn't know where anything was or what was available. Turned into "go drive around the yard, see what you find and let me know you grab :laughing:

Got the posts pretty well set, got them cut to height. Got both ends headers in place and 1 side top rail in place. Need to buy a bigger ladder, the lone 6' isn't cutting it for the high side. Rather than move a bunch of stuff and put the ladder in the pickup bed, I'm just going to buy a taller one for setting rafters.

20240622_174445.jpg


And where we left off yesterday

20240622_203822.jpg



It's starting to look like a thing. Sunday is going to be shower, laundry and hang out with my mom and her husband day. Monday buy more stuff and do more work.

It's been nice having a couple extra sets of hands
 
You'd have saved yourself a few boards and got a better result if you were notching shit with the circular saw and chisel (real good task for children and women) rather than screwing shit to the side of other shit.
 
arse_sidewards said:
You'd have saved yourself a few boards and got a better result if you were notching shit with the circular saw and chisel (real good task for children and women) rather than screwing shit to the side of other shit.
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All the long angled pieces are just set with a nail into the posts to hold them level while we added back dirt into the holes and until the rafters are in place. Those are all 1x4s that will become my rafter straps/purlins for under the roof.

The 1x4 running along the top was used as my level and guide for the chainsaw to make the posts all the same height. The 2x8 along the top, laid flat, is the header for the rafters to rest on and will get some braces Y from the posts
 
Provience said:
All the long angled pieces are just set with a nail into the posts to hold them level while we added back dirt into the holes and until the rafters are in place. Those are all 1x4s that will become my rafter straps/purlins for under the roof.

The 1x4 running along the top was used as my level and guide for the chainsaw to make the posts all the same height. The 2x8 along the top, laid flat, is the header for the rafters to rest on and will get some braces Y from the posts
Click to expand...
What about the pieces on the ends resting on cripples?
 
Ah, I see what you mean now.

Guess those end headers could've been notched and set into the posts. That makes sense and would've been easier.
 
Provience said:
20240624_195734.jpg


Today's progress, measure a dozen times, cut twice:laughing: rafters and Ys complete

Tomorrow, measure and order siding and roof.
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But why? That's like twice as much work as doing it rightish.

Also I would scab on some 2x and extend your overhangs, being that short is going to hammer your siding and build up ice around the bottom of your building. It's also not to late to put eaves on the ends, trust me you won't ever regret 2 ft eaves.
 
speed bump said:
But why? That's like twice as much work as doing it rightish.

Also I would scab on some 2x and extend your overhangs, being that short is going to hammer your siding and build up ice around the bottom of your building. It's also not to late to put eaves on the ends, trust me you won't ever regret 2 ft eaves.
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I'm going to go a foot over on the over hangs.

What do you mean by do it right? You fuckers can't correct after I do something without saying anything when I ask in advance :flipoff2:
 
Provience said:
I'm going to go a foot over on the over hangs.

What do you mean by do it right? You fuckers can't correct after I do something without saying anything when I ask in advance :flipoff2:
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I missed the first construction pictures. If you snapped a level line at the height for your front and rear top plates then installed them vertical on the outside of posts you could have skipped bird's mouthing and blocking. After everything is in place cut your posts to height. That eliminates all of your Ys and need to get post heights right along with the coming sag in your roof.

As far as eaves 1 ft is the minimum I would go on someone elses project that the siding is close to the ground.

You can still cut your end rafters off, drop them between you posts and build a ladder (can even be 2x4s) for your gable ends. My first outbuilding I didn't redo the roof that way and have fought weathering on those walls for 12 years. On my shop I definitely spent the extra effort to hang some 1.5' ladders and they make a difference in building weathering and snow up against it.
 
arse_sidewards said:
Probably putting the top plate in the proper orientation to bear vertical load. :laughing:
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Vertical? You know what's funny about that? Everybody here, in person, has made "1 change" to what I was trying to do.

For example, my wife is the reason it got moved over 4 feet and is not square to the compass.

My mom's husband is the reason the top plates are horizontal instead of vertical.

Ultimately, it doesn't matter. I had wanted to get shorter lengths for the rafters. That was one of the big changes at the lumber yard, they only had longer lengths, so the Y are all cutoffs that were doing nothing anyways. This leaves every other rafter landing on a support and gives more room for nails.
 
speed bump said:
I missed the first construction pictures. If you snapped a level line at the height for your front and rear top plates then installed them vertical on the outside of posts you could have skipped bird's mouthing and blocking. After everything is in place cut your posts to height. That eliminates all of your Ys and need to get post heights right along with the coming sag in your roof.

As far as eaves 1 ft is the minimum I would go on someone elses project that the siding is close to the ground.

You can still cut your end rafters off, drop them between you posts and build a ladder (can even be 2x4s) for your gable ends. My first outbuilding I didn't redo the roof that way and have fought weathering on those walls for 12 years. On my shop I definitely spent the extra effort to hang some 1.5' ladders and they make a difference in building weathering and snow up against it.
Click to expand...
I've got plenty of pieces still for the gable ends, I could go 2' instead of 1' on those pretty easily.

I guess I don't understand what you mean by build a ladder. I was going to cut the cutoffs from the rafters and nail them to the current outside rafter, then nail the gable ends to those.

It'd be nice if it doesn't sag. 2x8 @ 16" O.C. is what the lumber rafter book calls for to withstand the 100 psf "50 year maximum ground snow load" for this area and 10' span.

If it does, oh well.
 
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