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Cheap bastard TinyHome design, need some direction

Provience said:
Used carport would be sweet, I don't think i'll be able to spend the time to find one up there. Might be worth figuring out the logistics of getting one down here and bringing it up there. If I do that and end up putting the trailer behind the pickup and driving the truck & the motorhome up there, figure probably another $1k in cost for fuel. I'd need to believe I was going to save at least that much.


I'm a metal guy, so dirt and wood is all strange to me.
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Rake wall vs cripple wall
Rake is under the lid sets on the toplate.
And or is 1 long stud from floor to toplate.

Cripple is tween mudsill and floor Joyce.

Course we could be in the ghetto fab thread in regards to nomenclature :flipoff2:

Fwiw
It's easier. AND cheaper, to do a short side rake ( left to right looking at the front door) pitch the sloap down with the rains path so it doesn't blow up under...
 
Clb said:
Rake wall vs cripple wall
Rake is under the lid sets on the toplate.
And or is 1 long stud from floor to toplate.

Cripple is tween mudsill and floor Joyce.

Course we could be in the ghetto fab thread in regards to nomenclature :flipoff2:

Fwiw
It's easier. AND cheaper, to do a short side rake ( left to right looking at the front door) pitch the sloap down with the rains path so it doesn't blow up under...
Click to expand...
alright, looks like i've got it drawn up as a "long side" rake.

that's for 2 reasons, let me know why they don't make sense and aren't worth it

1) this has the garage door opening facing South, so whatever sheds off will go to the north and any ice dam or whatever will go north, away from things where it can stay ice as long as it wants.

2) wind predominately goes from North to South or from East to West with more gusto than when it goes the other direction. Based on my limited time being there and using the traffic camera a couple miles away to see if wind is going down the hill or up the hill. I'd rather have the wind blowing on my back, figure the roof would want the same thing :laughing: maybe it doesn't work like that. Going 2:12 pitch makes it easier? I dunno, seems like less roofing material.

I could probably make due with 6' height on the short side and 10' height on the tall end though for the walls. Then to slope the short side, go with the west side/walk in door side the tall side?

rain tends to be from the North/West to the South/East
 
Easiest/cheapest answer is a pole barn. Probably at $7k in materials realistically. Figure roughly a grand in skid steer rental if this isn't a super shitty lot.

Before you get crazy what is your ground snow load? If it's much more than 35 psf it's going to get expensive fast
 
I'll be back to go thru that later ,
for now
#1 deal with ice dam/ flow first.
So whatever you need trumps wind.
Usins torch down or rolled/glued it wont matter.
Be back latet mommas home:beer:
 
speed bump said:
Easiest/cheapest answer is a pole barn. Probably at $7k in materials realistically. Figure roughly a grand in skid steer rental if this isn't a super shitty lot.

Before you get crazy what is your ground snow load? If it's much more than 35 psf it's going to get expensive fast
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i've got a neighbor close enough that I need to reach out to. I'm hoping for a grand he'll give me something mostly flat-ish in not much time. Last time I looked into a rental it was going to be a bitch. Guess i'll have the ability to move trailers with the pickup, but this guy already has the stuff.

Elevation: 6709 ft
Normalized Ground Snow Load (NGSL): 0.015476 psf/ft

Ground Snow Load: 104 lb/ft2
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www.lib.uidaho.edu

2015 Idaho Ground Snow Load Interactive Map Application | Ground and Roof Snow Loads for Idaho

Interactive Map and Report about Ground Snow Loads in Idaho compiled by researchers from the Department of Civil Engineering at University of Idaho
www.lib.uidaho.edu


edit: alright, guess I need to figure out how to read this attachment

AWC span tables

awc.org

Understanding Loads and Using Span Tables

awc.org awc.org

instructions for tables

edit: PDF Viewer

ain't no way it is really asking for a 2x10" rafter to make that span at 50 pounds live & 10 static with 12" on center spacing. There is zero chance any of the stuff in that region is built to TWICE that level.

also attaching ASCE 7



edit3: used ASCE standard on page 72 for calculating snow load as i'm outside one of their default tables. Using the Idaho state number of ground snow load of 104 lbs/sf

flat roof

0.7*exposure factor [0.9 fully exposed] * thermal factor [1.2 unheated]* importance factor[0.8 for low risk]*ground load [104]

nets me a math of 60 flat roof snow load

7.3.4 says "where ground snow load exceeds 20 on monoslope roof under 10 degrees, use 20*importance factor

nets me a math of 16 minimum snow load
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for an unheated space, i'd need a slope GREATER than 12:12 before it would have any impact on the rating the roof would see, using not metal roof. so, whatever then. that puts me back to a 2x10 at 12" on center for a roof that just won't be fucked with, for a 50 year variance in weather.
 

Attachments

  • AWC-SpanTables2005-0606.pdf
    344.3 KB · Views: 6
  • DDJ-148 ASCE 7-10.pdf
    3.6 MB · Views: 3
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Yeah, with 104 PSF ground snow load you ain't building anything cheap. You want a decent pitch roof (somewhere in there you get a break because it doesn't retain snow but I can't remember what it is). The last time I saw 100+ PSF trusses they were like 3 2x6s laminated together for an application you would expect to see a 2x4 truss for.

I would probably pour a footer to keep the bottom of the building out of the snow and build 2x6 walls to drop some heavy trussing on and might as well make it 4 ft wider. Pole barn ends up being trusses on 2 ft centers and poles on 4 ft centers so it isn't cheaper unless you can cut your own poles.
 
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1702263640387.jpeg

This took 42”s of wet snow a few years back. 30’ clear span 10” perlings on 4’ centers. 22 deep, 30 wide.
 
speed bump said:
Yeah, with 104 PSF ground snow load you ain't building anything cheap. You want a decent pitch roof (somewhere in there you get a break because it doesn't retain snow but I can't remember what it is). The last time I saw 100+ PSF trusses they were like 3 2x6s laminated together for an application you would expect to see a 2x4 truss for.

I would probably pour a footer to keep the bottom of the building out of the snow and build 2x6 walls to drop some heavy trussing on and might as well make it 4 ft wider. Pole barn ends up being trusses on 2 ft centers and poles on 4 ft centers so it isn't cheaper unless you can cut your own poles.
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dang, sorry I missed this reply. it took me a quite a while (dang, over 2 hours :laughing: ) to get the code books dug up, read and mathed out :rasta:

The math drops me down to a 60 PSF snow load [if the roof was flat and this was a lived in space], which is close enough to the 50 live and 10 dead load that I can find on the chart, which corresponds to a normal 2x10 w/12" O/C to clear 16'...which goes back to doing the slope along the short side of the building and still lets me avoid trusses.
 
Id call that 3-4 inch pipe.

Bought some 4 and 6 inch to redo my gate posts so my eye is calibrated now.


Provience said:
what size pipe are your corners? that's pretty sweet, though i'd still like to do sides.
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So I have a conditioned crawlspace with proper concrete foundation. The critters tunnel under it… How cheap is sand in that area. Critters cant tunnel through like 12” or more of sand from what I have heard. 2’wide several feet deep “moat” around the structure? With proper site prep would slab on grade be an option?
 
buzzbombxj said:
This is a good excuse to do something like this. It's not like you won't eventually want a garage anyway.
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Eventually, but in a different spot which will require more dirt work. I'm trying to take advantage of an easily accessible spot that's close to level
 
Tiny home around here can mean a basic shed built on skids small enough to avoid the desire for the county to ask or demand you to pull a permit and get taxed for it,

Since the fire in Paradise many locals have bought those sheds on a long skid as a base and built them into what is called a tiny home.

A local NAVY veteran in town cuts the skid runners in what ever size builders want from oak or doug fir or cedar and they build on from from there into all different shapes and sizes keeping under a specific (unknown to me) square footage.
 
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PAE said:
Tiny home around here can mean a basic shed built on skids small enough to avoid the desire for the county to ask or demand you to pull a permit and get taxed for it,

Since the fire in Paradise many locals have bought those sheds on a long skid as a base and built them into what is called a tiny home.

A local NAVY veteran in town cuts the skid runners in what ever size builders want from oak or doug fir or cedar and they build on from from there into all different shapes and sizes keeping under a specific (unknown to me) square footage.
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200sf is my limit. As long as it's an ag building/non living then there is no code requirements and the permit is more a heads up. Going over 200sf should give me an address, which will be nice.

Using code references will hopefully get me something that will last more than a season, that'd be nice.
 
Ok
I missed the roll/ membrane roofing bit.
So disregard the wind direction part completely.
Shed the water away as needed.

.16 pitch is like 3/16 rise per foot ...
2 in 12 would be 48" of rise.
Check the minimum sloap for your choice of roofing first...


The no floor part.
If you just do a vapor barrier shit will dig under, granted @ 3' dept those footings would deter it.
But you said dig till I'm tired and say that's good nuff:laughing:

I don't do " frost heave" but a floating slab would crack pdfq. I feel.

It's $$$ but I'd do the perimiter footings and line footing down the center.

A framed floor will most likely cost more than a slab.

Rafters
This is ALL on snowload calks, BUT...

Doing a half lap/scarf joint is gunna want at least a perlin.
You will build in a sag in the lid otherwise.
Perhaps you sister 2 say 18' rafters?
( side by side, overlapping in center)

fenstration ( doors winders)
You need a door seal of some sort.
Barn doors just keep livestock IN.
Look at low pitch skylight framing first...

Eta
Now you said get an address....
Can o worms time.

Check with mortgage brokers and county thieves about what's the minimum you need first...
 
Dont know I would want an address if given the choice again.

When is a concrete slab not a floating slab and subject to frost heave / lift ?
 
Perimiter footings and slab poured simultaneously/ monolithic.
Read keyed in...
 
Footings meaning the sides deeper than the slab or just the corners?
 
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