you understand KOH is a single event right?
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you understand KOH is a single event right?
Pick a class to get your feet wet in like every other form of grass roots motorsports and move up as your skill/budget increases like every other form of motorsports. Being a single race once a year has nothing to do with it unless you are just looking for a money grab and nothing else.
Rockwood
An Ape
You sure can, and guys do it all the time. You just have to jump through hoops because those series are gigantic. Helps if you're rich enough to buy the team and put your son in feeder leagues where you manufacture wins to gain points on a super license... For example:
Lance Stroll's daddy bought an entire team in F1 and put his son on it. Unless he got unlucky, teammate Alonso smokes his qualifying times by more than half a second (10+ spots on the grid) and generally finishes nearly a lap ahead. He's a very fast driver by normal standards, but not worth of an F1 seat on skill alone. His 2016 pre-F1 "wins" were manufactured wins with top drivers pedaling back to give Lance the win.
Pay drivers litter motorsports history in all sanctioning bodies. Hell, until the 70s, F1 was pretty much ALL rich dudes who bought their way into it, since the idea of sponsors paying for everything hadn't permeated that series yet. Even now, with rare exceptions like Hamilton, most are the sons of former drivers or other rich dudes who buy their kids' way through Jr. karting. There's definitely merit, but that requires metric tonnage of currency to get.
Ultra4 might get there someday, but right now they're perfectly willing to take registration money. The "track" is gigantic, so other than a couple of spots, there's more than enough room for it. Helps that with Ultra4, your lack of talent generally results in a traffic jam, or at worst injury to you and your co-dog (hence this discussion on roll cages). In F1, T/F, NASCAR, your fuck up can easily kill another competitor or spectators.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
That is the logical approach but not the approach that lots of the 4400 class racers of Ultra4 have elected to take.
Pick a class to get your feet wet in like every other form of grass roots motorsports and move up as your skill/budget increases like every other form of motorsports. Being a single race once a year has nothing to do with it unless you are just looking for a money grab and nothing else.
pennsylvaniaboy
make fullsizes great again
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IMO thats was makes KOH so cool. The LCQ, if you makes it, send it.....I dont care if you just bought it all the day before, or begged, borrowed on your house, and sucked a dick to get there....if you make LCQ, you race....
Wfoyota
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Maybe. Unless they lower the 4400 weight class, we can change a rear axle and still be fine. With ultra 4 in limbo right now, we will most likely get our feet wet with the line mtn series. Winter of 24/25 will prolly promote a rear axle change and hope the U4 rule book hasnt drastically changed.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
Sounds like a good approach.
Pick a class to get your feet wet in like every other form of grass roots motorsports and move up as your skill/budget increases like every other form of motorsports. Being a single race once a year has nothing to do with it unless you are just looking for a money grab and nothing else.
why would you sell your tube chassis buggy to build something with a body? this is the root of the problem with the tubing diameter which sparked this thread.
everyone had something with a body that escalated to it being a raisin, exo cage to 'save' the body, then they decide tube chassis, they built tube chassis, u4 started, ooh fun they went and got the safety stuff and peeled out. they are content honing their skills with the buggy they got, slowly working to a better result and for some the elusive finish. they started when there were no classes, just run what you got. they upgrade some shocks, some drivetrain parts as stuff wore out, and have kept the costs inline with their income over the years. so after a decade of racing you want to boot them to a lower class?
sxs racing is so popular because you can roll into the dealership, sign the dotted line, swipe the card to get fancy parts and have a lot of fun. as much as it pains me to say it, sxs is the feeder class you are talking about.
can 4500 and 4600 forcing those racers into sxs and make some changes to race the new 4800 rules to give some variety ... saftety standards, solid axle, DOT tires, 37s for 2 shocks per corner OR 40s and a single shock per corner. thats your entire rule book for 4800, rear engine, front engine, transaxle, single seat, 5 seats, who cares.
no matter how you slice it, there is not enough 'pros' to support the race and keep the hype up to bring new people to the sport.
EXTREMETOWNIE
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Where can i find the line mountain schedule?
everyone i talk to has a great time at line mtn.
it may make sense to reach out to goatbuilt and see if they can print you a 2" passenger compartment. i bet they could making the transition really simple with minimal disruption to the rest of the cars systems
Bebop
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Wisconsinite
Red Skull Member
Goatbuilt can help with things like this, no problem. A few dimensions, a quick sketch, an hour or two of design time, half hour to program, and a an hour of cutting/bending and your new 2.00" DOM cage can be in the ups truck. Hit me up if you want to dicsuss further.
snivilous
Well-known member
Is LCQ even a thing? I've never heard of someone not being allowed to race because they didn't make LCQ, and there's a lot of weird rigs that race 4400 and make it a couple miles and don't seem to appear until KOH.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
After a quick Google search, I don’t see a website just a FaceSpace page for info.
Bebop
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No LCQ anymore
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
Yes and no. In the past, when they had an actual LCQ for KOH, it seems they just let them all race regardless of qualifying or not.
Wasn't that a line mountain rig? They run some intresting drive train combos up there.
Wfoyota
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It's on their facebook. Couldnt find any solid contact info but if you send them a message on facebook, they will reply.
Side note, if anybody has some contact info for the trec series, send me a pm with it please.
gt1guy
Apparently a racist
And there are still pros getting lapped in pro only races, even with all the feeder series. Pro only still has a wide range of skill level and speed. Turning Pro just means you have to get used to getting smoked all over again. Then they want a top 20, 10, 5, podium and then a win if they're lucky. Some Pro's will never win a race, or top 5, or top10.
I guess my point is that if there was a Pro only class at King of the Hammers, it would look very much like it already does.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
Very well articulated. Add in the difficulty of variable terrain, dust, and weather (rain, mud, Oklahoma tornadoes) and you have what separates Ultra4 from other disciplines of racing.
gt1guy
Apparently a racist
Except motocross. Motocross make everyone else look like pussies.
Sit in a seat during a race...............that's called spectating.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
Except motocross. Motocross make everyone else look like pussies.
Sit in a seat during a race...............that's called spectating.
HYDRODYNAMIC
Rock Stacker
I don’t think KOH would be what it is without the spectators who are borderline racers wanting see how far comparable rigs to theirs will make it.
Spectators keep the sport and race rolling by putting money in the pockets of the the sponsors and industry. Once the race is out of reach of the spectators, it will loose interest and die off. Progressing too fast where spectators can’t keep up with the rules and cost to enter makes the race irrelevant.
Racing hand me downs and garage built buggies are just as important as the 1Mil race car teams, it’s how KOH started.
Spectators keep the sport and race rolling by putting money in the pockets of the the sponsors and industry. Once the race is out of reach of the spectators, it will loose interest and die off. Progressing too fast where spectators can’t keep up with the rules and cost to enter makes the race irrelevant.
Racing hand me downs and garage built buggies are just as important as the 1Mil race car teams, it’s how KOH started.
Wfoyota
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And motocross guys are pussies compared to the enduro and harescramble guysExcept motocross. Motocross make everyone else look like pussies.
And motocross guys are pussies compared to the enduro and harescramble guys
Truth
Sean
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Not race related, but I was planning to build a pair of 4WS portal cars hopefully <4K lbs all out of 1.5" DOM tubing, mainly for simplicity of buying tube, notching all one size and tighter radius bends. However, I'm only saving 65# over 1.75x.120" for an entire car (probably over-guestimating 200 feet of tubing). These would be solely for crawling; not high speed stuff.
Am I crazy or should I be looking at mixing 1.75" (for the main rails and passenger compartment) with 1.25 and 1.5" as bracing? Back as late as the mid 2000's comp crawler cars were often running all 1.5".
I think I know the right answer: The added safety of the larger tube isn't worth trading for saving probably less than 65#.
Thoughts?
Am I crazy or should I be looking at mixing 1.75" (for the main rails and passenger compartment) with 1.25 and 1.5" as bracing? Back as late as the mid 2000's comp crawler cars were often running all 1.5".
I think I know the right answer: The added safety of the larger tube isn't worth trading for saving probably less than 65#.
Thoughts?
CarterKraft
Red Skull Member
Makes you wonder the weights of a 2" cage and 1.5" chassis?
Obviously most are gonna say not needed but if you already have the design it's easy to do the math.
Treefrog
Book Wheeler
I've always heard change thickness not diameter for braces.
Sean
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Mainly going off what I'm seeing in "kit" cars or crawler chassis. For example the JHF trail cars use a mix of 1.75 and 1.25. Same with Hulse. I thought Bomber and Fabn801 did, but they seem to be all 1.75". Makes sense though....make those tubes .095, .083, etc.