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Axle swaps besides Toyota/wag44?

YotaAtieToo said:
The problem, like you know, is getting low enough r&p. Although he may be fine with the V6. Some used 4.30s iirc. So 5.29s or 5.71s and 35s would probably be fine.
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This was my thought also.

Toys will get you to 5.71, and old school LP d44s will get you down to 5.89. JK/JL axles only go down to 5.38. If you need to go lower, itll have to be a 9" or 60s, or put in a sami or other tcase.
 
I'd run Toys. They're everywhere. aftermarket is endless. drop out thirds are the tits. if you can hack it, the spring perches are only like 5/8" off if you can deal with that.
 
woods said:
I'd run Toys. They're everywhere. aftermarket is endless. drop out thirds are the tits. if you can hack it, the spring perches are only like 5/8" off if you can deal with that.
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When is the last time you searched out toys? They really aren't easy to find anymore and when you do, people want $500+ for an old junk axle that's most likely bent.

Thats the whole point of this thread, keep up :flipoff2:
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
This was my thought also.

Toys will get you to 5.71, and old school LP d44s will get you down to 5.89. JK/JL axles only go down to 5.38. If you need to go lower, itll have to be a 9" or 60s, or put in a sami or other tcase.
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I don't think 5.29-5.71 would be bad if he's got 4.30s. Same jump I just did on my 4runner 4.30-5.29s with 35s. Works well. But zuks are just higher rpm power by nature so 5.71s may be smart.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
When is the last time you searched out toys? They really aren't easy to find anymore and when you do, people want $500+ for an old junk axle that's most likely bent.

Thats the whole point of this thread, keep up :flipoff2:
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I'll admit its been awhile, but I wouldn't think it'd be that bad.

What are 20+ year old Rubicon axles pulling in for?
 
woods said:
I'll admit its been awhile, but I wouldn't think it'd be that bad.

What are 20+ year old Rubicon axles pulling in for?
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Around here Rubicon axles bring $1500+ for the fronts, and then you still have to re-gear and truss/sleeve them to keep from bending everything. To me, they only make sense if you can bolt them in your rig and go.
 
RE: JL front axles.....


Did I mention that you can swap the larger 1410s in, no extra mods needed.

Stocker on the Left, 1410 on the right.

1410-vs-stnd.png
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
Around here Rubicon axles bring $1500+ for the fronts, and then you still have to re-gear and truss/sleeve them to keep from bending everything. To me, they only make sense if you can bolt them in your rig and go.
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man I picked a helluva time to cut bait. :laughing:
 
woods said:
I'll admit its been awhile, but I wouldn't think it'd be that bad.

What are 20+ year old Rubicon axles pulling in for?
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I don't think Rubicon axles are worth the money. I'd rather risk the D30 front or put a D44 center put in with the retube.

The other thing would be buying a set someone has dumped a bunch of money into for pennies on the dollar.
 
man shits going to suck in another 15 years when everything is cv shafts. :laughing:
 
I was thinking a little more about this, and the tcase thread. With built Sami's kinda fading away and track/kick/vitara becoming the norm, the 9" diff starts to make a lot of sense. JR4X mentioned it a while back. When you factor in trying to get a decent high range out of the tcase, it almost makes sense to just go to 9" diffs and 6.xx-7.xx gears. Basically throw 4.24s in the tcase and the rest of what you would spend on messing around with a tcase could be spent on axles. An early bronco or truck 9" would be in the 58-65" range and work fine for the rear. For the front you could cut down a stock housing or pick up any number of aftermarket housings for $300-900 depending on how much you plan to beat it. Add Jk, JL or 99-04 D60 C's.

It's not going to be as cheap as some $500 Toyota axles, but those are kinda gone and still only gets you 5.71 at best when you really want ~6.50+ for 35s. I think 9" go all the way to 7.40s. Which is exactly the same as running a 4.9-6.4 case and 4.62s.

Crawl ratio would be very similar to a 6.4 case and ~4.88s as well.

Here's all the ratios on summit.

Screenshot_20220410-081551_Chrome.jpg
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I was thinking a little more about this, and the tcase thread. With built Sami's kinda fading away and track/kick/vitara becoming the norm, the 9" diff starts to make a lot of sense. JR4X mentioned it a while back. When you factor in trying to get a decent high range out of the tcase, it almost makes sense to just go to 9" diffs and 6.xx-7.xx gears. Basically throw 4.24s in the tcase and the rest of what you would spend on messing around with a tcase could be spent on axles. An early bronco or truck 9" would be in the 58-65" range and work fine for the rear. For the front you could cut down a stock housing or pick up any number of aftermarket housings for $300-900 depending on how much you plan to beat it. Add Jk, JL or 99-04 D60 C's.

It's not going to be as cheap as some $500 Toyota axles, but those are kinda gone and still only gets you 5.71 at best when you really want ~6.50+ for 35s. I think 9" go all the way to 7.40s. Which is exactly the same as running a 4.9-6.4 case and 4.62s.

Crawl ratio would be very similar to a 6.4 case and ~4.88s as well.

Here's all the ratios on summit.
Click to expand...

The more I think about it the more it seems like my best option is 9”s. For my 16V tracker I want 6.33’s for 32’s or 6.80’s for 35’s.

6.50’s behind a 2.5 V6 for 35’s sound just right.
 
JR4X said:
The more I think about it the more it seems like my best option is 9”s. For my 16V tracker I want 6.33’s for 32’s or 6.80’s for 35’s.

6.50’s behind a 2.5 V6 for 35’s sound just right.
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I know nothing of the v6 except that it came with 4.30s, so it may not need ultra deep gearing like the 1.6s. Obviously it depends on use. I like to err on the side of lower, but I live in the mountains and do very little highway cruising.

4.30s to 27s would be 5.57s to 35s. So add a little for the extra wieght and 5.75-6.00s would be good for "back to stock" but if it's a drive to the trail on mountain roads, I wouldn't be afraid of 6.50s+
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I know nothing of the v6 except that it came with 4.30s, so it may not need ultra deep gearing like the 1.6s. Obviously it depends on use. I like to err on the side of lower, but I live in the mountains and do very little highway cruising.

4.30s to 27s would be 5.57s to 35s. So add a little for the extra wieght and 5.75-6.00s would be good for "back to stock" but if it's a drive to the trail on mountain roads, I wouldn't be afraid of 6.50s+
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The 04 vitara I built for my ex had a 2.5 V6 the 4 speed automatic and 4.88 gears for 225 75/16’s. I still have the diffs out of it and we got with 15k miles on it. 5.62’s were just right for 245/75/16’s on it. They need low gears just the same as the littler no torque motors
 
Yeah, the V6s are kinda anemic. Not sure how much work it would be, but a 9" housing that could bolt in place of the front IFS, would be sweet. I have doubts that it fits though. Mike Hagen built one with a centered front diff and long a-arms, but it was a tall rascal.
 
I have a friend i gave both axles from a 82 wide track CJ -7 to , Dana 30 ,Model 20 that were beefed up a bit Rear Truss , aloy shafts, Arb's and 4:56s and some bracing on the C's he runs 33s and goes everywhere no problem,
 
So we kinda hashed out the available options in FleshEater s thread a bit and he ended up with an xj D30 and ram D44 otters.

350TacoZilla mentioned the Ram knuckles will swap for 5x5.5 pattern.

I'm still trying to formulate a plan for mine as I'd eventually like to run 35-37 roxxillas :smokin:

Anyone know anything about the 94-01 ram D44s? If the knuckles swap with D30s I assume they should be able to fit the same 1350 sized ujoints or rcv bells.

They have the shitty CAD, but if running one in a zuk, I'd be narrowing it and swapping diff side anyway, so it wouldn't be difficult to eliminate.

There is not much info online, but it appears the stub shaft is the same 1.41 33 spline as the D60 stubs of the same Era ram. The only problem I see is that there is basically no aftermarket support. So even having custom shafts made could turn into a major headache if no one supports that stub shaft size.

So then you might be better off putting xj/zj/wj/tj knuckles onto the D44 if you're after the larger diameter ujoints or rvc bells. There are Definitely options with these c's.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
So we kinda hashed out the available options in FleshEater s thread a bit and he ended up with an xj D30 and ram D44 otters.

350TacoZilla mentioned the Ram knuckles will swap for 5x5.5 pattern.

I'm still trying to formulate a plan for mine as I'd eventually like to run 35-37 roxxillas :smokin:

Anyone know anything about the 94-01 ram D44s? If the knuckles swap with D30s I assume they should be able to fit the same 1350 sized ujoints or rcv bells.

They have the shitty CAD, but if running one in a zuk, I'd be narrowing it and swapping diff side anyway, so it wouldn't be difficult to eliminate.

There is not much info online, but it appears the stub shaft is the same 1.41 33 spline as the D60 stubs of the same Era ram. The only problem I see is that there is basically no aftermarket support. So even having custom shafts made could turn into a major headache if no one supports that stub shaft size.

So then you might be better off putting xj/zj/wj/tj knuckles onto the D44 if you're after the larger diameter ujoints or rvc bells. There are Definitely options with these c's.
Click to expand...

To confirm all the info I got I used Rock Auto to cross reference part numbers and recommended parts.

You could try the same with what you’re thinking about doing. Stick to Dana parts and the item numbers should match if they’re the same.
 
It's a shame that there isn't much out there for the ram D44 since it can be 5x4.5" - 5x5.5" - 6x5.5" & 8x6.5" all relatively easily with off the shelf parts.
D30 knuckle swap= 5x4.5
GMT800 unit bearings with GMT400 rotors=6x5.5
Ram 2500 Light gvw unit bearings\rotors=8x6.5 stock
Do they make a one piece shaft to eliminate the CAD like the D60 rams?
On the 9" gearing thing at what point do you have to start worrying about driveshaft speeds for a vehicle that sees interstates? Big difference between dropping into a low gear in Tcase while offroad and running down highway in high range but 7.0:1 ring and pinions
 
350TacoZilla said:
It's a shame that there isn't much out there for the ram D44 since it can be 5x4.5" - 5x5.5" - 6x5.5" & 8x6.5" all relatively easily with off the shelf parts.
D30 knuckle swap= 5x4.5
GMT800 unit bearings with GMT400 rotors=6x5.5
Ram 2500 Light gvw unit bearings\rotors=8x6.5 stock
Do they make a one piece shaft to eliminate the CAD like the D60 rams?
Click to expand...

I couldn't find much on aftermarket axles. I saw some stub shafts, but not much else.

Dutchman and Moser will make about anything for about the same price as Yukon or whatever junk. Only issue might be if the one piece shaft would be extra long.

For me, I would be retubing and narrowing anyway. So custom shaft is a must.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
So we kinda hashed out the available options in FleshEater s thread a bit and he ended up with an xj D30 and ram D44 otters.

350TacoZilla mentioned the Ram knuckles will swap for 5x5.5 pattern.

I'm still trying to formulate a plan for mine as I'd eventually like to run 35-37 roxxillas :smokin:

Anyone know anything about the 94-01 ram D44s? If the knuckles swap with D30s I assume they should be able to fit the same 1350 sized ujoints or rcv bells.

They have the shitty CAD, but if running one in a zuk, I'd be narrowing it and swapping diff side anyway, so it wouldn't be difficult to eliminate.

There is not much info online, but it appears the stub shaft is the same 1.41 33 spline as the D60 stubs of the same Era ram. The only problem I see is that there is basically no aftermarket support. So even having custom shafts made could turn into a major headache if no one supports that stub shaft size.

So then you might be better off putting xj/zj/wj/tj knuckles onto the D44 if you're after the larger diameter ujoints or rvc bells. There are Definitely options with these c's.
Click to expand...

Are you sure that the XJ knuckles can fit the 1350 joints? I am pretty sure that is the JK knuckles that will run the larger joints, but its been a while since I messed with Jeep stuff.

Since you are flipping sides and narrowing, I would likely get it to a length that I could use an off the shelf shaft. The d44 diff should accept side gears for 30 spline, and that would allow you to use a whole host of d44 shaft lengths.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Yes, here's one

www.revolutiongear.com

Revolution Gear USA Made 1997-06 TJ LJ XJ Dana 30 30 Spline 4340 Chromoly Front Axle Kit

www.revolutiongear.com www.revolutiongear.com

I used to think that also, but if going to 1350 or rvc or whatever, it doesn't really matter. If using say an XJ front, I'd be inclined to leave the wms, and with the dodge maybe build it to use the same length shafts as an XJ D30.

Another nice thing is 32 or 35 spline inners seem to be fairly common now for D44s.
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That is good news. Really opens up a cheap axle source for sure. I even tried googling before replying... apparently, my game is off.

I agree that custom shafts dont matter. But if you can avoid being too custom, you might be able to find spares, on the trail, if needed.
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
That is good news. Really opens up a cheap axle source for sure. I even tried googling before replying... apparently, my game is off.

I agree that custom shafts dont matter. But if you can avoid being too custom, you might be able to find spares, on the trail, if needed.
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The problem is that with the Ram D44 stub, you're not going to find much, I guess you could try and use like a gm or waggy inner and the Ram outter.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
The problem is that with the Ram D44 stub, you're not going to find much, I guess you could try and use like a gm or waggy inner and the Ram outter.
Click to expand...

JK axles uses 1350 joints, so that might be a good one to model shaft lengths from. To your point, the RAM outer might not interchange, but you should be able to find cheap inners for spares.
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
JK axles uses 1350 joints, so that might be a good one to model shaft lengths from. To your point, the RAM outer might not interchange, but you should be able to find cheap inners for spares.
Click to expand...

I have not found 1350 ram stubs, so I'm not sure they're the best option if after larger joints
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I have not found 1350 ram stubs, so I'm not sure they're the best option if after larger joints
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If the stubs are same diameter and spline of the D60 rams could you just use ones meant for a D60 and match up the inners ?
 
Ah for some reason I was thinking the stock D60 stubs were 1350 or so
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I have not found 1350 ram stubs, so I'm not sure they're the best option if after larger joints
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I guess it depends on what wheel pattern you want. Since the xj D30 knuckle will work on the dodge C, I believe you could adapt the JK UB to work with the D30 knuckle. It might work with the dodge knuckle? From searching on the internet, it looks like the JK UB is the same pattern as the XJ, but slightly larger OD on the rear, and has ~1/8" more inset. With a spacer, similar to what you use with a WJ swap, you "should" be able to use JK outers. I dont have any of those pieces here, so I cannot confirm. That would still net 5on5 though, but could be redrilled to 5x5.5. Not sure on brakes.
 
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