Alec Baldwin Shot a Lady

[Thefishguy77]

Damn, all my comments from today were lost in the Great Chipmunk Fire of 1979.
Guess I’ll restate them in a single comment.

Baldwin is a douchebag, but, it’s not criminal manslaughter. It was a workplace accident. Unless something else comes to light showing he had knowledge there was live ammo present that could have been placed into the prop gun, it’s no different than your company mechanic giving you back your work vehicle, which then catastrophically fails resulting in the death or injury of someone else.

So if I handed you a gun and said it was GTG to point and shoot at someone or something in a closed set with a lot of crowded people would you take my word for it or would you check the firearm yourself before using your bugger hook to pull the trigger?

I check every firearm handed to me regardless of who handed it to me. Only exception is if its a hunting partner asking me to hold it while they cross/navigate a dangerous obstacle. Maybe I am overkill but I person Dont want to have to shoot anyone and even more so dont want to do it via a mishandling incident.

 

[Roc Doc]

Damn, all my comments from today were lost in the Great Chipmunk Fire of 1979.
Guess I’ll restate them in a single comment.

Baldwin is a douchebag, but, it’s not criminal manslaughter. It was a workplace accident. Unless something else comes to light showing he had knowledge there was live ammo present that could have been placed into the prop gun, it’s no different than your company mechanic giving you back your work vehicle, which then catastrophically fails resulting in the death or injury of someone else.

Not criminal, as in intent I'm pretty sure, but there's still a part of me that thinks it's negligent homicide. I don't know if SAG has firearms rules set out for it's members or if IATSE has firearms rules, (I was a member for a minute but not in film), but any of these people that get paid to play make believe should be trained in the basics of firearms handling and how to ensure the "prop" is safe. As it is now, it seems they put all their faith in the property master, which in this case Baldwin is going to use to deflect any blame.

It's a fucked up situation all the way around.

 

[Yota Up]

Damn, all my comments from today were lost in the Great Chipmunk Fire of 1979.
Guess I’ll restate them in a single comment.

Baldwin is a douchebag, but, it’s not criminal manslaughter. It was a workplace accident. Unless something else comes to light showing he had knowledge there was live ammo present that could have been placed into the prop gun, it’s no different than your company mechanic giving you back your work vehicle, which then catastrophically fails resulting in the death or injury of someone else.

I think you're right, but I also suspect me or you would be treated differently.
Imagine if we're making a film for our youtube channel and an "accident" happened, you think we'd get the same deal?

 

[300sniper]

And

Sorry, but disagree with you all above. There are no excuses with firearms. And there are certainly no carve-outs for a 'movie star'.

are there zero excuses with vehicles? Do you trust the manufacturer that your suspension won’t fall off killing a busload of nuns?

 

[smurfblue40]

I check every firearm handed to me regardless of who handed it to me.

☝🏻

While keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction

 

[animator]

I think you're right, but I also suspect me or you would be treated differently.
Imagine if we're making a film for our youtube channel and an "accident" happened, you think we'd get the same deal?

I tend to agree. Celebrity making a movie accidentally shoots someone? Oh well, shit happens. Here’s your settlement.

One of us accidentally shoots someone? Charged to the fullest extent of the law.

 

[ChiScouter]

Production crew walked off Baldwin movie set before tragic shooting

The workers had been complaining about the fact they had to stay overnight in Albuquerque - an hour's drive from the set - and not Sante Fe because production wouldn't pay for their hotels.

www.dailymail.co.uk

'Rust' crew describes on-set gun safety issues and misfires days before fatal shooting

At least one of the camera operators complained last weekend to production managers about gun safety on the set.

www.latimes.com

If these two stories are accurate 99 percent of what happened is laid out and the blame is firmly put in 2 places. Hint, he had no authority to touch it, and they should not have been left where he could access them.

Upon further thought what rounds were actually in the gun and why still needs to be brought out and examined.

 

[300sniper]

I'm not sure where to be on this deal but...

If you don't know howto operate something, then don't fuck with it.
He was the last person in control of the gun, it should be his responsibility to make sure that he was operating it in a safe manner.

Sometimes you’ve got to trust people to do their job. I’m assuming you don’t do burst tests and x rays of a new set of tires before you head out on the highway.

 

[300sniper]

I tend to agree. Celebrity making a movie accidentally shoots someone? Oh well, shit happens. Here’s your settlement.

One of us accidentally shoots someone? Charged to the fullest extent of the law.

I think you’re wrong and they are two completely different circumstances.

 

[300sniper]

So if I handed you a gun and said it was GTG to point and shoot at someone or something in a closed set with a lot of crowded people would you take my word for it or would you check the firearm yourself before using your bugger hook to pull the trigger?

I check every firearm handed to me regardless of who handed it to me. Only exception is if its a hunting partner asking me to hold it while they cross/navigate a dangerous obstacle. Maybe I am overkill but I person Dont want to have to shoot anyone and even more so dont want to do it via a mishandling incident.

Do you want me to disassemble the cartridge? How far do you want me to go? It’s a fucking movie, where prop guns are pointed at people and fired.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Upon further thought what rounds were actually in the gun and why still needs to be brought out and examined.

The projectile whizzed by the camera operator but penetrated Hutchins near her shoulder, then continued through to Souza. Hutchins immediately fell to the ground as crew members applied pressure to her wound in an attempt to stop the bleeding

Dude, she fawkin bled out, no vital organs hit. No medics on the shoot? That makes the whole situation even worse.

 

[M92PV4U]

Sometimes you’ve got to trust people to do their job. I’m assuming you don’t do burst tests and x rays of a new set of tires before you head out on the highway.

No, but I also mount my own tires to my vehicle and adjust the air as needed after picking them up from the tire shop.

It doesn't take much to check the gun and if you know what to look for the ammunition to see if it's unloaded or loaded with blanks.

 

[Thefishguy77]

Do you want me to disassemble the cartridge? How far do you want me to go? It’s a fucking movie, where prop guns are pointed at people and fired.

Check to see if there are rounds in a gun. Clear the weapon. Shit that I learned when I was like 6-7 years old. Never trust the person handing your the gun just like you never trust the mechanical safety on a firearm.

 

[300sniper]

Check to see if there are rounds in a gun. Clear the weapon. Shit that I learned when I was like 6-7 years old. Never trust the person handing your the gun just like you never trust the mechanical safety on a firearm.

What’s the last movie you stared in?

 

[Sandy Johnson]

Check to see if there are rounds in a gun. Clear the weapon. Shit that I learned when I was like 6-7 years old. Never trust the person handing your the gun just like you never trust the mechanical safety on a firearm.

yeah, true. Even if Baldwin isn't smart enough to do that, the AD should have, and the armorer should have. Of course, if I think back to my film school days, I don't think there are actually supposed to ever be live rounds on the set. Blanks, yes, actual cartridges with bullets in the? No. Then for the AD to call "cold gun" making everyone think it's completely unloaded while he didn't check himself... damn. It took a colossal chain of failures all the way down the line to get that DP killed.

edit also it's generally accepted in the industry that most actors are kind of like race car drivers at KoH- good at one thing and pretty much worthless at everything else, or at least it's safe to assume that, and should be handled as such.

 

[300sniper]

No, but I also mount my own tires to my vehicle and adjust the air as needed after picking them up from the tire shop.

It doesn't take much to check the gun and if you know what to look for the ammunition to see if it's unloaded or loaded with blanks.

I call bullshit.

 

[Stingray]

☝🏻

While keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction

Not disagreeing with you,
But do you think Alec Baldwin has the slightest clue???

his answer will be .... well they handed it to me and said it was ok, It's a prop to him, not a firearm.
wrong on so many levels, and they will hang the props guy sadly

 

[Honky Lips]

Well

 

[Trackerbacker(fvckvs)]

☝🏻

While keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction

If movies did that, you'd never have this scene

But clue me up to speed, why was there live rounds to start with?

Edit

Are they saying any live round in the industry is only a blank? As in she got hit with 'shrapnel ' or did she get with an authentic live 44-40 round?

 

[300sniper]

If movies did that, you'd never have this scene

But clue me up to speed, why was there live rounds to start with?

That’s the thing, there never should have been live ammunition on the premises. There was ZERO reason for an actor using a prop gun while filming a movie scene to assume it could be “hot”.

 

[Sandy Johnson]

For those that don't know how it went with Brandon Lee, here's what led up to him getting shot:



I wonder if a similar chain of fawk ups happened here? Even then, the industry supposedly has learned from the Brandon Lee incident and every production is supposed to have protocols in place to prevent it from ever happening again.

 

[DWT]

That’s the thing, there never should have been live ammunition on the premises. There was ZERO reason for an actor using a prop gun while filming a movie scene to assume it could be “hot”.

Uhhhh...

 

[ChiScouter]

Dude, she fawkin bled out, no vital organs hit. No medics on the shoot? That makes the whole situation even worse.

Correct me if I am wrong but medics are provided at the producers discresion and there is no rule of any kind that they are present on set, but I have never seen a shooting crew that did not have a medic. I would think info that no vital organs were hit would only come from an autopsy and if the autopsy was released I would like to hear what the projectile was. The article I linked said she was shot in the chest, where can you be shot in the chest and not hit a vital organ? How about posting the info that she was not hit in a vital organ and would have been saved by a medic?

 

[smurfblue40]

Not disagreeing with you,
But do you think Alec Baldwin has the slightest clue???

Not even the slightest.

And will probably become an even bigger anti gun douche bag than before because of this incident.

 

[DWT]

Stupid question but why is there a gun capable of firing live ammunition used in the first place?

 

[300sniper]

Uhhhh...

I guess per everyone here, an actor should personally visually check the bore before each take…

 

[Sandy Johnson]

The article I linked said she was shot in the chest, where can you be shot in the chest and not hit a vital organ? How about posting the info that she was not hit in a vital organ and would have been saved by a medic?

The LA Times article you linked said she was hit near her shoulder, which is what I was going off of, could be they got it wrong:

" The projectile whizzed by the camera operator but penetrated Hutchins near her shoulder"

 

[aczlan]

Correct me if I am wrong but medics are provided at the producers discresion and there is no rule of any kind that they are present on set, but I have never seen a shooting crew that did not have a medic. I would think info that no vital organs were hit would only come from an autopsy and if the autopsy was released I would like to hear what the projectile was. The article I linked said she was shot in the chest, where can you be shot in the chest and not hit a vital organ? How about posting the info that she was not hit in a vital organ and would have been saved by a medic?

Exactly, you could easily be shot "in the shoulder" and hit the subclavian artery:

Picture source: Circulatory Pathways | Anatomy and Physiology

Aaron Z

 

[300sniper]

Stupid question but why is there a gun capable of firing live ammunition used in the first place?

I’m honestly curious about this myself.

 

[DWT]

I’m honestly curious about this myself.

Seems pretty stupid, it's not like someone couldn't make something random like a .35 caliber that can't fit any common ammunition but there are squibs and blanks readily available for prop use.