What's new
By:
Filters

Steering and brake upgrades for older tow rigs

I swapped a red head box into mine and it got rid of some slip but did not address other issues. I wondered if “the fix” from ruff stuff would be of benefit on the obs trucks, with the flop.
 
Wilson said:
I swapped a red head box into mine and it got rid of some slip but did not address other issues. I wondered if “the fix” from ruff stuff would be of benefit on the obs trucks, with the flop.
Click to expand...
I don't think the tre's is the main problem. I had the wife wiggle the wheel back and forth while I looked at everything, with the tre's clocked opposite of each other, the roll isn't bad. I'd prefer some type of cross over just to fully eliminate it though. The slop is between the pitman arm and the wheel. Maybe a new steering shaft is in order?
 
Use a 99-04 SD knuckle out, swap to 99+ disc 10.5, 16" SD XLT wheels. Or just swap 05+ axles and 18s.

Throw your <97 alcoas on a trailer.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I don't think the tre's is the main problem. I had the wife wiggle the wheel back and forth while I looked at everything, with the tre's clocked opposite of each other, the roll isn't bad. I'd prefer some type of cross over just to fully eliminate it though. The slop is between the pitman arm and the wheel. Maybe a new steering shaft is in order?
Click to expand...
quarter turn of flop inside the box is normal
you aren't going to get preload on the interface between the piston and the sector shaft, or run oversize balls in the ballscrew
 
YotaAtieToo said:
99-04 brakes would be almost no upgrade for that amount of work.
Click to expand...
I am still hoping someone on here can confirm what I think will work...

I think 2013+ F250/350 brakes are a direct bolt-on to 99-04 (13" vs 14.29"). 05-12 Ford F250/350 caliper mounting bolt distance are different (shorter distance). I suspects ford/dana went back to 95-04's caliper bolt mounting distance on 2013-current.

In that case, may be worthwhile, as long as unit bearings from a donor D50/60 are usable...

Front rotor diameter on Ford 250/350
87-94 12.56"
95-97 12.95"
99-04 13.03"
05-12 13.66"
13+. 14.29"
 
TrailTamer said:
I am still hoping someone on here can confirm what I think will work...

I think 2013+ F250/350 brakes are a direct bolt-on to 99-04 (13" vs 14.29"). 05-12 Ford F250/350 caliper mounting bolt distance are different (shorter distance). I suspects ford/dana went back to 95-04's caliper bolt mounting distance on 2013-current.

In that case, may be worthwhile, as long as unit bearings from a donor D50/60 are usable...

Front rotor diameter on Ford 250/350
87-94 12.56"
95-97 12.95"
99-04 13.03"
05-12 13.66"
13+. 14.29"
Click to expand...
easiest thing to do is to order at the local auto parts store 1 of each caliper, measure the ears in the store and say "looks like they won't work".

no charge and they've likely got them sitting on the shelf, so no big deal to them to pull them up for some numbers
 
TRINDU said:
Use a 99-04 SD knuckle out, swap to 99+ disc 10.5, 16" SD XLT wheels. Or just swap 05+ axles and 18s.

Throw your <97 alcoas on a trailer.
Click to expand...
I think 17” alloys still fit. 2013+ F250/350 came with 17” alloys from factory, per rockauto fwiw
 
Rear axle and it’s brakes may be least of an concern to most, but I’ll like to share this….

Seem like an easy way to put 14” disc brake in rear. just need to figure out the trapezoid bolt pattern and hole location & make a flange to weld on & bolt everything on. ~$100 a side for a loaded backing plate, ~$100 a side for caliper, ~$50 a side for rotors. Or roughly $250 on one corner. Not too terrible if need a brake job to start with.

downtofab.com

Ultimate Dana 60 Parking Brake Assembly 2007 - 2018 Jeep Wrangler JK / JKU 2009 - 2017 Dodge Ram 2500 / 3500

Product Details: Ultimate Dana 60 parking brake assembly Features a hole for the wheel speed sensor (2) required for the rear axle Fits left and right side of the axle New M16X2.00 thread Class 10.9 studs 4.339" ID pilot Backing plate known stamped part numbers: A003D651 180428 Interchanges...
downtofab.com
 
TrailTamer that trapezoid pattern appears to be the same (or very similar) to the disc ram2500, e350, and f350 axles I have.

Many have copied it for their swaps. too lazy to dig up links on phone, but project 1ton fat ass (PBB) and a page called Fordmann come to mind.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
99-04 brakes would be almost no upgrade for that amount of work.
Click to expand...

I agree, I hated the brakes on my 2000 F-250. Regardless of brand, rotors would warp every 30k and calipers would stick periodically too.

I fought the steering too for about a year before I figured out I had a bad steering box, then a sloppy replacement from redhead, then a good replacement from redhead, and sticky ball joints. There was slop in the wheel itself and then not enough return to center because of the sticky BJ's. Made it a son of a bitch to hold a lane on the highway.

The brakes were what pushed me into a newer (2012 F-350)...I looked into the other options just couldn't justify more lipstick on the pig.
 
I just ordered a red head box and Borgeson steering shaft. Has u joints on both ends. Will report back with results.

Edit: Also ordered a hydroboost booster and hoses. The F-superduty unit is getting hard to find! May as well do it all when the power steering is all apart.

After doing more research, all you really need is the booster, the pressure lines and a tee for the return lines. Some guys swapped on the F super duty reservoir with 2 barbs, but that's discontinued as well.
 
Last edited:
my 350 has a chevy hydroboost unit in it
I'd have used the chevy MC if I had it but I didn't so I just filed the MC bolt holes out to where the ford master would bolt on
the plate on the back was all wrong so I knocked the chevy studs out and drilled holes in the ford firewall pattern
ford hoses worked fine, and the returns are just teed together

why the fancypants big name box rather than a fresher junkyard super duty box? SD box has a bigger... everything
 
[486] said:
my 350 has a chevy hydroboost unit in it
I'd have used the chevy MC if I had it but I didn't so I just filed the MC bolt holes out to where the ford master would bolt on
the plate on the back was all wrong so I knocked the chevy studs out and drilled holes in the ford firewall pattern
ford hoses worked fine, and the returns are just teed together

why the fancypants big name box rather than a fresher junkyard super duty box? SD box has a bigger... everything
Click to expand...

Sweet that you got the GM box to work.

I was able to order, apparently the last F-super duty booster off of rock auto. :laughing:

I don't know about over there, but I think I've only ever seen 1 super duty in a pick N pull. I'm also short on time vs anything else. We don't have many junk yards near me, I think there is 1 that's just a dudes property. So finding a box would probably be an all day affair. My last few junk yard trips were a total bust, all they had were econo boxes. Although I haven't been since we moved. I don't think I need bigger anyway, just not 340k miles. $266 for a "new" upgraded box is well worth it to me.

I did see that apparently some 97s got the SD box, mine didn't and the steering shaft said it wouldn't work with the newer box.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I don't know about over there, but I think I've only ever seen 1 super duty in a pick N pull.
Click to expand...
the late model dirt common ones with the space in the name? lots of them that got taco'd frames and smashed cabs
seems every self important faggot uses one as a DD these days, so there are plenty in the junkyards

F-superduties got the same box that they put in rangers, so don't bother looking for /them/
 
[486] said:
the late model dirt common ones with the space in the name? lots of them that got taco'd frames and smashed cabs
seems every self important faggot uses one as a DD these days, so there are plenty in the junkyards

F-superduties got the same box that they put in rangers, so don't bother looking for /them/
Click to expand...

Super duty as in 99+ F250+

Rust belt junk yards aparently are very different from what I'm used to.

F-superduty's got a different box than the F350s?
 
Over the weekend I gave my truck’s (1997 Ram 2500) steering some TLC. All 4 ball joints and retrofit 2005+ Ford Super Duty’s steering linkages. Tie rod bolted in as-is. I thought I’ll need to shorten it some. I had to cut down drag link ends’ threads shorter & shorten the adjusting sleeve. Reamed passenger side knuckle both ways. I plan to machine an insert to make the conversion more permanent and ‘safer’
 

Attachments

  • 55271B05-3D6A-4596-B83E-DEF7FECE6D0D.jpeg
    55271B05-3D6A-4596-B83E-DEF7FECE6D0D.jpeg
    4.3 MB · Views: 51
  • B02B3F3A-1AE3-4E0A-9068-8D55E7302EEF.jpeg
    B02B3F3A-1AE3-4E0A-9068-8D55E7302EEF.jpeg
    1.8 MB · Views: 53
  • 7327E61B-F6CC-48C0-B60C-1E0EE0E60660.jpeg
    7327E61B-F6CC-48C0-B60C-1E0EE0E60660.jpeg
    4.9 MB · Views: 53
TrailTamer said:
Over the weekend I gave my truck’s (1997 Ram 2500) steering some TLC. All 4 ball joints and retrofit 2005+ Ford Super Duty’s steering linkages. Tie rod bolted in as-is. I thought I’ll need to shorten it some. I had to cut down drag link ends’ threads shorter & shorten the adjusting sleeve. Reamed passenger side knuckle both ways. I plan to machine an insert to make the conversion more permanent and ‘safer’
Click to expand...

Damn, you do all the cool shit!

Probably would have been easier to just add 05+ radius arms and axle under your trunk though :flipoff2:

I had wondered about this. I like the way they do the passenger knuckle. Good to know it works. I'm still leafs, can you picture the drag link working? Worst case I can make a slight Z link and use the 05+ tre's.
 
i figured i should share my recent experience fwiw

90 dodge cummins front KP d60 rear chevy 14b with the bigger dually drum brakes, brakes have always been shitty for the 10+ years ive had it. steering is fantastic with the springless high steer arms/cross over and u joints in the shaft going to the steering box, turning radius is awesome thanks to the steering knuckles getting maxed out to stop as the u joints in the axle shafts start to bind. i have wanted to go hydro boost for years but ive also wanted to do a cab swap(67-72 ford cab) for years so ive put off the hydro boost conversion. i finally got sick of the horrible braking power and i gave in, decided to replace everything, booster, master, calipers, wheel cylinders, rotors, drums, rubber lines(including vacuum line for booster), pads, and shoes. pretty much everything with the brakes, the results are more than i could have ever hoped for and im slapping myself for not doing it long ago. truck stops WAY better than it used to, no more spongy pedal and weak stopping power :grinpimp:

i know going with a big brake kit and hydroboost would be the better choice and i probably will some day in the distant future but for now some people may just be happy replacing everything with new parts like i did :beer:

i also bled/flushed all the old brake fluid out of the lines before installing the new parts as to not contaminate them with old fluid
 
Last edited:
correct

should have done it a long time ago but always put it off because i wanted to upgrade, stops great now

forgot to mention i also bled/flushed all the old brake fluid out of the lines before installing the new parts as to not contaminate them with old fluid
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Back Refresh