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Pumpkin Spice Cummins Swapped Square Body

xr-nut

xr-nut

GROUP W BENCH
Joined
May 19, 2020
Member Number
75
Messages
658
Loc
BFK. Bum Fuck Kansas
The name comes from my buddy Levi. He helped me get my '68 back on the road in time for my kids senior prom and is all around a good man. But, he's die hard through and through a bow-tie guy and when I showed him these pics and told him my intentions he rolled his eyes and called it a white girl pumpkin spice sqaure :lmao: So thats what Im going to call it. Pumpkin Spice. Thanks Levi :laughing:



One guys loss is another guys gain. At least that is the saying. This loss for MattS is not really my gain, its going to end up costing me money, but hopefully I will have a cool (to me) truck from it. I grew up in square body 3+3 trucks. I will get a couple pics of them posted tonight from home. But back to Matt. You may have read the sob story ( Fire experts opinion needed), dumbass fil blah blah blah caught the truck on fire. Shit deal for sure. I have been wanting to put this truck together for a long time and knew that truck of Matts would be a great start. So here it is, the burned up '93 12valve truck.

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I picked it up a few weeks ago. Took the plow mount and wiring (that was still good) off and got them listed on market place. Selling them will help keep the cost of the swap down a little. I thought about posting $'s but I'm not sure how I feel about that at this point.

The swap victim is a 1982 3+3 that I picked up from the Rob VanVleet sale two weeks ago. I made the trip out there last thursday and grabbed it up. Pretty uneventful trip, lots of windshield time. Here it is.

irate4x4.com

Jesus Fuck Best truck collection I have ever seen

I want to know what this is going Into.
irate4x4.com irate4x4.com

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As it sits it is a 454/sm465 2wd truck. I plan to swap the entire drivetrain from the dodge, including the front diff. Making Pumpkin a 4x4. Not super techy or anything new, but I will doc the process here as a couple irate members have asked to follow along. If anyone is close enough to NE kansas and needs a big v plow hit me up. :laughing:
 
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Yeah.

I have a 12v in my c60 project and have been himhawing about putting it into the crew but i dont want to gut that project or swap my axles back out for ratios.
But ive been thinking about it!
 
665.0coupe said:
I don't need a v-plow, but whats the story on the dump bed? Going to get rid of it?
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Yes, it needs a new home. I plan to leave it on the frame, bend the frame in and make a trailer. Unless you have better plans, let me hear them. Whats it worth, etc.....?
 
total newb said:
Yeah.

I have a 12v in my c60 project and have been himhawing about putting it into the crew but i dont want to gut that project or swap my axles back out for ratios.
But ive been thinking about it!
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Probably shouldn't follow along then........... this might be the push you dont need! :laughing:
 
xr-nut said:
Yes, it needs a new home. I plan to leave it on the frame, bend the frame in and make a trailer. Unless you have better plans, let me hear them. Whats it worth, etc.....?
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I'd like a dump bed on my 96 F250 fire wood truck, but a dump trailer sounds like a better idea. Are you leaving the rear axle in the Dodge frame or swapping it into the Chevy? Whats the frame/bed worth?? About tree fiddy :flipoff2:
 
Swap an AAM rear and regear the front.

Would also lean torwards a newer trans choice as well.
 
The last manual I had in the fleet gone. At least it went to a good home! I want a ride when it's all done. Hopefully diesel will be back to $2 a gallon. :flipoff2:The plow worked awesome just to big for my driveway. It's full of new synthetic BOSS fluid also.

Oh and if you want to know how good that dump bed works. Man shit right there. I kept filling, testing lifting to make sure it would lift. Don't need to be using a shovel at the dump IN your dump truck. :homer:

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:eek:
 
665.0coupe said:
I'd like a dump bed on my 96 F250 fire wood truck, but a dump trailer sounds like a better idea. Are you leaving the rear axle in the Dodge frame or swapping it into the Chevy? Whats the frame/bed worth?? About tree fiddy :flipoff2:
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My plan was to keep the 14bolt in the chevy and re-gear. I do not know what gearing is in the 14 or the 60, but re-gear to the better one for that combo.

With that in mind, for all the web wheelers....... knowing what we know- 12valve with the 5 spd through a 205 with say 35's, what gearing will suck the least? :laughing: Maybe answer that question once I pull covers on them and see which way to go.

So that would leave the dodge diff under it. It needs a new pump set up, it was inside the cab. I planned to paint the bed, add new wood top sides and pump then hope to get $1500 for it as a trailer. If I don't do any of that......? Can you haul it in the condition I described? Bare frame from the bed forward, no front diff, rear diff untouched? Or would I need to make it a "trailer" first? Maybe this needs to be a phone convo. Shoot me a pm with phone and I'll reach out. I could have it stripped down by the end of the week.
 
The chevy should have a d70hd not a 14bff.

Since youre gona feed it the d60 you should just use the dodges rear d70 also. That way you have matching 5/8" lugs and hub pilots. But that also depends on what eheels you want to run.

Being a late dodge it should have 3.55/4.10.
The chv should be 3.73/4.10
 
total newb said:
The chevy should have a d70hd not a 14bff.

Since youre gona feed it the d60 you should just use the dodges rear d70 also. That way you have matching 5/8" lugs and hub pilots. But that also depends on what eheels you want to run.

Being a late dodge it should have 3.55/4.10.
The chv should be 3.73/4.10
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Just looked under and you're right. Huh. I thought they all had 14s under them. So that changes my plan a little. :laughing:
 
xr-nut said:
.

With that in mind, for all the web wheelers....... knowing what we know- 12valve with the 5 spd through a 205 with say 35's, what gearing will suck the least? :laughing: Maybe answer that question once I pull covers on them and see which way to go.
Click to expand...

I would not go any higher than a 4:10. 12 valves can do a ton of work, but they dont do it fast. Lower gears and letting the engine run free and not labor too hard will let them live a long life.

I switched my 4:10's for 3:54's in search of a little better fuel mileage. Less than 1K miles before I switched them back. I lost all of the power I was used to, and even lost fuel mileage.

35" tires and work truck doesn't compute for me. Makes the truck too tall to hook a gooseneck or throw stuff in the bed.
 
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Johnny Longrifle said:
I would not go any higher than a 4:10. 12 valves can do a ton of work, but they dont do it fast. Lower gears and letting the engine run free and not labor too hard will let them live a long life.

I switched my 4:10's for 3:54's in search of a little better fuel mileage. Less than 1K miles before I switched them back. I lost all of the power I was used to, and even lost fuel mileage.

35" tires and work truck doesn't compute for me. Makes the truck too tall to hook a gooseneck or throw stuff in the bed.
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This truck is done working, it'll just be a dd/ toy now. I have my 04 for tow duty. Now that I've learned the Chevy does not have a 14b I'll use both diffs from the dodge. So no regear for now.
 
I wish that shipping crate was in better shape. I need a driver fender, and door for mine. My girlfriend wants a classic style truck to fix up. I said no need to get another we can fix the Dodge up. Its not all that old but its an old body style. Thankfully Dodge was stuck in the 70s clear into the 90s. She wants to paint it Plum Crazy. Perfect that was my plan for it before I met her anyways so it would match my buggy.
 
Looks like I’ll be a fun project.

As for gears, I’m happy with 3.73s in my 68 K20 Burb. Specs: 92 Cummins, NV5600, NP205, Dodge D60 front, 11.5AAM rear, 35’s (315/75r16). Engine is turned up just a hair and has been in this rig for 11ish years.

My donor truck had 3.55s and 35’s and I used it to tow my Burb from SoCal to SoDak. It was horrible. Granted it was 100% stock motor, but way under geared with 35s and towing ~9000 lbs. Also locked up the already failing G360 once it cooled off from that trip, but thankfully had already bought the 6 speed.

If you’re keeping it a dually, 255/85R16s would be decent if the Dodge axles are 3.55.
 
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Well I got started this last weekend. First order of biz was to get my shit show organized. that took the better part of the day. Pushed the donor in and got started under the hood. Plan is to pull the front clip and cab, then the motor/trans, then the front and rear diffs. At some point then I need the diff from PS to put back under the dump box frame.

Ended up getting the clip off and the cab mounts removed. Stabbed the tractor in the cab holes and tried to pick it up. Nope. Got out my 6' breaker and tried to help. Nope. The front of the cab is coming up but cannot get any movement out back. Crawled underneath to see the main frame for the dump box is going through the back of the cab, above the floor. Its not going anywhere until I can cut the floor out of it.

Anyone want the clip and doors? free. They are kind of rusty and the passenger door now is bent up a little.

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total newb said:
The chevy should have a d70hd not a 14bff.

Since youre gona feed it the d60 you should just use the dodges rear d70 also. That way you have matching 5/8" lugs and hub pilots. But that also depends on what eheels you want to run.

Being a late dodge it should have 3.55/4.10.
The chv should be 3.73/4.10
Click to expand...
Will it make more sense to swap ring and pinions into Chevy’s D70HD despite the lug stud contraption it’ll cause?

Not sure but I vaguely remember 1st gen’s D70s aren’t “HD” and tend to spin carrier bearing races when worked hard.
 
I roughly have the single wheel version of the truck you’re building. Seriously consider cutting the firewall and moving the engine back some. The getrag is a meh. The nv4500 is marginally better but has pretty wide ratio spreads, a 3200 gov spring will help. I run a vintage air system and probably wouldn’t do that again. A diamond eye stainless steel exhaust kit for the 90 to 93 dodge fits the square body chassis pretty good with minor mods. Also don’t buy the gmcummins conversion crossmember kit. It’s ill fitting trash.
 
Aggie06 said:
Sub’D. What are your plans for boxing the frame?
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None? I did consider buying the plate kit from diy4x and doing it, but this thing will not see any type of off road. Nor will it be used for heavy towing. It will just be a driver. Something I can tinker with and make nicer over the years. My og plan was to have two nice cars to leave my two boys. My old camaro and this.
fvs said:
I roughly have the single wheel version of the truck you’re building. Seriously consider cutting the firewall and moving the engine back some. The getrag is a meh. The nv4500 is marginally better but has pretty wide ratio spreads, a 3200 gov spring will help. I run a vintage air system and probably wouldn’t do that again. A diamond eye stainless steel exhaust kit for the 90 to 93 dodge fits the square body chassis pretty good with minor mods. Also don’t buy the gmcummins conversion crossmember kit. It’s ill fitting trash.
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Why do you mention moving it back? I'm going to run the entire drivetrain as is. This truck won't see much for towing anymore. I planned to run the dodge compressor into the factory air on the truck. And the exhaust will be handled custom by my shop. I hope to pull the mounts from the dodge frame and move them over. time will tell.

Do you have a build thread?
 
TrailTamer said:
Not sure but I vaguely remember 1st gen’s D70s aren’t “HD” and tend to spin carrier bearing races when worked hard.
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As far as I know, they're all 2U or 2U-A variants in the diesels. Dana ended the stronger B variant by the early/mid 80s.

One of my SRWs definitely had some housing wear. Did a bearing re&re and the carrier fell right back in again - no case spreader. :homer:

The dually has a bigger inner hub bearing. If it's c&c, the width (67-68") is actually better for a SRW. What I'm not sure is, if the dually got downgraded to 32 spline shafts for 91.5 like the SRWs did.

I used to have a '91 square crew I was sizing up for a 6BT 20 years ago. IIRC The dished firewall area for the V8 distributor is a bit low for the Cummins cylinder head. Some combination of getting the cab up, or engine down should limit (or avoid) cutting. However far you get it back gives more freedom at the front for fan, rad, condenser, and intercooler.
 
TrailTamer said:
Will it make more sense to swap ring and pinions into Chevy’s D70HD despite the lug stud contraption it’ll cause?

Not sure but I vaguely remember 1st gen’s D70s aren’t “HD” and tend to spin carrier bearing races when worked hard.
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Yes you can swap the r&p. Hd's use standard gears.

You can drill the rear hubs and get a hub ring or swap the fronts to gm and all is good
 
xr-nut said:
Why do you mention moving it back? I'm going to run the entire drivetrain as is. This truck won't see much for towing anymore. I planned to run the dodge compressor into the factory air on the truck. And the exhaust will be handled custom by my shop. I hope to pull the mounts from the dodge frame and move them over. time will tell.

Do you have a build thread?
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No build thread. Packaging. The 5.9 is a long motor. By the time you fit a rad, shroud, condenser, and intercooler the gm core support is out of real estate. The factory Cummins ac compressor location will require cutting the frame and is still tight. The 93 motor mounts move a lot. Consider the newer style.
 
I would pick a hub/stud/wheel move that gets away from those coined wheels. That said, Chevy wheel pilot won't fit over a rear dodge hub.
 
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