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Furloughed for one week a month.

1oddtech said:
Would it be cheaper long term tho?
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Hard to say and I don't have any of the data that would be needed to decide. You can bet Boeing is doing the math on it. All large companies do.
u2slow said:
Within the company, sure. The execs can slide saved wages into their own pockets or make their profits look more impressive.

Cheaper airfare for the masses? No F'ing way.
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There is a world of difference between designing, engineering, building and selling an aircraft that is compliant with current safety standards and competitive in the global market and owning, operating, leasing, staffing, and other logistics that go into offering a single seat air fare service and what you think CEO's should be compensated.

I am sympathetic to people wanting jobs and who doesn't want to make a little more salary? I also know that you can't get blood out of a turnip, no matter how hard you squeeze. Ultimately if the workforce and the employer can't work out a deal, the company will go away and or move, leaving the entire workforce without a job. Who wins in that situation. As someone said to me years ago when I asked for a job "I am running a business, not a charity".
 
1oddtech said:
I didn't know Boeing were the ones that charged airfare for flights.
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Wow. Not really seeing how things are connected are we? :homer:

Pony_Driver said:
There is a world of difference between designing, engineering, building and selling an aircraft that is compliant with current safety standards and competitive in the global market and owning, operating, leasing, staffing, and other logistics that go into offering a single seat air fare service and what you think CEO's should be compensated.
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They line their own pockets first, and set targets for lofty growth because that pleases investors/creditors. Then that money-suck is leveraged against the supposedly-greedy union workforce "sorry guys - times are tough - you have to suck it." What is not said is that they have such a controlling interest in their market that growth requirements are nearly moot. Even a plane levels off when it gets high enough.

This corporate phenomenon is getting worse. Starve/stall worker pay to show fatter profits. If they can inihilate some unions along the way - hell, there's bonuses for that.
 
1oddtech said:
Could Boeing just tell them to stuff it and hire new employees non union? Move manufacturing to a different state?
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I believe Washington is closed shop so no.

Your talking billions of dollars, multiple years, and a lot of risk. You have to buy a bunch of new machines that are 1 of 1 and the size of a building or attempt to disassemble and reassemble the machines you currently have. You have to have find a suitable area logistically that has space to build a giant complex. You need favorable power prices. You need an area that can provide a large enough work force that can work at an aerospace level. You need a metric shitload of local suppliers and smaller support companies that can work to your standards.
 
Fishnbeer said:
I was IAM union member for 10 years. I was in lodge 1101, which was several car dealerships. I guess because we resurfaced brake rotors, somehow that made us 'machinists' ...?? I had no interest in being in a union, the shop I wanted to work at was union so I had to join.

In my experience, IAM was fucking worthless. Pension is insolvent, no money left but you still have to pay into it. Fucking union rep was a fat piece of shit and was never around when we needed them. We worked out of contract for 2 years at one point, and when they finally settled it was a miniscule raise that didnt even come close to cost of living. Then during covid we were all working, but the fat piece of shit union troll 'could not be in the office because it was unsafe' so we had no union rep for 2 years.

$110 a month and did not include medical

I quit after 10 years and got hired at the same exact pay rate at a different shop

Fuck that union
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That was my experience as an IAM member at a car dealer as well. Union rep was fucking useless and nowhere to be found ever. The shop steward quit and she didn't even know about it for 6 months. We ended up voting them out, as soon as that process started she was there all the time trying to keep that money rolling in. Had a pretty heated meeting with all the service staff and the dealer owner, he's so crooked he's gotta screw his shoes on in the morning and even he was badgering her asking why she didn't do her job.
 
u2slow said:
Wow. Not really seeing how things are connected are we? :homer:



They line their own pockets first, and set targets for lofty growth because that pleases investors/creditors. Then that money-suck is leveraged against the supposedly-greedy union workforce "sorry guys - times are tough - you have to suck it." What is not said is that they have such a controlling interest in their market that growth requirements are nearly moot. Even a plane levels off when it gets high enough.

This corporate phenomenon is getting worse. Starve/stall worker pay to show fatter profits. If they can inihilate some unions along the way - hell, there's bonuses for that.
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If you know business so well, why aren't you rich?
 
Sounds like the strike isn't going to end any time soon


komonews.com

Boeing withdraws offer as ongoing strike impacts business, customers and community

Boeing announced Tuesday evening that they've withdrawn their latest offer to the union representing striking factory workers.
komonews.com komonews.com

Boeing announced Tuesday evening that they've withdrawn their latest offer to the union representing striking factory workers.

Boeing Commercial Airplanes President and CEO Stephanie Pope released a statement Tuesday, day 26 of the employee strike, saying the two parties were unable to reach a contract agreement. She continued to note the strike in the Pacific Northwest region has "deeply affected" Boeing's business, customers, and their community.

Pope's statement in its entirety can be read below:

I want to share my sincere appreciation for all that you are doing for our customers and each other at this challenging time. We understand that the steps we’re taking to preserve cash affect you and your loved ones. We do not take these impacts lightly as we take actions and consider next steps.The strike in the Pacific Northwest has deeply affected our business, our customers and our communities.

Our leadership team has been doing all we can to find common ground with the union. We just concluded a third round of bargaining with a federal mediator, which included two days of negotiations this week. Our team bargained in good faith and made new and improved proposals to try to reach a compromise, including increases in take-home pay and retirement.

Unfortunately, the union did not seriously consider our proposals. Instead, the union made non-negotiable demands far in excess of what can be accepted if we are to remain competitive as a business. Given that position, further negotiations do not make sense at this point and our offer has been withdrawn.This is a disappointing outcome and not one we wanted. We remain committed to finding a resolution and will work with the union when they are ready to bargain an agreement that recognizes our employees and preserves our company’s future.

I will provide updates and keep you informed throughout the process.



The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers 751 responded Tuesday, claiming Boeing was "hell-bent" on standing on the non-negotiated offer that was sent directly through the media on Sept. 23.

IAM Union District 751 claimed Boeing refused to propose any wage increases, vacation or sick leave accrual, progression, ratification bonuses, or the 401k match contribution. The union also mentioned that Boeing refused to reinstate "the defined benefit pension."

IAM Union District 751's statement can be read in its entirety below:

Today, we completed a second day of mediated talks with Boeing. The company was hell-bent on standing on the non-negotiated offer that was sent directly to the media on September 23, 2024. They refused to propose any wage increases, vacation/sick leave accrual, progression, ratification bonus, or the 401k Match/SCRC Contribution. They also would not reinstate the defined benefit pension.

By refusing to bargain the offer sent to the media, the company made it harder to reach an agreement.Your negotiating committee attempted to address multiple priorities that could have led to an offer we could bring to a vote, but the company wasn’t willing to move in our direction.Through the mediator, Boeing has now withdrawn its September 23 offer.When we surveyed our members on that offer, the response was overwhelming - those who participated said it was not good enough.

Holding the line and picketing is more important than ever. Members are doing what it takes to weather this strike to stand on principle.Your negotiating committee remains ready to continue mediated or direct talks.We will work on a survey in the next week to ask our members where the priorities are. Your voice is more critical now more than ever. We will prevail.

"One day longer, One day stronger" is more than just a catchphrase. It's our battle cry that we must all use as we stand together, united and defiant against one of the most powerful companies in the world.Stand strong, brothers and sisters. We are all in this together. Boeing may have started this fight, but the Machinists will finish it.

IAM District 751 and W24 have asked for at least 40% wage increases but have been voted down by the company. Over two weeks ago, Boeing announced that furloughs are expected for thousands of workers across the company as a result of the strike. The company has said it could face up to a $3.5 billion loss as the strike continues.

The union that represents aerospace engineers at Boeing rejected a request from the company to furlough workers in an effort to save money. Boeing employees on strike are getting support from other local unions like the Everett Education Association and the UNISERV Council, who had representatives out on the picket line Friday alongside the machinists’ union.

Nearly a month ago, 96% of Boeing machinists' union members voted to initiate a striketo get better wages and benefits from the company.Union members have remained out on the picket lines outside of Boeing’s facilities across the Puget Sound region.


The strike by nearly 33,000 machinists now approaching its fourth week, and negotiations also stalled earlier in the walkout that has halted production of Boeing's best-selling airplanes. The strike will not disrupt airline flights anytime soon but has put more pressure on a company that has already faced a series of financial, legal, and mechanical challenges this year.
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Ransil said:
so theses are not Machinists but assembly workers in the machinist union
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Boeing has about 6 Unions. Machinist Union members make and assemble plane parts or directly support machinist.
Here is a list of job positions:
www.iam751.org

Job Descriptions

Boeing - Job Descriptions Click on the job to get the .pdf of that particular job. The first three (3) digits is the job family.
www.iam751.org www.iam751.org

Strike is expected to last 3 months.
 
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www.king5.com

Boeing has no comment on potential credit downgrade, suggestions it could file for bankruptcy

Economic experts say each day workers aren't making planes is costing the company millions of dollars, topping more than a billion in a month.
www.king5.com www.king5.com


Nearly a month into the Boeing Machinists Strike, both sides appear to be digging in for a long fight. At the beginning of the week, talks broke down between the company and the International Association of Machinists District 751. Both sides blamed each other.

With the announcement from S&P Global that it could downgrade Boeing's credit rating, citing the company's growing cash needs amid the strike, some economic experts believe the company has more to lose than the workers.

"I think Boeing, because of its financial troubles, is playing hardball but the hardball is having a ricochet effect on its finances," Dr. Bahram Adrangi, a professor of economics at the University of Portland, said.


Adrangi said the company is estimated to lose more than $1 billion dollars each month the strike continues. That's on top of the more than $30 billion Boeing has lost since 2019.

If the planemaker's credit is downgraded, it's going to cost more for it to borrow money to dig itself out of the hole.

"When they come back online in a couple of months, let's say, they're going to need capital to get back and running. When they try to borrow, instead of 5%, they're going to have to borrow at 8% or 9%. That's a lot more money over time," he said.

With a dire economic outlook, some striking workers believe Boeing could use the machinists strike to file for bankruptcy.

A spokesperson did not comment on the potential credit downgrade or suggestions from workers it could file for bankruptcy.

Citing the company's role in the world market, Adrangi believes Boeing will do what it can to avoid bankruptcy.

"I don't think Boeing is going to go bankrupt. I don't predict that at all, so workers don't have to worry about that," he said.
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So serious question here. What happens if Boeing actually does file for bankruptcy? What does that mean for the union and the workers on strike?
 
reptillikus said:
So serious question here. What happens if Boeing actually does file for bankruptcy?
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Yeah I figured that would happen. The whole "too big to fail" thing. What I was getting at, is if there's a way Boeing could use this to break the union.
 
www.dw.com

Boeing to lay off 10% of staff, delay first 777X delivery – DW – 10/12/2024

The aerospace giant warned in an email that employees at all levels of the company are at risk. It comes as a strike by factory workers cripples airplane production.
www.dw.com www.dw.com

US aerospace company, Boeing announced Friday that it plans to cut 17,000 jobs, or 10% of its global workforce, as it forecasts a significant loss for the third quarter following a machinists' strike in the Seattle area.

Boeing workers affiliated with the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers walked off the job on September 13 after overwhelmingly rejecting a contract offer. The strike, involving 33,000 workers, halted production of Boeing 737 MAX, 767, and 777 planes.

The company needs to "reset our workforce to align with our financial reality," Chief Executive David Calhoun said, adding that the cuts "will include executives, managers, and employees."

In a separate release, Boeing, which reports third-quarter earnings on October 23, said it now expects revenue of $17.8 billion (€16.3 billion), a loss per share of $9.97, and negative operating cash flow of $1.3 billion.

Delay in Delivery of the 777X​

Calhoun also said Boeing has informed customers that the company now expects the first delivery of the 777X in 2026, instead of 2025. The delay is due to challenges Boeing has faced in development, as well as the flight test pause and ongoing strike.

Boeing has already faced certification issues with the 777X that have significantly delayed the airplane's launch.

Reaching an agreement to end the strike is critical for Boeing. Ratings agency S&P estimates the strike is costing the company $1 billion a month and puts it at risk of losing its prized investment-grade credit rating.

Even before the strike began on September 13, the company had been burning cash as it struggled to recover from a mid-air panel blowout on a new plane in January that exposed weak safety protocols and prompted US regulators to curb production.
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RM222 you part of the 10%?
 
Many employees are making around $22 an hour and basically can't move up for 6 years. Does that sound good to you?
 
I have no fucks to give if someone choses to work for less money, some people just make bad choices in their job selection
One could work at Fred Meyer and make $24 an hour
boeing is called the lazy b for a reason
Corey Young said:
Many employees are making around $22 an hour and basically can't move up for 6 years. Does that sound good to you?
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Corey Young said:
Many employees are making around $22 an hour and basically can't move up for 6 years. Does that sound good to you?
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I probably wouldn't be as stoked on making that now as when I was in my early 20's, but you gotta start somewhere.

Also the cement Masons are hiring and they start way higher than that. So those dudes making $22hr could go be cement madons and be making $30hr....:flipoff2:
 
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