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Buggy Build Rear Steer Stupidity Check

If you're going to do a D70, I'd look for a different donor. Those diffs are just huge with no real benefit over a standard D70, may as well go D80.

Although if you dropped the money on an arb for it, i believe it will not swap over to a standard (non HD) D70.
 
Tech Tim said:
The late model '98+ carriers and ring gears have the R.G. bolts go into the back of the gear like a standard ring gear. The pinion also has a larger splined section. iirc 27 to 29 spline.
Click to expand...

Is the carrier larger then?

The problem with that is then you have a somewhat scarce diff?

Tech Tim said:
I'm a fan of the 9.5" for Land Cruiser applications or those who want to stay Toyota. Beyond that, the 9"/10" platform has many more benefits.
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Its a nice option to jump up from an 8" and not have to source custom locker, side gears or whatever. I just sold a set of 9.5s and they were pretty sweet. If the po had done FJ80 outters I would have kept them, but the mini truck steering angle sucks :laughing:

Tech Tim said:
It's too bad we can't get one of the bigger axle companies to come out with a Hi 9/10 3rd and supporting gear sets for the masses. Currie and Yukon would be the first to come to mind.
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A gearset that was sub $500 vs $1400 would be a game changer alone. The gearworks case is very reasonably priced already.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Is the carrier larger then?

The problem with that is then you have a somewhat scarce diff?
Click to expand...

I forgot to mention, the 98+ rear diff also has 32 spline axle shafts.

Same size diff, the bolt pattern is moved to out on the flange:
1990-1997 - 80 series LC (FF) - RD142 - 30 spline (1.31" dia) - RG bolt circle dia = 12 x 6.14" (156mm)
1998-2006 - 100 series LC (FF) - RD152 - 32 spline (1.37" dia) - RG bolt circle dia = 12 x 6.85" (174mm)

ARB lists all the pre-'98 LC ring gears at 8.9" OD and lists the '98+ LC rear ring gear at 9.5" OD.


YotaAtieToo said:
A gearset that was sub $500 vs $1400 would be a game changer alone. The GW case is very reasonably priced already.
Click to expand...

Sub-$600 for the Gearworks case, this is pretty good. Didn't realize they are that low.

So what gear ratio does everyone want??? :laughing::laughing::laughing:
 
Tech Tim said:
I forgot to mention, the 98+ rear diff also has 32 spline axle shafts.

Same size diff, the bolt pattern is moved to out on the flange:
1990-1997 - 80 series LC (FF) - RD142 - 30 spline (1.31" dia) - RG bolt circle dia = 12 x 6.14" (156mm)
1998-2006 - 100 series LC (FF) - RD152 - 32 spline (1.37" dia) - RG bolt circle dia = 12 x 6.85" (174mm)

ARB lists all the pre-'98 LC ring gears at 8.9" OD and lists the '98+ LC rear ring gear at 9.5" OD.




Sub-$600 for the Gearworks case, this is pretty good. Didn't realize they are that low.

So what gear ratio does everyone want??? :laughing::laughing::laughing:
Click to expand...

Ya, I was surprised also. Their lp 3rd is cheaper than a lot of other nodular 3rds

5.38ish makes the most sense, but I'd like to see 6.20 become more popular.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Ya, I was surprised also. Their lp 3rd is cheaper than a lot of other nodular 3rds
Click to expand...
And...you can get it with a load bolt. Moser/Strange don't even offer that option in nodular...only aluminum.
 
Tech Tim said:
The late model '98+ carriers and ring gears have the R.G. bolts go into the back of the gear like a standard ring gear. The pinion also has a larger splined section. iirc 27 to 29 spline.

I'm a fan of the 9.5" for Land Cruiser applications or those who want to stay Toyota. Beyond that, the 9"/10" platform has many more benefits.

It's too bad we can't get one of the bigger axle companies to come out with a Hi 9/10 3rd and supporting gear sets for the masses. Currie and Yukon would be the first to come to mind.
Click to expand...
And just to be clear....I like everything about the Ford 9" except the LP's really low driveshaft location. Well, and apparent lack of reasonably priced selectable lockers that have good locking collar engagement.
 
Tech Tim said:
I forgot to mention, the 98+ rear diff also has 32 spline axle shafts.

Same size diff, the bolt pattern is moved to out on the flange:
1990-1997 - 80 series LC (FF) - RD142 - 30 spline (1.31" dia) - RG bolt circle dia = 12 x 6.14" (156mm)
1998-2006 - 100 series LC (FF) - RD152 - 32 spline (1.37" dia) - RG bolt circle dia = 12 x 6.85" (174mm)

ARB lists all the pre-'98 LC ring gears at 8.9" OD and lists the '98+ LC rear ring gear at 9.5" OD.




Sub-$600 for the Gearworks case, this is pretty good. Didn't realize they are that low.

So what gear ratio does everyone want??? :laughing::laughing::laughing:
Click to expand...

5:38, 5.40, 5.43 seem to be the most common choices for the specialty 4x4 ratios.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
If you're going to do a D70, I'd look for a different donor. Those diffs are just huge with no real benefit over a standard D70, may as well go D80.

Although if you dropped the money on an arb for it, i believe it will not swap over to a standard (non HD) D70.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure I follow this. The D70 uses the same cover as a D60....while the tubes are bigger and the casting is bulkier, it's not really that much bigger than the D60. What am I missing?
 
Sean said:
I'm not sure I follow this. The D70 uses the same cover as a D60....while the tubes are bigger and the casting is bulkier, it's not really that much bigger than the D60. What am I missing?
Click to expand...
I have a Ford E-series D60, 70s Dodge M40 D70 and 90s Dodge D80 all sitting in my yard.

The 70 has a much more chonky boat anchor of a housing than a 60, very close to the same as an 80.

If you were to track down one of the "smooth bottom" D70s (someone who knows what vehicles they came in should chime in with that info) then that would be much better for an off road application.
 
arse_sidewards said:
I have a Ford E-series D60, 70s Dodge M40 D70 and 90s Dodge D80 all sitting in my yard.

The 70 has a much more chonky boat anchor of a housing than a 60, very close to the same as an 80.

If you were to track down one of the "smooth bottom" D70s (someone who knows what vehicles they came in should chime in with that info) then that would be much better for an off road application.
Click to expand...
I have a 70-2U sitting on the back porch and yeah, it's bigger than a 60...but not nearly as big as the 80 under my 3/4T 2002 Dodge. Is the 2U that much smaller than a regular 70?
 
IDK. I can never keep the D70 stuff straight in my mind. I know there's a couple different degrees of heavy duty and I'm not sure how the smooth one is related to them or which one I have.

Which one is a 2U?
 
arse_sidewards said:
IDK. I can never keep the D70 stuff straight in my mind. I know there's a couple different degrees of heavy duty and I'm not sure how the smooth one is related to them or which one I have.

Which one is a 2U?
Click to expand...
Prevalent in 94-2002 3/4T SRW auto equipped Dodge Cummins
 
Sean said:
I'm not sure I follow this. The D70 uses the same cover as a D60....while the tubes are bigger and the casting is bulkier, it's not really that much bigger than the D60. What am I missing?
Click to expand...

Just lots of extra bulk in the casting, uses a D80 carrier, plus 4x500 tubes. Probably good for wieght carrying ability, but very little benefit in the offroad world.

You're right on the same cover, but my e350 D60u also used the same cover, but I actually had to grind 1/4" off of it so it didn't hang down.

arse_sidewards said:
I have a Ford E-series D60, 70s Dodge M40 D70 and 90s Dodge D80 all sitting in my yard.

The 70 has a much more chonky boat anchor of a housing than a 60, very close to the same as an 80.

If you were to track down one of the "smooth bottom" D70s (someone who knows what vehicles they came in should chime in with that info) then that would be much better for an off road application.
Click to expand...

Early to mid 80s Ford had them in a 35 spline, but more common would be 90s Dodge.
 
Sean said:
5:38, 5.40, 5.43 seem to be the most common choices for the specialty 4x4 ratios.
Click to expand...
Isn't that cause there isn't much options for lower? 6.5-7 somethings would be cool. Few guys run 7.17's and it's pretty dang nice for a wheeler.
 
Weasel said:
Isn't that cause there isn't much options for lower? 6.5-7 somethings would be cool. Few guys run 7.17's and it's pretty dang nice for a wheeler.
Click to expand...

My friend has 6.17s and they've held up well enough but honestly it's a little too low IMHO and I'm a Toyota guy. It's a pretty simple 4.3/th350/4-1 300

I always though the low 5 ratios were the sweet spot between strength and reduction. When the pinion has less teeth there's less tooth engagement.
 
Weasel said:
Isn't that cause there isn't much options for lower? 6.5-7 somethings would be cool. Few guys run 7.17's and it's pretty dang nice for a wheeler.
Click to expand...
No idea....it's just what's most common from the high end folks like GW and TH9.
 
Weasel said:
Isn't that cause there isn't much options for lower? 6.5-7 somethings would be cool. Few guys run 7.17's and it's pretty dang nice for a wheeler.
Click to expand...
Pinion size smaller than a yota R&P.

pass.
 
arse_sidewards said:
I have a Ford E-series D60, 70s Dodge M40 D70 and 90s Dodge D80 all sitting in my yard.

The 70 has a much more chonky boat anchor of a housing than a 60, very close to the same as an 80.

If you were to track down one of the "smooth bottom" D70s (someone who knows what vehicles they came in should chime in with that info) then that would be much better for an off road application.
Click to expand...
The smooth bottom 70U’s came in F350’s from like 74 up to when they switched over to Sterling in the 80s with some overlap. The SRW ones were only from 79 up. I just sold one a while back, listed it on here and nobody showed the slightest bit of interest in it.
 
JR4X said:
The smooth bottom 70U’s came in F350’s from like 74 up to when they switched over to Sterling in the 80s with some overlap. The SRW ones were only from 79 up. I just sold one a while back, listed it on here and nobody showed the slightest bit of interest in it.
Click to expand...
Mouth breathers just want to weld a kit onto a 14B

If I didn't have an 80 on the shelf or got off road more than once a year I'd be all over one at like $150.
 
Bebop said:
Mouth breathers don't want to do the work twice.
Click to expand...

:shaking:

Not everyone wants a boat anchor of an axle that requires stepping up 3" of tire size to make up for.

Can you please take a break from shitting up literally every single tech topic with Reddit engineer "if you spend 3x as much to install X and then redesign half the vehicle to make up for the tradeoffs you can get 5% more Y" type commentary. Not every build needs an LS swap, 3.0 bypasses and links fit for a monster truck. Fuck off with that shit. If we wanted to hear opinions like yours we'd go to Reddit and get that shit straight from the source.
 
Jeebus christ! You guys are worse than my kids.:flipoff2:

I considered just going to 7.17s in my current axles. I really like the idea of going to portals to get down in the 8-1 range. I think most don't see the benefit of going that low, but they are still stuck on old non-od transmissions. Most transmissions with overdrive can't make use of the taller 5-1 or up rear end gearing when in high range and going fast in the dirt. Your just lugging the engine constantly. Going to a newer trans with OD and a lower 1st as well as deep axle gearing reduces the need for t-case gearing, and increases your rpm in high range. You could actually use all the gears in the trans when in the desert for once. Also might have higher speeds in low range when in between obstacles on the trail. Unfortunately I can't afford portals and 7.17 gears don't seem like the strongest idea.

I do like the ability of the 9" to run 6.20 gears, and that actually might be an option. With the gear cut of the 9" I don't know that they loose as much strength when going lower as compared to a dana axle. The 9", while more expensive to build than just building an 05+SD axle itself, the third is still pretty reasonable for a low pinion basic 9" third that could be upgraded later on. The housing seems to be the major expense, but its better ground clearance and lighter weight, plus ease of fabricating link mounts and steering might make up for the expense.
 
I guess it's on what you do but the 7 17s have held up well for the crawler dudes here. Another buddy did chip a tooth but he was running the havoc event in Idaho. Replaced and seems to be doing good since then.

No I wouldn't race them but not everyone rams trees at 50mph either.

:flipoff2:
 
Bebop said:
Portals
Flipped LP9s
Problem also solved
Click to expand...
Heck, at that point I'd just use some low pinion toy 8" and get a better air locker out of the deal. I wonder how heavy the portal box stuff is vs SD05+ parts?
 
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