bought a house from 1910

[88mitsu]

;n196503]Couple pictures of the roof, dunno what all I was trying to show

third is of the gussets, I'm using 1-1/4" drywall screws to hold them on, I was thinking I'd get some 2" wood screws for it, but these seem to be able to pull themselves in past the head, so why bother with more holding power than the OSB will handle...
Might glue them on with doing final assembly

will be adding in the usual zig-zag cross bracing in there too so that the triangles are smaller and many instead of large and singular

Get a harbor garbage 21 degree nail gun for $100 and nail the shit out of it.

Do any wheelies with the bobcat yet?

 

[billybob_81067]

;n196534]I'm always disappointed in how slowly everything goes
it all fits in a 15 minute youtube video, after all

Yeah everything I do takes forever to get done... Sometimes even longer... Don't believe the youtube videos or home renovation shows. They either have a crew of 50 working on something to knock it out in a week, or they cut some major corners...

 

[D Nelly]

When a roof sags like that it's almost always because the walls have blown out from where they're supposed to be. If that's your case you might have to draw them back together to get the ridge back up. Collar ties are your friend once you get it back together

 

[[486]]

Get a harbor garbage 21 degree nail gun for $100 and nail the shit out of it.

Do any wheelies with the bobcat yet?

funny you mention nailing them
I remembered I had a nice bucket of subfloor nails that had gotten wet and the paper fell off so I figured I'd nail the next one I did by hand.
Second plate, managed to smash two fingers at once
second to last plate I realize that one of the braces fell down before I got all the nails in, and now needs to be un-nailed (luckily I've got one of them old bridgeport #56 (or whatever) nail pullers) so that I can line it back up again
after I get that fuckshow fixed I see my M12 drill on the floor, managed to break the case on one of my 4AH batteries

So, not only did it take a lot longer, I had to wear earmuffs, I smashed my fingers, broke an expensive ass battery, and got real tired doing it. Probably the first time in this whole remodel using nails, been using screws the whole time, got a few 25lb pails for $20 each from a nice gentleman. Fuck nails.

Actually got a nailer I could borrow from my dad, and just picked up a whole case of subfloor nails for it at a garage sale, just all that was 70 miles south of me, and I don't have a compressor up there yet.

did get the bobcat way fuckin' stuck last spring, multiple times, made a thread on the old board about it in fact

 

[[486]]

When a roof sags like that it's almost always because the walls have blown out from where they're supposed to be. If that's your case you might have to draw them back together to get the ridge back up. Collar ties are your friend once you get it back together

I'm fairly sure it did that, along with the rafters just sagging along their entire length
also, the top joint between the two rafters was nice and tight full width, not pulled apart at the bottom like I'd expect from something like you describe

When I jack it up they do in fact pull apart and I jam some 1/2" osb in the gap to get the proper height. The shingles on the ridge are probably tearing and sad, but there isn't visible light or water yet and it's been snowing just about every day.

As with everything on this remodel, square and plumb are relative. It's better than it was, but not as good as it could be.

Regarding the collar ties, I looked at them in the store and immediately decided that bedframe angle iron was cheaper, made up some brackets outta that and hey presto

 

[[486]]

now some pictures (doing this separate because it will eat my carefully hand crafted post from time to time. Fuck I miss vB2 forums)

First pic is the contents of the swanky artisanal faux-OSB veneer cabinetry
Monitor is real deal 9-pin EGA with screen burn-in from a bank or something down in the cities

second pic, the partially braced one was the first I jacked up, then the fully braced one is the first I put fully together, figure I'll go back and reposition the semi-braced one after getting the two others up and level

third and fourth are my lovely jack setup for one of them, the bobcat is actually terrible to jack on for the same reason it is terrible for leveling dirt, it rocks forward and back real bad, finally figured that one out after catching flying bits a couple times and tossed a floor jack under the bobcat. Side bracing is sometimes necessary.

fifth pic is the completed one I used FUCKING NAILS on
you can also see the other two in the background

 

[[486]]

okie dokie
first pic is a look at the angle iron hurricane ties, because cheap bastard
eave vents crudely blocked because squirrels, and it makes it easier to heat

second pic is one of the upstairs walls, third is what I did to the first side with individual panels for all of the bays and one length of plywood longways for rigidity, this time I stuck a 4x8 up there across all of them, then filled in the gaps at the top piecemeal. Also remembered to jack up this side so it was straight before screwing all that sheeting on there, much nicer than the 1/4" of droop on the other wall in the second picture. Other side is drywalled nice so I ain't gonna go back and straighten it. This side luckily is still ugly and cracked (see a few posts back for pictures of the other side)
there was no cross bracing between the rafters, so mice could transit from the attic down the walls. I'm fixing that slowly as I enclose the walls, also scabbing over all the electrical wiring holes in studs. Fuck mice.

On to the bathroom of horrors. Know you're in for a good time when you've got a carpeted bathroom. Ripped out some of the walls earlier in order to flatten out the second floor's... floor.

 

[[486]]

Gave the toilet a good solid yank, it's out in the front yard now, all those open spaces were stuffed full of moldy cardboard and about 50lbs of rugs
the cardboard was burned, and the worst/smallest of the rugs were burned. I'm saving all the bigger carpet scraps for filter fabric when I'm doing the drain tile. Also figure on using it as geostabilization fabric on another few future projects, but that'll involve some dumpster diving to get the amount needed. Unrelated tangent!

Knocked off (and saved) the tile, note how some of the backing is painted and rotten. Farmer died 20 years before his wife, she was doing the best she could to keep the place together, then it sat vacant for almost ten years. Anyways, saved the tile because I saw a video on assembling freestanding concrete arches without formwork by sticking tiles together with plaster of paris, kinda want to try that some time. Yanked the tub outta there and while nothing was in there at the moment, fucking squirrels.

Tore down more paneling and such, separated the sink plumbing with nothing more than a yank. Some nice plywood in here, the paneling is all fire food because the constant humidity took its toll on the glue, but the 5/8" shit behind it is all nice and solid. Real fine layers on it too, at least like 8 plies.

On to the cieling. Fucking blow-in insulation. Even better than the rest of the house, this shit got wet a lot so it's all really dark from the lovely 'black mold' boogeyman. Luckily I've got hard earned experience with this dusty shit, elsewhere in the house there was a lovely mix of cellulose and vermiculite (starring other boogeyman asbestos!). Learned that you box it in, seal the doors and then blow that shit out a window to make a vacuum in the area you're working in. More pics of that next post, gotta piss.

 

[[486]]

got the A/C condensing unit fan screwed to the window frame, the '220, 221 whatever it takes' is coming from a piece of 14ga romex jammed into the 50a stove outlet
used the plywood and panelling to seal in the room as best I could to keep the dust contained

then out comes the shovel to smite the 1/4" plywood from the ceiling with a fury only having had to do this for the entire rest of the house will bring.
From a distance of course, but did still end up getting the poop on me. All the rest of the shit I was doing with a 12" flat bar and a 3lb hand sledge, that was... last winter. Huh. Guess I've had the place a year now. Spent most of the summer sorting out the barn and shit.

Anyways, next sheet was neatly bisected by the back wall there. all that's there is 1/4" panelling. The last untouched room will soon be soiled. Just had to clear it out, as it had accumulated all the various shit that unused clean space does.

Opened one of the windows and found a bunch of wasps huddled around a big wasp. Scared the shit outta me until I realized they were moving with all the fury a cold blooded fuckstain can at 45 degrees, so I hit them with the brake clean. Made sure to get the big one too because fuck dealing with its spawn next year. Fucking bees.

Will summarize future goings on next post as the shit forum software loves eating long posts

 

[[486]]

Okay, so plans for the immediate future are to get the cieling joists (second floor floor joists?) exposed so I can get them all scabbed together real good in preparation for the floor coming out. The first floor floor. Right now the building is on a poured perimiter foundation that goes maybe 6" into the dirt. Almost no steel in the thing, certainly nothing long enough to stop the massive amount of breaks in it. Frost line up here is nominally 54", but it'll freeze to 7' pretty regular so I'm shooting for at least 6' footings. Plan to do a full perimeter, in 10' or thereabouts sections. Normal perimeter drain, then backfill the excavated clay with sand, basement included, and then pour a concrete floor. Planning on pouring the walls, too.

anyways, figuring I'll make the footing 8" thick, 24" wide, and then make the stem walls 6" thick, all of this with a lot of 3/8" rebar in it. I figure on the small rebar because then I can run a lot more of it for the money. Kinda like the wire mesh, except not near as hard to keep in the middle of the pour.
Thinking 4 sticks in the footing, then a 16" grid through the walls. 6" long L bends at the bottom ends of the uprights to keep them from pulling out.
Going to run a vapor barrier around the footing because the wall above grade will be one with the stem wall which will be one with the footing. Should I run the vapor barrier up the inside of the wall too? Figuring on insulating with whatever EPS foam I can get from flat-roof job dumpsters.

Slab will be poured floating inside the walls, as I figure if I poured it atop the stem walls, then put the walls atop it I'd run into the walls cracking if it ever heaved or settled. I've done almost none of this before, I've just got a little electric mixer and retard skeleton-man strength.

Alternatively I could just do some post footings and frame out the walls as though it were a post-frame building. Same sand backfill and floating slab. Hundred times easier, but stuck with shitty pole barn walls instead of nice poured concrete. The hundred times easier really speaks loudly to me though, especially since I'm going to need to dig the new footing by hand basically directly underneath the existing one. Thinking I'll be helped by the ground freezing but that might not be a help.

Now it's your turn, you all better give some sort of response. I'm disappointed that a single picture of some rubber dicks got 100X the response of this thread, and all with zero fucking effort.

 

[M92PV4U]

Sounds good to me but I have zero fucking clue about fixing up houses.

 

[88mitsu]

does it have a basement now?

i know nothing about basements or footers, but you have a bobcat and I remember watching this video years ago. Maybe you can copy them and do a few 6ft sections at a time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3zc...haelNicolaides

 

[88mitsu]

you also need some of these working with that nasty old dusty shit

 

[Black Sabbath]

;n206279]Now it's your turn, you all better give some sort of response. I'm disappointed that a single picture of some rubber dicks got 100X the response of this thread, and all with zero fucking effort.

Well you started before giving us the chance to suggest the 5 gallons of diesel and road flare option, so we are just along for the ride

 

[[486]]

does it have a basement now?

i know nothing about basements or footers, but you have a bobcat and I remember watching this video years ago. Maybe you can copy them and do a few 6ft sections at a time.

it has a dugout sorta deal with a lot of house jacks holding up various bits of the framing

main problem with going in from the outside is that then it is open to animals and people getting in for the duration. Okay if I've got a few people that know what they're doing, but this is gonna take me a couple months I'm thinking. Also it'll be snowing pretty consistently soon and the ground freezing. Might be able to keep the ground thawed inside the house if I commit to running a heater in there but 100% will not waste the money keeping the outside ground thawed

also, that's one of them tiny skidsteers, though I could get at most of it from the outside with my mid-sized 773.

 

[jpmassey]

Having lived in and worked to restore a house from 1895, I can confidently say: "never again".

 

[Provience]

;n206279]
Slab will be poured floating inside the walls, as I figure if I poured it atop the stem walls, then put the walls atop it I'd run into the walls cracking if it ever heaved or settled. I've done almost none of this before, I've just got a little electric mixer and retard skeleton-man strength.

i almost need a picture to keep up with all this text

if you are running small rebar and doing the footing and stem wall pours, in addition to a mixer and retard strength, you will also NEED a vibrator, otherwise your concrete will be full of voids and won't do what you want it to do around the net ad such. If you have access to the sides like above ground, you can use a sawzall without a blade or a palm sander without paper and work along the forms to vibrate them down, it also helps draw the creme to the side. for the deep holes, just get a rental for day of pour, but it is essentially a similar thing with a 6' or so whip and a stainless vibrating head you can pass down around the rebar and vibrate the conrete as you are doing your lifts or whathave you

as for vapor barrier, obviously everywhere that earth is on one side and concrete is on the other, it needs to be. you can always add treatments to the positive side if you have issues at some point, but one side of the slab should be reasonably exposed to air so that it can breathe.

 

[Muckin_Slusher]

What's your plan for forming up those poured walls?

8 foot tall walls are no joke and need some substantial reinforcing to not blow out. Did you read my "patio rebuild with a hot-tub" thread at the old site? Have you watched "essential craftsman" on yootube? Lots of nice concrete work on that channel.

The foxblox make pouring walls stupid easy, as all the reinforcement is done for you, just gotta stack and brace them and pour.

Pouring big walls like that with an electric mixer like 2bb is gonna be difficult to put it mildly, and youll end up with a lot more inconsistencies in the mixes, maybe even cold joints. There's lots going on with concrete pours, you need a few buddies to keep up with everything. Is there a reason you can't bring in a truck?

I don't comment much, but do read everything and enjoy threads like this. Thanks for sharing.

 

[[486]]

as for vapor barrier, obviously everywhere that earth is on one side and concrete is on the other, it needs to be. you can always add treatments to the positive side if you have issues at some point, but one side of the slab should be reasonably exposed to air so that it can breathe.

okay cool, so I'll vapor barrier the outside and the entire stem wall/footer
leave the inside wall open to the structure, as it is likely to be the dryest air in there

got a couple mean motherfuckers of concrete vibrators, they'll be a tight fit in the wall forms though. Might have to buy one of the sawzall-motor driven ones too...

What's your plan for forming up those poured walls?
...
Pouring big walls like that with an electric mixer like 2bb is gonna be difficult to put it mildly, and youll end up with a lot more inconsistencies in the mixes, maybe even cold joints. There's lots going on with concrete pours, you need a few buddies to keep up with everything. Is there a reason you can't bring in a truck?

I'll probably be making up a set of two 4x4 foot form boards and just leapfrogging them across everything. Yes, there will be a lot of cold joints but I figure it is still going to end up much stronger than CMU block walls.

I'd love to bring in a truck, but 4yd minimum would mean I'd need to make 4 sets of 4x8 form boards, and at 40 bucks a sheet for the good outdoor rated plywood that stands a chance of re-use, that'd be another 320 bucks plus whatever the 2x4 bracing on the backs of the forms would end up running. Also, much more technically concerning, I'd need to dig out 32 feet of the perimeter at a time to set up those forms. I've got a 10' beam already down there provided by the previous owner that I can leapfrog around once I've got a section of the stem wall poured to brace the floor joists against.
Too cold out to do "half the concrete in the forms, and half into pouring a segment of driveway" sorta deal.
Basically, shit timing is why I'm doing it this way. I could leave it for 6mo and then get the concrete delivered.

ETA: the pump house in post #42 I already did, and I found out that I can do about half a yard in 4hr working at a lazy pace when it is hot out. Cleanup without running water included. Mixing with my sand and gravel piles 100' apart. Figure I'll start moving the gravel up to the house with the bobcat to save some effort.

 

[Provience]

sounds like a bitch of a plan, but a plan nonetheless!

 

[Ransil]

my contribution to this thread

 

[Fivepointfive]

That’s scary as shit the first time it happens. I’m also a dumbass who’s been known to do sketchy shit with a bottle jack. So I’m pretty familiar with the jack suddenly fucking off in a direction you weren’t expecting.

Yeah the second time is like no big deal. it's that ONE time that gets ya

And you left coasters don't even know what an old house is. Grew up in a 1801 Model. Live in a '37 now. Owned a mid 80s boom special, never again. Got out from under that fucker just in time.

 

[Thefishguy77]

Yea, to us left coasters an old house is 1900’s usually. But still a lot of adventure in pulling them apart. My buddy is looking at a 1920’s house that the last major upgrade was 1971. I asked him are you guys old house people. They can be like pandoras box. Once open you cant just close it amd pretend it didnt happen. So either live in it as is or know what you dont know and be prepared to pay for it.

 

[[486]]

sounds like a bitch of a plan, but a plan nonetheless!

The alternative is pole shed walls.

 

[2big bronco]

I'm not sure I have much to add other then good luck pouring walls 4 or 6ft tall. Even after all my experience my forms still bowed out on my stairs going from my garage into my house.


Oh and why am I not surprised you own concrete vibrators... the harbor frieght sawzall style one seems to work good for the $50 it costs

 

[Provience]

;n206721]


got a couple mean motherfuckers of concrete vibrators, they'll be a tight fit in the wall forms though. Might have to buy one of the sawzall-motor driven ones too...
.

if you've already got the motors, you should be able to get/rent some smaller heads for the whips so that you can fanangle them into the forms better

 

[Clemson13]

I like reading threads like this. But I always have a question; wouldn't it be easier, faster and not much more $ to bulldoze and start over.
over. Not meant to be an insult, honest question.

 

[junkytj]

I'm clearly not an "old house person." I would have burned that fucker and started over.

I'm going to start by saying I'm not a cold weather person either. Is the basement a must? Why not just do a pier foundation and set beams. With your "equipment" and means and auger and sonotube and steel beams seems like a much simpler solution.

 

[Thefishguy77]

I like reading threads like this. But I always have a question; wouldn't it be easier, faster and not much more $ to bulldoze and start over.
over. Not meant to be an insult, honest question.

Sometimes it is. Although you lose all the charm an older house brings. Also if the house is historically significant or registered that will present problems. We personally had plans drawn up for an 2000 sqft “addition” for our current house because our location was grandfathered in yet we could never build there again. Setbacks have changed some since 1970.

 

[[486]]

I'm going to start by saying I'm not a cold weather person either. Is the basement a must? Why not just do a pier foundation and set beams. With your "equipment" and means and auger and sonotube and steel beams seems like a much simpler solution.

I really like the idea of sonotubes. I just don't like the idea that there'd only be shitty options for enclosing the bottom of the wall
crawlspace sucks because animals will get in, and they're a bitch to insulate without causing massive mold problems
basement sucks because then I've gotta heat the place or it'll all bust up

I'm just figuring on putting in a perimeter foundation mainly so I can have poured concrete walls, with the base of the wall below the frost line so it doesn't lift and bust up.

I like reading threads like this. But I always have a question; wouldn't it be easier, faster and not much more $ to bulldoze and start over.
over. Not meant to be an insult, honest question.

100% the plan going in was to burn everything down
I always confused everyone by describing the house as "a burn-down"
poked around in there and figured I can fix it for much cheaper, really proven right on that one with the current lumber market

I'm only into this structure about $2k and it is sorta kinda half liveable already.
It would absolutely be faster and easier to just plop a mobile home 40' away and let this shithole fall into a pile, except for the fact that when I poked around a little, a single wide mobile home is like $40k, a few years old

if you've already got the motors, you should be able to get/rent some smaller heads for the whips so that you can fanangle them into the forms better

the motor is the head, it's like 3-3.5" diameter, the hose is just a power cord with a really neat inline switchbox that looks like old mining equipment. You toss one of these in a 5 gallon bucket of water and no joke fully half the bucket flies out at you.
Kinda sucks as you can't even really hold them against formwork, as unless you hold it a few feet up the hose you've got some instant-arthritis going on