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any Kamala voters here?

Sandy Johnson said:
Sure, and when their family drops the ball?
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Why should that be the states responseability?

Pretty much evrey societal problem can be traced back to:
A) breakdown of family systems
B) people having unwanted kids

We need to fix that, not put that burden onto the state and the rest of the population. The state has no incentive to fix either one of those problems.
 
Slander said:
Why should that be the states responseability?

Pretty much evrey societal problem can be traced back to:
A) breakdown of family systems
B) people having unwanted kids

We need to fix that, not put that burden onto the state and the rest of the population. The state has no incentive to fix either one of those problems.
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The state doesn't have to fix it, but if no one fixes it, then we all have to live with it.
 
JD Mark said:
Tell me how I'm wrong.

Nope, I haven't and never will.
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Dosage matters. How can you not comprehend that?

You can smoke a little weed and catch a little buzz or you can smoke a lot of weed and get high as Snoop Dogg. You can do a bump of coke and get a pick me up or you can rail lines and grind your teeth off. You can take the dosage of opioids a responsible doctor would prescribe or you can take the whole bottle and nod off and probably die. You can eat a bag of mushrooms and launch yourself into an alternate dimension or you can do a micro dose and feel basically nothing.
 
Slander said:
How is a state mandated, publicly funded, school system fixing that issue currently filling that gap of the family not doing its basic job?
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In waaaay more ways than it should have to at the moment. On paper there's before and after school care, meals, sex education, etc. On a whole other level is providing a mentor and caring about a child's well being when their family does not. This of course requires a teacher to give a shit and have the spare time to actually make an effort. Some school districts have that combo, some don't.

It's easy to bash on public schools based on a few high profile stories in the news highlighting teachers or districts doing the wrong thing. All the positive things get ignored because they don't get the clicks or the shock value.
 
Mr. Mindless said:
I trust Harris to defend democracy. Trump hasn't and won't.

Single issue voter here <---
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I’m assuming you’re just making a joke to show off your username.


If that’s NOT the case, then congrats on defending freedoms by voting with Hollywood, and Pharma, and Blackrock, and the MIC, and people that literally say the 1st amendment is problematic and needs changed. Oh, and the squirrel kidnappers and killers.
 
Sandy Johnson said:
In waaaay more ways than it should have to at the moment. On paper there's before and after school care, meals, sex education, etc. On a whole other level is providing a mentor and caring about a child's well being when their family does not. This of course requires a teacher to give a shit and have the spare time to actually make an effort. Some school districts have that combo, some don't.

It's easy to bash on public schools based on a few high profile stories in the news highlighting teachers or districts doing the wrong thing. All the positive things get ignored because they don't get the clicks or the shock value.
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What about the issue where public school teachers are dramatically more likely to commit statutory rape than Catholic priests? Just saying, that part seems to be undercriticized, not over.
 
OHV Wildcat said:
What about the issue where public school teachers are dramatically more likely to commit statutory rape than Catholic priests? Just saying, that part seems to be undercriticized, not over.
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Only the public school teachers huh? Never the private school teachers?
 
Sandy Johnson said:
Only the public school teachers huh? Never the private school teachers?
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I can’t say. But public school teachers are like 90+ percent of teachers. And are the ones that get their jobs straight out of college. And are the ones that can’t get jobs at private schools.

So, probably mostly public teachers.
 
OHV Wildcat said:
Well, yeah. But with logic. :flipoff2:
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All those hard to get $43k / year jobs. :homer:

1730849281492.png


Luckily there is a safety net of $54k/ year jobs in public schools there to catch all those who didn't make the cut in the private sector.
1730849330467.png
 
RedX said:
If anyone has experienced the last 3.75 years in this country and the world and can still vote for more of that (and likely an expansion/acceleration of that), then they are completely lost, in my eyes.

There is no way of rationalizing that mentality.
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Pretty much my rational.

Who the fuck can compare the last 4 years with the previous 4 and come to the conclusion that we need more of that! (Rhetorical)
 
Sandy Johnson said:
All those hard to get $43k / year jobs. :homer:

1730849281492.png


Luckily there is a safety net of $54k/ year jobs in public schools there to catch all those who didn't make the cut in the private sector.
1730849330467.png
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Around here, teachers flee the public system to get to the private system. They pay less because there’s more demand for the job—it’s a buyer’s market on teacher labor for the private schools. The public schools have to pay more because of the shitty everything else about the job. Again—my assumptions, I’m not a teacher. This is what I get from the ones I know.
 
Sandy Johnson said:
If only there was some sort of institution that could be used to tell young teens that message....
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their parents and family should, not the state. never the state.


Sandy Johnson said:
In waaaay more ways than it should have to at the moment. On paper there's before and after school care, meals, sex education, etc. On a whole other level is providing a mentor and caring about a child's well being when their family does not. This of course requires a teacher to give a shit and have the spare time to actually make an effort. Some school districts have that combo, some don't.

It's easy to bash on public schools based on a few high profile stories in the news highlighting teachers or districts doing the wrong thing. All the positive things get ignored because they don't get the clicks or the shock value.
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you are trying to solve societal and welfare problems by turning education into welfare, when it should be about education.

you're making my point for me.


and by posting the job numbers, you are owning yourself because even with the sky high taxes, California public school teachers get paid less than other states..... but oh wait, they probably have some ridiculous pension and cant be fired because they are union.

california spends $23,723 per student a year on education, but most like, they spend a majority of that as "welfare" instead of actual education.

they are #23 ranked in education but have the 2nd highest student per teacher ratio in the country. 20.6 students per teacher.

and you want to sit here and defend public education? everything you are posting is that its a glorified indoctrination center that provides meals and health care.
 
OHV Wildcat said:
Around here, teachers flee the public system to get to the private system. They pay less because there’s more demand for the job—it’s a buyer’s market on teacher labor for the private schools. The public schools have to pay more because of the shitty everything else about the job. Again—my assumptions, I’m not a teacher. This is what I get from the ones I know.
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you're not wrong.


but you need to get to the teachers who will tell you the truth, not the ones who lie and tell you everything would be better if they just made more money.
 
Texas97 said:
their parents and family should, not the state. never the state.




you are trying to solve societal and welfare problems by turning education into welfare, when it should be about education.

you're making my point for me.


and by posting the job numbers, you are owning yourself because even with the sky high taxes, California public school teachers get paid less than other states..... but oh wait, they probably have some ridiculous pension and cant be fired because they are union.

california spends $23,723 per student a year on education, but most like, they spend a majority of that as "welfare" instead of actual education.

they are #23 ranked in education but have the 2nd highest student per teacher ratio in the country. 20.6 students per teacher.

and you want to sit here and defend public education? everything you are posting is that its a glorified indoctrination center that provides meals and health care.
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A friend of mine is a public school PE teacher for short bus kids, mostly autistic kids, but also some recovering from cancer, or an accident, that kind of thing, at various schools and sometimes in home. He's got his masters in education and makes low 80's, and he'll get almost that same amount through his CalSTRS account. Of course he's put in over the years, but the big one is that his medical coverage will continue. This in SoCal.
 

How does teacher pay differ by state?​

For the 2021–22 school year, the nation’s average cost-of-living-adjusted K-12 public teacher salary was $64,300. Nineteen states and Washington, DC, paid higher than this national average and 31 states paid less.
Florida had the lowest average adjusted salary at $50,508.

New York pays the highest average adjusted teacher salary, and Florida pays the lowest average salary.​

Average K–12 teacher salaries adjusted for cost of living, 2021–22 school year

Click to see unadjusted pay
A dot chart where states are ranked by average teacher salary, adjusted for cost of living.


New York
$84.22K
Massachusetts
$83.43K
Connecticut
$79.13K
California
$78.07K
Rhode Island
$75.28K
Pennsylvania
$74.97K
Washington
$74.93K
District of Columbia
$74.16K
New Jersey
$72.45K
Maryland
$71.33K
Illinois
$71.29K
Alaska
$70.59K
Minnesota
$69.59K
Michigan
$69.17K
Ohio
$68.3K
Oregon
$67.62K
Delaware
$67.21K
Wyoming
$66.53K
Iowa
$66.16K
Wisconsin
$64.76K
US average
$64.3K
Georgia
$63.95K
Vermont
$63.72K
Alabama
$63.35K
Nebraska
$62.58K
Utah
$61.97K
New Hampshire
$61.25K
Kentucky
$61.23K
North Dakota
$61.22K
Oklahoma
$60.71K
Nevada
$60.5K
Maine
$60.45K
New Mexico
$60.37K
Kansas
$60.13K
Texas
$59.78K
Hawaii
$59.17K
Idaho
$59.09K
Tennessee
$59.02K
Arkansas
$58.68K
Virginia
$58.63K
Montana
$58.57K
Indiana
$58.37K
Louisiana
$57.38K
North Carolina
$57.19K
Missouri
$57.03K
South Carolina
$56.99K
Colorado
$56.77K
Arizona
$56.43K
West Virginia
$55.44K
South Dakota
$55.2K
Mississippi
$54.46K
Florida
$50.51K
Cost of living adjustments made using Regional Price Parities from the Bureau of Economic Analysis
Source: National Center for Education Statistics Get the data Embed Download image Download SVG



Florida was an outlier compared to other states that pay lower teacher salaries. In the next three states with adjusted salaries close to Florida – Mississippi, South Dakota, and West Virginia – the average teacher salary was within $600 of $55,000, or nearly $5000 more than the average Florida teacher salary.
More than a third of states paid teachers an adjusted average of less than $60,000 per year.

​



Meanwhile, New York paid the highest teacher salary — $84,218 — when adjusted for cost of living. Massachusetts was second highest, with an average teacher salary of $83,434. This pair was separated by nearly $5,000 from the third-highest teacher salary: $79,125 in Connecticut.
Hawaii’s teacher salary was the most impacted by the cost-of-living adjustment. Hawaii’s unadjusted teacher salary is the 15th highest in the nation, but 35th when taking cost of living into account. Its unadjusted teacher salary of $67,000 is much more difficult to live on compared to a state with a similar nominal teacher salary, such as Minnesota, where the average unadjusted teacher salary is $68,491.
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Holy shit Floriduh!
 
Texas97 said:
their parents and family should, not the state. never the state.




you are trying to solve societal and welfare problems by turning education into welfare, when it should be about education.
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Firstly, I'm not. That's why I said:
Sandy Johnson said:
In waaaay more ways than it should have to at the moment.
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But if we take that away from the schools, and the parents aren't doing it, then what do we end up with?

Texas97 said:
and by posting the job numbers, you are owning yourself because even with the sky high taxes, California public school teachers get paid less than other states..... but oh wait, they probably have some ridiculous pension and cant be fired because they are union.

california spends $23,723 per student a year on education, but most like, they spend a majority of that as "welfare" instead of actual education.

they are #23 ranked in education but have the 2nd highest student per teacher ratio in the country. 20.6 students per teacher.

and you want to sit here and defend public education? everything you are posting is that its a glorified indoctrination center that provides meals and health care.
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I'm not here to defend public education, it needs fixing, especially in California for the obvious reasons you mentioned.

I am here to say that privatization won't fix it either, because right now, public schools are picking up the slack of dealing with all the problems that private schools don't get. Why? Because it takes money and caring about your kids education to decide to put your child in a private school. There's not a single parent who has their child in a private school that isn't actively involved with their child's learning. So they get schooling and a family who cares behind them. Take away the public school catch-all net, and send everyone to private schools and you'll be back to the same societal issues, just in private schools, with less funding because now people who don't have kids in the schools aren't paying in to the pool. Don't even get me started on the pool of teachers. If I even accept that every private school teacher there is taking a $10k/year pay cut because they're so good and despise the public system so much.. if everything goes private, where is that pool of teachers to meet the demand going to come from? It will be the same labor force that was working public schools, working with the same kids that went there, but they'll be taking a pay cut.

Also, you still haven't told me how vouchers or whatever you're using for low income students will be paid for if non-parents are no longer paying into the school system via taxes and everyone else is busy paying for their kid?
 
Slander said:
My point was if you can't financially support having kids, do not have them. The rest of society should not be supporting your bad choices.

Also sounds like a charity/grant/scholarship opportunity to privately fund those poor kids to go to school and not force people to pay for it under the threat of jailing/state sponsored murder.

This topic gets me fired up as I don't have kids, yet get raped on taxes on all fronts and I have to hear entitled teachers cry constantly about how hard they work, get 3xs the time off I do, all while we have some of the dumbest students in the world.
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I have kids, but same.
 
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