60's Coot Atv thing

[Java230]

Found a gear set.... It's dumb $, like everything I have into it $.

I'm tempted to sell this off.... I can I get more than I have into it, or equal at least.

There is an argo centaur a half days drive away.... Modern ish and with a plow.

And anyone near Hayden ID?

 

[350TacoZilla]

While it sucks to see the project die like that I can understand budget. have you taken the old gears out to see how bad damage is? I know its janky but I have seen people build up the teeth on like mower trans and such to get little more life out of them and it seemed to work ok. They just did little row of tacks and then grind down, rinse and repeat till the teeth were matching the non damaged section for height \ depth.

But if you have the cash for a newer machine and you dont feel you will lose $$$ on flipping this I guess its the smarter long term thing just more investment.

 

[Yotota]

Found a gear set.... It's dumb $, like everything I have into it $.

I'm tempted to sell this off.... I can I get more than I have into it, or equal at least.

There is an argo centaur a half days drive away.... Modern ish and with a plow.

And anyone near Hayden ID?

I could start a new thread, and maybe we should...

But I've always wanted an Argo. I didn't know about the Centaur but the enclosed cab looks great.

What does everyone know about Argos in general? Are they robust/durable enough to be worth buying an older used model? Are parts available?

 

[dave_dj1]

I could start a new thread, and maybe we should...

But I've always wanted an Argo. I didn't know about the Centaur but the enclosed cab looks great.

What does everyone know about Argos in general? Are they robust/durable enough to be worth buying an older used model? Are parts available?

slow, no suspension, I don't know about parts availability but I would think so, there are some dedicated groups for them.

 

[72Pstroke]

I am just outside of Hayden.
PM me if you need something.

 

[Java230]

While it sucks to see the project die like that I can understand budget. have you taken the old gears out to see how bad damage is? I know its janky but I have seen people build up the teeth on like mower trans and such to get little more life out of them and it seemed to work ok. They just did little row of tacks and then grind down, rinse and repeat till the teeth were matching the non damaged section for height \ depth.

But if you have the cash for a newer machine and you dont feel you will lose $$$ on flipping this I guess its the smarter long term thing just more investment.

Unfortunately the gear is bronze. Perhaps I could tig something on? I honestly have zero clue.

No have not pulled it apart yet. It's a fucking project to get the damn gears out. I did find a service manual and a typed up how to on getting them out. The axle runs all the way through, so it's pull the king pins both sides, disassemble the axle tubes, take come collars off inside the gear box. Remove the worm gear, then side alxe over and remove keyway etc. That's also assuming it's not rusty AF....

If I sell the boat it should get me about half the cash for the argo. I hate to see the coot go, but newer not so unique machine is prob not a bad thing. Plus it has a plow.

 

[Java230]

I could start a new thread, and maybe we should...

But I've always wanted an Argo. I didn't know about the Centaur but the enclosed cab looks great.

What does everyone know about Argos in general? Are they robust/durable enough to be worth buying an older used model? Are parts available?

I don't know much, but my main concern is they are chain drive. Seems like a lot of maontance there. The centaur is a hydrostat drive. The older ones I think are simple band brake steering.

Not fast, do float (without the tracks on for the centaur), this one is diesel which may suck in winter?

 

[dave_dj1]

Wheel spacers arrived, not sure I got much more steering angle with the new splash shield.... But its done. Its crazy how cheap China can make things.

My shitty sheet metal skills. This was way thicker than needed.... Had to score with the grinder to even bend it.

Driving position sucks....LOL

And I need a new brake line, I am no expert, but its puking between the hard and soft line connection, and its tight (ish).

Looking at this pic, if that is the gear that is bad can't you replace the gearbox with a go cart clutch set up?

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[CJ503]

Does anyone know if Karl is still around ? Jantz Eng in some-fucking-place Seattle-ish area ? Kind of an odd duck, but he does some pretty amazing stuff machine shop wise. Was a machinist at Boeing for a long time after he left here. Wheeled with him for years when he was on this side of the hill.

I had a PTO Braden on my EB about 10,000 years ago. I managed to run a 1/4-20 nut through the gears, it too was bronze. He was tooled to hobb gears.

A thought, he "could" make you a new one out of steel ?

Having said that.......and doing a shit ton of mobile service on stuff from the stone age. Old is cool, if you want cool. If ALL you want is cool. I have seen a coot, but it was in a field by the gorge and I was not going to go trolling for rattle snakes to look at it. I have also actually had limited experience with an Argo. Again, in that case, older is NOT better. The plow is win or a detriment. They float, they have tiny engines and they use brake steering. At least the old ass stuff I have seen does. Lighter is not better for moving snow.

Don't jump out of the pan into the fire like I always seem to do. Stand back, I'm a professional at dragging crap home that should of just gone to the scrap yard.

If your just going for the "cool" factor, maybe do an upgrade to the coot ?


If you want function, look elsewhere. Not sure if any of that made sense. I seem to always get myself into never ending projects that I always intended to just bring home and use.

Either way, I'm in, it is a good thread.

 

[Java230]

Looking at this pic, if that is the gear that is bad can't you replace the gearbox with a go cart clutch set up?

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The gear that is bad is in the square box in the middle of the axle.

I did new clutches on the engine side already.

 

[Java230]

Does anyone know if Karl is still around ? Jantz Eng in some-fucking-place Seattle-ish area ? Kind of an odd duck, but he does some pretty amazing stuff machine shop wise. Was a machinist at Boeing for a long time after he left here. Wheeled with him for years when he was on this side of the hill.

I had a PTO Braden on my EB about 10,000 years ago. I managed to run a 1/4-20 nut through the gears, it too was bronze. He was tooled to hobb gears.

A thought, he "could" make you a new one out of steel ?

Having said that.......and doing a shit ton of mobile service on stuff from the stone age. Old is cool, if you want cool. If ALL you want is cool. I have seen a coot, but it was in a field by the gorge and I was not going to go trolling for rattle snakes to look at it. I have also actually had limited experience with an Argo. Again, in that case, older is NOT better. The plow is win or a detriment. They float, they have tiny engines and they use brake steering. At least the old ass stuff I have seen does. Lighter is not better for moving snow.

Don't jump out of the pan into the fire like I always seem to do. Stand back, I'm a professional at dragging crap home that should of just gone to the scrap yard.

If your just going for the "cool" factor, maybe do an upgrade to the coot ?


If you want function, look elsewhere. Not sure if any of that made sense. I seem to always get myself into never ending projects that I always intended to just bring home and use.

Either way, I'm in, it is a good thread.

I was drawn to the coot as it was cheap and I drove one as a kid.... I like it, but gears are a pita. But I've put effort into it too....

The argo is 20k 😳 not just your typical tub style argo.

 

[CJ503]

Yeah, I get that. Think of where we are at. Everyone here for the most has dumped WAY beyond what anyone would into what they want. I have have guy I know into the TUCKER scene. Crazy money.

Cool, I was suggesting maybe an upgrade on the gear ? Boston gear also makes some pretty cool dual output gear boxes.

Trust me, I have a rare talent for investing WAY too much to achieve what I want. But that is what it is, right ? Your coot is cool. Not certain I would not be following your exact path. Parts is the bitch. Can't find it ? Make it, or change it. In the end, it will be cool.

 

[Java230]

Yeah, I get that. Think of where we are at. Everyone here for the most has dumped WAY beyond what anyone would into what they want. I have have guy I know into the TUCKER scene. Crazy money.

Cool, I was suggesting maybe an upgrade on the gear ? Boston gear also makes some pretty cool dual output gear boxes.

Trust me, I have a rare talent for investing WAY too much to achieve what I want. But that is what it is, right ? Your coot is cool. Not certain I would not be following your exact path. Parts is the bitch. Can't find it ? Make it, or change it. In the end, it will be cool.

Totally. Yes it's cool, and reminds me of being a kid. It's pretty damn simple except a few specialized (and hard to find) parts....

The bronze gear was up sized mid production, the early ones are 1" older are 1.5". My data plate is long gone, but I'll assume it's the 1".

The gears are about 600 plus my time to 'try' to get it apart. I'm not 100% sure I can is the real issue. Then the trans is the only other thing to really break. The rest is dirt simple.

 

[CJ503]

I know I mentioned this, but Jantz might be able to one off parts ???


My thought ? Look at your local industrial power products vendor. With some minor machining you could have a very dependable rig, with readily available parts.


I have machine so many "adaptors" to get part to fit. In the gray market it is almost like every single vendor invents their own thread/fitting. I get a call out to "fix" it. WTF ??? it doesn't even match any thread pitch. So...you make it work.


Say you want an LS in your Scout on stock drivetrain. Not sure why, but whatever. No, there are no parts to do that. So what do you do ? Adapt.

Hey, you want to hit me with some dimensions, I'll give it a go. I'm definitely not the best machinist in the world, but I have have made some pretty odd stuff.

 

[Java230]

I know I mentioned this, but Jantz might be able to one off parts ???


My thought ? Look at your local industrial power products vendor. With some minor machining you could have a very dependable rig, with readily available parts.


I have machine so many "adaptors" to get part to fit. In the gray market it is almost like every single vendor invents their own thread/fitting. I get a call out to "fix" it. WTF ??? it doesn't even match any thread pitch. So...you make it work.


Say you want an LS in your Scout on stock drivetrain. Not sure why, but whatever. No, there are no parts to do that. So what do you do ? Adapt.

Hey, you want to hit me with some dimensions, I'll give it a go. I'm definitely not the best machinist in the world, but I have have made some pretty odd stuff.

Yeah I get that. Supposedly there was a drawing of the gear made (the guy selling them had a run made) but I can't find it anywhere. I'm guessing he kept it close to his chest so he can recoup the costs.

 

[Java230]

Well my wife said whatever just buy what you want without evening looking at the price she may need another drink or 20 if I bring it home....

 

[aczlan]

Here is a Coot for sale in PA, supposedly has spare front and rear gearboxes: Log into Facebook
No idea if the seller would sell the front separately, but worth calling.

Aaron Z

 

[NORDFORD]

It’d be a hell of a drive, but here you go!!

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[Java230]

It’d be a hell of a drive, but here you go!!

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That's a big chunk of $ too....

 

[NORDFORD]

That's a big chunk of $ too....

Fuck it! You’ll make more tomorrow!

 

[Java230]

Fuck it! You’ll make more tomorrow!

Ha! I can get gears for ~600 ish, but I'm not 100% sure it's gonna come apart well to replace them

 

[budget76]

if we're posting local Coot's for sale, this one looks in good shape overall Log into Facebook

Is the diff/gear set that failed integral to the chassis of the Coot? No possibility to yank a diff with the right ratio out of something like a golf cart axle? ZERO clue what the design looks like never seen one of these things in person

 

[Java230]

if we're posting local Coot's for sale, this one looks in good shape overall Log into Facebook

Is the diff/gear set that failed integral to the chassis of the Coot? No possibility to yank a diff with the right ratio out of something like a golf cart axle? ZERO clue what the design looks like never seen one of these things in person

100% coot specific.

It's a radial and worm gear setup, and the axle runs through it

 

[budget76]

damn :(

surprised we don't see more listings of ones for sale with blown out gears if thats the case. Seems like a machine that's either in parades, or getting used for what it was made for

 

[arse_sidewards]

100% coot specific.

It's a radial and worm gear setup, and the axle runs through it

Pics? Ratio?

Worm gear boxes that allow a through-shaft on the output are pretty common and they get as low numerically as the mid single digits.

I have a hard time believing that a specialty ATV manufactuer didn't use something close enough to an off the shelf solution that you can't find a close enough fit for a replacement.

 

[vetteboy79]

Boston gear also makes some pretty cool dual output gear boxes.

Boston Gear also sells loose worm gearing with customizable bore and keyway sizes, most of it in stock on the shelf. Much of it goes to OEMs to incorporate into proprietary housings, steering racks, etc.

Worm Gears

Boston Gear offers worm gears manufactured from a variety of materials, such as acetal, minlon, bronze, and cast iron to suit your application's requirements.

www.bostongear.com

(I used to work there 🙂, it's been a few years but there's a guy named Kevin Williams in the sales dept who can tell you exactly the info they'd need to see if it's something they have. If you tell him Chris from Bauer sent ya he'd probably get a kick out of that )

 

[Java230]

I'm no gear expert to be honest. I can take some measurements? AFAIK it's a custom price.

 

[vetteboy79]

I'm no gear expert to be honest. I can take some measurements? AFAIK it's a custom price.

Biggest things would be the shaft & keyway diameter for each gear, the center distance (between the centerline of each gear, aka the distance between the centerline of the input and output shafts), and ratio.

 

[bdkw1]

I would also bet they are off the shelf pieces. Nobody is tooling up to make one offs like that for a limited production run vehicle. It's just not cost effective.

 

[Java230]

That's an interesting point, very well could be an off the self piece..... Where would the best place be to look for that type info (for new gears). I could certainly take it apart and measure. It all has to come apart anyway if I do want to replace it.

What would that type of gear technically be called? I know the worm, but what's the other one?

Here are a couple pics from the repair manual.