What's new
By:
Filters

5.13 gears for sterling 10.5???

pennsylvaniaboy

pennsylvaniaboy

make fullsizes great again
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Member Number
2192
Messages
997
So this past winter we put a ‘05+ SD60 in a buggy. Kept the 8x170 pattern. The rear axle is a built 35spline 9”(Yukon nod 3rd, strange axles, disc brakes, shave and trussed stock housing). To run the same wheel pattern we used 2piece adapters to go from 5x5.5 to 8x170.

well the adapter loosened up 2 times. So exploring options. The main idea is to do a shaved sterling with factory discs, e locker, etc. run a ballistic truss and shaved cover. Problem is....I can’t find the matching 5.13 gears for a 2011+ sterling?

on the older ones they say you can use a 10.25 gearset/bearings. But one site says not on 2011+?
 
They changed the bearings and the pinions but not the housings form 10.25 to 10.5. So if you put in a matching set of bearing you can use whatever year you want. If you are changing out only the gears or only the bearings then you will need to keep whatever year has the remaining parts. I believe that if you do a master install with all new everything, the best practice is to all 10.5 parts. Aftermarket lockers are labeled as both since they will work with whatever gear set you have.
 
The idea is to use a 10.5 with factory e-locker but every source saying it can’t be done with the 2011+ trucks
 
What I seem to be finding is do 5.13(10.25) in a 99-2010 housing with the 2011+ELD Locker
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I can speak for the strength of the Ford unit, but I did the same thing with a Toyota years ago. My cheapness ended up costing more than an ARB.

I'm curious to see how one holds up in a buggy though :flipoff2:
Click to expand...

Soo how does an ox or ARB hold up? I feel like I have seen a lot of issues with arb?
 
pennsylvaniaboy said:
Soo how does an ox or ARB hold up? I feel like I have seen a lot of issues with arb?
Click to expand...

Most of the ARB issues I've read about were due to piss poor installs. Dumb ass "mechanic" pinching o-rings when putting ARB into axle. Dumb ass routing lines where they catch on stuff or burn.

The only design issue I recall reading about was the Ford 9" 35 spline race version many years ago.
 
So to rabbit hole a diff way, is there a reasonably cheap what to convert the 9” to 8x170 full float and full width?

or just pony up for the sterling parts? Also it looks like you can get just the locker from Ford for around $500
 
pennsylvaniaboy said:
So to rabbit hole a diff way, is there a reasonably cheap what to convert the 9” to 8x170 full float and full width?

or just pony up for the sterling parts? Also it looks like you can get just the locker from Ford for around $500
Click to expand...

Order a 9" housing with ub cups, then have double spline shafts made

Weld ub cups to current housing, and again, double spline shafts

Or the most economical way. Cut the spindles off your bent sterling, use sterling hubs, and brakes. Then have some 35 spline shafts made to fit your axle (Dutchman and Moser are only around $4-500 for custom FF shafts.
 
The ford e-locker fits in any 10" sterling case. For the 10.25 with tone rings, a small notch has to be ground for a locating tab. What size tires are you running that you are worried about shaving the sterling?

The ford e-locker in a factory controlled vehicle engages with 12v and immediately swaps to 5v to keep it locked. Fulltime 12v supposedly doesnt hurt it unless running for hours on hours.

I like to run the SOLID axle industries nodular iron cover on my sterlings. Its cheap, thick, factory shape, and smooth on the outside.
 
HYDRODYNAMIC said:
They changed the bearings and the pinions but not the housings form 10.25 to 10.5. So if you put in a matching set of bearing you can use whatever year you want. If you are changing out only the gears or only the bearings then you will need to keep whatever year has the remaining parts. I believe that if you do a master install with all new everything, the best practice is to all 10.5 parts. Aftermarket lockers are labeled as both since they will work with whatever gear set you have.
Click to expand...

The pinion bearing pockets are different, no known bearing that woukd let you swap a 2010 down gear set into it.
 
Wellstig1 said:
The pinion bearing pockets are different, no known bearing that woukd let you swap a 2010 down gear set into it.
Click to expand...

Adding this information as it is unclear what years and mix matching everyone is talking about.

85-92 10.25, 35 spline pinion and yoke, gen one short pinion and yoke length
93-98 10.25, 35 spline pinion and yoke, gen 2 longer pinion and yoke length
99-07 10.5, 35 spline pinion and yoke, .25" larger ring gear, smaller pinion bearing, (possibly) can use 10.25 gears in the housing with specific install kit
08-10 10.5, 35 spline pinion and yoke, can use a pinion spacer for use with 10.25 gears in the housing
11+ 10.5, 37 spline pinion and yoke

Yukon Master Overhaul kit for 2008-2010 Ford 10.5″ differentials using aftermarket 10.25″ R&P Only
https://www.randysworldwide.com/product/yk-f10-5-b/

I believe E locker housing have a different housing and might throw off the adaptability.
The 11+ might only be an issue if you use the 37 spline yoke, but if you change all the parts the housing might fit prior years.
I read and was told by gear shops not to try and use the E locker for rock crawling as the power to apply and disengage was weak as well as failures, not worth investing time and money in unless its free and you don't mind fixing it down the road.
 
Last edited:
Helping a buddy Dealing with this right now. Got a 2011 f350 elocker sterling cheap. Is there a way to add 5.38’s with the elocker? Or do I need the older housing and run 10.25 gears?

seems like the answer is yes to second question but I’m confirming.
 
Rangerrod said:
Helping a buddy Dealing with this right now. Got a 2011 f350 elocker sterling cheap. Is there a way to add 5.38’s with the elocker? Or do I need the older housing and run 10.25 gears?

seems like the answer is yes to second question but I’m confirming.
Click to expand...
Change the 37 spline pinion yoke to the 99-10 35 spline pinion yoke, with the same year 5.38 gear set
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Or the most economical way. Cut the spindles off your bent sterling, use sterling hubs, and brakes. Then have some 35 spline shafts made to fit your axle (Dutchman and Moser are only around $4-500 for custom FF shafts.
Click to expand...
I prefer the option of "weld the 10.25 side gears into the 9" diff carrier and run the sterling shafts"
 
[486] said:
I prefer the option of "weld the 10.25 side gears into the 9" diff carrier and run the sterling shafts"
Click to expand...
9" is only good if you go all aftermarket. I'd rather just keep the sterling than try to scab old junk together. I do remember spider doing that with 14b outters and shafts, but he had a serious knack for that type of stuff.
 
Rangerrod said:
Helping a buddy Dealing with this right now. Got a 2011 f350 elocker sterling cheap. Is there a way to add 5.38’s with the elocker? Or do I need the older housing and run 10.25 gears?

seems like the answer is yes to second question but I’m confirming.
Click to expand...
Based on my research the difference is the 10.5 has a longer pinion so you’ll need a different yoke. The older 10.25 suffered from the pinion nut coming loose, so a solution was to make the pinion longer and probably put more threads on it. The ring gear works In both.
 
HYDRODYNAMIC said:
Adding this information as it is unclear what years and mix matching everyone is talking about.

85-92 10.25, 35 spline pinion and yoke, gen one short pinion and yoke length
93-98 10.25, 35 spline pinion and yoke, gen 2 longer pinion and yoke length
99-07 10.5, 35 spline pinion and yoke, .25" larger ring gear, smaller pinion bearing, (possibly) can use 10.25 gears in the housing with specific install kit
08-10 10.5, 35 spline pinion and yoke, can use a pinion spacer for use with 10.25 gears in the housing
11+ 10.5, 37 spline pinion and yoke

Yukon Master Overhaul kit for 2008-2010 Ford 10.5″ differentials using aftermarket 10.25″ R&P Only
Yukon Master Overhaul kit for 2008-2010 Ford 10.5" differentials using aftermarket 10.25" R&P Only. | YK F10.5-B | RANDYS Worldwide

I believe E locker housing have a different housing and might throw off the adaptability.
The 11+ might only be an issue if you use the 37 spline yoke, but if you change all the parts the housing might fit prior years.
I read and was told by gear shops not to try and use the E locker for rock crawling as the power to apply and disengage was weak as well as failures, not worth investing time and money in unless its free and you don't mind fixing it down the road.
Click to expand...

All pre-'11 Sterling 10.5/10.25 have 31 spline pinions, not 35 spline pinions as you have listed, but the information is otherwise correct. I have not seen definitively whether the '11+ housings themselves are actually different enough from the earlier housings to preclude installing earlier gear sets in them. Obviously Wellstig1 says the bearing pockets are different, but I have heard claims both ways. It would be nice if someone would take some pictures and measurements so we wouldn't have to wonder whose word to take.

It is bull shit that that the aftermarket hasn't been making true 10.5" gear sets when the 10.5" has been out for over 20 years now. The 37 spline pinion on the newer axles has been out for 10 years now, and they still don't have anything lower than a 4.88 available :shaking:

Do you have any evidence of the factory E-locker not holding up? I have read hearsay from several people on here that they are weak, but how weak can they really be since they are putting them in trucks with 1,000 FTLbs that weigh 8,000Lbs from the factory? I have yet to see anyone talk about a first hand failure or post pictures of a broken one. Seems like typical internet bull shit to me.

Bigblue 94 said:
The ford e-locker in a factory controlled vehicle engages with 12v and immediately swaps to 5v to keep it locked. Fulltime 12v supposedly doesnt hurt it unless running for hours on hours.
Click to expand...
I have seen ZERO evidence of constant 12V supply being an issue, and have heard of multiple people leaving them engaged on custom installs overnight by accident and the lockers still work fine afterwards. They are just an electromagnet, I don't see them being particularly sensitive to voltage. You could probably run them just fine on any DC voltage within reason.
 
Last edited:
pennsylvaniaboy said:
So to rabbit hole a diff way, is there a reasonably cheap what to convert the 9” to 8x170 full float and full width?

or just pony up for the sterling parts? Also it looks like you can get just the locker from Ford for around $500
Click to expand...

YotaAtieToo said:
Order a 9" housing with ub cups, then have double spline shafts made

Weld ub cups to current housing, and again, double spline shafts

Or the most economical way. Cut the spindles off your bent sterling, use sterling hubs, and brakes. Then have some 35 spline shafts made to fit your axle (Dutchman and Moser are only around $4-500 for custom FF shafts.
Click to expand...

I second this if you really want to stay with the 9". It will probably be cheaper to just go with a Sterling even if you do have to buy a locker and gears. I wouldn't bother shaving a Sterling personally; they have much better ground clearance than a 14 bolt in stock form.
 
My 10.25 actually has slightly better clearance than my front 60. To be fair, it's a wider, bulkier diff and would hang up more than a rear 60, and certainly more than a aftermarket 9" housing.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
My 10.25 actually has slightly better clearance than my front 60. To be fair, it's a wider, bulkier diff and would hang up more than a rear 60, and certainly more than a aftermarket 9" housing.
Click to expand...

I trimmed the top of my 10.5 to clear the truss but I should go back and trim the bottom webs off. Since its not being loaded with payload or a trailer in that direction it seems overkill to leave it there when it has a really good shape to hang up on things. The front 60 doesn't have near the same amount of webbing as the 10.5 and you don't hear about the diffs cracking in half.


STL002.JPG

STL003.JPG

STL004.JPG

STL001.JPG
 
What is the consensus on welding the tubes to the diff to prevent spinning and shearing of the plug welds?
Diesel shops are doing it but that is for high torque sled pullers not off road. I always read that welding the tubes made them weaker?
 
That's a good idea to trim the webs, that and maybe grind/ramp the lip as much as you can.

Having a smooth diff is key.
 
'84 Bronco II said:
All pre-'11 Sterling 10.5/10.25 have 31 spline pinions, not 35 spline pinions as you have listed, but the information is otherwise correct. I have not seen definitively whether the '11+ housings themselves are actually different enough from the earlier housings to preclude installing earlier gear sets in them. Obviously Wellstig1 says the bearing pockets are different, but I have heard claims both ways. It would be nice if someone would take some pictures and measurements so we wouldn't have to wonder whose word to take.

It is bull shit that that the aftermarket hasn't been making true 10.5" gear sets when the 10.5" has been out for over 20 years now. The 37 spline pinion on the newer axles has been out for 10 years now, and they still don't have anything lower than a 4.88 available :shaking:

Do you have any evidence of the factory E-locker not holding up? I have read hearsay from several people on here that they are weak, but how weak can they really be since they are putting them in trucks with 1,000 FTLbs that weigh 8,000Lbs from the factory? I have yet to see anyone talk about a first hand failure or post pictures of a broken one. Seems like typical internet bull shit to me.


I have seen ZERO evidence of constant 12V supply being an issue, and have heard of multiple people leaving them engaged on custom installs overnight by accident and the lockers still work fine afterwards. They are just an electromagnet, I don't see them being particularly sensitive to voltage. You could probably run them just fine on any DC voltage within reason.
Click to expand...
No first hand experience. The guy I talked with was an Eaton dealer at one point and saw a shit load of two pinion failures. And has seen a few 4 pinions blow up under jk’s. Said Eaton you can’t get replacement parts and warranty sucks.

I suspect his bias towards sterling elockers comes from this experience.
 
Rangerrod said:
No first hand experience. The guy I talked with was an Eaton dealer at one point and saw a shit load of two pinion failures. And has seen a few 4 pinions blow up under jk’s. Said Eaton you can’t get replacement parts and warranty sucks.

I suspect his bias towards sterling elockers comes from this experience.
Click to expand...

Perhaps, but most of the Eaton E-Lockers have a really shitty locking mechanism design that unlocks and re-locks during direction changes regardless of 2 or 4 pinion versions. I do not believe the OEM Ford E-lockers disengage during direction changes like most Eatons do, but I honestly can't say for sure how the locking mechanism on the Ford diffs work.


Can anyone post pics of a broken Ford E-locker? I don't care if it is from a sled puller, crawler, or otherwise, I just want to see proof of a failed unit.
 
'84 Bronco II said:
most of the Eaton E-Lockers have a really shitty locking mechanism design that unlocks and re-locks during direction changes regardless of 2 or 4 pinion versions. I do not believe the OEM Ford E-lockers disengage during direction changes like most Eatons do, but I honestly can't say for sure how the locking mechanism on the Ford diffs work.
Click to expand...
The Sterling Elocker (and the new D60 Eaton) do not disengage in reverse, nor do they have the ramp breakage that the other Eaton elockers have.
 
'84 Bronco II said:
Can anyone post pics of a broken Ford E-locker? I don't care if it is from a sled puller, crawler, or otherwise, I just want to see proof of a failed unit.
Click to expand...
not going to happen because not enough people are abusing them in offroad vehicles, can anyone post pics of a hardcore rig with a ford elocker that hasnt broken it?
 
Rangerrod said:
Helping a buddy Dealing with this right now. Got a 2011 f350 elocker sterling cheap. Is there a way to add 5.38’s with the elocker? Or do I need the older housing and run 10.25 gears?

seems like the answer is yes to second question but I’m confirming.
Click to expand...
Platinum Torque
Motive
National has both Motive and Platinum Torque 37 spline pinion 5.13 and 5.38 gears
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Back Refresh