Wood Stove inserts

Otto M@n

Otto M@n

Red Skull
Joined
Jan 1, 2022
Member Number
4654
Messages
18
This past winter highlighted the uselessness of my fire place and its ability to assist in keeping my ~2400 sqft home warm. I'm looking at doing a wood stove insert. I've found decent used ones on Marketplace, but of course the nicer high end units caught my eye as some have automatic fan control. Are Pacific Energy units worth the buy in cost? Or do I say **** it and just get a pellet stove? Logistics associated with wood collecting isn't something I get excited about, but it's still cheaper than buying pellets, but I acknowledge I'm just spending my time instead of spending money on pellets.

My house is all electric so gas is out of the question. I'm mostly looking to supplement my electric heat during the especially cold days. I don't have an open floor plan layout, it is a separated room layout on the first floor but it has two man door entries, but no doors hung.
 
wood's a PITA
btu/btu pellets near me are similar in price to propane, bulk delivery and owning my own 500g tank

a propane burner can be a lot more efficient and troublefree than a pellet stove, hell, can even do a totally electric-free propane burner and your draft (waste heat) can still be metered down pretty precisely since the fuel metering rate is extremely consistent

Dunno man.
Only experience with wood is a couple twenty and thirty year old quadrafire 3100 ACT inserts, and they are certainly nice enough. I'd get a larger firebox (loooooonger foremost, but taller for more reserve volume would be good too) and the add-on fan does change the heat distribution markedly. Without a fan seemingly most of the heat ends up being sucked in as combustion draft air.
 
I had an insert.. worked great in the one end of the house where it was located.. but went with a more efficient wood stove located more centrally within the house..

Now I burn less wood and have better heating.

As a backup system, it could be somewhere between acceptable to great.

Firewood is free until you factor in costs of chainsaw(s) truck, trailer, storage.. I’m not complaining.. I like it this way.

Is adding a propane tank an option?
Is coal or corn an option?
 
The wife and I had a Lopi stove insert when we bought the house. I loved it. The wife hated processing firewood.

It heated the house great. As a bonus, you could cook on it.

We traded it for a pellet stove. Much easier for the wife.

FWIW hearth.com is the irate 4x4 of home heating.
 
I run a 35yo Pacific Energy stove. Been good to me.

Rather than an insert, I'd prefer the freestanding stove routed into the existing fireplace/chimney. Having the heat radiate freely is nicer than having to blow all your air around to make the space warm.
 
not all fireplace chimneys are able to be converted to wood stove use. Found that out when we went to put an insert in my fireplace.

the house also came with a pellet stove we've run for the past 10 years. The heat is great but I hate the thing. Always needs to be cleaned out repaired.

We are putting in a wood stove next year.
 
I have an old pacific energy free standing stove at a property that has been dead nuts problem free. Last house we had we put a quadrafire pellet stove upstairs and a wood stove insert down stairs. I prefer the wood hehat but the pellets are way easier for the wife. Also most pellet stoves can run on a thermostat. Downside is you need a generator for them when the power is out. Heat with a wood stove, 40ish years old at our current house and its great. The bigger the firebox the better it is overnight not having to stoke it in the middle of the night.

Just my opinion and worth what you paid for it.
 
Will12785 said:
not all fireplace chimneys are able to be converted to wood stove use. Found that out when we went to put an insert in my fireplace.
Click to expand...

That sucks, but also not surprised with how fussy the inspection stuff has become.

For primary heat, I'd still sooner have a freestanding woodstove (and new piped chimney) over the insert.
 
I loved going from propane insert to soapstone insert. I went with a Hearthstone Clydesdale. It was a few K just for the unit.

I never found it to be onerous to deal with. Once a day, walk a small bucket of ash outside and dump at various spots around the yard. **** wood was an issue for complete burning and thus more ash/bits of wood.

I can't comment about overnight because my unit was sized for a MUCH larger house than my 700 square:goofball: But it never had a problem keeping the minimally insulated house warm from about 8pm to 5/6am.

As some one else mentioned, location of unit will be a key especially if you have a larger house. Also, you might see what smoke does in your area. I had an asshole neighbor that I got to drown in smoke when I got bad wood:lmao:

I didn't have an issue converting my fireplace to the triple wall venting on a late 40s house. The only "issue" was having a minimum non-flammable section near the stove. A **** inspector could have failed it... the guy who inspected mine bumped the stove a little bit to get it to pass then pulled it back out.
 
I have a Fisher insert that is free standing in my shop. It will get my 30x40 shop up to 70 no problem when outside temp is around 0. I dont know the exact model , it is about 34" deep and has a 8" top flue outlet. I have it reduced to 6" triple wall chimney. It needs the chimney swept once a month, I have had 2 chimney fires this past year. There is no baffle , so when door is open the flame travels up the chimney and ignites the chimney pretty quick if there is any creasote build up.

It uses a good amount of wood burning 24/7. I would say one heaped 8 ft pickup truck load goes about a month.

I have an oil furnace in the shop also, burning the wood kept the oil use minimal. This summer I will be removing the oil furnace and installing a 24k BTU mini split in the shop. Will keep the wood stove , the furnace is taking up floor space I can use for other things.

So next winter I will not be burning 24/7, the mini split will handle keeping the shop at 48 degrees when I am not working in it, which is most of the time. When I am working in there I will start a fire. Also will keep a fire going when the outside temp is in the -10 to 10 degree range to save on electric consumption from the heat pump.

I dont care for all the work needed to burn wood 24/7 in the winter. It is a ton of time and physical work to get all the wood needed to burn it all winter. I have better things I can do with my time than cutting wood. If you buy pre split wood then your money is better spent to run a heat pump or fill a propane tank.
 
We have a Hearthstone soapstone unit (heritage model). If your budget allows, the soapstone is a better option for residual heat (cast iron loses the heat too fast). The newer models have side loading which is nice but not a necessity. If the hearth is big enough, I echo pulling it out for a proper stove vs. an insert. The radiant heat from all sides is worth it. I can get my 1000 sqft finished basement to about 90deg if I feel like wearing shorts in February. Processing wood is work, but if you like doing it, it's less so. If you don't, just have it delivered. I have friends & neighbors with pellet stoves too and they are happy with them - it just depends on what works for you. I like seeing a wicked nice flame from real hard wood. I can also burn whatever I want in it (within reason). A lot of Amazon boxes, confidential/private papers, six-pack holders, etc are all great kindling to get it started.

If you really want to spend, take a look at Jotul - they are the Ferrari of stoves.

I also agree with not requiring something that requires electricity to run. Having the ability to heat without power is a very nice insurance policy (also depends on what kind of climate you live in).

I recommend going to a real stove store and discussing what you need. Definitely listen to their advice about BTUs vs room-size/house-size. This is one of the very few occasions where bigger may not always be better.

ETA - Also look into possible tax credits - I don't know if they still exist for stoves or not, but I am fairly certain I looked into when I put ours in but we may have already exhausted our energy credits that year.
 
dwygrsshpr said:
<snip>

I recommend going to a real stove store and discussing what you need. Definitely listen to their advice about BTUs vs room-size/house-size. This is one of the very few occasions where bigger may not always be better.

<snip>
Click to expand...
Can confirm you can potentially cook yourself out with too big of a stove. My Hearthstone Clydesdale was rated for ~2000 square feet. In three years of use, I only really baked myself out of a 700square foot house maybe three times. :homer: All it took was turn off fan and open front dutch door to 25 degree outside:goofball:

It looks like the price went way up from when I bought mine 10 years ago... $3500 to $5500:eek:
 
What type of fireplace do you have? When we moved into the house I thought we would put an insert into the open fireplace we had. Turns out that open fireplace was a zero clearance fireplace deal that you can't put an insert in. Ended up tearing it all out and putting in a new sealed up fireplace with a fan to cirdulcate heat. Works awesome now but was a huge pain in the ass to install.
 
Here is the guy I had during first fire up:
haraka.jpg
 
I did an insert because I wanted the fire to be where the existing brick fireplace was but it definitely doesn't heat as well as freestanding ones I've used in the past.
I thought the existing 2 story brick chimney would keep the install cost down but it needed a liner added to be upto code so that was kinda pointless. It woulda been cheaper, put out more heat and had many more models to choose from had I just gone freestanding somewhere else with an exposed flue exiting through the ceiling.
But it's right where I want it, under the TV, and doesn't take up any extra floor space 🤷
 
gathering wood can be cheap
I like wood stoved because of the fact that you are not relying on other people to keep your family warm
propane, wood pellets, electricity all need others to do their job

wood, I just need to put it in there and it works

but Im old, jaded, and dont trust anyone anymore
 
Looking to go this route and hoping to get a wood stove insert next week...been educating myself as much as I can and learning a lot. Plan on tackling everything myself with the assistance of a friend when needed. Last thing I want to do is spend $ on something that isn't hobby related, but the thought of saving $$ on my electric bill, so that I can spend more on my hobby, is very attractive to me :homer:

Will be sure to post up my attempt of this **** show when I finally get an insert on hand. Google says the average fireplace is good for 5-10,000 BTU's and the Osburn 2000 model I'm looking at is a maximum of 65,000...holy **** I'm hard at the thought of hopefully how much less my heat will run :laughing: Will definitely have to probably adjust the minimum time the HVAC fan runs to circulate the heat, but if I have $3k in this project all said and done, it should only be about a 3 year turn around time on my investment in it.
 
I only heat with wood, 8-10 cord a year for 10+ years. I have a wood furnace and 2 fireplaces and I converted both to Lopi's. Went with the biggest that would fit, freedom upstairs, freedom bay downstairs. Installed with 6" insulated flexible liner. Both units were CL finds that were in good shape. I gave them a coat of grill paint, new firebrick, and they look like new.
They work great, when you open the bypass before opening the door, no smoke comes in the house. They will burn overnight if you run them right and put out 1000000x more heat per stick than the silly 70's fireplaces they replaced.
Lopi is the best, buy used and you can get them for a song.
My furnace preheats DHW and is much closer to my wood storage, so I mostly use it, but the Lopi's will heat the whole house eaisily. I also made a little table thay goes inside with either a grate or pizza stone. 800F makes a perfect pizza in 3mins!

Also, they are a perfect recipie for couch lock, radiant heat knocks you out coming in from the cold.
 
larboc said:
I also made a little table thay goes inside with either a grate or pizza stone. 800F makes a perfect pizza in 3mins!
Click to expand...
man, yet another reason to wish for a larger firebox
though I suppose it could be made to work even with a fairly small one, get it all full of coals, rake it out flat then fit the grate in there...
huh
once the house construction is done I might have to clean out my stove real good, get all the trash ash outta there
larboc said:
Also, they are a perfect recipie for couch lock, radiant heat knocks you out coming in from the cold.
Click to expand...
glass in the door is dangerous
you end up sitting on the ash bucket and watching the fire for an hour if you aren't careful
 
Update: Got this thing up and running and holy ****...what a difference. Just in time for spring and summer :homer:

Question on burning stuff. Growing up I treated my dad's wood stove in the shop building like it was a damn incinerator :laughing: If it would burn, I chucked it in there. I even would soak some logs in used motor oil for a few weeks and let'r eat.

Obviously it says to only burn wood stuff, but what harm to the stove/chimney liner does burning other stuff cause? Like does burning plastics and such cause long term damage to the fire bricks or the secondary reburn air tubes? It is a noncatalytic stove.

Either way, in a strange way, I'm somewhat looking forward to seeing what an improvement in heating the house will be will this. I know initially on paper the $$$ doesn't make sense, as I'm just about $3k in all said and done. Even if the stove saves me $150-$200 a month in electric, it'll take years to break even, but I'll be a hell of a lot warmer during those years with cheaper bills to boot. I was blown away at how much more heat this thing throws out compared to a normal fireplace. Not even remotely comparable.
 
Love wood heat, but man its a **** ton of work. Messy too. Need to have the yard and time to be able to handle it.
 
Otto M@n said:
Update: Got this thing up and running and holy ****...what a difference. Just in time for spring and summer :homer:

Question on burning stuff. Growing up I treated my dad's wood stove in the shop building like it was a damn incinerator :laughing: If it would burn, I chucked it in there. I even would soak some logs in used motor oil for a few weeks and let'r eat.

Obviously it says to only burn wood stuff, but what harm to the stove/chimney liner does burning other stuff cause? Like does burning plastics and such cause long term damage to the fire bricks or the secondary reburn air tubes? It is a noncatalytic stove.

Either way, in a strange way, I'm somewhat looking forward to seeing what an improvement in heating the house will be will this. I know initially on paper the $$$ doesn't make sense, as I'm just about $3k in all said and done. Even if the stove saves me $150-$200 a month in electric, it'll take years to break even, but I'll be a hell of a lot warmer during those years with cheaper bills to boot. I was blown away at how much more heat this thing throws out compared to a normal fireplace. Not even remotely comparable.
Click to expand...
The higher temps of burning trash will lead to warping and corrosion, will take a while but will. Also, plastic has a knack for getting on the door seal and pulling the rope out if its place. It also stinks. IHMO not worth it, especially in a home. I burn cardboard, paper, or wood.
 
larboc said:
The higher temps of burning trash will lead to warping and corrosion, will take a while but will. Also, plastic has a knack for getting on the door seal and pulling the rope out if its place. It also stinks. IHMO not worth it, especially in a home. I burn cardboard, paper, or wood.
Click to expand...
Yeah stick with cellullose based materials. I have burned some plastic packaging material before and it is gnarly - burns too hot, stinks (dangerous as well), and can leave residues as said; especially on the glass - what a PITA - eventually burns off but still no bueno. About the worst I do anymore is all the christmas wrapping, the inks can make for some colorful flames. But that is also a pain because it leaves too much ash; again no foils or plastics. When I burn documents that have staples, the fire is generally hot enough to vaporize them.

Really the best is just use clean dry wood and burn it hot - that will keep the chimney clean enough (I have a double wall stainless liner so YMMV). There is always smoke at start-up but once it's up and running at temp, I always go out side to look at the cap and all you can see is heat shimmer.

Keep the stove clean and empty the ash pan as often as possible (harder to do when running constantly).

I also use fatwood sticks to light with a benzomatic plumbers torch. I ****ed with firewood matches for far too long!

Oh, and this product if you have a glass door: MEECO'S RED DEVIL 701 glass cleaner. It's essentially lye - spray it on (when cold) and wipe with a paper towel. Crystal clear glass. When the fire is burning hot, nothing accumulates on the glass but when you bank it for the night and it cools off, that's when deposits form. And to echo 486 above, a glass door can send you into a time warp!

​

 
Last edited:
dwygrsshpr said:
Yeah stick with cellullose based materials. I have burned some plastic packaging material before and it is gnarly - burns too hot, stinks (dangerous as well), and can leave residues as said; especially on the glass - what a PITA - eventually burns off but still no bueno. About the worst I do anymore is all the christmas wrapping, the inks can make for some colorful flames. But that is also a pain because it leaves too much ash; again no foils or plastics. When I burn documents that have staples, the fire is generally hot enough to vaporize them.

Really the best is just use clean dry wood and burn it hot - that will keep the chimney clean enough (I have a double wall stainless liner so YMMV). There is always smoke at start-up but once it's up and running at temp, I always go out side to look at the cap and all you can see is heat shimmer.

Keep the stove clean and empty the ash pan as often as possible (harder to do when running constantly).

I also use fatwood sticks to light with a benzomatic plumbers torch. I ****ed with firewood matches for far too long!

Oh, and this product if you have a glass door: MEECO'S RED DEVIL 701 glass cleaner. It's essentially lye - spray it on (when cold) and wipe with a paper towel. Crystal clear glass. When the fire is burning hot, nothing accumulates on the glass but when you bank it for the night and it cools off, that's when deposits form. And to echo 486 above, a glass door can send you into a time warp!

​

Click to expand...
So, for cleaning the glass I just use a wet paper towel. Once the soot soaks for about 45 seconds it wipes right off.
 
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