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The Blue & White Whale -1990 GMC 2500 Suburban...

Not a whole lot of updates on this yet, still trying to decide on a build plan.

Alternator had grenaded a bearing, so replaced that with some new pulleys and a belt, accessory drive is much happier now. Runs and drives half decent, brakes even work, limited slip maybe sort of works? Has a fuel leak in return line and the rad is now leaking, but the major overhaul will wait until after winter.

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Also pulled up the wet carpets to find some hidden rust from salty boots.

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From what I have found reading online thus far, I think that the current np241 case behind the th400 should be able to work behind either an sm465 or an nv4500.

The nv4500 is maybe an inch or two shorter than the th400, probably still enough to require driveshafts? I have this trans in other trucks, and it's alright, gear splits aren't the greatest, but OD is nice. Seems to be getting harder to find, junkyards asking up to 2k for something that will likely need gone through. :eek: And rebuild parts aren't exactly cheap either...

I was kind of leaning towards the 4 speed option, should be much cheaper to get a trans, but the cost of new bellhousing, pedals, and driveshafts will still be significant. Would hopefully be more stout as well. Does the 350 TBI have enough grunt to handle OD ratio? 3.73's with 31s or 33's would be the plan, may have a trailer behind it a fair bit. Not sure how much I will hate life with no OD, or if the fuel mileage will be that much worse.

Rear axle is going to get replaced, the 9.5" SF has a ton of miles, and the leaf springs have some heavy wear. Need to read up on the 14b bible and figure out the right combo of donor truck to start looking for. Allegedly the 10.5" FF pinion is very slightly shorter than the 9.5" SF, so in combo with a nv4500 the rear driveshaft may be a required change anyways.
 
Find a rotted out 2000-06 2500 6.0 burb (or better yet 8.1) and swap it over. It will have the 14b FF and the 4l80 or 85e depending on the year.
 
So this thing sat all winter, in a nice climate controlled storage tarp. Time to get cracking on it once again. Probably do some basic maintenance stuff and try to get it on the road for a bit, then do the manual swap a bit later.

Been slowly gathering new parts off rockauto whenever there was good closeout deals, and also finding some used parts off CL. (screw FBMP...) Pretty much decided that unless a good cheap NV4500 falls into my lap in the next couple months, it's getting a 4 speed.

Got a hydraulic clutch pedal setup along with a bellhousing. Was listed for $400, tried my hardest to get it for tree-fiddy, but seller wouldn't budge.

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Scored some free tires! They should even pass inspection. :smokin:

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Picked up a suburban FF 14b and another front 10b for parts, $125.

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Still need to find an SM465 tranny. From the research I was doing when replacing the ECM, it sounds like the 88-91 TBI trucks had a 4th gear sensor switch that was linked to the ECM for better economy?? If I can find a correct PROM for the manual trans, maybe it would be possible to manually trigger that with an independent switch? I'll update as/if I figure out what goes on with that.
 
Ripped the car alarm system out, what a PITA that was with bits and pieces crammed all up in the dash.

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Put it up on jackstands, then it rained for a week. Water leak on passenger side seems to be coming from windshield. Removed the running boards.

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The springs are pretty clapped out, think it looks good sitting just a couple inches higher, may have to address that at some point. The front springs have a concerning amount of negative arch?

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Rear springs are a little better, but after 314k they are showing some pretty good wear.

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The stock front springs almost always have negative arch after few years on them, they start out basically flat. 2.5-4" all spring kit with 33-35" tires would be a good fit I think without looking like a lifted mud truck lol. Nice to see an old suburban getting some love, keep up with the progress.
 
Been ripping things apart. Got the radiator out, it had been leaking from multiple places.

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Gas tank is out, the factory skid plate was a PITA with 3 of the 6 bolt heads rusted too far to loosen... Tank and sending unit were rusted pretty bad, guess it's time to buy a new 40 gallon tank. Started pressure washing to blast off any loose remnants of undercoating.

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Also found out the down pipes on the remaining exhaust are trashed and rotted through. Was hoping to just add on some new pieces, but we've hit that stage of the build where marginally necessary upgrades are being implemented. Tried to break the exhaust bolts loose and amazingly they all started to move! So, did some research on the best fitting headers, and got a set on order. :shaking:

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Got the "new" tires on the freshly painted wheels, which I found out are actually ford wheels. Hooked up the little sandblaster I picked up last year and it worked surprisingly well. Gonna see how bad things shake with no balancing.

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Got the "new" tires on the freshly painted wheels, which I found out are actually ford wheels. Hooked up the little sandblaster I picked up last year and it worked surprisingly well. Gonna see how bad things shake with no balancing.
Mine are also ford wheels, the "dog dish" hub caps from the late 70s chevys fit them.
 
Mine are also ford wheels, the "dog dish" hub caps from the late 70s chevys fit them.
Heck yeah, got the fronts from the parts axle ready to go. :smokin: Gonna try and find a couple cheap GMC rears at the local swap meet next month, could totally just buy some off ebay right now, but more fun chasing parts the old school way.

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Patched up the drivers floor with a repair panel. It's pretty hack, but it gets the job done. Going to liberally coat everything in preservation grease to keep the rust from makign a comeback.

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Spent today chipping away more crusty paint and undercoating, almost ready to start spraying some groil all over.

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Threw some sealing snot into the windshield gasket, there was a small gap up at the top corner, this seems to have solved the water leakage into the cabin.

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Tried to swap out the manual hubs from the donor axle, but found out that they are 6 bolt vs 5, so no go until the whole hub gets swapped. That can wait for stage two of the build when the rear axle and trans goes in.

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Threw some left over high heat paint onto the headers that came in, I'm sure it will last for a solid 2 heat cycles...

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Pulled throttle body to go through it. Got a rebuild kit and a new TPS, the engine would cut out if given a very small amount of throttle, but if you gave it just a bit more it would rev up fine. We'll see if that fixes it.

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The hubs will swap, you end up taking everything out so that includes the piece with bolt pattern. pretty easy job as long as snap ring comes out ok (and in 1 piece)

I mean locking hubs not whole wheel hub, figured I should edit that.
 
New gas tank arrived, figured since the old one was rusted out now would be a good time to put in a 40 gallon tank. Will be fun filling that up the first time...

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Got the area above and around the tank undercoated (grease/oil/linseed mixture) before it goes in, will finish the job after things are closer to finished.

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The Intake showed signs of a slow but regular coolant seep, so figured might as well pull that since it's this far into it. I would much rather try to fix problems like this before they become a major issue on the side of the road. Might always drive old junk, but you gotta put in some PM time if it has any chance of being long term reliable.

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Ahhh, scraping gasket remnants by the light of a flashlight...


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New thermostat and gasket.

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New water pump. I was a bit surprised to see no actual gaskets in the valley? Used fel pro gaskets and the little tube of supplied RTV, but when the intake was torqued down there wasn't as much squishing out as I would have liked! Guess for once it would have been appropriate to just go all in on the silicone... :shaking: Really hope it sealed well and doesn't leak oil everywhere.

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While the distributor was out I put in a new pickup coil, already had it in the parts pile from when I was trying to get the engine running the first time.

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Got the headers in, they actually fit surprisingly well! Contrary to the instructions, you don't have to actually remove all of the spark plugs. Putting those back in took longer than the headers...

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Rebuilt TB went on.

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Put the new tank and fuel pump in, after coating the top side with grease.

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Didn't realize how thin the layer of spray paint on the tank was until the camera on the phone took one with the flash. :laughing:

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Put an O2 sensor bung in the collector. Flawless welds... (it got rotated upwards)

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Put in the new rad, new hoses, and old fan.

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It lives!!! Well, again...





Quickly found a fuel leak through a rust pin hole on the supply line. Chopped the bad section out, spliced in some hose, and rockin' again! Until, another leak sprang up on the return line... Almost though about just replacing all the entire hard lines with hose, but just did another dice and splice. No more leaks for now.

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Tried to break the bleeder on the passenger caliper free so I could replace the hose. Tried heat, impact, finesse, penetrating oil, nothing worked, snapped it off... Maybe the hose is still good for a while?

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Didn't you have a spare axle? Swap the caliper, or spend about $20 on rockauto for new one..... (after core return) hell might be worth buying a pair and a set of the $9 brake pads :lmao:
 
I hear ya, we'll get to that eventually. :lmao: There is actually a set of reman calipers and pads in the parts pile already, was just trying to get away with a quick fix. :homer: The parts axle donated the calipers for the core charge, those ones were really rusted out.

The plan remains to run it on the road for just a little while to see what other issues come up, then it's getting the tranny swapped once one shows up. Doing the minimal amount of work possible on the rear axle and springs, those will most likely get yanked out and replaced.
 
I have a sm465 coming out of an 86 k30 sometime this summer.
 
I have a sm465 coming out of an 86 k30 sometime this summer.
Will have to keep that in mind if nothing comes up locally, but hopefully should turn up, gotta be a lot of them around.


Ended up throwing the new calipers and brake hoses on. Rotors weren't terrible so scuffed them up good, bearings felt smooth. I was going to pull the hubs and go through them as well, but that's when I started to consider the condition of everything else on the axle. The ball joints and TRE's all looked to be on there for a very long time.

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Dragged the spare axles into the shop, was going to go over the 14b anyways and do the brakes. Was thinking that it may be easier to just rebuild the spare axle with all new parts while it's out of the truck.

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New shocks all around.

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Replaced the front brake lines with nickel copper ones.

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Pieced the exhaust together with some leftover 2-1/2" S bends I had from a while back, finally got around to using them.

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$19.99 Summit glasspacks and some "cats" :smokin:

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Re-used the over axle pieces.

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Dropped it on the ground and drove it around the yard. All the paint burned off the headers in an impressive smoke show. Just need to get it insured, plated, and give it a real run. Still needs cleaned out and a bunch of little stuff yet.

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Tried to do the whole exhaust the legit way, but just couldn't NOT toss in a couple extra coat hanger brackets to keep the tips from sagging...

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Removed what was left of the headliner material and foam with compressed air, that was a freakin mess...

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Spent all weekend at the swap meet selling crap, then buying even more crap, and emptying beer cans. No luck on hub caps or leaf springs, but was able to score a SM465 for 60 bucks! :grinpimp: Wow is that thing heavy. :laughing: Was from a 86 K10, double checked the splines to make sure it was 32. I think the adapter piece for the t-case is going to need swapped to the short style, need to find one of those that isn't $200+ on ebay.

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Hey man your getting it all together! Those hydraulic clutch setups are getting harder and harder to find, I got one from a member over on the other forum years ago then like a dummy sold the truck after getting it all running. I had gotten the itch for something newer to DD so projects left. I just lucked across another one over the winter for a steal about 2hrs away in BFE, guy said he worked at night and didnt get home till like 11pm but otherwise he could do something in a few days but had few people he was waiting to hear back from. Loaded the wife up in car and made a trip at almost midnight in light snowfall to meet guy before someone else snatched it up. The wife was THRILLED at the idea of driving over 4hrs in bad weather for a truck part....:lmao:
 
Road Update: Put like 700 miles on it so far, working the bugs out. Steering wheel was off center, messed with drag link for a while until finding that the steering shaft was 180 degrees off. Swapped in some less worn TRE's from the donor axle.

The average fuel economy is coming in right around 10.5 mpg, never been so happy to barely get double digits! :laughing:

Starter is probably starting to go. Added heat shielding between it and the headers. Probably put off replacing it until dies completely in the dead of winter...

Thing rides like a lumber wagon, the entire suspension feels worn out. I replaced the cheap front shocks with "heavy duty" ones to alleviate the front end bounce, it helped but still not great. I can see why these had the option for dual front shocks.

Rear window wiring was corroded out at the connector, spliced that back together and the key switch works now. Rear power windows work but are excruciatingly slow. Tossed a cheap stereo head unit in for now, can't go without tunes! 2 out of 4 speakers work, and the tuner sucks, so its got a SD card full of 90's rock mix on constant rotation.

For the most part though, been a hoot driving it. Surprised how many comments and waves it gets. NEEDS the 4 speed installed, but that likely won't be until next year.

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If anyone is bored and wants to watch the live-action struggle of getting this thing back on the road...




Currently parked it out back under a tarp for the remainder of salt season. Needs suspension freshened up something fierce, was hauling a decently loaded trailer and it was getting pretty sketchy with any cross wind.
 
On the lumberwagon ride do I remember correctly that you are thinking about a small lift in future for this? If so a fairly low budget setup would be a set of stock height 52's up front. They can give you the lift and ride better, just need to play with spring pack till your happy with height vs ride. I know there are ton of options to do that but I always just re-use the stock front spring hangers and flip them side to side so the little brace is in front of body mount instead of behind. In rear you could go with new springs that are bit softer or convert to the 63's from a newer truck for bit better ride and do a shackle flip at same time to get the height to match front.

Obviously the sky is the limit if you want to throw more money into it with link setup or custom springs.
 
On the lumberwagon ride do I remember correctly that you are thinking about a small lift in future for this? If so a fairly low budget setup would be a set of stock height 52's up front. They can give you the lift and ride better, just need to play with spring pack till your happy with height vs ride. I know there are ton of options to do that but I always just re-use the stock front spring hangers and flip them side to side so the little brace is in front of body mount instead of behind. In rear you could go with new springs that are bit softer or convert to the 63's from a newer truck for bit better ride and do a shackle flip at same time to get the height to match front.

Obviously the sky is the limit if you want to throw more money into it with link setup or custom springs.
Good to know. :beer: Sounds like pretty close to what I'd be looking for, even if I had to pull a leaf from the 52's I could add it to the rear pack to help out there. Was hoping to just get some used stuff cheap and make bastard packs.
 
Not sure what you would have in rear currently 52's or 56's being a 3\4T sub. If 52's you could pull a leaf or two and throw bushings in for the front then junkyard scrounge a set of 63's from a 99+ 2500 and play with pack. I know some guys do throw the 56's on the front too but I just don't have any experience to share on how that works out. In rear you dont have to go shackle flip since blocks or zero rates could get you little height if you only end up needing a bit to level it out. Also since the rear will need rivets cut and stock hangers moved to make up for spring length and pin center you could also play around with moving them down on frame a bit to get extra height.
 
Bump for summer updates!!:flipoff2:
Still haven't done the 4 speed swap yet... Found that BOTH of the front upper shackle bolts were sheared on the nut side! Definitely helps explain why the handling sucked so bad, haha. The broken pieces were still solidly rusted into the shackle though, so you couldn't really see that they were broken. Couldn't get remnants of old bolts out, had to cut rivets and remove shackle mounts.

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While the front springs were out, put in all new bushings, and installed an extra leaf to help get rid of the negative arch. Front is sitting pretty good now, raised up 3-4 inches, handles better. Only problem is I haven't sourced any rear springs yet, so the back end now looks like it's squatted... Got-damn flat billers are giving me thumbs ups now. :flipoff2:
 
Still haven't swapped the 4 speed and rear axle yet, just keep putting it off...

After fixing up the front suspension was hoping for a drastic improvement in stability and handling. While the front end did improve when hitting bumps, it's still not great. The steering is tight, virtually zero dead spot in steering wheel. Tires are wearing fine, doesn't pull left or right. However, it just doesn't have a stable feel to it.

Move wheel 1" to the right, you are GOING to the right, vice versa with left. May need to add angled shims to increase caster? Thought the caster would have been significantly improved when the negative spring arch was reduced?

Hauled a bit with it, not the most enjoyable. Still need new rear springs. Between the very sensitive steering and the trailer pushing it around on rough roads it was a handful at times.
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Side note: the summit glass packs have mostly burned out, boy do they start rappin' when all 147 ponies are running. :laughing:
 
Still haven't done the 4 speed swap yet... Found that BOTH of the front upper shackle bolts were sheared on the nut side! Definitely helps explain why the handling sucked so bad, haha. The broken pieces were still solidly rusted into the shackle though, so you couldn't really see that they were broken. Couldn't get remnants of old bolts out, had to cut rivets and remove shackle mounts.

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While the front springs were out, put in all new bushings, and installed an extra leaf to help get rid of the negative arch. Front is sitting pretty good now, raised up 3-4 inches, handles better. Only problem is I haven't sourced any rear springs yet, so the back end now looks like it's squatted... Got-damn flat billers are giving me thumbs ups now. :flipoff2:
Thats impresive.....


How is the engine running? Using much oil? Smoke?
:beer:
 
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