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Hydraulic Auger Build

Duc

Red Skull Member
Joined
May 30, 2020
Member Number
1679
Messages
384
Loc
ABQ NM
Time to add a post hole digger setup to the Kubota L2502 to help install a few gate posts, solar panel mount poles and plant some trees. Originally planned on purchasing a 3 point post hole digger but figure a hydraulic system would make a fun project and work better.

Solidworks files can be sent to anyone that wants to copy for personal use.


I will try to keep a running tally of cost on the first post.

Total Cost
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Items to still be purchased
QTY 2 2.75 ID x 4.437 Tapered Bearings
QTY 1 3.5 OD x 12in metal rod
Hoses

Free items
Plate on hand and steel tubing to make tractor mount

Motor Selection
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Few Calcs from Parker Tech sheet

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And some calculation Magic if I didnt screw up excel :homer:

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Not sure about the side or thrust load the motor can take so I decided a thrust bearing setup was need in the design. I was unable to locate a commercial off the shelf solution such as a mounted taper bearing that didnt break the bank.

Option 1 - taper bearings off ebay with a custom shaft. Would involve also building a sleeve to hold them.

Option 2 - Use a old unit bearing from my 2003 2500HD that I laying around. Probably going with this option.


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Mount for my pallet fork setup on the tractor minus the forks. Latches into the area the forks sit in. Built a adjustable clamp for the bottom to clear the bottom lip. 12inches wide by 21inches

Auger mount.jpg



Mount on the pallet fork attachment.

Auger Mount 3.jpg



Rear locking mechanism. Required to get around the lip at bottom of attachment.

Auger mount 2.jpg
 
Through the years of selling and using hydraulic augers they kinda went like this. First ones were reduced by a chain and sprocket setup. Naturally that had its failures due to the chain breaking.

Then came the planetary gear drive system which has held up great and has taken a lot of abuse

Point being, you’re not going to do very well with direct drive motor to auger bit drive, it needs to be a gear reduced setup to have the power and torque necessary to drill in the ground.

You want to shoot for 15 gpm @ 3000 psi for an attiquite performance. If you are using the auxiliary boom hydraulics on the front of that Kubota tractor, it may not meet those specifications. Will it work? Yes. What’s the problem then? Auger stalling and hydraulics hissing at you as it’s going over the hydraulic pressure relief valve.

You can get a pto pump system or build one that will give you the performance you’ll need.
 
ThePanzerFuhrer said:
A direct drive is a no go. You’re gonna need a planetary on there. That is unless you’re drilling 2” holes.
Click to expand...
From the pump''s perspective or the auger bit's perspective there's no difference between a 4 cubic inch motor and 2 cubic inch motor with a 2:1 reduction.

That shit only starts mattering when you start trying to run parts outside their "happy" zone.
 
arse_sidewards said:
From the pump''s perspective or the auger bit's perspective there's no difference between a 4 cubic inch motor and 2 cubic inch motor with a 2:1 reduction.

That shit only starts mattering when you start trying to run parts outside their "happy" zone.
Click to expand...
I know:lmao: He is still a 2:1 reduction away from having a ok drill. The skid steer augers tend to start at 1200 ft/lbs for the small stuff and go up to 3-4000 for the guys that want to spin a 24” auger. His 750 foot lbs is gonna be a tough one to use.
 
More reduction less speed... I think...
This A7B is direct drive but I've never seen one, we usually only sell the A13B.

specs from the yellow brand A7B hydraulic auger

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From everything I can find online, the system will have more power than a 2 - person auger. But open to trying to adapted to more torque. The build is only at the beginning and I can always pivot.

I wonder if a planetary gear set from a automatic transmission would work? Transmissions can be found all day long at junkyard for $120.

I dont have enough experience in automatic transmissions to know if I can use the parts.


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500 ft*lbs

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7.75 lb*ft before a 30:1 reduction = ~232.5 lb*ft
 
Duc said:
From everything I can find online, the system will have more power than a 2 - person auger. But open to trying to adapted to more torque. The build is only at the beginning and I can always pivot.

I wonder if a planetary gear set from a automatic transmission would work? Transmissions can be found all day long at junkyard for $120.

I dont have enough experience in automatic transmissions to know if I can use the parts.


1721779628893.png

500 ft*lbs

1721780090680.png

7.75 lb*ft before a 30:1 reduction = ~232.5 lb*ft
Click to expand...
The chain drive would be easy for you to adapt and cheap.

Alternatively a torque hub from surplus center might do it too.

And well there's this :lmao:
1000014211.jpg
 
Those two man augers don't have a lot of power either... They also don't use "real" bits.

IMO I support what you're doing but think you need to emulate the performance of the commercial product not make a useless inferior one.

I did what you are doing for my father in law. I got a A19 auger out of the scrap that has a broken auger shaft, bought the shaft from Auburn gear and made a mount to slip on a fork of his 4600 Kubota. It was a pleasure to use, much better than his Danuser PTO unit.
And infinitely better when you got it screwed down beside a rock and had to manually in screw the PTO shaft :mad3:
 
Duc said:
From everything I can find online, the system will have more power than a 2 - person auger.
Click to expand...
If that's all you want then fine. But when you have a machine that makes it stupid easy to drill circular holes in the ground you're gonna want to use it for larger diameter stuff like building footings.
 
Just sold 2 augers for cheap but more than I bought them. Excavator works better
 
Excavator works great to use a post hole digger mounted on the stick but to dig a 12" hole a excavator doesn't do that well.
 
Duc said:
From everything I can find online, the system will have more power than a 2 - person auger. But open to trying to adapted to more torque. The build is only at the beginning and I can always pivot.

I wonder if a planetary gear set from a automatic transmission would work? Transmissions can be found all day long at junkyard for $120.

I dont have enough experience in automatic transmissions to know if I can use the parts.


1721779628893.png

500 ft*lbs

1721780090680.png

7.75 lb*ft before a 30:1 reduction = ~232.5 lb*ft
Click to expand...
Are you using the auxiliary hydraulics off of your Kubota tractor? What gpm/psi is it putting out full throttle?
 
If I was putting that much time and expense into a machine implement, I'd want it to be 5-10x what a two person power tool could do. Otherwise, why not just suffer the two person power tool.
 
GLTHFJ60 said:
If I was putting that much time and expense into a machine implement, I'd want it to be 5-10x what a two person power tool could do. Otherwise, why not just suffer the two person power tool.
Click to expand...
I work alone on most projects. Never know when I will get a hair up my ass to complete something. If setup doesnt work then I will modify.

Received in the timken bearings. 2.75in ID. Must have been really old stock from a closed business.
$50 each versus +$200 each
Timkenbearings.jpg


Day of sketchy setups on the mill.

6"x.5"x11.5in steel tube. Blocks welded on the sides for clamping down before squaring tube up and cutting a recess for the motor mounts. Tube was shimmed by ~.052 to fix angle from saw cut.
Tube Mod.jpg


Best setup :lmao:

Window for the hydraulic fittings. Flat spot at bottom was added in last operation for clocking the window to the motor mount cutouts in setup. I tried to use the strap to dampen the cutter noise, tried is key word but left on till it was done.
Tube window.jpg
 
Duc said:
6"x.5"x11.5in steel tube. Blocks welded on the sides for clamping down before squaring tube up and cutting a recess for the motor mounts. Tube was shimmed by ~.052 to fix angle from saw cut.
Tube Mod.jpg


Best setup :lmao:
Click to expand...

The stupid cheap Chinese 10 or 12" lathe vices on ebay make great round material vices on the mill. I think I got a 10" for like $120 shipped way back when I got the first mill. It's been surprisingly useful.
 
bgaidan said:
The stupid cheap Chinese 10 or 12" lathe vices on ebay make great round material vices on the mill. I think I got a 10" for like $120 shipped way back when I got the first mill. It's been surprisingly useful.
Click to expand...
I'm googling "lathe vise" and finding nothing.
 
[486] said:
cut section of tire tread works great for this
wad it up and jam it in there
Click to expand...
I should have.

bgaidan said:
The stupid cheap Chinese 10 or 12" lathe vices on ebay make great round material vices on the mill. I think I got a 10" for like $120 shipped way back when I got the first mill. It's been surprisingly useful.
Click to expand...
Normally I dont machine tubes to often in the mill. But it might be time to purchase a large lathe chuck for future things.

[486] said:
I'm googling "lathe vise" and finding nothing.
Click to expand...
Lathe chuck


Made some more progress.

Diesel bath to remove the vanish from the old bearings
Diesel bath.jpg



Picked up a 12in auger from tractor supply this weekend. Dam thing was 20 dollars cheaper in Rio Rancho then ABQ. I should have taken a side by side picture of the old stock auger versus new stock. New stock appeared to be 1/8 on new stock versus the old stock which had ~.160.
$200
Auger.jpg


Now onto the bastard. I should have stopped when ahead.

-Bored the inside to 4.4375 for a slip fit on the bearing instead of a proper fit of -.005. I have green loctite or a punch at final assembly if needed. Plus bearing is way oversized and spinning slow. Lathe worked awesome at 500 sfm, .020 DOC, .010/rev. Only had a 1in steel boring bar hanging out 3.25in for a 2.8in depth.

and the fuckups
-Broke a tap on the first hole of the first pattern. I should have machined out instead of trying a new pattern
-Selected the wrong hole when spotting new pattern. Melted that spot drill since old tap was still in hole
-Moved the pattern for a 3rd time. spot and drill everything just fine but manually tapped the holes this time. used a tapered tapped to start the holes but decided to use a spiral flute tap to finish the hole off. Fucking snapped on the first hole. Never had this many issues with tapping.
-Use a 1/8 carbide end mill to remove 95% of the tap before that broke.

Good fucking enough. I will fill the holes with JBweld later.

Mother fucker.jpg
 
I'm a retard.

I was picturing some kind of circular vise thing looking like a couple steady rests that you bolt to the carriage to carry pipe that you're line boring
Maybe like a couple pipe vises in one.
 
[486] said:
I'm googling "lathe vise" and finding nothing.
Click to expand...
[486] said:
I'm a retard.

I was picturing some kind of circular vise thing looking like a couple steady rests that you bolt to the carriage to carry pipe that you're line boring
Maybe like a couple pipe vises in one.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm tarded. Sometimes words don't come out good. :laughing:


But yeah, a cheap chuck. You can make a wider backplate for them so you can toe clamp them and not impact the working area. I was usually working with small stuff so I just put a couple clamps around the face and it worked fine. They make chucks specifically for clamping to a mill table, but they're $$.
 
Tomorrow I should have the flat plates but still no shipping info on the shafts.

Lathe Vise :grinpimp:

Lathe vise.jpg
 
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