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Fireball releases a giant vise - the Hardtail

subybaja said:
:laughing: Neat idea!

Some triangles to back up the jaw holders would be easy enough...
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True. I'm already thinking of the next one I want to build with some design changes.


Another thing you can do, if you haven't already sourced the tube, is just use a wider piece of tube for the body. If you go to, say, a 6"x4" tube, with the 6" laid horizontally you could get wider supper behind the jaws.....of course it'd also change the front and back plates and the base/mounting plate dimensions too.
 
ThePanzerFuhrer said:
I got the steel to make them it will just be a bit. I was hoping a cnc guy could burn them out in a few hours . If not I’ll turn the old Bridgeport into a production machine lol.
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jptbay said:
I'm hoping someone here that has CNC machines could knock out the bearing plate and jaws holders too. Is there a job shop thread here?
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PAToyota said:
Let me check on some things on Monday. I may be able to make up a batch of them.
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I got the bearing plate (front jaw end cap) and jaw support block drawn up in Fusion last night and will check on materials today. How many "kits" have been made so far so I can estimate for an initial run of materials?
 
PAToyota said:
I got the bearing plate (front jaw end cap) and jaw support block drawn up in Fusion last night and will check on materials today. How many "kits" have been made so far so I can estimate for an initial run of materials?
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15 so far
 
Also, if I make "extended" jaw supports for an offset setup, I can easily make them 6" or 8" as bgaidan said. I'd just need to know how many people were looking for each length - standard, 2" over, or 4" over.
 
PAToyota said:
Also, if I make "extended" jaw supports for an offset setup, I can easily make them 6" or 8" as bgaidan said. I'd just need to know how many people were looking for each length - standard, 2" over, or 4" over.
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I bought a set and will be grabbing the bearing plate and jaw blocks if I can. I was hoping for a set of 6" jaws. I thinks that's what was shown earlier in this thread as a normal ish. Should have an small overhang in each side but still keep to the original video premise? 6" in a normal bolt pattern is my vote for jaws.
 
This was the ones I was leaning towards.

https://www.amazon.com/Tools-Record-Replacement-Mechanics-T6D/dp/B0002JT60E/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=2S5O6N5UEB6CE&keywords=6”+irwin+vise+jaws&qid=1638188352&qsid=146-8232021-9944320&sprefix=6+irwin+vise+jaws%2Caps%2C376&sr=8-3&sres=B0002JT60E%2CB019VOT6JG%2CB081QZ88HF%2CB01LZS58CB%2CB0040UGSY8%2CB07848T22X%2CB078MVLSZS%2CB0001LQY4O%2CB00J5AE8EU%2CB009ACC7GY%2CB07DJF5QYL%2CB07DJD8Q9J%2CB0068EVEIO%2CB0002JT5ZK&srpt=HARDWARE_CLAMP_VISE

6” Irwin

6”x1”x.5” bolts spacing is 4” apart .5” up
 
aczlan said:
That's what I was thinking, parts availability going forward should be good and should have enough overhang to clamp down on something vertical off to one side.

Aaron Z
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I liked the Irwin’s better than the wiltons from McMaster care.
 
PAToyota said:
Also, if I make "extended" jaw supports for an offset setup, I can easily make them 6" or 8" as bgaidan said. I'd just need to know how many people were looking for each length - standard, 2" over, or 4" over.
Click to expand...


I need to site down and sketch it a bit, but I'm thinking about starting with an 8" jaw, offset 2" to one side - so you'd have 1" overhang on one side and 3" on the other. But I'd also drill the backing plate for 6" and 8" jaws so if I don't like the 8" I can just zip the extra backing off and go to a centered 6".
 
bgaidan said:
I need to site down and sketch it a bit, but I'm thinking about starting with an 8" jaw, offset 2" to one side - so you'd have 1" overhang on one side and 3" on the other. But I'd also drill the backing plate for 6" and 8" jaws so if I don't like the 8" I can just zip the extra backing off and go to a centered 6".
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I like it.

I am adding 3 onto the 15 already done.
 
bgaidan said:
I need to site down and sketch it a bit, but I'm thinking about starting with an 8" jaw, offset 2" to one side - so you'd have 1" overhang on one side and 3" on the other. But I'd also drill the backing plate for 6" and 8" jaws so if I don't like the 8" I can just zip the extra backing off and go to a centered 6".
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As I recall, the jaw support block doesn't have any machining for where the jaw side plates attach to it, so if it's drilled for both the T6D and T8D Irwin plates (with both starting at one side), you could pick a size and a offset
I would be interested in a set drilled for both the 6" and 8" and if I do offset it, I can add triangulation to the offset side.

Aaron Z
 
aczlan said:
As I recall, the jaw support block doesn't have any machining for where the jaw side plates attach to it, so if it's drilled for both the T6D and T8D Irwin plates (with both starting at one side), you could pick a size and a offset
I would be interested in a set drilled for both the 6" and 8" and if I do offset it, I can add triangulation to the offset side.

Aaron Z
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He does show the support block machine with a .25" recessed ledge for the jaws. I don't think it's 100% necessary but it would be better to have it.
1638195519707.png


I'm drawing the whole vise up in conFusion360 at the moment. Meant to do it at the start of this but never got around to it.

Centering the 8" jaw over the 6" would pose problems with bolt hole spacing (if you were doing it to have the option to cut it down to 6" later), but offsetting it like I mentioned should work great.
 
If we use the Irwin jaws the jaw holders only need to be drilled and tapped. Fireball drawing is not good for those.
 
Managed to get the fixed side of the vise modeled.......but I need to do some actual work today too. :laughing: I'll knock the rest out tonight.


Here it is with the 8" jaw offset.

1638198317614.png




The 6" jaws put the holes right on the center of the edge of the supports. The plans show using 4" jaws with through-holes countersunk on the backside. We'll either need to do tapped/blind holes to use 6" jaws. If you're sure you're going to stick with the 8", you could just slide the jaw support over another 1/4" or so.

1638198511596.png
 
bgaidan said:
Managed to get the fixed side of the vise modeled.......but I need to do some actual work today too. :laughing: I'll knock the rest out tonight.


Here it is with the 8" jaw offset.

1638198317614.png




The 6" jaws put the holes right on the center of the edge of the supports. The plans show using 4" jaws with through-holes countersunk on the backside. We'll either need to do tapped/blind holes to use 6" jaws. If you're sure you're going to stick with the 8", you could just slide the jaw support over another 1/4" or so.

1638198511596.png
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Irwin jaws bolt in from front not rear. So holes don’t matter where they line up on body of the vise.
 
Pretty sure the Irwin jaws don't require a through hole in the jaw holder, only a tapped blind hole, so there should be no interference.

Bolt head appears countersunk in the jaws.

8" jaw holders with the option to cut down to 6" sounds awesome.

I think a ledge machined into the jaw holders would be beneficial.
 
ThePanzerFuhrer said:
Irwin jaws bolt in from front not rear. So holes don’t matter where they line up on body of the vise.
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Yeah, for some reason I was thinking he showed countersunk holes on both the front side of the jaws AND the backside of the support plate. Looking at it again he was bolting the jaws from the back side. So yeah, just tapped blind holes in the supports will be fine with the irwin jaws.
 
ThePanzerFuhrer said:
Yes ledge no through hole and countersink. I was referring to the hole. The Irwin jaws are .5” thick so a .200-.250 shoulder would be awesome.
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What's the diameter of the holes in the irwin jaws? Both the through hole and the countersunk? Will a standard socket cap screw work or do we need to look for low profile ones?
 
bgaidan said:
What's the diameter of the holes in the irwin jaws? Both the through hole and the countersunk? Will a standard socket cap screw work or do we need to look for low profile ones?
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I’ll check tonight once I get home. There are either 1/4 or 5/16 diameter bolts
 
Ok, if were using front bolted jaws count me in the camp of 8" jaw holders with the option to cut down to 6" sounds cool to me. Then we can drill and tap our own locations based on jaw choice?
 
bgaidan said:
He does show the support block machine with a .25" recessed ledge for the jaws. I don't think it's 100% necessary but it would be better to have it.
1638195519707.png


I'm drawing the whole vise up in conFusion360 at the moment. Meant to do it at the start of this but never got around to it.

Centering the 8" jaw over the 6" would pose problems with bolt hole spacing (if you were doing it to have the option to cut it down to 6" later), but offsetting it like I mentioned should work great.
Click to expand...
Sorry for the confusion, I was talking about the lack of machining on the backside of the jaw support block where it ties into the side plates, so I could take a a jaw support block setup for an 8" jaw and offset it as much or as little as I wanted to.

bgaidan said:
What's the diameter of the holes in the irwin jaws? Both the through hole and the countersunk? Will a standard socket cap screw work or do we need to look for low profile ones?
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41FmiRTm1GL._AC_.jpg


Someone from Irwin replied to a question about jaw plate dimensions on the Amazon ad and said:
We do have the dimensions for these jaw plates: 152mm (6.00") Plate length, 25.4mm (1.00") Jaw plate height, 12.7mm (0.50") Jaw plate width, 8.3mm (0.33") Fixing hole diameter, 102mm (4.00") distance between fixing hole centers, 12.7mm (0.500") distance from bottom of jaw plate to fixing hole center, 25.4mm (1.00") Distance from side of jaw plate to fixing hole center
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Not sure if the 8.3mm/0.33" "Fixing hole diameter" is the through hole diameter, or the counter sink hole diameter, perhaps ThePanzerFuhrer can measure the ones that came with the T8D jaws that he got?
Edit, looks like I missed the post where that is already in the works.

Aaron Z
 
My plan for the jaw supports is to mount the jaws and then clamp and weld in a 1/4" piece of steel below them which would eliminate the need for machining. Fully welding the bottom and sides and 2 or 3 rosette welds in the middle should be plenty strong and leave a clean shelf for the jaws to sit on.

Since there are a bunch of different configurations and jaws being brought up this might be the most flexible solution.
 
Here's the complete model with the offset jaws.


I need to double check my dimensions. The way I have it drawn now you can't fully close the jaws....there's about a 1/2" gap with the side plates touching. I may have just fat-fingered a dimension or something.

1638214171194.png
 
bgaidan said:
Here's the complete model with the offset jaws.


I need to double check my dimensions. The way I have it drawn now you can't fully close the jaws....there's about a 1/2" gap with the side plates touching. I may have just fat-fingered a dimension or something.

1638214171194.png
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They should work with the thin jaws may have to go up to a 1 1/2x 2 jaw retainer. I used the 1x1 aluminum bar stock for my jaws. If you have the cutouts lay them on the table and see what the spacing is with the edges touching.
 
MigGunslinger said:
My plan for the jaw supports is to mount the jaws and then clamp and weld in a 1/4" piece of steel below them which would eliminate the need for machining. Fully welding the bottom and sides and 2 or 3 rosette welds in the middle should be plenty strong and leave a clean shelf for the jaws to sit on.

Since there are a bunch of different configurations and jaws being brought up this might be the most flexible solution.
Click to expand...
My other thought was to put a "thick steel" Diablo blade on my old table saw, weld a angle iron "handle" to the back of each jaw and cut it out one kerf width at a time. Would be loud, but it seems like it should work slowly...

Aaron Z
 
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