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Eaton Elocker4 vs. old style eaton e locker

YotaAtieToo said:
Luck of the draw maybe, or like you said, theirs are part of the generation with issues, I know a couple people who have ran arb's for ~20 years with almost no issues.

Instal is a big thing with them, make sure that you have someone do it who knows what they're doing.

Sounds like you might just want a grizzly or Detroit. Running 2 hi or even front wheel only when possible will help a lot with steering. An auto locker front should steer better than a locked selectable, but obviously not quite as good as an open.
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Install doesn't affect bonded seals unless you're dropping the thing on the floor and torching it or something dumb. All of my issues have been with the bonded seals..no other issue.
 
nukegoat said:
Install doesn't affect bonded seals unless you're dropping the thing on the floor and torching it or something dumb. All of my issues have been with the bonded seals..no other issue.
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So like I said, you got one of the shitty gen ones.

Install may not effect the seal, but when the copper line cracks because of a poor install, you're fucked.
 
Yeah that’s what I’m thinking. I sent the video to Eaton to see what they say.

Another thought is that my wife’s project is a 2WD E350 cutaway camper van that’s got a Dana 70. Eventually she wants me to 4x4 swap it but a rear locker isn’t a bad idea if I already have one....I wonder if 29in tires can break the locker? :grinpimp:
 
There you go, throw the new parts in anyway and use it in the van.

Only problem may be carrier break assuming the elocker is 4.56+ and you're not using thick gears.
 
Well the pins sheared off the locking clutch. Based on the video, it isn't immediately apparent how that makes the locker fail but it certainly is a concerning piece of evidence. Possible that the ears eventually got loose enough to put all the shear load on the pins, which then broke, and then subsequently allowed the clutch to misalign just enough under load to slip? I don't see signs of fretting on the clutch teeth but... ?
06h3 said:


Wtf? Nothing seems broken
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Yeah that is true. I’m 4.56+ and the van has 4.10s

What’s also weird is that after the locker skipped teeth it locked up and worked after that. If I remember correctly we ended up running spooners the day after the locker was skipping teeth. So it’s like it wouldn’t line up under load?
 
06h3 said:
Yeah that is true. I’m 4.56+ and the van has 4.10s

What’s also weird is that after the locker skipped teeth it locked up and worked after that. If I remember correctly we ended up running spooners the day after the locker was skipping teeth. So it’s like it wouldn’t line up under load?
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Just having it locked and driving in circles on flat dirt made it pop constantly IIRC. I think you just didn't need it much on spooners
 
That’s right. It was popping. You probably have a video of it....stupid locker.

Detroit locker, the only one that hasn’t failed me yet. I do want to test out the ARB because it’s the only selectable I haven’t tried but I’ll probably just be setting myself up for disappointment when the locking collar starts to round off.

Didn’t that happen to you on your 70?
 
06h3 said:
That’s right. It was popping. You probably have a video of it....stupid locker.

Detroit locker, the only one that hasn’t failed me yet. I do want to test out the ARB because it’s the only selectable I haven’t tried but I’ll probably just be setting myself up for disappointment when the locking collar starts to round off.

Didn’t that happen to you on your 70?
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Even when they leak, they lock. Never had an issue with the ARB not actually doing what I need it to, it only has interesting side effects like constantly running the compressor, pushing gear oil out the vent tube, etc.

I mean, don't get me wrong, I would love an alternative to ARBs. But I don't like having a non-selectable rear
 
I’m just about ready to throw my locker back into the axle and I’m torn. The e locker is rebuilt. My theory is basically what nukegoat said....I believe my failure was due to the locking mechanism digging into the case. There’s “slop” in it due to the design which allows it to “slam” into the case and dig into it. Then the locking mechanism that has the pins on it take a side load compared to The pushing force they are designed for which locks the axle. That’s all theory....

So with all that said, I wouldn’t feel comfortable with it selling it to someone unless I knew it was used on a tow rig or something that has small tires that probably won’t see the load a 40+in tire rig would see.

So I can slap it back in, run it, see how long it lasts or find a new locker. I wish I could just fill the dig marks with material but that would be disastrous.

I’d like selectable and that basically leaves auburn or ARB. If I break one of them I will be beyond ticked off. Auburn is out but I am intrigued by it. Their new “select a loc” is intriguing, no posi crap, just open or locked. New design, genright runs em in their terremoto JK that finished KOH....but I know better. I went down the experimental path before with Eaton. Admittedly I had 4.5 good years out of it problem free.

ARB is tried and true for strength but I worry I will regret it. It’s just from what I have seen.

I want parts availability....so that takes out Eaton and probably leaves me with ARB and a lunchbox

Detroit is out. Fuck Eaton, too big of a corporation to give a shit.

Spool (rather not)

Yukon doesn’t make a grizzly or zip unfortunately.

I am intrigued by a lunchbox, really because I am so ticked off by lockers at this point that when I breaks I won’t be raging with anger lol. I know guys who have broken shafts before the lunchbox....this Eaton has broken the damn locker before the a stock 35 spline inner.

I’m going to give ECGS a call today. I wish I had a crystal ball, if the future told me a lunchbox will cost $2,000 but it won’t break in the next 20 years I’d buy it today. I’m not concerned about cost. I’m concerned about never looking at another locker again.
 
Damn it, impulse buy with ECGS on the phone....ARB locker is on its way.

I’m really just buying it to prove that I will break that pile of shit too :flipoff2: Then end up with a spool that costs 1/4 of the price.

And I’m not talking airlines or copper lines....im talking broken hard parts
 
subybaja said:
OX?
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Already broke one of those unfortunately.

When I had a Dana 44...the case half bolts are tiny 1/4in bolts. They back out and sheer, sometimes the bolts take out your R&P when the bolts back out. Some would say it’s install error but when the locker comes preassembled from Ox and it backs out I’d say not install error. When the case half comes apart the internals aren’t happy.

Enough people had issues with them that they changed the bolt and case half design. The bolt now sits flush in the case and they machined a groove in the case to accept a massive snap ring that prevents the bolt from backing out. I’m not sure if that is the same design as the 60/70.

The old school e locker I could break on demand on 35s. Ball and ramp 2 pin brings the suck.

New school 4 pin e locker (one I just broke) was great for 4.5 years. Broke pins that engage locker due to side loading. Case half is too soft and allowed the locking mechanism to dig into the case.

Ox was the issue mentioned above.

In terms of selectables I only have two more options, Auburn and ARB. We will see if I can break the ARB. I won’t bother with the auburn and if I break the ARB I can then claim all selectables suck lol. All kidding aside I hope this is the last locker I ever buy.
 
So I notice a lot of people put their copper line over the ring gear. Why? I feel like fluid slinging wants to push it into the ring gear. I would think it makes more sense to route it up on the same side the line is at
 
06h3 said:
Damn it, impulse buy with ECGS on the phone....ARB locker is on its way.

I’m really just buying it to prove that I will break that pile of shit too :flipoff2: Then end up with a spool that costs 1/4 of the price.

And I’m not talking airlines or copper lines....im talking broken hard parts
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I don't think you'll be disappointed. Most all of my wheeling buddies run ARB's with little to no issues. The ones that were afraid of them due to failures went with OX or Eaton and they were ALWAYS the ones on the trail having problems with their lockers as those of us with ARB's were laughing at them.

I put my ARB's F&R in my Cruiser back in 1997. One problem with an airline due to the way I routed it, easy fix on the trail. The rear end I swapped out a couple years ago was still running the same ARB and factory seals even after changing the R&P once, different housing and zero [problems. I sold that rear end and installed a ProRock also with an ARB, also zero problems.

The front ARB I'm still running is the one from 1997. Works flawless still. People talk about maintenance with them but since I've installed it, I've ran 4 different engines soon to be 5th, 5 sets of tires, 2 transmissions, a broken an Advanced adapters Rock Box, broken birfields, and so much more all on the same ARB and seals from 1997.

The front ARB has been through Rubicon, Fordyce, Sledge Hammer, Jack Hammer, Dusy, Barret, Swamp Lake, and many more and most of them multiple times. The reliability of the ARB's has been incredible.
 
Rock Hugger said:
I don't think you'll be disappointed. Most all of my wheeling buddies run ARB's with little to no issues. The ones that were afraid of them due to failures went with OX or Eaton and they were ALWAYS the ones on the trail having problems with their lockers as those of us with ARB's were laughing at them.

I put my ARB's F&R in my Cruiser back in 1997. One problem with an airline due to the way I routed it, easy fix on the trail. The rear end I swapped out a couple years ago was still running the same ARB and factory seals even after changing the R&P once, different housing and zero [problems. I sold that rear end and installed a ProRock also with an ARB, also zero problems.

The front ARB I'm still running is the one from 1997. Works flawless still. People talk about maintenance with them but since I've installed it, I've ran 4 different engines soon to be 5th, 5 sets of tires, 2 transmissions, a broken an Advanced adapters Rock Box, broken birfields, and so much more all on the same ARB and seals from 1997.

The front ARB has been through Rubicon, Fordyce, Sledge Hammer, Jack Hammer, Dusy, Barret, Swamp Lake, and many more and most of them multiple times. The reliability of the ARB's has been incredible.
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that has been my experience as well, there were 8 ARBs in our group at one point, brand new to 18yrs old and never any issues with the locker itself, very rarely a compressor or air line routing problem. over half of those ARB's were beat on like a red headed step child, i personally broke or witnessed those ARB's break almost a dozen chromo shafts and countless other drive train parts, including a 14b axle shaft, ARB laughed at it all and they all work to this day.
 
One nice thing about arb is they're instant lock and unlock. I don't have experience with the Eaton, but more elockers seem to lag a big to lock and even worse to unlock.

Another option is to get the comp version, where they use air to unlock and locked with no air. A front axle with locking hubs is perfect since you can leave it locked(no air) almost all the time. It's only available on certain models though.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Another option is to get the comp version, where they use air to unlock and locked with no air. A front axle with locking hubs is perfect since you can leave it locked(no air) almost all the time. It's only available on certain models though.
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i could be wrong but i think thats a yukon zip thing not ARB
 
That’s what I thought. Got my ARB in the mail. Should be here Wednesday....so I say Thursday. I feel my accent is getting slightly more Aussie since this purchase :flipoff2:

anyone have any comments on the copper line routing? I mentioned it above. Most go over the R&P...why? I thought there’s less chance of issues if it stays on the same side as the seal housing
 
ARB suck in winter. Just like summer. :flipoff2:

Moisture in the air lines freezes and makes things fun.

Last local guy finally ditched them a few years ago and says he should have did it sooner. He repainted his rig after ever couple runs and is a bot xtreme on maint and prep.

Lots of locals have run them in the past. No one does now. They get annoying after a while with the leaks and seals. I have on in my truck that has a leaking seal, yay. That's gonna be fun.
 
06h3 said:
That’s what I thought. Got my ARB in the mail. Should be here Wednesday....so I say Thursday. I feel my accent is getting slightly more Aussie since this purchase :flipoff2:

anyone have any comments on the copper line routing? I mentioned it above. Most go over the R&P...why? I thought there’s less chance of issues if it stays on the same side as the seal housing
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Honestly, I'd have someone who has installed 100s of them do it. Install is important.

I'm not sure why they would go over the ring gear, but I wouldn't try to make it as short as possible. You want room for the line to give when it gets hot and cold.

rockyota83 said:
i could be wrong but i think thats a yukon zip thing not ARB
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Ya, I had to look it up. Arb makes a competition :eek:9" locker ($2400 :eek:) but that's just extra beef. The comp zip locker is the one I was thinking of. You could buy the D60 version and have jantz do a little work to it to use in the d70 if you really wanted it.
 
Again that is from someone you know not YOU. Everyone knows a guy that knows a guys that’s had numerous problems or has a friend of a friend or heard stories but no one knows the real issue because it’s someone else. Probably a hack job install. Do it right and don’t worry.
 
Rock Hugger said:
Again that is from someone you know not YOU. Everyone knows a guy that knows a guys that’s had numerous problems or has a friend of a friend or heard stories but no one knows the real issue because it’s someone else. Probably a hack job install. Do it right and don’t worry.
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Lol I've literally had all of them leak due to faulty internal parts having nothing to do with install. 06h3 won't break the ARB, but it's not gods gift to selectable lockers by any stretch
 
nukegoat said:
Lol I've literally had all of them leak due to faulty internal parts having nothing to do with install. 06h3 won't break the ARB, but it's not gods gift to selectable lockers by any stretch
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You have the shitty year versions right? Sucks that they fucked them up for a bit but other than that specific time frame, they're pretty bulletproof. Like the guy who's had the same one since 97?

There really isn't many other viable options for a selectable in a hardcore rig. Besides the zip, which is an arb copy iirc.

I've heard the latest ox is really good, but I'm not dropping $1200 on one to be a test dummy.
 
06h3 said:
anyone have any comments on the copper line routing? I mentioned it above. Most go over the R&P...why? I thought there’s less chance of issues if it stays on the same side as the seal housing
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If anything, there's more chance of issues. The seal collar needs to have some float, and it has to be physically possible to install the seal collar and get the copper line into the bulkhead fitting. A short run line with one bend in it will make this very hard and will increase the risk the seal collar is preloaded by the copper line. Running it around the ring gear provides enough flex in the copper line to resolve both problems. I have seen failures where the copper line was run in front of the ring gear and the line ended up pinched between the ring gear and the housing, but that's poor install. Run the line up and over the ring gear clear of where if could contact the housing or gear and it will be fine.
 
nukegoat said:
Lol I've literally had all of them leak due to faulty internal parts having nothing to do with install. 06h3 won't break the ARB, but it's not gods gift to selectable lockers by any stretch
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By all accounts the MacNamara diff lock is a superior design to the ARB - it has a much larger locking ring, but it's made in small numbers, basically to order. Jack is also getting on a bit and his customer service approach is "novel" so while they might be a masterpiece, potential lack of future parts and support make them less appealing even if the product isn't as good.

As an aside, aftermarket selectable lockers for recreational 4X4's were basically born down here in Melbourne , Australia. - Bill Larman developed a Land Rover locker in the 1970's, and went on to work on the McNamara locker, while Tony Roberts developed the Robert's Diff Lock in the early 1980's for japanese 4WD's, and that was bought by ARB in 1988 and productionised as the Air Locker. Because the local market never embraced North American vehicles for a number of reasons, we developed products for predominantly Toyota and Land Rover, which let our aftermarket grow in a bubble.
 
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