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Choosing Brake Pads

Austin

Austin

Blame Canada
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I've never done anything but tell the Autozone fella the year/make/model and he tells me which pads to buy. I've never researched pads and don't know shit about compounds.

I ordered some forged Wilwood Forged Dynalite Calipers, there are 10ish options for pads. Only 1 suggests off-road... they also say 'race only, not for street'. I don't plan to make my mog a DD, but I want to drive it on the road some.

Here is that table from the Wildwood site:
AXLE SET P/NCOMPOUND
150-8850KBP-10
150-20-7112KBP-20
150-28-7112KBP-28
150-12243K - labeled "off-road"BP-40
150-Q-7112KBP-Q
15A-5734KPolyMatrix A
15E-6096K - labeled "off-road & street, high rotor wear"PolyMatrix E
15A-5734K-B (bedded-in pads)PolyMatrix A
15E-6096K-B (bedded-in pads)PolyMatrix E

Anybody thats shopped or experienced these have any thoughts?
 
I had "track" pads on my Lotus.

They were very "meh" until warmed up then they were "holy shit". So kinda sucked for road use.

I forget the brand/compound now.

Was sorta looking into something for my 5500 Dodge, the brakes aren't great on it when loaded.

I'd bet blocks carved from pine on those calipers would be an improvement over the factory 1960s Merc drums
 
I don't know any of those, but the race only ones will need to be up to temp to work, and will suck ass until hot,

Wilwood Disc Brakes

Part Number: 150-12243K, brake pads, pads, polymatrix, racing, high friction, high temperature range, wear resistance, pad fade, friction loss, compound
www.wilwood.com www.wilwood.com

reading three specs, looks like these will be aggressive cold, and take heat well. So you will get consistent braking across the range.

I usually go for the most aggressive braking to start, Toyota on 37-40's with Toyota rotors need as much initial bite as possible.:homer:
 
I'm no rocket appliancetist but I agree with Stingray, of the compounds available that BP40 looks like what I'd pick for an off-road/lower speed rig. Something like a Unimog isn't gonna be putting a ton of heat in the brakes during normal use, you'll want whatever works best cold.
 
Stingray said:
I don't know any of those, but the race only ones will need to be up to temp to work, and will suck ass until hot,

Wilwood Disc Brakes

Part Number: 150-12243K, brake pads, pads, polymatrix, racing, high friction, high temperature range, wear resistance, pad fade, friction loss, compound
www.wilwood.com www.wilwood.com

reading three specs, looks like these will be aggressive cold, and take heat well. So you will get consistent braking across the range.

I usually go for the most aggressive braking to start, Toyota on 37-40's with Toyota rotors need as much initial bite as possible.:homer:
Click to expand...
I like those too, was wondering why they say not for street use. They are good for road course and oval ... what part of street driving is not good for these?
 
Austin said:
I like those too, was wondering why they say not for street use. They are good for road course and oval ... what part of street driving is not good for these?
Click to expand...
Not sure, but your not commuting in this, I would go for the pad that works best right off the start. It might be a wear issue. normal operating range look like 500-1000 with a max of 1300

If it compatible with the rotors and calipers you ordered they look good
 
how many calibers are you planning to run per corner. singles wont stop mog sized vehicle safe in street driving.
 
The BP20's are to hard unless you have assist and lots of line pressure. The poly matrix E pads are good for manual brakes.
 
Also, have you checked line pressure yet?

I used some EBC pads with similar compound to the E pads. Worked decent but there is no substitute for power assist.
 
Austin said:
1 per with spidertrax ultimate 14” rotors
Click to expand...

That's a non-vented rotor that's 3/8" think correct?

Those rotors will get hot as fuck fast under any kind of hard braking with a heavy rig on the road. There's no place for the heat to go in a solid rotor, it just builds up higher and higher.

If you want the Smart pads, I'd be looking at the BP-28's. Or PolyMatrix, B or H.

Wilwood or AP racing brake fluid cause you're going to be dumping a ton of heat into those calipers.
 
gt1guy said:
That's a non-vented rotor that's 3/8" think correct?

Those rotors will get hot as fuck fast under any kind of hard braking with a heavy rig on the road. There's no place for the heat to go in a solid rotor, it just builds up higher and higher.

If you want the Smart pads, I'd be looking at the BP-28's. Or PolyMatrix, B or H.

Wilwood or AP racing brake fluid cause you're going to be dumping a ton of heat into those calipers.
Click to expand...

This.

Spidertrax solid rotors and Willwood calipers look cool and that's about it. Unless you are putting those on the rear of a 2800lb race car and matching them with a pair of vented front rotors and much better calipers you ain't stopping very good. Spidertrax made those rotors to lighten up axles and rotating weight on U4 cars and they were never great at stopping. Ask any U4 racer and they will tell you the same thing.

I'd recommend the highest ratio pedal set you can find to give yourself 1/2 a chance at stopping. Anything less and you are grabbing the steering wheel and pulling yourself down towards the brake pedal with your leg locked to slow down. Stopping quickly isn't happening.
 
gt1guy said:
That's a non-vented rotor that's 3/8" think correct?
Click to expand...
yea, they are slotted not drilled
IMG_8939.jpeg


This parts list is what 74Weld has been selling as a Unimog conversion for years. I haven’t heard of any complaints, but I also don’t know the specs for a Unimog’s factory brake system they are added to. Will do some digging on that.

TimJus said:
issue with those caliber are they flex like crazy and you just cant get decent braking force.
Click to expand...
Interesting. Is it the size? Material? Brand? Is there a better caliper that size people are using?


I’ve never weighed mine, but a factory 404 weighs 6,300lbs. I’m sure I’m under that but, by the time I’m done, probably not by much.
 
Austin said:
Interesting. Is it the size? Material? Brand?
Click to expand...
3/8" does not seem very thick to me.

Ultimate 14 in. Rotor
for 5-1/2" BC Hats
Building on the same platform of our previous generation Pro Series Rotor, the Spidertrax Ultimate Rotor delivers many of the competition proven benefits our brake rotors are known for, but at a fraction of the price. We start with domestic grade laser cut mild steel plate, then CNC all Ultimate Rotors using our unique slot pattern optimized for achieving excellent pad wear. All of this while boasting a massive 14" diameter, the key for superior Ultra4 stopping power at both high and low speeds. If you're an Ultra4 racer who likes to go fast, but needs to watch that budget while doing so, the Ultimate Rotor is for you.

This Ultimate Rotor is designed to work with Spidertrax 5-1/2" BC Hats. Rotor measures 3/8" thick. To clear the diameter of this rotor, a 17"+ wheel is required. Brake Hat mounting hardware included.
 
Austin said:
Interesting. Is it the size? Material? Brand? Is there a better caliper that size people are using?


I’ve never weighed mine, but a factory 404 weighs 6,300lbs. I’m sure I’m under that but, by the time I’m done, probably not by much.
Click to expand...
its just design, missing bridge, too weak material. un controlled flexing is the reason they give max psi.

im planning trash canning mine and relapsing them with Toyota landcruiser hd/kdj120 calibers. same size pistons.
cheaper and pads are cheaper too. bit heavier but they dont flex.
 
TimJus

Is your buggy set up with those rotors and calipers F&R and what is the total weight of the rig? Would you say it stops good at fairly high speed or no? Also, what's your pedal ratio if running without assist?
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
TimJus

Is your buggy set up with those rotors and calipers F&R and what is the total weight of the rig? Would you say it stops good at fairly high speed or no? Also, what's your pedal ratio if running without assist?
Click to expand...
all corner dynalites + hydraulic handbrake with dynalite calibers. my rotors are diy drilled ~14" non vented
i have vacuum booster. can even remember pedal ration anymore i have changed it multiple times.
my buggy is 4k lbs it just wont stop good from any speed. there is never firm feel in brakes with dynalites.
i have tried all there is with these. (manual setup/residual valves/boosters/pedal rations/pads/rotor design and mc sizes)
 
Austin said:
yea, they are slotted not drilled
IMG_8939.jpeg


This parts list is what 74Weld has been selling as a Unimog conversion for years. I haven’t heard of any complaints, but I also don’t know the specs for a Unimog’s factory brake system they are added to. Will do some digging on that.


Interesting. Is it the size? Material? Brand? Is there a better caliper that size people are using?


I’ve never weighed mine, but a factory 404 weighs 6,300lbs. I’m sure I’m under that but, by the time I’m done, probably not by much.
Click to expand...


The venting I was speaking of is a rotor that looks like this.


160-13497-xl.jpg



Looks like just about every car/truck rotor out there. You can see the part that makes them "vented" in between the pad surfaces. Those vents are cooling fins and are shaped to grab air and move it through the rotor.
So when the friction between the rotor and pads creates heat, that heat works it's way to the vents and is removed by the air flowing through it.

Here you can see how the vents are shaped to force air through the rotor. Air move from the ID to the OD of the disk.

160-13497-dw-lg.jpg




If you're going to be ~6klbs. That's full size truck weight.

To me, and this is just my opinion, the second you add street driving to the mix, you really need to approach a few things like brakes differently. Gotta figure stopping from 40-50-60mph (with traction) over and over and over.
 
Wilwood and a bunch of other racecar companies make vented rotors for high speed and heavy applications but I have no idea if they will bolt up to a Spidertrax hat and if bigger/better calipers will mount to your axles without extensive mods to the brackets.
 
Looks like I could send these back and upgrade to their vented rotors. Same for the calipers, they have bridged 6 piston ones to fit these rotors.

I have the 74Weld hats made just for the 404’s axles and designed to work with the rotors I got. So I would assume I could use their vented rotors as well. Just may need to make a custom bracket to mount the caliper. Will have to call 74Weld and Spidertrax to verify.
 
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SLOWPOKE693 said:
if they will bolt up to a Spidertrax hat and if bigger/better calipers will mount to your axles without extensive mods to the brackets.
Click to expand...
I’m converting from drums and stock portal boxes to disc & 74Weld boxes …. so it’s all an extensive mod :grinpimp:
 
Austin said:
50-60mph in a Unimog, I wish :lmao:

I get what you’re saying though. What brand are those?
Click to expand...

SLOWPOKE693 said:
Wilwood and a bunch of other racecar companies make vented rotors for high speed and heavy applications but I have no idea if they will bolt up to a Spidertrax hat and if bigger/better calipers will mount to your axles without extensive mods to the brackets.
Click to expand...


Wilwood 14" vented rotors on Spidertrax 8x6.5 hats, Aero 6 calipers in front.

IMG_20230712_194306.jpg


IMG_20230712_194325.jpg



Wilwood 13" vented rotors on Spidertrax 8x6.5 hats, Aero 6 calipers in rear.


IMG_20230806_154737.jpg



Front calipers have the larger pistons and the rear calipers have the smaller pistons.

The Spidertrax hats have a 12x8.75 bolt circle for the rotors.


IMG_20220601_152042.jpg



IMG_20220601_152135__01.jpg




Edit:

It all fits inside a 17" Trail Ready wheel too.
 
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