Hyde
Andgoseek
Supported or unsupported and what's the span? Trying to figure out what I'm going to use for mine, roughly 36"x36" belly
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Supported or unsupported and what's the span? Trying to figure out what I'm going to use for mine, roughly 36"x36" belly
ScottRS
Not @Rockstomper today
Buggy was less supported than the Jeep, which I think was part of the issue. Belly overall is about 27x44, but the largest free space is about 14x16. The buggy had a free space closer to 16x24 which was where I had bending issues (started with 1/8" steel over 3/8" UHMW, went to 3/16" steel over 3/8" UHMW, bent that too), and what I was trying to reduce down on the Jeep this go-around.
I would not leave a 36x36 open space on a belly if I could avoid it. If that means having to add a removable crossmember thing (I'm assuming that space is to pull the trans?) to help support, I'd be all over it. Did exactly that in the Jeep.
Hyde
Andgoseek
That was a "too lazy to walk to the shop" guess. Its actually 33" frame width and 25" length. A simple crossmember in the middle would be easy enough too.
chaplinfj60
Well-known member
who has hit their engine skid, and what kind of skid did you have. , i have hit the belly more than i could count but never had a engine skid, i want one now because the LS hangs down more than 22r,
chaplinfj60
Well-known member
you really cant just hard face a plate, not the thin stuff too much anyway. at least the way i am thinking about it. it wont do much to prevent bending. hard face or wear face rod make that area super hard to resist the impact force and help rocks glide vice wear out a part. now i have done wear face rod on my front axle where i reinforced it with plate
Attachments
Winchested
IH Scout SSII
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2020
- Member Number
- 2128
- Messages
- 1,411
My engine skid is 1/8th plate doubled up in the center area of the deep part of pan. Bout the width of oil pan.
Added it after a log in a mud hole almost punctured the steel oil pan on the IH 345. The alum LS pan on it now even more fragile.
This bolts to my front frame crossmember with two 1/8" bolts and to the main 3/16" skid with 3 7/16" bolts.
94toytruck
Eastcoast crawler
I have 1/4 6061 with 3/4 plastic on it and my rig is 4100lbs. Plastic is going on it's 3rd season, the belly portion is pretty beat up and showing wear but works fine still, the engine skid only has a few scratches. I'm sure AR plate is probably cheaper over all and might slide better. I don't care though, the hidden benefit is plastic is it absorbs some of the impact through the bottom of the car. My back is pretty happy with it vs. my old rig which had a steel skid.
gt1guy
Apparently a racist
Looking for opinions here.
Here's the bottom of my fuel cell cage. The can is welded to the tub and doesn't touch this cage at all. 1/4" of space everywhere.
The larger of the open spans are 10.5"x 8.5", so not very big at all.
I want to skin the bottom with mild steel and cover that with a piece of 1/2" UHMW.
Problem I just noticed is I have two choices for the mild steel and neither would be my first choice. I'd prefer 3/16", I have on hand 1/4" and 16ga.
I'm leaning towards the 16ga, cause I think 1/4" is stupid over kill in this spot.
More pictures so show how it sits at least at ride height.
I'm thinking if I stitch weld the 16ga to the bottom of it so it pulls it tight, I should be ok for covering it with the 1/2" UHMW. It would all have to get pushed up 1.25" before it even touched the can and the bladder doesn't even touch the bottom of the can.
The other reason I'm not wild about slapping a pice of 1/4" back there is that the cell is 32gal and it's all sitting behind the rear axle.
What say you folks?
Here's the bottom of my fuel cell cage. The can is welded to the tub and doesn't touch this cage at all. 1/4" of space everywhere.
The larger of the open spans are 10.5"x 8.5", so not very big at all.
I want to skin the bottom with mild steel and cover that with a piece of 1/2" UHMW.
Problem I just noticed is I have two choices for the mild steel and neither would be my first choice. I'd prefer 3/16", I have on hand 1/4" and 16ga.
I'm leaning towards the 16ga, cause I think 1/4" is stupid over kill in this spot.
More pictures so show how it sits at least at ride height.
I'm thinking if I stitch weld the 16ga to the bottom of it so it pulls it tight, I should be ok for covering it with the 1/2" UHMW. It would all have to get pushed up 1.25" before it even touched the can and the bladder doesn't even touch the bottom of the can.
The other reason I'm not wild about slapping a pice of 1/4" back there is that the cell is 32gal and it's all sitting behind the rear axle.
What say you folks?
chaplinfj60
Well-known member
i say thats a huge fuel cell. and you have so much structure i cant imagine anything getting pushed in between them stringers. so yeah maybe the sheet metal and plastic would be good. now as i say that a hit in the center may make deflect some but again i cant imagine much.
gt1guy
Apparently a racist
I went with the sheet metal yesterday. Came out good and I'm happy.
Marked out all the support members on it and drilled a series of 1/4" holes down the centers to spot weld it in place from the bottom. Held it nice a flush, but there were a couple of the open spans that had a bit of movement in the sheet metal when you pushed on it. I was expecting that. So I added 4 stitch welds and hit the corners of each open section.
Did exactly what I wanted and pulled everything tight and in tension. No more movement and tight as a drum.
First attempt a installing videos, so this may be a big fail.
This is just after the spot welds on the bottom.
And after pulling everything tight with the stitch welds.
Ya, it's a big tank. But I want the range. And with close to 600hp, the range may turn out to be about the same as stock. I hope not.
Last edited:
chaplinfj60
Well-known member
wow that worked out amazing. so just welding the edeges from the inside pulled it a bit and that solved it. so cool. that is a neat trick. what about water drainage?
gt1guy
Apparently a racist
Yes, when you weld, the metal contracts more when it cools than it expands when it heats up. That why things warp.
Another way to do the same thing would have been to heat up about a 3" circle in the center cherry red, and hit it with cold water. That's how we would smooth out decks on navy ships at the shipyard. Your just shrinking the metal.
I plan to drill few drain holes in each section. But I'll wait till the UHMW is installed to drill through everything
gt1guy
Apparently a racist
I've read a bunch of threads over the years about guys using UHMW putting a radius on the edges to help it slide over stuff.
So Yesterday I pick up a cheap router and a radius bit. Figured I'd give it a try on the little piece of UHMW I cut out for the fuel cell skid.
Fuck me, that makes a world class mess.
It looked like it snowed inside the shop. Now I know why I don't do woodwork. 5mins with the router and 45 with the shop vac.
So Yesterday I pick up a cheap router and a radius bit. Figured I'd give it a try on the little piece of UHMW I cut out for the fuel cell skid.
Fuck me, that makes a world class mess.
It looked like it snowed inside the shop. Now I know why I don't do woodwork. 5mins with the router and 45 with the shop vac.
Stokes
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 10, 2020
- Member Number
- 1938
- Messages
- 58
Mines not anything different per say from what has been posted here but a different play on thicknesses. I went with 1/2" UHMW under my Engine, Trans, Transfer cases with a combo of 3/16x1" angle and 1"x3/16 tube internal supports behind the UHMW. the main frame is 1.5" .120 DOM (should have done .25 here). this setup does deflect and has bent around the internal supports from years of abuse but I am happy with it. you can see in the photos where I have cut and re done the front of the engine skid to fit around the 3UZ oil pan, but the rest has put up with wheeling by Braile for ~5yrs
On edit, the front section under the oil pan is 3/16" due to being out of UHMW during the engine swap and the rig scaled at 3900lbs this last summer with all her usual trail items.
C3225752-4F14-411B-B720-A6103DEEC379 by Joey Stokes, on Flickr
On edit, the front section under the oil pan is 3/16" due to being out of UHMW during the engine swap and the rig scaled at 3900lbs this last summer with all her usual trail items.
Sean
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2023
- Member Number
- 6041
- Messages
- 1,412
Sorry for bringing up an older thread....but I searched and didn't find a lot of relevant info. For AR plate (probably AR400/450, Hardox, etc.) what do you guys use to drill it for mounting bolts? I've read about carbide tipped masonry bits...but that's only for a few holes and is pretty marginal from what I've read/seen on YT.
Would carbide bits be the best way to go? I'd consider plasma cutting too...though if you need a clean hole, that may not be ideal if you need to bore it to size since the edges seem to harden from the heat.
Or is it best to just stitch weld it for a belly skid/boat sides....maybe preheat it first? If so, how much....I'd assume cherry red is too much.
Would carbide bits be the best way to go? I'd consider plasma cutting too...though if you need a clean hole, that may not be ideal if you need to bore it to size since the edges seem to harden from the heat.
Or is it best to just stitch weld it for a belly skid/boat sides....maybe preheat it first? If so, how much....I'd assume cherry red is too much.
arse_sidewards
Red Skull Member
- Joined
- May 19, 2020
- Member Number
- 71
- Messages
- 8,562
I've had decent luck drilling spring steel with carbide tipped masonry bits but it's been awhile. Sharpened the edge on the grinder before I started. Low speed, medium feed, tons of oil.
cerial
Member
- Joined
- May 9, 2023
- Member Number
- 6429
- Messages
- 8
If you don't "plan" on hitting rocks or logs. Then for mud and sand a "flying carpet" works great with a bit of lightweight gusseted support
They are Polypropylene(like most cutting boards) so it makes cleaning mud clumps off easier. Great for wheel wells, factory skid plates, interior floor pieces or as a flexible means to keep mud out of a engine bay. You can't put the entire rigs weight on them on jagged rocks and not expect them to rip. But they will stop stones thrown off the tires from denting the heck out of aluminum wheel tubs or just be used to lessen clean up after playing in rocker high mud.
They are fairly cheap and available to your door in a day or two year round. Blue, pink ,or red available to match your pretty in pink diff cover that everyone you passed gets to stare at as they try to catch up. You could just paint them black with some polymer "snow jet" paint. Eventually that paint does wear off though.
It all depends on the application. 1/8" plate gusseted/triangulated in the right areas is going to be as strong if not stronger then a non gusseted/triangulated piece of 1/4" slapped onto the bottom of a tube frame with countersunk bolts. Something like a lightweight geo, early jeep, or buggy may be just fine running gusseted aluminum or use the steel skid plate under an all aluminum turbocharged 4 as a structural member.
Some areas demand strength. But there is always the cost of the weight associated with that strength. That 4 cylinder turbocharged buggy may be just fine running a hp dana 30 with a 35 out back keeping that overall weight around 2500lbs. But getting to that number is done with ounces not pounds. Loosing a little bit of weight in several places adds up. A lightweight skidplate designed for the application that is still strong enough for the application takes a bit more work. But it pays off by having a better power to weight ratio.
Something like a XJ cherokee where someone has just added weight in the form of a exo cage and several thick skid plates covering things without removing weight can easily push that cherokee over 5000lbs. That dana 30 is going to be much happier hitting logs going up a hill in a 2500lb pile with a few crumpled areas then a 5500lb rig covered in .120 plate and dom.
The "best" skid plate is the one that works for your rigs use while not being heavier then it needs to be.
They are Polypropylene(like most cutting boards) so it makes cleaning mud clumps off easier. Great for wheel wells, factory skid plates, interior floor pieces or as a flexible means to keep mud out of a engine bay. You can't put the entire rigs weight on them on jagged rocks and not expect them to rip. But they will stop stones thrown off the tires from denting the heck out of aluminum wheel tubs or just be used to lessen clean up after playing in rocker high mud.
They are fairly cheap and available to your door in a day or two year round. Blue, pink ,or red available to match your pretty in pink diff cover that everyone you passed gets to stare at as they try to catch up. You could just paint them black with some polymer "snow jet" paint. Eventually that paint does wear off though.
It all depends on the application. 1/8" plate gusseted/triangulated in the right areas is going to be as strong if not stronger then a non gusseted/triangulated piece of 1/4" slapped onto the bottom of a tube frame with countersunk bolts. Something like a lightweight geo, early jeep, or buggy may be just fine running gusseted aluminum or use the steel skid plate under an all aluminum turbocharged 4 as a structural member.
Some areas demand strength. But there is always the cost of the weight associated with that strength. That 4 cylinder turbocharged buggy may be just fine running a hp dana 30 with a 35 out back keeping that overall weight around 2500lbs. But getting to that number is done with ounces not pounds. Loosing a little bit of weight in several places adds up. A lightweight skidplate designed for the application that is still strong enough for the application takes a bit more work. But it pays off by having a better power to weight ratio.
Something like a XJ cherokee where someone has just added weight in the form of a exo cage and several thick skid plates covering things without removing weight can easily push that cherokee over 5000lbs. That dana 30 is going to be much happier hitting logs going up a hill in a 2500lb pile with a few crumpled areas then a 5500lb rig covered in .120 plate and dom.
The "best" skid plate is the one that works for your rigs use while not being heavier then it needs to be.