3rd gen 4runner/1st gen tacoma thread

[rockota]

Guarantee you would not be able to tell blindly riding in a truck with E rated tires vs others

I guarantee like for like, you’re wrong

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I'm as guilty as anyone for hijacks, but can we drop the tire shit? start a gcc thread.

 

[Slander]

Back to questions the op can easily find on any other mall crawling Toyota site but he's too scared to look because overlanders!

To answer your shock question, 5100s or OMEs. Coilovers with the stock control arms never made any sense to me.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Back to questions the op can easily find on any other mall crawling Toyota site but he's too scared to look because overlanders!

You can find people talking about this shit, yes, but it's mostly idiots who are just regurgitating what someone else told them. I was trying to add some real world tech about these rigs to the internet. Hence the bit about 285s fitting fine with no lift.

To answer your shock question, 5100s or OMEs. Coilovers with the stock control arms never made any sense to me.

Why wouldn't it? You don't have to race KOH or baja to utilize the benefits of better shocks. Also, for the 3rd time, I have the coilovers

 

[Yotota]

Well I have 5100s installed, been happy with them for the price and having the adjustable lift is cool for a stock replacement.

I picked up some of the nicer fabtech shocks, made by fox, for like $100. The bushings are pretty gone and they seem to have leaked a bit. I'm trying to decide if they're worth rebuilding or not.



Good to know about the polys.




Spc is the one that won't fit without spacers?



2.5" lift already killed 3 boots. I want to drop to the 2" or so.

Also, what about diff drops? I have lots of room in the skid plate, but a few people say they kill pinion bearings which would be easy enough to remidy, but it's seems that it doesn't really move the cv centerline down that much. Peeking in there, it looks like it would be pretty hard to drop the pinion side down.


Knock on wood, I haven't touched any of the steering at 338k, the last ~80k or so has been a fair amount of bad dirt roads and a little wheelin. Maybe that's next. I have always been impressed with the steering force on the stock rack over my 90 with a box.

Sounds like the 5100s work for ya so I would keep them and focus the time/money elsewhere. Lower the perch down a clip or two and call it good.

I ran SPC arms with stock wheels and 265/75r16 Duratracs, no spacers needed.

Diff drops are crap and not worth the money or effort. They lower the front mounts of the diff 1" but the CV is set back from that so it gets lowered much less - I think it 3/8" for these trucks. There are anecdotes about pinion oil starving but who knows if that's actually happened.

 

[rockyota83]

OH!!!

Lower ball joints SUCK on these trucks. They are under tension so when they fail the front wheel flops out sideways and fucks up the fender, suspension parts, ABS and brake lines, and more.

Treat the LBJs as a consumable part and replace them with a Japanese unit every 100k. OEM Toyota or Sankei 555. I'm trying Proforged ball joints in my GX now and they could be another option for these trucks as they make one that fits.

its not just the lower, the upper does it too. i recently put a solid axle under a tacoma because the upper bj failed and the tire came off

 

[Slander]

Get the upgraded steering rack poly bushings if you don't already have them, those help keep the steering rack from rotating around. If you do blow the rack up replace it with an OEM. The tards on the other sites replace them with O'Riley specials and they enter into a rack death spiral it seems.

 

[rockota]

I'm as guilty as anyone for hijacks, but can we drop the tire shit? start a gcc thread.

You don't own your thread... the community does.

Steering:
Poly bushings
Tack weld the steering shaft
Check that your outter TRE's can handle the travel (mine bind)

A-ARMs:
Light Racing on my 4Runner.
Total Chaos Uni-ball on my Tacoma. - I had to install limit straps to prevent TRE binding on the Tacoma. I also upgraded the bushings and replaced the uni-balls after ~25K miles

Diff Drop:
YES! Just do it.

Next question?

 

[Yotota]

its not just the lower, the upper does it too. i recently put a solid axle under a tacoma because the upper bj failed and the tire came off

Haha yes the uppers also suck and will limit your travel, as well as the upper arm hitting the spring with more droop. Worth swapping early on.

You don't own your thread... the community does.

Steering:
Poly bushings
Tack weld the steering shaft
Check that your outter TRE's can handle the travel (mine bind)

A-ARMs:
Light Racing on my 4Runner.
Total Chaos Uni-ball on my Tacoma. - I had to install limit straps to prevent TRE binding on the Tacoma. I also upgraded the bushings and replaced the uni-balls after ~25K miles

Diff Drop:
YES! Just do it.

Next question?

FYI Light Racing arms are now called SPC arms. I think they got bought out or something 5ish years back. Still excellent quality and the extra adjustment is nice, just have to keep the travel close to stock as the ball joint doesn't have as much travel as a uniball. So with a longer travel coilover one needs to go uniball.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

So to add to the 35x10.5s. They kinda do rub it's manageable, and I think I can cure most of it, but it's probably too much rubbing for most.

Which brings me to another point. I messed with the alignment cams for the first time, and I'm curious about how much you can move the spindle forward and still have decent alignment.

Well, looks like the spc arms are designed for exactly that.

Get your tire where you want it in the wheel well: Use adjustment in the control arm and on the OE lower cams to maximize alignment angles and move oversized tires forward in the wheel well to minimize or avoid fender trimming.

Some like the JBA arms as well, but others say the tire clearance sucks.

Both claim more angle than a uni-ball (spc=80* and jba 90*) spc isnt cheap, but has adjustment.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Well some ifs drama has hit me

Been using this thing a plow rig for a little bit. It's just a little utv plow, wieghs like 80 lbs max. Anyway, I got stuck trying to push a big berm back. I was rocking it a little and it seemed like it wanted to grab, rode the brakes and gas a little and it started making a bad noise in the front end. I figured one of the torn boot China cv's let go. Grabbed some new ones and swapped them in, nope, something internal. I'm guessing it's a spider gear, same thing that happened on my 90 4runner. Stupid add has the spider gears just whirring all the time. Well this one made it 340k miles and had enough of 35s and plowing snow.

I also knew it need upper ball joints, and TRE's. So I have spc arms and oem TRE's coming. I grabbed a diff drop, and "spindle" (knuckle) gusset kit while I'm in there. I also stretched the CV boots so they aren't rubbing constantly.

Now I'm trying to decide if I should spend another $2k on having the diffs regeared with the arb I have for the front, or just find another stock diff.....

May as well do a LT kit while I'm at it

 

[rockota]

Well some ifs drama has hit me

Been using this thing a plow rig for a little bit. It's just a little utv plow, wieghs like 80 lbs max. Anyway, I got stuck trying to push a big berm back. I was rocking it a little and it seemed like it wanted to grab, rode the brakes and gas a little and it started making a bad noise in the front end. I figured one of the torn boot China cv's let go. Grabbed some new ones and swapped them in, nope, something internal. I'm guessing it's a spider gear, same thing that happened on my 90 4runner. Stupid add has the spider gears just whirring all the time. Well this one made it 340k miles and had enough of 35s and plowing snow.

I also knew it need upper ball joints, and TRE's. So I have spc arms and oem TRE's coming. I grabbed a diff drop, and "spindle" (knuckle) gusset kit while I'm in there. I also stretched the CV boots so they aren't rubbing constantly.

Now I'm trying to decide if I should spend another $2k on having the diffs regeared with the arb I have for the front, or just find another stock diff.....

May as well do a LT kit while I'm at it

Sounds the the front end will be almost completely apart anyway… only a few more bolts to yank the diff (assuming you can sneak it out w/o lifting the engine … then att 4 more bolts)

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Sounds the the front end will be almost completely apart anyway… only a few more bolts to yank the diff (assuming you can sneak it out w/o lifting the engine … then att 4 more bolts)

Except my skid plate, which by itself isn't hard to remove, but I made my bumper mount up flush with it, so I have to remove the bumper to get the skid plate off. I'm thinking about adding a flange up near the radiator as it's been in the way more than once.

I have a used 7.5 arb, but I'm not going to waste the time installing it without regearing. I like the idea of using east coast gear supply. They said they would take the arb, rebuild it, build 2 diffs, ship them to me and I could ship mine back. I like the idea of just swapping shit same day(s) vs waiting however long for a shop. Just bad timing as my 7.3 is down also. This is what I get for driving 90s shit with 300k+ miles

 

[rockota]

I had ECGS do mine. Great customer service, great prices , quick delivery. I even like the paint they use.

Overall, super simple transaction. Only regret is not doing 5.29’s.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Spc arms are nice. I got them from Madison motor parts, about $80 cheaper than everyone else and free shipping. Almost infinite adjustment. Which makes me nervous about the knuckle heads trying to align it

Ball joint are way bigger also.

Figured I may as well add the knuckle gussets while I'm there.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Anyone mess with stiffer coils? Specifically ome?

Front has a plate bumper, winch and heavy skid plate. So stock coils aren't cutting it. Rear is always loaded with gear, usually 3 kids and eventually a rear bumper.

Either 883 (2.5 lift for up to 300 lbs over stock) or 882 2.5 lift with over 300 lbs over stock.

Then 891 rears 3" lift with 150-450 lbs over stock.

I'm tempted to go with the 883s as I don't want to it be overly stiff.

Also, in the rear, how dumb would those in coil air bags be instead of heavier coils?

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Found a decent thread on doing alignments with the spc arms. I wasn't excited about taking it to les schwab for an alignment with all the adjust it has now. I may just do it myself and get it close enough.

Around page 12, they talk about adjusting the lower cam bolts to push the tire forward, and then rotating the upper ball joint all the way forward as well, then you have the slot in the arm to adjust camber. They were able to get about 3* caster this way. I don't have a terrible rubbing issue on the firewall with the 10.5s so I may go back a notch or 2 on the upper to get a bit more caster. Toe is obviously simple.

It may be worth taking it in to have the camber adjusted, but I don't know is an angle finder on the rotor good enough?

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Guess I'm just talking to myself at this point, but oh well

Spc arms are still awesome. I was able to adjust the lower cams to put the tire forward. I cut my bumper, and removed the giant washer fluid bottle (for now, winter road grim sucks without it) I pulled the strut and jacked to the bump stop to check for clearance. The 35s still kiss the firewall, but it's smooth enough that it's fine, up front they rub a hair here and there, but that full bump lock to lock. I don't think this thing will hit the bump stops just flexing, but we'll see. I thought about adding a piece of 1/4" or so to the bump for a little wiggle room, but screw it.

 

[rockota]

Anyone mess with stiffer coils? Specifically ome?

Front has a plate bumper, winch and heavy skid plate. So stock coils aren't cutting it. Rear is always loaded with gear, usually 3 kids and eventually a rear bumper.

Either 883 (2.5 lift for up to 300 lbs over stock) or 882 2.5 lift with over 300 lbs over stock.

Then 891 rears 3" lift with 150-450 lbs over stock.

I'm tempted to go with the 883s as I don't want to it be overly stiff.

Also, in the rear, how dumb would those in coil air bags be instead of heavier coils?

Almost hate to suggest it... But Yotatech or ExPo would be good places to dig into this detail deeper.

my 96 4runner had the in-coil bags. Worked fine. As far as I know, they are still on the truck 12+ years later

 

[rockota]

Guess I'm just talking to myself at this point, but oh well

Spc arms are still awesome. I was able to adjust the lower cams to put the tire forward. I cut my bumper, and removed the giant washer fluid bottle (for now, winter road grim sucks without it) I pulled the strut and jacked to the bump stop to check for clearance. The 35s still kiss the firewall, but it's smooth enough that it's fine, up front they rub a hair here and there, but that full bump lock to lock. I don't think this thing will hit the bump stops just flexing, but we'll see. I thought about adding a piece of 1/4" or so to the bump for a little wiggle room, but screw it.

guesstimate on how far forward the tire is now? I have SPC's on my 02... haven't messed with it, but larger tires are inevitable.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Almost hate to suggest it... But Yotatech or ExPo would be good places to dig into this detail deeper.

my 96 4runner had the in-coil bags. Worked fine. As far as I know, they are still on the truck 12+ years later

I've been reading on them. I'm. Pretty set on 883/891s. Although, I've contemplated full air ride rear dirt head dave style

The helper bags are interesting too, I read they did wierd things in cold weather though.

guesstimate on how far forward the tire is now? I have SPC's on my 02... haven't messed with it, but larger tires are inevitable.

At least 1", and I only have the upper ball joint in the middle spot to maintain better caster. If I pushed that forward, I'd just be hitting more shit in the front.

 

[rockota]

This Pic was supposed to be in the op. Driveway flexin with the 35s

Favor to ask... what's the overall height/width on those tires, mounted on the truck?

Wife's 5th gen is going to need tires in ~5k miles or so. Have about 55k on the Falkens, and love them, but might look at a skinny 35.

 

[FleshEater]

Found it.

Looks awesome with 35’s.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Favor to ask... what's the overall height/width on those tires, mounted on the truck?

Wife's 5th gen is going to need tires in ~5k miles or so. Have about 55k on the Falkens, and love them, but might look at a skinny 35.

I measure accross the tire when on the vehicle, as ground to top of tire just has too many factors.

They're almost exactly 35x10.50s. Maybe 34 3/4"

I'm not super familiar with 5th gens, but I know the 4th gen wheel wheels are small. You'd be really opening up a van of worms with 35s. They do make a 33x10.5 also. Whichbi probably should have got

Quite a bit taller than the 2 sets of 285s I've ran. One thing I miss a little bit is the 285s were flush or a hair past the flares, these are a hair inside. I've thought about adding those 1/4" spacers, which might help a bit with some rubbing but, meh I don't care than much.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

So I keep thinking about those +2" axles...... 2" Long Travel with Chromoly Outer Cage & Race for the 3RD Gen 4Runner, 1st Gen Tacoma

I think I already mentioned it seems simple enough to just lengthen the stock control arms, but having just spent a decent chunk on the spc upper arms, I don't want to chop them up. But then I realized. The bj has about a 1" offset and would probably work perfectly if flipped 180*

So the lower arm would just need to be stretched. Which looks pretty easy.

I'd think if it was done right near the bushings, the distance from the hub to the shock would remain the same and spring rates wouldn't be effected to much, but you also wouldn't gain travel..... That's something that could easily be tuned through.

Steering would also be super simple obviously, either make correct length hiem links. Or have a small extension piece made to go between the inner and outer tre.

I just ordered 5.29 diffs from ecgs, and f&r ome coils, so I think I'm done dumping money into my 340k mile pos for a bit. But if I start breaking Cv's it's on with the +2" stuff

 

[rockota]

So I keep thinking about those +2" axles...... 2" Long Travel with Chromoly Outer Cage & Race for the 3RD Gen 4Runner, 1st Gen Tacoma

I think I already mentioned it seems simple enough to just lengthen the stock control arms, but having just spent a decent chunk on the spc upper arms, I don't want to chop them up. But then I realized. The bj has about a 1" offset and would probably work perfectly if flipped 180*

Doooo iiiiiiiiiiiittttt!!!!

Spent a lot of time thinking about this over the weekend. I think a +2 would be ideal.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Doooo iiiiiiiiiiiittttt!!!!

Spent a lot of time thinking about this over the weekend. I think a +2 would be ideal.

Buy the CV axles and I'll build 2ea of the rest

Seriously though, I don't see why this wouldn't be as simple as I typed it?

I agree that +2" would be a good setup for most people running this platform. I think you loose about 1.5-2" total wms with a 2" lift already, so it would still be very reasonable as far as tire stick out. Lot of people are running spacers and doing this while ditching the spacers would help a lot with firewall rubbing.

I'm surprised blazeland hasn't moved into the 3rd gen 4runner/1st gen taco market at all. Seems like the go to rig for budget ifs wheeler.

 

[rockota]

Buy the CV axles and I'll build 2ea of the rest

Seriously though, I don't see why this wouldn't be as simple as I typed it?

I agree that +2" would be a good setup for most people running this platform. I think you loose about 1.5-2" total wms with a 2" lift already, so it would still be very reasonable as far as tire stick out. Lot of people are running spacers and doing this while ditching the spacers would help a lot with firewall rubbing.

I'm surprised blazeland hasn't moved into the 3rd gen 4runner/1st gen taco market at all. Seems like the go to rig for budget ifs wheeler.

I think you're onto something with the upper arm. Might be much easier than anticipated.

I think i threw away a set of lower a-arms a while ago... will check storage, just in case.

 

[Yotota]

Doooo iiiiiiiiiiiittttt!!!!

Spent a lot of time thinking about this over the weekend. I think a +2 would be ideal.

So I keep thinking about those +2" axles...... 2" Long Travel with Chromoly Outer Cage & Race for the 3RD Gen 4Runner, 1st Gen Tacoma

I think I already mentioned it seems simple enough to just lengthen the stock control arms, but having just spent a decent chunk on the spc upper arms, I don't want to chop them up. But then I realized. The bj has about a 1" offset and would probably work perfectly if flipped 180*

So the lower arm would just need to be stretched. Which looks pretty easy.

I'd think if it was done right near the bushings, the distance from the hub to the shock would remain the same and spring rates wouldn't be effected to much, but you also wouldn't gain travel..... That's something that could easily be tuned through.

Steering would also be super simple obviously, either make correct length hiem links. Or have a small extension piece made to go between the inner and outer tre.

I just ordered 5.29 diffs from ecgs, and f&r ome coils, so I think I'm done dumping money into my 340k mile pos for a bit. But if I start breaking Cv's it's on with the +2" stuff

YES. DOOOO EEEEETTTTT

I had the same thought when I did the SPC arms on my old 3rd Gen 4runner. The axles are the only expensive part, everything else is easy.

But there would be a bit of travel decrease... I recall the lower arms being about 16" pivot to pivot, with the coilover pivot mostly centered. A 2" stretch on the inner half of the arm would amount to an approximately 10% travel reduction from my quick CAD sketch.

If at all possible, do the stretch on the outer half of the arm (between the coilover mount and the ball joint). It would be worth the work to get an actual travel increase.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I think you're onto something with the upper arm. Might be much easier than anticipated.

I think i threw away a set of lower a-arms a while ago... will check storage, just in case.

Ya, seems too easy. The only thing is you may loose some caster adjustment since you won't be able to rotate it front or back. But if you move the hub forward a little with the lower arm, you might not have to. I have mine set in the middle currently, so 180* and they would work perfect.

I had an entire frame chop from an SAS that I was going to use to play with. Ended up not wanting to drag it 900 miles in the move.

New replacements aren't too bad really.

https://www.carparts.com/details/Toyota/4Runner/TrueDrive/Control_Arm/1999/SET-REPT281521.html?TID=gglpla&origin=&utm_source=google&utm_medium=pla&utm_campaign=9649693653&gclid=Cj0KCQiAxoiQBhCRARIsAPsvo-xa_P_OyctWSRA3o9OJeqRS30dcSMzQEBN7x-NSGjsLGuKSM0OlJ0saAvFgEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds