Helper bags on a crawler?

YotaAtieToo

YotaAtieToo

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Had a thread going at the old place, but never actually did it myself.

My crawler rear suspension has a hard time pulling double duty. Could be a day trip with just me, or a 3 day rubicon trip with 5 of us, gear, food, tools, ect.

Anyone running a common helper bag with some decent travel leafs?

Built in bump stops or no?
 
Id be hesitant, myself. Maybe some longer speedbumps?
 
Add an air shock? I saw some F250 OBS crawler in 4WOR a long time ago that did something similar.
 
Put a bag in the middle of the axle. Go read the reverse engineering thread in the Land Rover forum. My eyes glazed over after the fourth or fifth post, but I remember that from the beginning. Light coils on the outside to articulate and a bag or maybe hydraulic thing in the middle for loads.
 
LScout800 said:
Add an air shock? I saw some F250 OBS crawler in 4WOR a long time ago that did something similar.
Click to expand...

Thought about it, but that's ~$800 vs sub $200 and need nitrogen every time I adjust it. I already have nice shocks for it.

Gbkeith said:
Put a bag in the middle of the axle. Go read the reverse engineering thread in the Land Rover forum. My eyes glazed over after the fourth or fifth post, but I remember that from the beginning. Light coils on the outside to articulate and a bag or maybe hydraulic thing in the middle for loads.
Click to expand...

Why? So it can flop all over the place when loaded down?
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
Sticks pop air bags.
Click to expand...

Sticks can rip out wires or fuel lines but we still run those?

Also see dirt head Dave running them on everything wheelin all over the country for 20+ years with no issues?

I'm not saying it's not a comprise, but what's the alternative? Either super stiff springs or add a ton of wieght for day trips?
 
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YotaAtieToo said:
Sticks can rip out wires or fuel lines but we still run those?

Also see dirt head Dave running them on everything wheelin all over the country for 20+ years with no issues?

I'm not saying it's not a comprise, but what's the alternative? Either super stiff springs or add a ton of wieght for day trips?
Click to expand...
I think you’ve answered your own question.

I just wonder how it’ll feel when flexing and transitioning between bag contact and no bag contact, is that going to make some weird behavior at an unwanted time when you’re off camber?
 
fl0w3n said:
I think you’ve answered your own question.

I just wonder how it’ll feel when flexing and transitioning between bag contact and no bag contact, is that going to make some weird behavior at an unwanted time when you’re off camber?
Click to expand...
I think that would depend on if you plumb the bags individually or together. If they were tied together, then the air from the compressed side will go into the unloaded side. You would only get the additional load capability when they are loaded equally
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Sticks can rip out wires or fuel lines but we still run those?

Also see dirt head Dave running them on everything wheelin all over the country for 20+ years with no issues?

I'm not saying it's not a comprise, but what's the alternative? Either super stiff springs or add a ton of wieght for day trips?
Click to expand...
Hydropneumatic suspension. Have a hydraulic cylinder and a hydraulic accumulator. Some solenoids and a power steering pump to pump fluid in or out to adjust height. Both heavy equipment and the Land Cruiser have used it for years. Check out "Hydropneumatic Suspension Systems" by Bauer for all the nerdy details (one of the most clearly written books I've ever read).
 
fl0w3n said:
I think you’ve answered your own question.

I just wonder how it’ll feel when flexing and transitioning between bag contact and no bag contact, is that going to make some weird behavior at an unwanted time when you’re off camber?
Click to expand...

Again, it's a comprise when doing those types of trips.

I'm hoping it would be just a progressive bump of sorts, can't imagine it would terrible crawling speed.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Again, it's a comprise when doing those types of trips.

I'm hoping it would be just a progressive bump of sorts, can't imagine it would terrible crawling speed.
Click to expand...
The Daystar cradles are popular with the Tacoma overlander crowd. They gain load capacity for roof top tents and skottles and still have flex.
 
Do you have a swaybar? If so, you could mount some smaller bags on the bar.
 
bdkw1 said:
Do you have a swaybar? If so, you could mount some smaller bags on the bar.
Click to expand...
Wasn't planning on it, because leafs

665.0coupe said:
The Daystar cradles are popular with the Tacoma overlander crowd. They gain load capacity for roof top tents and skottles and still have flex.
Click to expand...

Right

I never trust any of those forums. I thought there was a few guys on here who had done it with chase trucks.
 
Air lift 5000 bags. Air lift cradle mount mounted either on top of the leafs or the axle so the bag isn’t attached and opens up if you really flex out. Those bags are pretty damn durable I would have no issue with that setup for an overland ish style rig.
 
Byro said:
Air lift 5000 bags. Air lift cradle mount mounted either on top of the leafs or the axle so the bag isn’t attached and opens up if you really flex out. Those bags are pretty damn durable I would have no issue with that setup for an overland ish style rig.
Click to expand...

It's a buggy-ish rig with 5 seats, 1 tons, 43s, rear is trail gear or marlin leafs with decent arch in spua. Sits about perfect as is, but guessing it will be dragging ass loaded for a rubicon trip.

20250816_132241.jpg
 
I don’t think the shocks will do anything for height, just dampening, I’d throw day star cradles in it and rock out. Some overlanding H3 guys I know do it and it has worked out well for them, one of them did the rubicon with me and no issues on that front
 
It won't do much at all. The pressure you would need at that shaft size would make your seals hate life.
 
Kinda what i figured.

I'll probably try the air bags, it might be something that only gets put on once a year or less. We'll see
 
Swap the smooth bodies out for coil overs? Just toss some springs on for the extra weight when you need it.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Thought about it, but that's ~$800 vs sub $200 and need nitrogen every time I adjust it. I already have nice shocks for it.
Click to expand...
What about the inexpensive kind of air shocks?


1755691826090.jpeg


Monroe part# MA834 for example in my quick search, list at 9.34” stroke

Possibly keep the shocks you currently have, and install them in conjunction with a bracket underneath the frame to disconnect them at the axle side, flip them up & pin them stowed away for wheeling and not become a suspension travel limiter or not overdamping when unladen?
 
The air shocks I don’t think would take the travel. A universal kit from Air Lift with the bottom cradle would be 2 3/8” bolts on top to remove the bag if you wanted.

accuair.com

Universal Air Helper Kit - Dodge Ram, Chevrolet, GMC, and Ford Air Helper Kit

AccuAir helper air springs provide load-bearing support through air pressure that can be adjusted for different load capacities. The air springs enhance the ride by reducing inner-leaf friction. They help control the steering while maintaining braking effectiveness during weight shift events...
accuair.com accuair.com
 
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