chaplinfj60
Well-known member
this may help or may make you ask more questions. lol i keep going back to the definition of commercial vehicle, most of us have dont operate a commercial vehicle but we do operate in the higher weight ratings.
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Tuesday Towing Question (Weight Restriction/Endorsements for RV/Motorhome/Campers)
- Thread starter ridered3
- Start date
Provience
Kill!
the question would be Why would you ever register above GVWR
many states Tax you annually based on registered GVWR, which is why my trailer is registered as "1500 lbs" despite having 7k lbs of axles and weighing 2k lbs just as it sits. Not by me, it was like that when i bought it
Every regulatory enforcer is going to go with MFG GVWR, so I don't see a benefit there even if you were to register it higher, the scale cop isn't going to care.
But that leads to the next point, nobody is ever going to know or care. You aren't high enough to attract scale attention and anybody who pulls you over for going 80mph in a 75mph zone is damned likely to not have scales on them or care enough to call somebody.
The rare time that does happen and you get to leave the trailer behind for a day, the cost for the tow will likely be lower than the lifetime of higher fees.
just my line of thinking
Provience
Kill!
that's pretty comical
guess I'll add NC to the list of CA/NY of places to avoid towing fun loads.I wonder if they are actually ticketing those people or otherwise forcing them to stop driving until properly licensed?
Provience
Kill!
is this for Iowa? It reads very much similar to how the TN one reads, where the GCWR isn't a factor, just the GVWR and there is no carve out for Recreational Vehiclethis may help or may make you ask more questions. lol i keep going back to the definition of commercial vehicle, most of us have dont operate a commercial vehicle but we do operate in the higher weight ratings.
chaplinfj60
Well-known member
i understand this is federal requirement.
Provience
Kill!
ah, many states are more restrictive and the "noncommercial class a/b" stuff is also state specific
TrailTamer
🤣🖕🏻
Hefty fines if weigh more than what it show on registration. I was pulled over and warned. I could’ve gotten a $3000 fine when I had my truck registered as “class b” (8,000lbs) (Illinois). I registered my truck 12,000lbs after that anal cop.the question would be Why would you ever register above GVWR
You got luck thus far, that they’re not enforcing this in your area.many states Tax you annually based on registered GVWR, which is why my trailer is registered as "1500 lbs" despite having 7k lbs of axles and weighing 2k lbs just as it sits. Not by me, it was like that when i bought it
What laws explicit stating your registeration need to be at or no higher than mfg gvwr? I can’t find it!
arse_sidewards
Red Skull Member
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Revenue ticketing. It's not worth it for Mr. Rich to fight the ticket. It is worth it for the scrap hauler. So they don't target the scrap hauler.
Exactly my thought. But I also don't tend to tow shit 1500mi from home
Provience
Kill!
interesting, so you were pulled over by an asshole cop and STILL didn't get a ticket
I agree, i'm lucky. nobody has every asked me about it. Heck, my trailer plate is held on with zip ties that have magically not broken yet, I fully expect to see it half dangling or just gone one of these days.
I have not seen anything which says you cannot register at any made up number, but the licensing and weight laws are pretty explicitly using manufacture GVWR.
When you got hasselled in Illannoy, what was the actual vehicle, what was the door sticker GVWR and did you ever get hassled again where the 12k lb "higher" rating made a difference?
TrailTamer
🤣🖕🏻
Provience
Kill!
post 6,7,12 and 31 of this thread has links to several states and probably a federal reference. All of them deal with GVWR and none care at all about registered weight.
also, anecdotally, the reason you can get the same trailer from a manufacturer with a number listed as GVWR lower than the axle combined weight rating. If you haul equipment behind your class B dumb truck and don't want a class A license operator, get a 20k trailer and get a MFG tag which says 9,999 lbs on it. Then you can commonly haul the small stuff, but still safely occasionally haul bigger stuff if somebody has a different license.
well, if you weren't hassled again, how will we ever know if paying the extra fees up front via higher registration made any difference at all
Provience
Kill!
Illinois State info
www.ilsos.gov
They do have a state waiver for RV purposes
www.ilsos.gov
fees
www.ilsos.gov
looks like their commercial tiered weight fees kick in around 10k lbs
so sure, you told them to put a different number on the title and it may or may not have cost you any extra money, but it didn't do fuckall for changing your vehicle mfg gvwr. Any cop who gives you shit about the registration weight and not the door tag weight can go fuck a blender. Unless they don't match and they feel you are trying to short change the state.
hell I am pretty sure my pickup has registration that says 6.5k lbs for the purpose of titling, but the door sticker says 7.8 or 7.9k lbs and then there was a sticker on the outside from it's commercial life days that says 8k lbs gvwr.
I want to say the alxes combined rating is 8.5k lbs or something similar.
Commercial Driver's License
They do have a state waiver for RV purposes
Fees
fees
Fees
looks like their commercial tiered weight fees kick in around 10k lbs
so sure, you told them to put a different number on the title and it may or may not have cost you any extra money, but it didn't do fuckall for changing your vehicle mfg gvwr. Any cop who gives you shit about the registration weight and not the door tag weight can go fuck a blender. Unless they don't match and they feel you are trying to short change the state.
hell I am pretty sure my pickup has registration that says 6.5k lbs for the purpose of titling, but the door sticker says 7.8 or 7.9k lbs and then there was a sticker on the outside from it's commercial life days that says 8k lbs gvwr.
I want to say the alxes combined rating is 8.5k lbs or something similar.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
Glad to see so much discussion and info fir various states.
This is the chart I always used to determine “on paper legality” but it doesn’t get into RV/motorhome exemptions (where applicable).
This is the chart I always used to determine “on paper legality” but it doesn’t get into RV/motorhome exemptions (where applicable).
TrailTamer
🤣🖕🏻
Ok sure.
What about manufacturer GCWR? What’s stopping me from do a BDL? S-10 (let say it have 6,000lbs GVWR) towing a 20,000lbs GTWR trailer?
TrailTamer
🤣🖕🏻
Another thing to note that it’s not illegal to register your tow rig below its GVWR, but still will not exclude you from CDL A if either GVWR or GCWR exceed 26,000lbs. But I can see how it can make for a scrutiny & get weighed to check whether you’re over the registered gvwr if get pulled over, tho.
Example: big dumb lifted 1 ton mud truck which is purely a toy and will not tow or haul whatsoever and can save money on registration via register it at a lesser gvwr.
Example: big dumb lifted 1 ton mud truck which is purely a toy and will not tow or haul whatsoever and can save money on registration via register it at a lesser gvwr.
Provience
Kill!
Nothing, mfg gcwr is meaningless. Do you exceed the s10 gvwr ? Have at it. Something like a hay trailer with no tongue weight, good to go
TrailTamer
🤣🖕🏻
So, mfg gvwr is meaningless?
Provience
Kill!
No, gross vehicle is meaning full.
Mfg gross combined weight is meaningless....unless class a tractor stuff.
Jeffh555
Red Skull Member
My 7.3L diesel E350 (with windows and a camper top, registered as an RV) is rated to tow 10k from the factory. I'd like to get/build a bumper pull toy hauler that the Jeep would fit in. I expect it would weigh ~12-14k loaded.
Since it's an RV towing an RV, both legally and visually, then I'm really not likely to get pulled into a scale or weighed.
Would I be better off with a trailer rated at 10k so I'm 100% legal when unloaded, or the trailer rated at 14k so it's not over GVWR, even though it's more than my van and my class C license are rated for?
Since it's an RV towing an RV, both legally and visually, then I'm really not likely to get pulled into a scale or weighed.
Would I be better off with a trailer rated at 10k so I'm 100% legal when unloaded, or the trailer rated at 14k so it's not over GVWR, even though it's more than my van and my class C license are rated for?
GLTHFJ60
Stupid is as stupid does
The weight ratings (regardless of scaled weight) are for your license requirement and that alone. If your van's GVWR plus the trailer's GVWR are over 26,001, then you need a Class A license, CDL or not.
If your trailer is rated for 10k and it scales out over 10k on the axles, then you can get a different ticket for being over your ratings, regardless of your license level.
So, for the license requirement (class A or not), depends what your van's GVWR is. For your trailer/toy hauler, make sure not to exceed the rating if you're worried about getting a ticket.
As for whether or not you'll "look" like you're breaking the law, or the likelihood of you getting a ticket for being over your weight ratings or license level, who knows, but that's what the law says.
If your trailer is rated for 10k and it scales out over 10k on the axles, then you can get a different ticket for being over your ratings, regardless of your license level.
So, for the license requirement (class A or not), depends what your van's GVWR is. For your trailer/toy hauler, make sure not to exceed the rating if you're worried about getting a ticket.
As for whether or not you'll "look" like you're breaking the law, or the likelihood of you getting a ticket for being over your weight ratings or license level, who knows, but that's what the law says.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
The look and likelihood comment is exactly what I try to convey to my buddies that are in the “it’s fine and no one would know about you being overweight” camp/thinking (while trying to justify loading their 1/2 ton gas trucks to 95% capacity for even basic day trips and bragging about getting 7mpg…)
Even at a 1 in 100 chance of having an issue that results in a major fine or a park it ticket, that’s more risk than I am willing to take on a trip.
So when I get a bigger truck or trailer or both that puts me over 26k, I’ll get to proper non-commercial endorsements but until then I’ll stick with what I have which is under 26k.
All u guys need to do is move to Delaware. I drive the Repete at 47k lbs all day long on a standard class d liscense. Its registered as an rv and i have never stopped at a weigh station. State of DE does not have have a non commercial class and the dmv will not issue or allow me to test in my truck/trailer because it is not a commercial set up.
arse_sidewards
Red Skull Member
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If you're only overweight because trailer it's easy.
Unhook and go to the nearest place that will rent you an MDT.
All the money saved using the smaller tow rig will easily pay for it and the ticket.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
All u guys need to do is move to Delaware. I drive the Repete at 47k lbs all day long on a standard class d liscense. Its registered as an rv and i have never stopped at a weigh station. State of DE does not have have a non commercial class and the dmv will not issue or allow me to test in my truck/trailer because it is not a commercial set up.
Somewhere down the line when I have too big of a truck and too big of a trailer for my regular license, wanna rent me a room just long enough to get everything registered up there??
That could work too but depending on how overweight on the trailer, I could probably just take out all the unnecessary stuff we carry (A because we are both over prepared people and B because if you have the storage space you must fill the storage space with stuff, right???)
GLTHFJ60
Stupid is as stupid does
I've heard that the overweight tickets are many hundreds if not thousands of dollars. In NC I believe the fee increases every 100# over the limit you are.
ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
I’ve heard similar horror stories fee/ticket wise.
Plus I also tend to think of the Ambulance Chaser legality of it all. Say I’m not a fault for an accident while towing 29k on a 26k license. A good lawyer could argue that if I weighed below the legal limit, I could have made the correct maneuvers to avoid the accident. My insurance company could also tell me to pound sand for exceeding my limits as well. Both are could scenarios and may not be how it would actually play out but still something I consider.
simmons3067
Well-known member
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From my research I understand you fall under the states laws in which your drivers license is issued regardless of what state you are traveling through.
I regularly tow with my HDT that is titled and registered as an RV in New Mexico out of state and have never had an issue.
I regularly tow with my HDT that is titled and registered as an RV in New Mexico out of state and have never had an issue.
TrailTamer
🤣🖕🏻
that’s the thing. I’ve learned that it’s easy to ‘get away with it’ when traveling through (or living in) a state with out of state DL & registrations. I learned that after going to school out of state for years.
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ridered3
Low Talent Wheelin
That’s my understanding as well. So in my case, if it’s legal in Tennessee it should be legal elsewhere too.
arse_sidewards
Red Skull Member
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I hate this bullshit.
Except in cases of strict liability, when it comes to civil suits legal thresholds barely matter and whether you were being responsible or not matter a fuckton.
Being "under the limit" is not going to help you if the fact pattern indicates you are in fact a fucking dumbass.
Being over the limit isn't gonna do jack shit if the fact pattern indicates you're just unlucky.