Ranch Land Buys? What is the catch?

['84 Bronco II]

This part is the truth. People around me are running cattle on less than 20 acres per cow. The largest ranch in the area has roughly that per. This is in the Chama Valley area of NM. To be fair though, this spring has been miserably and abnormally dry so far and they may be selling off soon if we don't get any rain. The Brazos and Chama rivers are still flowing full for now though.

I almost specifically mentioned the Chama area by name since I would guess that is about the lushest area to ranch in New Mexico. Out of personal curiosity, how big are these operations running less than 20 acres per cow, and do you know whether they are having to buy feed for the winter? I have a buddy with 4 sections out around Datil and they run 30-40 cows, and another acquaintance with 8 sections up by Cuba, and he runs about 70-90 cows, but he says he occasionally has to buy feed for the winter.

 

[kercher]

Lots of great info...thanks. The plan is more along the lines of what Provience is doing. HOA was a bad analogy, I just thought there had to be something along the lines of the land being managed in some way and restrictions were in place as far as land use. I am not so concerned about power, but water is the issue if we pull the trigger on any land - ranch buy in or not.

 

[Provience]

Lots of great info...thanks. The plan is more along the lines of what Provience is doing. HOA was a bad analogy, I just thought there had to be something along the lines of the land being managed in some way and restrictions were in place as far as land use. I am not so concerned about power, but water is the issue if we pull the trigger on any land - ranch buy in or not.

load up the car and take a week. pick a couple different spots and check them out. it is 2 very full days of driving to get from Cleveland to sanders AZ. i'd suggest doing a 12 hour stint into east OK, maybe see if you can find an example of cheap land in OK even if you don't ultiamtely want to go there, but just for comparison sake. spend an easy day in OK and maybe check out a space or two, but mostly relax. then do a 8 or so hour stint into northern NM, check out a couple spots the next day. try to find things with diversity. the individual plot doesn't matter so much, but things like more sand/rock in the pictures, more juniper, how far to recreational water, how much meth is in the town. then cruise a day after that into N AZ and repeat.

2 long shit highway days to come back, but that is only because i'm not much good after 12 hours straight driving

1 day to OK,
1 day to see OK
1 day to NM
1 day to see NM
1 day to AZ
1 day to see AZ
2 days back...8 days, rent a car if your isn't comfortable or fuel efficient

then repeat along I-80 and check out Iowa, Nebraska, CO, UT, NV and you'll have a pretty good idea of what everything in "the west" looks like to help narrow down you region a bit

 

[kercher]

load up the car and take a week. pick a couple different spots and check them out. it is 2 very full days of driving to get from Cleveland to sanders AZ. i'd suggest doing a 12 hour stint into east OK, maybe see if you can find an example of cheap land in OK even if you don't ultiamtely want to go there, but just for comparison sake. spend an easy day in OK and maybe check out a space or two, but mostly relax. then do a 8 or so hour stint into northern NM, check out a couple spots the next day. try to find things with diversity. the individual plot doesn't matter so much, but things like more sand/rock in the pictures, more juniper, how far to recreational water, how much meth is in the town. then cruise a day after that into N AZ and repeat.

2 long shit highway days to come back, but that is only because i'm not much good after 12 hours straight driving

1 day to OK,
1 day to see OK
1 day to NM
1 day to see NM
1 day to AZ
1 day to see AZ
2 days back...8 days, rent a car if your isn't comfortable or fuel efficient

then repeat along I-80 and check out Iowa, Nebraska, CO, UT, NV and you'll have a pretty good idea of what everything in "the west" looks like to help narrow down you region a bit

Thanks. I did a Chapel Hill - NC to Seatlle - WA to Cleveland - OH move over about 3 years. I always have from mid-April to mid-August off work, so that is exactly the plan now that the kids are 11 and 7. Thinking it will be a nice summer trip for the family and a way to plan for a potential purchase. Did you scout out the location you bought?

 

[Wheelerfreak]

As others have pointed out, make sure you can get water. Personally, I would not be willing to deal with the hassle of hauling water. The next big thing is electricity. Sure, it is a great area for solar, but I personally wouldn't want to deal with the hassle and expense of an "off-the-grid" solar system. Also, I would make sure all the rights come with the land (mineral, water, grazing, etc.).

Water is a big thing, I have a well that’s 660’ and produces good water at 10gpm. Neighbors haul water or collect rain water because the cost for a well like mine is in the $40k range. That’s something many don’t consider when getting a good price on land. Plus if you don’t want to live off grid you’ll need power run out to it. We were quoted $7-10k A pole depending on terrain to get power to some areas we looked at prior to buying a house on grid.

shit I’ve learned in the 8 years I’ve lived out in BFE...you better be able to do everything on your land and house, plumbing, electrical, welding, plowing, framing, roofing, automotive etc since getting good help out here can be near impossible. Nearest grocery store is an hour and a half round trip and it’s tiny. Stock up and plan way ahead. I’m on grid and a backup generator is a necessity since in the winter the snow can cause the power to be out for days and the local co-op likely will get to me last out here. Police, yeah good luck with that. EMS, hopefully you’re conscious enough to drive yourself an hour out to a small clinic that is only open m-f business hours. Cell service or internet, satellite or I use my cell phone on a booster as my access. Not much else to chose from. Those may sound like negatives to some but it’s the reason we moved out to BFE.

 

[kercher]

Water is a big thing, I have a well that’s 660’ and produces good water at 10gpm. Neighbors haul water or collect rain water because the cost for a well like mine is in the $40k range. That’s something many don’t consider when getting a good price on land. Plus if you don’t want to live off grid you’ll need power run out to it. We were quoted $7-10k A pole depending on terrain to get power to some areas we looked at prior to buying a house on grid.

shit I’ve learned in the 8 years I’ve lived out in BFE...you better be able to do everything on your land and house, plumbing, electrical, welding, plowing, framing, roofing, automotive etc since getting good help out here can be near impossible. Nearest grocery store is an hour and a half round trip and it’s tiny. Stock up and plan way ahead. I’m on grid and a backup generator is a necessity since in the winter the snow can cause the power to be out for days and the local co-op likely will get to me last out here. Police, yeah good luck with that. EMS, hopefully you’re conscious enough to drive yourself an hour out to a small clinic that is only open m-f business hours. Cell service or internet, satellite or I use my cell phone on a booster as my access. Not much else to chose from. Those may sound like negatives to some but it’s the reason we moved out to BFE.

Thanks. We can do most of that fairly well, but all great stuff to consider...I appreciate the info...

 

[Provience]

Thanks. I did a Chapel Hill - NC to Seatlle - WA to Cleveland - OH move over about 3 years. I always have from mid-April to mid-August off work, so that is exactly the plan now that the kids are 11 and 7. Thinking it will be a nice summer trip for the family and a way to plan for a potential purchase. Did you scout out the location you bought?

yup. i'm from Northern CA and have family in NV so i already had a pretty good idea of what i was looking for. selling the wife on the idea was the fun part she isn't much for the visualization of things and taking in the area, so we'd go someplace and she'd just judge the immediate property we were looking at we made a few long weekends to look at individual properties, mostly to get a feel for access. Some were instantly wrote off because of access or the neighborhood, some looked much better in person than in pictures, most looked better in pictures than in person.

there was one spot in particular that looked awesome and had pretty good access, priced a bit higher than the rest in the area. we went out there and it was extremely sandy, really sparse vegitation for most of it because of the sand. Nope, couldn't do it it wasn't listed very long so it must have met somebody elses needs. there is also always and forever has been tons of pure speculation on bare land.

i don't own the mineral rights under my land, but i'm not concerned about it. maybe worth a phone call to the exploration place that owns them, but they bought the rights for a massive area for ~$100 a couple decades ago, kind of doubt they'd respond to a request for a 1/4 1/4 even if i offer them the full $100. just means that i won't ever hit the "oil lotto"

 

[NOTHINGWILLCHANGELANCE]

A scam as old at time.

 

[makemeknowit]

I didn't read all this so if this was already posted, sorry.

 

[Provience]

A scam as old at time.

certainly, the area i bought in to was an area that was "owned" or whatever since the late 19th century. the guy split it off in to a bunch of 20-320 acre groupings in the 70's to try and catch the wave then. it never really turned in to much and his LLC's went tits up in the 90's. Certainly he made some money splitting it up, but probably nothing like what was being figured at the time. Lots of those lots are still completely bare, some have hunting cabins, some HAD nice cabins on them that haven't been touched in 20 or 30 years, some have a few burned out buses the folks i bought from owned it for about 15 years (iirc? might have been under 10, but it was about that) and i bought at or near the top of the market before this crash and i gave them ~50% more than they paid. not a bad store of value.

from the time of being broken up to now, it hasn't done much for beating inflation, what with the (likely) high period of inflation we are running through at the moment, in 10 years i'll probably be able to unload for what i paid for it, plus inflation and probably get enough to cover some of the taxes paid and the cost of paperwork to sell it. it is certainly NOT the way to go if you are trying to make your money work for you, be a millionaire and retire wealthy and such.

for the same amount of money, i could have bought tesla stock or (insert about anybody today, BP is a safe bet etc.) and earned enough to buy a place that was already built up, etc., but that wouldn't have done shit for my ADD in the meantime

 

[mrblaine]

This part is the truth. People around me are running cattle on less than 20 acres per cow. The largest ranch in the area has roughly that per. This is in the Chama Valley area of NM. To be fair though, this spring has been miserably and abnormally dry so far and they may be selling off soon if we don't get any rain. The Brazos and Chama rivers are still flowing full for now though.

I've got some friends in the Chama area but I haven't spent much time there. My experience was living as a guest with my parents on a cattle ranch off the highway between Alto and Capitan. Maybe not quite God's country but he can certainly see it if he squints a bit.

 

[Wheelerfreak]

I've got some friends in the Chama area but I haven't spent much time there. My experience was living as a guest with my parents on a cattle ranch off the highway between Alto and Capitan. Maybe not quite God's country but he can certainly see it if he squints a bit.

Capitan is far south of us.,

Hwy 84 is the road through the area. Just in my biased opinion this is Sto-Vo-Kor is what I I call this area. It is god's country. It's what most think of when they think of Colorado but without the land costs and BS. Cold down to -23 in the winter and 90's in the summer in the worst case. I will die in this place before I move.

 

[HillbillyDeluxe]

All this talk of rural land. Screw it Im moving to NYC and getting a 600 sq ft apt for half a million instead.

 

[Provience]

All this talk of rural land. Screw it Im moving to NYC and getting a 600 sq ft apt for half a million instead.

might as well, don't need to bother with a car, easy walk to all sorts of entertainment and dining, easy walk to the market every day for fresh food, plenty of activities, rent control so you can stay there forever and lot's of close medical care for when you need it.

some people dream of that

 

[heavytlc]

might as well, don't need to bother with a car, easy walk to all sorts of entertainment and dining, easy walk to the market every day for fresh food, plenty of activities, rent control so you can stay there forever and lot's of close medical care for when you need it.

some people dream of that

Some people would love to live on a corner lot. There are literally hundreds of thousands of homes in sub divisions that from the front porch you can see 20-30 neighbors houses. Once I figured out some people really like living like that, I was much more at peace. It’s because of those people there is still land available for the rest of us.

 

[Provience]

Some people would love to live on a corner lot. There are literally hundreds of thousands of homes in sub divisions that from the front porch you can see 20-30 neighbors houses. Once I figured out some people really like living like that, I was much more at peace. It’s because of those people there is still land available for the rest of us.

absolutely! life of relaxation and travel. being out in the sticks is near a full time job just in itself

 

[heavytlc]

Yes that is true. I often think how much more time and money I would have if I just bought a nice house in town with a 2 car garage and only owned a daily driver and Jeep. For what I spend in fuel alone I could have a lawn service cut my grass if I lived like that.
Owning property and even semi rural living is a lot of work. Off grid is a full time lifestyle. Definitely not for most people.

 

[Provience]

Yes that is true. I often think how much more time and money I would have if I just bought a nice house in town with a 2 car garage and only owned a daily driver and Jeep. For what I spend in fuel alone I could have a lawn service cut my grass if I lived like that.
Owning property and even semi rural living is a lot of work. Off grid is a full time lifestyle. Definitely not for most people.

every time i try, i realize how much i can't stand it.

my sister on the other hand, i'm pretty sure her 2 Story house has more SQFT than her whole lot and she is super excited to have it, everything she could want for in a place to live. people have flocked to cities for thousands of years, suburbia and the automobile has just made one hell of an impact on that sprawl for the last 70 years