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Is my junk gonna break on stickies?

ScaldedDog

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2020
Member Number
3082
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47
I've been running 39.5" Rockers for years, but am contemplating a move to 40" Trep stickes to keep with the Jones' - er, my wheeling mates, who are running 42" Reds and Treps. I'd love to do it, but much prefer wheeling to breaking stuff, and so could keep running what I have. What say you?

Here's my setup:

88 4Runner with 3VZE, R150F and dual-cases (2.28/4.7) with 30 spline outputs
Diamond axles with well setup 5.29s (ZUK setup with Detroit in back, good local guy with ancient ARB in front). 30 spline RCVs, ARP hub and steering studs, keyed FROR arms also setup with 5th stud. Heat treated hub gears and flanges. PSC assist.
4WU 3-link in front, Alcan leaves in back with traction bar.
The rig weighs about 4800lbs, and has a 111" wheelbase (front is 3" forward, rear is 5" back.

Everyone likes photos, so here's one:
4Runner (2).jpg


I've had this rig for over 20 years, and somewhere I got old in the process. At 63 I don't drive like a nut, but I do like to do reasonably hard full-bodied rig stuff.

So, am I asking for trouble moving to stickies, or will I find that the rig will still be as relatively trouble-free as it's always been? What's likely to break first? My initial concerns are the R&P and T-case, but I don't know how much harder on those parts a sticky set would be compared to what I have.

Mark
 
I put 37 reds on my samurai years ago. It had Toyota duals and FJ80 front ifs rear. No chromo.

First trip out at moonrocks NV (36 grit sand paper, similar to your pics) I broke a lot of shit. Stickies don't slip easily on that terrain.

After that, I wheeled pretty smart and was able to idle up shit guys on iroks were beating the shit out of their truck on.

The single biggest factor is how you drive.

I also ran 39 kr2 stickies on my 4runner for a bit with the same axles, but chromo rear out put and rcv's. I ended up breaking a stock 4.10 v6 front 3rd and twisting the front out put. I was pushing the truck on a breakover climb and knew it was probably going to break.

Nice thing about 40" treps is they measure almost as short as those pit bulls :flipoff2: I'd be a little worried about the rear 3rd, but I bet you'll be fine, you'll just be crawling up stuff most of the time anyway.
 
Nice rig. Love the full body. This will sound dumb, but what U-Joints, drivelines are you running?

My setups are on smaller tires, but I wheel with guys on 40's and built Toy axles, and U-joints are their designed fail point so to speak.

If your easy on the skinny pedal, and don't push it when bound up odds are you'll be ok.
 
Stingray said:
Nice rig. Love the full body. This will sound dumb, but what U-Joints, drivelines are you running?

My setups are on smaller tires, but I wheel with guys on 40's and built Toy axles, and U-joints are their designed fail point so to speak.

If your easy on the skinny pedal, and don't push it when bound up odds are you'll be ok.
Click to expand...

Are they running vatozone junk?

I know guys running v8s, 1 tons and 40-49s on Toyota drive shafts :laughing:
 
Good question on the drivelines, and I honestly don't remember (and am not near the rig right now). Toyota flanges and not huge Spicers. Here's a pic of the front, if it helps:

20210426_170119.jpg


Mark
 
ScaldedDog said:
Good question on the drivelines, and I honestly don't remember (and am not near the rig right now). Toyota flanges and not huge Spicers. Here's a pic of the front, if it helps:

20210426_170119.jpg


Mark
Click to expand...

Jesse at high angle driveline believes good Toyota u joints are equal to 1350. I laugh at guys who spend a shit ton to convert to 1310 shit :homer:
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Are they running vatozone junk?

I know guys running v8s, 1 tons and 40-49s on Toyota drive shafts :laughing:
Click to expand...
No, Stock size Japanese branded quality joints.

failures are few and far between, but when pushing the rest of the upgrade driveline parts on large stickies, a stock U-Joint is a much easier trail fix that some other internal parts.

Looking at his rig, I'm guessing He's not wheeling this like a buggy, or running off the rev limiter.

And ya, The stock Toy stuff is pretty tough.
 
Stingray said:
No, Stock size Japanese branded quality joints.

failures are few and far between, but when pushing the rest of the upgrade driveline parts on large stickies, a stock U-Joint is a much easier trail fix that some other internal parts.

Looking at his rig, I'm guessing He's not wheeling this like a buggy, or running off the rev limiter.

And ya, The stock Toy stuff is pretty tough.
Click to expand...

Gotcha, I mean ya, they will break obviously, but usually are pretty tough.

Axle wrap is a killer for any u joint.
 
toy joints are so fucking strong i blew up 4.7 gears(5k rpm clutch dumps on rocks, 30 spline outputs frt and rr on the tcase) running 14b axles front and rear with 43" stickies and the u joints were never a problem

i then went to an atlas and continued to do clutch dumps and still didnt break any u joints :laughing:
 
Stingray said:
Nice rig. Love the full body.
Click to expand...
Stingray said:
Looking at his rig, I'm guessing He's not wheeling this like a buggy, or running off the rev limiter.
Click to expand...
Thanks!! And you are correct. Though my theory of aging is that we should take up more and more dangerous hobbies as we get older... 🤣

Slander said:
Disclaimer I have never ran stickys so I don't know the actual level.of grip they give, but given the fact you are 63 and have been wheeling that thing for 20yrs, I betting you will be fine. Knowing a rig like the back of your hand prevents a bunch of broken parts!!
Click to expand...
That's a good point. I need to get out more, of course, but I do know it pretty well, and am generally not surprised by its behavior.

Pitbullcruiser said:
I wheel on 37” sticky Krawlers and all 8” axle stuff. I have had great success with this combination so far.
51215757372_e07ecbe708_b-jpg.392628
Click to expand...
Nice! I want to say surely those Krawlers are smaller than the Treps I'm considering, but perhaps that's not the case. From my buddy's experience with his, those are plenty sticky.

You guys are making me think this might be doable.

Mark
 
rockyota83 said:
toy joints are so fucking strong i blew up 4.7 gears(5k rpm clutch dumps on rocks, 30 spline outputs frt and rr on the tcase) running 14b axles front and rear with 43" stickies and the u joints were never a problem

i then went to an atlas and continued to do clutch dumps and still didnt break any u joints :laughing:
Click to expand...
Stop, Just stop.

Here I was thinking the stock joint were my designed failure point and a broken joint was an easy fix.

I have seen two break in 20 some odd years of wheeling, (not mine) But I've also sheared off a stock steering arm,
 
Stingray said:
Stop, Just stop.

Here I was thinking the stock joint were my designed failure point and a broken joint was an easy fix.

I have seen two break in 20 some odd years of wheeling, (not mine) But I've also sheared off a stock steering arm,
Click to expand...
if i listed all the parts ive broken with toy joints you really would be telling me to stop :laughing:

i have a toy drive shaft on the front of my cummins tow rig, i blew up the d70 rear axle towing my buggy home from fordyce grossing about 17k pounds, put it in 4wd and drove the final 50 miles home on the front toy shaft, which included climbing multiple grades through rolling hills :laughing: to say toy u joints impress me is an understatement :grinpimp:

ive broken 1 toy u joint in my lifetime and that was towing a 1wd broken fj40 up the committee exit on fordyce, and it was due to axle wrap
technically though the u joint didnt fail the ears on the yoke did
 
Last edited:
rockyota83 said:
if i listed all the parts ive broken with toy joints you really would be telling me to stop :laughing:

i have a toy drive shaft on the front of my cummins tow rig,
Click to expand...
That has to look like an RC car U-Joint under that thing.:lmao::lmao::lmao:

All of my buddy's have gone away from Toyota drivetrains, I stick with it, cause I'm cheap, do good maintance, and am generally easy on the pedal, and somehow I seem to go pretty much anywhere they go.
so I got no complaints.

This rig on 40 stickies seems like a go.
Plus He's owned the rig 20 years, He knows the limits, I'll be surprised if it breaks anything more than normal.
 
ScaldedDog said:
Thanks!! And you are correct. Though my theory of aging is that we should take up more and more dangerous hobbies as we get older... 🤣


That's a good point. I need to get out more, of course, but I do know it pretty well, and am generally not surprised by its behavior.


Nice! I want to say surely those Krawlers are smaller than the Treps I'm considering, but perhaps that's not the case. From my buddy's experience with his, those are plenty sticky.

You guys are making me think this might be doable.

Mark
Click to expand...

40" treps are a little short, 38.5"? The 39 kr2 reds were like a 38.

40 treps are a little heavy, but I doubt they're more than your 36x19.5 pit bulls :flipoff2:

I really want a set of treps, but Id look at 39 kr2 or kr3 stickies for your rig to save a little wieght. No idea on pricing though.

Stingray said:
Stop, Just stop.

Here I was thinking the stock joint were my designed failure point and a broken joint was an easy fix.

I have seen two break in 20 some odd years of wheeling, (not mine) But I've also sheared off a stock steering arm,
Click to expand...

Only time I've seen them break was when they were parts store junk, just got old and weren't greased, or the axle wrapped hard enough to lock the ujoint about 90*

I wasn't kidding about people slowly evolving a rig, to a V8, 1 tons and huge tires, while keeping the Toyota drive shafts with pretty good luck.

I'm building a jeep for my father in law, it's got a 500hp 6.2/6l80e/5.0 atlas, chromo 1 tons and 42s..... Toyota driveshafts :laughing: with the 4:1 1st gear and 5.0 atlas, it will be putting a lot of tq down. Hopefully the Toyota shafts break before the stupid old style 6 spline atlas shaft. :laughing:
 
Don’t hop it or excess skinny pedal when bound up and run it.

Sounds like you’re old enough you don’t drive like a jackass anymore haha.
 
It's all diving style, you're gonna break a lot of stuff if you're not a smooth smart driver. Reds and Treps both get better as they wear in though too so if you have new ones they take a bit to break in. I been on Treps for ages and love them, I just think they are the best in the terrain I run.

My completely clapped Treps that have been regrooved to the cords are 37ish, My spare is damned close to 40, I measured it awhile back. Obviously that's with no weight on them.
 
Everything I've seen on the 42s says they're 4" taller than the 40s and measure 42"

Maxxis are tough because they have so much tread, like mentioned, they loose like 3" of height when bald. Reds aren't as bad, but you get more life out of the treps. Seems like the trips are best for the money. I really want some 42s, but also would love 42 reds :laughing:
 
I'll try and measure my spare tomorrow sometime. It'll give me a reason to crutch my ass back outside:laughing:

The guy I wheel with the most has 42 Treps and they are probably 4' taller but his are almost new and mine are clapped. 166156624_3811520035630204_6023250411825869030_n.jpg

The amount of tread is retarded, I was looking for a set of used 42 to regroove but stumbled across a deal on a set of barely used 40's. They get so much better half tread and grooved too, they flex better with that strip of rubber cut out the center of the tire.

I haven't run reds in 15 years. I'd consider a 42 red but the whole 20" thing...
 
94toytruck said:
I'll try and measure my spare tomorrow sometime. It'll give me a reason to crutch my ass back outside:laughing:

The guy I wheel with the most has 42 Treps and they are probably 4' taller but his are almost new and mine are clapped.
Click to expand...

I'm just repeating what I've seen online. Often guys roll a brand new tire with 25 lbs of air up to their old tire, on the rig, with 8 lbs of air and are shocked that the sizes are way off. :homer:


94toytruck said:
The amount of tread is retarded, I was looking for a set of used 42 to regroove but stumbled across a deal on a set of barely used 40's. They get so much better half tread and grooved too, they flex better with that strip of rubber cut out the center of the tire.
Click to expand...

Bias tires seem to get more and more flexible with use too. It's like TSLs start to almost work right before they're thrown away :laughing:

But ya, the amount of tread is good for certain things. I get no everyone is looking for all out traction on dry sandpaper. The reds seem to work best right when the shoulder gets bald.


94toytruck said:
I haven't run reds in 15 years. I'd consider a 42 red but the whole 20" thing...
Click to expand...

Ya, i don't know why they won't offer it in a 17.
 
My wheeling buddy running toyota axles put 40” sticky treps on and blew a third first trip out. He broke 3 more thirds before putting in a 9” rear and going back to non sticky 40s. No more issues
9279A226-2069-4BF5-B2B0-93705E0FABDA.jpeg
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Well no shit with the entire household packed, should have went D80 with 4" tubes :flipoff2:
Click to expand...
LOL he did have to much gear that trip which probably didn't help but after that he didn't carry anything but some spare tools and still broke 3 thirds
 
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