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Help, I suck at drilling holes

[memphis]

Web wheeler
Joined
Jun 6, 2020
Member Number
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I do have a run out issue and I plan to measure that tonight on the bit and the chuck. When I’m drilling holes they start to look like a rotary piston. I’m getting chips because my bits are brand new but something isn’t right and when I punch through even .125” plate the bit gets stuck and doesn’t retract freely.

Speed is likely an issue and I should have been drilling a bit faster but having used ‘Murican General drill presses on the past, I never had such a shitty experience. I bought a standard run of the mill used Chiner Toolex 16 speed.

I had an Amazon bench top mill in my cart last night because this was so frustrating but I don’t really know what I’m doing wrong.

Will buying a quality chuck minimize the run out I am experiencing? Its bad enough I can see it by eye.
 
It can.

I drill very low speeds one everything from 1/4" up

Pull the chuck off and run out the shank

The chuck on my pos 30+ y/o chicago elec was disassembled and put back together wrong at some point and it doesnt do what youre talking about.
 
Pre drill with a smaller bit. Sounds like your drilling 1/2" or bigger, lubrication and less pressure before you break through will help it not hang up
 
What are you drilling?

Diameter?
Bit type? (sounds like standard twist drill---standard end grind?)
Thickness of material?
Type of material?
Are those chips continuous (like they should be) or are they little bitty pieces?
What color are the chips? Are they smoking?

Sounds like you're using drill press.

What's the setup?
Clamped tight?
What RPM?
How much pressure are you using?
Do you know how to drill? (when to push hard, when to back off, can you "feel" it when you're about to break through?)

Need details man!
 
Muckin_Slusher said:
What are you drilling?

Diameter?
Click to expand...

1/2” bit

Muckin_Slusher said:
Bit type? (sounds like standard twist drill---standard end grind?) - 135 Degree Split Point
Thickness of material? - .125” plate
Type of material? - mild steel
Are those chips continuous (like they should be) or are they little bitty pieces? - itty bitty tittys
What color are the chips? Are they smoking? - not blue, no smoke due to sub ~250 rpm (will verify)

Sounds like you're using drill press. - yes

What's the setup?
Clamped tight? Yes Will include pic of setup later tonight
What RPM? See above
How much pressure are you using? Too much and the pulley will stall and I’ll slip the belt
Do you know how to drill? (when to push hard, when to back off, can you "feel" it when you're about to break through?)

Need details man!
Click to expand...
 
Maybe try NOT clamping it tight. If you have runout issues, then the part can move around following the wobble of the bit.

Chart I found says 1000 RPM for 1/2 inch bit in mild steel.
Sucks that your drill press slips the belt, it can't provide the torque needed at the required pressure to make nice chips. Not sure what you can do to address that. New belt? Belt dressing spray? Increase pulley tension?

How are you with a cordless drill?
 
Muckin_Slusher said:
Maybe try NOT clamping it tight. If you have runout issues, then the part can move around following the wobble of the bit.

Chart I found says 1000 RPM for 1/2 inch bit in mild steel.
Sucks that your drill press slips the belt, it can't provide the torque needed at the required pressure to make nice chips. Not sure what you can do to address that. New belt? Belt dressing spray? Increase pulley tension?

How are you with a cordless drill?
Click to expand...
If my speed is wrong (too slow) and I am applying too much pressure I guess I could be deflecting the bit a little BUT with a 1/2” bit I don’t think that’s the case.

I’ll chuck some new material in there tonight and set my speed higher for science. The first chart I found on Google says 560 rpm mild steel. The column to the left says 1000 but that’s for brass.
 


start watching around 6:45 or so


this trick works awesome. your plate is a bit thick for the issues he is describing but it works the same for a wandering bit on thicker steel.
 
My dial indicator is in millimeters so this is a lot of run out…
 

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[memphis] said:
My dial indicator is in millimeters so this is a lot of run out…
Click to expand...

That's about .008". Pretty bad.


Try running the indicator on the spindle itself. If you have the wedge to remove the chuck, pull the chuck out and indicate the bore of the spindle too. That'll tell you if the spindle is fucked of if it's just the chuck and/or adapter.
 
bgaidan said:
That's about .008". Pretty bad.


Try running the indicator on the spindle itself. If you have the wedge to remove the chuck, pull the chuck out and indicate the bore of the spindle too. That'll tell you if the spindle is fucked of if it's just the chuck and/or adapter.
Click to expand...
The spindle was around .15mm but there is also surface rust which is likely skewing my reading. I don’t have a wedge to remove the chuck. Something quick and dirty I can make? Dead blow hammer caveman removal?
 
[memphis] said:
The spindle was around .15mm but there is also surface rust which is likely skewing my reading. I don’t have a wedge to remove the chuck. Something quick and dirty I can make? Dead blow hammer caveman removal?
Click to expand...
Assuming that press is morse taper and has the slot, you just need something wedge-shaped to stick in there and tap out the adapter. Though I've seen some smaller presses that don't have a taper hole and just have a jacob's adapter machined on to the end of the spindle.


1698584457257.png

1698584478176.png
 
Try a step drill for 1/8 and under.
 
You might be able to get a little more torque out of your machine by not using the smallest diameter pulley or pulleys.

The belt doesn't have much to grab going around the really little pulleys, so you could get a bit more torque and a bit more speed by stepping up to the next one.

Does your press have two or three pulleys? If it's three, then move the belt off the smallest diameter in the middle pulley (because it is seeing more torque than the pulley mounted on the motor since it's the second reduction).
 
bgaidan said:
8 thou of runout isn't exactly ideal either though
Click to expand...
Yes, but that drill ought to center on its point and flex. Assuming 100% rigidity, he would get an oversized hole, not the chatter induced tri lobe effect.

Speeds, feeds, rigidity, some combo is letting that bit walk around.
 
Speed increased to 560rpm using 1/2” bit

Pilot drilled with 1/8” first with much better results.

I bought some transfer punches on Amazon which really helped with my layout.

The exit wound on the plate was pretty clean compared to the other day. I did swap out for a step bit to soften the edges on all sides of the plate. I am wondering if the pilot helped with that or if it was strictly speed related.

I am using Napa ultrapro drill bits, they are rebranded but unsure what vendor. They look like Snappy thunder bits and actually cut quite well. I’ve been happy with several ultrapro tools I have purchased
 

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Steve300xcw said:
This was all about bolt holes for some tow hooks?
Click to expand...
No, I’ve run into other issues previously which prompted me to post. This was just the item on the table currently. I have OCD when it comes to assembly. I’m slow as hell but want to be proud of what I am doing. Nobody is going to see it… but I want a clean finished product.
 
On my drill press I recorded all of the available speeds (16 on mine) and then wrote a little formula in excel for the ideal speed in Steel, Aluminum, and Stainless. I then made a table that I stuck to the side of my drill press with the ideal available speed for each material and bit size. Drilling with even the shittiest drill press is better using the correct speed.

My drill press has a bit more than .005" runout, sometimes you can turn the chuck 180 degrees and offset some of the runout but in my case it made it worse. Good chucks are expensive.
 
[memphis] said:
I will report back tonight. I don’t have a shorter bit but I can do a pilot hole first
Click to expand...
I pretty much always use a 1/8" pilot bit for everything... That little bastard goes through so fast and easily and makes every subsequent drill go through fast and easy as well. Like If I'm drilling a 1" diameter hole I'll hit all my center punch marks with a 1/8" then step up to a 1/4 or 3/8 before going to the 1" bit. The added time swapping bits is way faster than trying to shove through a larger pilot bit. I buy 1/8" cobalt bits by the 100 pack. I do re-sharpen them, but also break a few and they just get tossed and I chuck another one up.
 
billybob_81067 said:
I pretty much always use a 1/8" pilot bit for everything... That little bastard goes through so fast and easily and makes every subsequent drill go through fast and easy as well. Like If I'm drilling a 1" diameter hole I'll hit all my center punch marks with a 1/8" then step up to a 1/4 or 3/8 before going to the 1" bit. The added time swapping bits is way faster than trying to shove through a larger pilot bit. I buy 1/8" cobalt bits by the 100 pack. I do re-sharpen them, but also break a few and they just get tossed and I chuck another one up.
Click to expand...

This is basically what I do. I buy double sided 1/8 cobalt in bulk and pilot everything with it then step up to garbage chinesium 1/4 then it's a free-for all from there. Just getting rid of the shitty 0RPM spot in the middle does wonders for the life of larger drill bits.
 
billybob_81067 said:
I pretty much always use a 1/8" pilot bit for everything... That little bastard goes through so fast and easily and makes every subsequent drill go through fast and easy as well. Like If I'm drilling a 1" diameter hole I'll hit all my center punch marks with a 1/8" then step up to a 1/4 or 3/8 before going to the 1" bit. The added time swapping bits is way faster than trying to shove through a larger pilot bit. I buy 1/8" cobalt bits by the 100 pack. I do re-sharpen them, but also break a few and they just get tossed and I chuck another one up.
Click to expand...
The thick HSS one made for mills, pilot bits? centered drills?
 
Got some holes drilled tonight… but for the experts am I reading my square wrong or is it actually labeled/etched wrong? I am off a heavy 1/16” at times when I know I measured it 3 times before cutting/drilling
 

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[memphis] said:
Got some holes drilled tonight… but for the experts am I reading my square wrong or is it actually labeled/etched wrong? I am off a heavy 1/16” at times when I know I measured it 3 times before cutting/drilling
Click to expand...
Those are wood framing squares and in my experience they sort of suck for layout.

Your technique is good but measure from both sides and make two scribes, between the scribes is your center.
 
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