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DIY Beadlock Anti Coning Rings

CDA 455 II said:
nOOB questions:
Does HMMWV rims have coning issues?
Or does their design avoid it?
Click to expand...
Two piece beadlocks like those should be good to go. When you bolt those together, the metal bolt flanges basically sandwich together with the oring in between, so there's nowhere for metal to deflect. Now if you have super thick tire beads with a standard width beadlock insert there may be a little flexing as the bolts get to final torque, but I don't think that would be problematic like your regular single beadlock coning
 
What is the rule of thumb for measuring for an insert or spacer?

I've never noticed until this weekend when I had to fix a flat but my old MRTs with Coopers STT Pros on them have quite the gap.
I've not ever had any problems out of them tho. No leaks, no hardware breakage, no re-torques
 
NDCjeepsmith said:
What is the rule of thumb for measuring for an insert or spacer?

I've never noticed until this weekend when I had to fix a flat but my old MRTs with Coopers STT Pros on them have quite the gap.
I've not ever had any problems out of them tho. No leaks, no hardware breakage, no re-torques
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From what I've read, most beads that are 3/4" or less thick are fine...spacers generally aren't needed.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
If you set the bolts that wide, how do you plan to get nuts on the back?
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I've made a few sets, but it's been probably ten years since I made the last set, but from memory that's how I've always done it?

I'll see if I can find my old DWG/DXF and compare it to a photo of the bolts in position. I don't remember ever having a problem getting the nuts on the back?
 
Wendle said:
I've made a few sets, but it's been probably ten years since I made the last set, but from memory that's how I've always done it?

I'll see if I can find my old DWG/DXF and compare it to a photo of the bolts in position. I don't remember ever having a problem getting the nuts on the back?
Click to expand...

The ones I've seen sit down flat against the bead lip. If you do this, there is no way you can get the bolts out to sit against the tire itself.

I do remember seeing a "tig version" of rings that are basically the same diameter of the whole wheel and you butt weld them on, is thay what AgitatedPancake is doing? Maybe that would give you more room?
 
YotaAtieToo said:
The ones I've seen sit down flat against the bead lip. If you do this, there is no way you can get the bolts out to sit against the tire itself.

I do remember seeing a "tig version" of rings that are basically the same diameter of the whole wheel and you butt weld them on, is thay what AgitatedPancake is doing? Maybe that would give you more room?
Click to expand...

I'm not positive I've seen those, but from that description, yeah that basically sounds like what I'm doing. The beadlock ring will sit as if it's resting on the very outermost lip of the wheel, spaced off the original bead surface. I have it shrunk slightly just to give room for the MIG weld material, but full diameter and tig welded would be easier to align with essentially the same end result
 
YotaAtieToo said:
The ones I've seen sit down flat against the bead lip. If you do this, there is no way you can get the bolts out to sit against the tire itself.

I do remember seeing a "tig version" of rings that are basically the same diameter of the whole wheel and you butt weld them on, is thay what AgitatedPancake is doing? Maybe that would give you more room?
Click to expand...

Yep, sounds about right.
Pretty sure the OD of my ring was just a couple mm smaller than the OD of the wheel so the tyre didn't have to be stretched much more than normal to get over the weld bead.
 
Now that I think about it. The best way to do it would be the way the old steel trail ready beadlocks i had were done.

They cut the lip of the wheel off and add a ring with the bolt holes that only sits inside the shell. Then a 2nd ring that slips outside of the shell bottoms out on the safety bead.

You end up with anti coning, perfect tire centering and the same ease of mounting as factory made beadlocks.

If I ever do another set, it will be done this way. Wouldn't even be that much more work.
 
Hmm that idea of cutting the outer flange of the rim off, dropping a ring onto the safety bead and welding it up sounds solid, and as you said you can maintain the original centering of the wheel shell. But with the second inner ring of bolts, it seems like it woukd still need some anti coning as there’s no support inboard of the bolts (if I’m understanding it right)
 
I made anti coning rings from 20x3mm flat iron welded to the inner ring. Has worked fine for many years.
IMG_7849.png
IMG_7850.png
 
AgitatedPancake said:
Hmm that idea of cutting the outer flange of the rim off, dropping a ring onto the safety bead and welding it up sounds solid, and as you said you can maintain the original centering of the wheel shell. But with the second inner ring of bolts, it seems like it woukd still need some anti coning as there’s no support inboard of the bolts (if I’m understanding it right)
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Shouldn't because the outter ring should bolt up flat to the new inner ring because of the step.

Basically it would be just like a manufactured beadlock, which do sometimes need a spacer with thicker beads.


You could also use the factory lip to get the inner ring flat before cutting it off. Clamp or bolt a few flat bars to the ring that stick out and hold it flat with the lip. Then tack or even weld the ring on before cutting the lip off.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
The ones I've seen sit down flat against the bead lip. If you do this, there is no way you can get the bolts out to sit against the tire itself.

I do remember seeing a "tig version" of rings that are basically the same diameter of the whole wheel and you butt weld them on, is thay what AgitatedPancake is doing? Maybe that would give you more room?
Click to expand...

This is what the nut clearance looks like with the tyre bead up against the bolts and the sitting against the face of the bead lip.
Can see the plastic ring in there as well.

Excuse the rust/mud - these tyres have been on these wheels for a loooong time...

PXL_20230822_235247053[1].jpg



PXL_20230822_235315022[1].jpg
 
Wendle said:
It's tight for sure. The nuts actually sit partially inside the space created by the bead lip profile.
You can't get a ring spanner (box wrench?) over them.

Shitty vague sketch below...


Clipboard01.jpg
Click to expand...

That’s a great pic, basically how I have mine planned to end up as well.
 
AgitatedPancake said:
That’s a great pic, basically how I have mine planned to end up as well.
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Just be real careful on the OD of the inner ring. You want a little internal corner to weld into without making the overall diameter of the wheel bigger.

The first set I made had the rings cut more or less the same size as the wheel. By the time you add the welding bead to that it makes it real, real hard to get the tyre over.

I think the next set I make I'll drop the ring into the rim, move the bolt PCD inwards and cut plastic spacer rings with the bolts going through them so that the tyre centers on that ring. I've got CNC woodworking gear, so that's a pretty easy deal to get right.

I'll probably have to make some soon, the wheels in the photos above are 18" for the old school sticky 40" Baja Claws. They're just about cooked and I don't think there's really any sticky 18" size options around any more?
 
Wendle said:
Just be real careful on the OD of the inner ring. You want a little internal corner to weld into without making the overall diameter of the wheel bigger.

The first set I made had the rings cut more or less the same size as the wheel. By the time you add the welding bead to that it makes it real, real hard to get the tyre over.

I think the next set I make I'll drop the ring into the rim, move the bolt PCD inwards and cut plastic spacer rings with the bolts going through them so that the tyre centers on that ring. I've got CNC woodworking gear, so that's a pretty easy deal to get right.

I'll probably have to make some soon, the wheels in the photos above are 18" for the old school sticky 40" Baja Claws. They're just about cooked and I don't think there's really any sticky 18" size options around any more?
Click to expand...

I actually have the rings slightly smaller than the lip of the wheel, so I'll have a nice open corner joint to fill with weld and create a nice soft radius. It'll make it a bit more difficult to square and level, but should make the welding a breeze once I have it positioned correctly. I'm planning to use some welding wire to support the ring during alignment, I'll definitely snap some pics along the way.

That's a sweet idea about a nice uniform spacer outside the bolt pattern to align the tire without working with these tight tolerances of the bolts near the wheel shell too, that should work pretty nicely
 
Wendle said:
Just be real careful on the OD of the inner ring. You want a little internal corner to weld into without making the overall diameter of the wheel bigger.

The first set I made had the rings cut more or less the same size as the wheel. By the time you add the welding bead to that it makes it real, real hard to get the tyre over.

I think the next set I make I'll drop the ring into the rim, move the bolt PCD inwards and cut plastic spacer rings with the bolts going through them so that the tyre centers on that ring. I've got CNC woodworking gear, so that's a pretty easy deal to get right.

I'll probably have to make some soon, the wheels in the photos above are 18" for the old school sticky 40" Baja Claws. They're just about cooked and I don't think there's really any sticky 18" size options around any more?
Click to expand...

Only option would be a 39" sxs tire, which might work if your rig is very light.
 
Finally found the pic of my wheels with the Mayhem beadlock kit welded on:

1696900401867.png
blurry as shit....but hopefully you can see there are two 'spacers' stacked alternately and welded to each other and the inner ring to give a half inch tall 'shelf' for the bead of the tire to sit on. If anyone's interested, I have to build another 8 lug set soon and can take more/better pics....but this should give an idea.
 
Sean said:
Finally found the pic of my wheels with the Mayhem beadlock kit welded on:

1696900401867.png
blurry as shit....but hopefully you can see there are two 'spacers' stacked alternately and welded to each other and the inner ring to give a half inch tall 'shelf' for the bead of the tire to sit on. If anyone's interested, I have to build another 8 lug set soon and can take more/better pics....but this should give an idea.
Click to expand...
That's what mine were as well. It was a slow process to get all those spacers centered up and true, but mine didn't wobble or vibrate down the road at all...i believe i show them in my build pics on the old site. I'll see if i can dig some up later.
 
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