College or house?

[Projectjunkie]

A while back I was researching building a house myself, being my own gc, etc.

one of the things that came up in my search was a very well written article laying out the dollars of starting at 18 years old and building a house with a chunk of sweat equity vs going to college. The cash value of sweat equity wasnt exorbitant, and the spread between income with and without a degree didn't seem skewed to make his point.

Building a house won for building wealth, hands down.

Now, houses aren't portable, degrees are.

Housing has risen for 100 years, but there are areas where it has dropped.

Demographics change, birth rates dropping, purple having less kids, demand for 4 bedroom houses may drop in 15 years, but, demands for careers can change as well.

At this point, I will have my kids college ready, but would be very happy to see them putting sweat equity into a house and getting roommates and looking for the next house

 

[Gatorgrizz27]

The biggest barrier when you’re 18 isn’t the mortgage, you’ve got to live somewhere unless you’re homeless or doing the van thing. It’s the down payment/closing costs/etc that makes it a seemingly impossible barrier when your checking account averages $75 after you’ve paid your bills.

A parent covering the cost of that and having their kid make all the payments would be a huge gift. I’d just title it jointly, they make the payment to you a month ahead of time, and make it very clear that they can only have one late/missed payment, ever, for any reason, before they are out of it. If they miss payment #2 they’re getting kicked out and you’ll rent it out to their friends.

 

[Gravy]

Don't give them shit. You keep your money a secret and tucked away. They need to make their own decisions in life, stop making them for them.

 

[woods]

Or what about the option of buying a place, renting it out for the next ten years, have kiddo help on the upkeep, learn to do the stuff themselves, then when they're good and ready move in. Pay "rent/mortgage" back to you at a price they can live off of.

I can't find the fault in helping out your kids. Not give them a free ride, but to just to get their footing. I mean, if you can why not? My grandfolk's did it for my folks. My folks did it for me. I'm going to do it for my kid. We all treat each other like business partners. We even put a weekly amount in a high yield account for if a property comes up to buy and rent out. We loan each other money back and forth, so no interest goes to the bank. It all stays with us.

 

[Roc Doc]

Well I paid for my own college, so never had that decision to make, but probably would have used the money to buy a ski boat and a badass truck to pull it with.

 

[45acp]

House x1000, but I only made 1 semester in community college. By HS I was tired of school and wanted no more... college literally made me ill to the point I don't think I would have survived 4 years.

I wasted 6 years at a great job living as a renter and that's the one thing I'd change if i had the magic time machine. I could have started with a 40k dump and do the flip/move thing every 5 years and be living in my current house payed for by now.

 

[Pony_Driver]

Take money for house, throw in index fund, learn trade, live like broke college student, retire at 38.

This would be the ticket, but how many people have the foresight at 18?

 

[Snowbird13]

Well, I'm 42, paying for a house, and college that I never finished, nor would I use the degree if I had, so I think the answer is easy. House.

 

[Mr Stubs]

People who don't pay for college have no skin in the game and don't appreciate it or take it seriously.

(Not just college, but extends to all things).

You want to do your kids a favor, make them pay their own way.

Don't give them college or a house.

They'll get the money when you die.

Yep... I would have “liked” but it sucks to suck.

 

[billdacat]

Fucking one or two year community college and military service to pay the way for a degree. Engineering is going to put food on the table and a roof over one's head. On the other hand; a fucking Roto Rooter franchise deserves a serious look.

 

[Jeffh555]

Another vote for it depends on the kid.

I'm an engineer, I don't think I'd be happy in any other career. It's not about the money, this is just how my brain works. I couldn't be where I am without a degree. Same thing with my wife, but she's a marketing manager, her brain just thinks marketing.

I could probably make more money installing and servicing elevators, but the whole time I'd want to be designing the elevator. I don't think most people are like that.

If there's something your kid is passionate about, and the path to that includes college, then college is probably the right call.

If they don't know what they want to do yet, then it's a lot more difficult of a decision.

 

[Projectjunkie]

On the other hand; a fucking Roto Rooter franchise deserves a serious look.

Yup. I expect good grades and college readiness, but I also point out the house belonging to the family that owns the plumbing company, new brodozers, sand car, new vette, vintage camaro, wakeboard boat.

shit smells like shit but it pays, then you hire guys and run things

doctors and nurses have to smell shit too

 

[billdacat]

Yup. I expect good grades and college readiness, but I also point out the house belonging to the family that owns the plumbing company, new brodozers, sand car, new vette, vintage camaro, wakeboard boat.

shit smells like shit but it pays, then you hire guys and run things

doctors and nurses have to smell shit too

I worked with my uncle (plumber) before graduating HS. I made some fucking serious cash! I was seriously considering a career in plumbing. HVAC peeps can also do well with a two year program.

 

[evernoob]

People who don't pay for college have no skin in the game and don't appreciate it or take it seriously.

(Not just college, but extends to all things).

You want to do your kids a favor, make them pay their own way.

Don't give them college or a house.

They'll get the money when you die.

Oh really? The Elite that run this country and the Free World didn't pay for their college.

I always hear that from my class of people, and you are wrong. This didn't dawn on me until I was in my late 30s.

Take UMich. The people who go there are from out of State, and when they hear 'Michigan' they think it's an Arctic wasteland. So their parents buy them $600 Canada Goose jackets. To walk across the Diag for 5 minutes at a time. They also have cars, usually BMWs and the like, often enough a newer domestic, too. It's not the Ivy League afater all.

Their parents helicopter them, pay for all of their shit, and give them a credit cards with a couple thousand a month for eating out at one of A2's many fine restaurants. This affords those kids leisure time to do the most important thing in college outside of math-based hard-STEM: socialize and enrich themselves. Kids should be schooling and exploring and interacting, not working their fucking fingers to the bone.

These kids are spoiled fucking brats who don't pay for anything in their life. By your theory, they should all become drunks and bums.

Instead, they go on to Med School, Public Admin, and Law. Those spoiled kids run the goddamned planet.

I wish I had known this decades ago, but maybe it would have made me too angry. My parents discouraged me from college because they were afraid of having to pay for it. I don't resent them now, because of their financial situation and they fact neither one graduated High School. They simply didn't know.

So I joined the Navy. I don't belong in the military but it was a good place for me at that age. I had a job and insurance.

But if my parents had insisted I go to college and paid for everything, I would be in a very different life right now. I spent decades resenting educated people but now I realize it's because I didn't have their advantages. Little 18 year old punks and sluts need to have their nose pointed in the right direction. Bribery is a perfectly acceptable way to motivate adolescents. It works.

The Brent Kavanaugh case really brought it home to me. While they were #metooing the guy, it was revealed he was in a little drinking club in HIgh School and spent a lot of time partying and having beer bashes. My parents, in their salt of the earth down home wisdom, would call the cops on me for violating the law and being too wild.

Kavanaugh's parents kept him out of trouble. Now he is a Supreme Court Justice. That's because his parents paid his way.

George W. Bush was a wastrel, and there is no way that mofo could ever, EVER get into Yale on his own. But daddy not only got him into Yale, he got him into Skull and Bones. And then the little monkey retard bankrupted about 16 businesses, got into baseball, became a Governor, and then POTUS.

If I could go back and re-do it, I would make money and buy my kids ALL the latest clothes. I would buy them nice new cars. I would pay for their college 100%, and I would gift them a very generous down-payment on a house.

That is EXACTLY what the leaders and Elite of this country do. It fucking works.

The blue collar and working class making their kids 'earn their way' is like kicking their own kids in the fucking face. I hate it.

 

[arse_sidewards]

Make them pay for their own college and help them out with a house later when they need it.

 

[det107]

These kids are spoiled fucking brats who don't pay for anything in their life. By your theory, they should all become drunks and bums.

When the parents say that they will cut their arms off for their kids "literally," isn't this what happens in a nutshell...?

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...Those spoiled kids run the goddamned planet...
​​​​I wish I had known this decades ago, but maybe it would have made me too angry.

While spoiled kids do run the place w/education & mansions, there is another outlook while I was growing up is that certain kids (no hint needed) was told by their parents not to participate in school activities such as reading, 'riting & 'rithmetic. Guess who pays for their "housing" & "Bachelor of the arts" degree?

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The blue collar and working class making their kids 'earn their way' is like kicking their own kids in the fucking face. I hate it.

At least you rose up & certainly made a name for yourself

 

[Ransil]

My wife just got her degree(s) last month, I have none both of us are in engineering positions. Military worked for us, plenty of time to screw off and get paid and learn something.
My Sister and brother's kids have it made , smart, liked school, but college is proving to be a challenge for them, they will be living in the basement.

I wouldn't give them shit, they need to earn it, have them get loans for school and pay them off only if they finish and get jobs.

Buddy's 2 kids were going to college both dropped out, with parents paying for it, they got labor jobs and figured out real quick a degree might be better, parents only paid after they were done from round 2 with school.

 

[Toreadorranger]

Easy, College - Engineering has been good to me.

This. My income is currently equal to what I paid for 4 yrs of college. The ROI is much better on the degree then it would have been on a house.

 

[Lil'John]

I would say college... it gives them a leg up on getting into "easier" less-physical jobs.

My parents did that for me with only one requirement: I maintain a passing grade. I took advantage of it and went comp sci. But I also took advantage of having a general contractor as a neighbor and have general construction skills; enough to have done a couple of stints of construction.

If I had young kids, I would make the same offer BUT add in the requirement of the degree be toward something with good job opportunities available: ie mostly STEM. No gender studies crap.

I wouldn't do a house for a few reasons: young are "flighty" and may not know where they really want to land. There are more expenses to a house that may overwhelm a minimum wage job if your kid can't pick up a useful skill.

 

[jeepyj]

It says what would you have taken, not what you would have gave your kids.

Well, fuck.

House. Free college would have just been seven more years of partying with nothing to show for it. Except maybe double secret probation.

 

[grumpy356]

I love all these threads, "Just be an engineer" . Maybe engineering school has changed with new technology and the amount of information and programs available on the computer, but when I went to school, they weren't just passing out engineering degrees. What I remember is there was a hell of a lot of math and you had to have some aptitude that is not a given.

 

[woods]

I love all these threads, "Just be an engineer" . Maybe engineering school has changed with new technology and the amount of information and programs available on the computer, but when I went to school, they weren't just passing out engineering degrees. What I remember is there was a hell of a lot of math and you had to have some aptitude that is not a given.

Right? I got to Diffy Q's and that was it. Screw that noise. Thermal Dynamics was the other. My Calc I class started off with about 60 students. By the time I gnawed through it, there was about 10 of us. I got a 30something on my midterm. But because the highest score was 40something I passed.

 

[Deuce 40s]

Become their bank.

Let them go to college under the illusion they need to get a degree that will pay it back and live a healthy lifestyle. After they graduate, pay off their debt and have them make payments to you with a much lower interest rate.

When it's time to buy a house, pay the down payment (or entire house) for them and have them pay you back with less interest than a real bank.

Everyone wins.

 

[woods]

Become their bank.

Let them go to college under the illusion they need to get a degree that will pay it back and live a healthy lifestyle. After they graduate, pay off their debt and have them make payments to you with a much lower interest rate.

When it's time to buy a house, pay the down payment (or entire house) for them and have them pay you back with less interest than a real bank.

Everyone wins.

You explained it better than I did.

 

[OHV Wildcat]

Right? I got to Diffy Q's and that was it. Screw that noise. Thermal Dynamics was the other. My Calc I class started off with about 60 students. By the time I gnawed through it, there was about 10 of us. I got a 30something on my midterm. But because the highest score was 40something I passed.

I was the smart kid that didn't care enough in engineering school. I made it through with a 3.0--nothing to brag about. The mix in our graduating class of 45 seemed to be -- 1 guy freakishly smart, tried, and kicked everyone's ass. 4 or 5 people that were book smart and useless, got good grades. 3 or 4 of us that were smart and didn't really put in the time or effort, and made it through. Maybe 20 that were mostly work ethic. And maybe 10 that were ONLY work ethic--no apparent aptitude for learning or math (judged from my lofty perch).

Obviously, I'm a great engineer, since this doesn't even add up to 45 students. But my point is--everything in life is on some sort of mishmash of qualities. When it comes to getting through engineering school, almost anyone can do it, they just have to adjust their willingness to work according to their natural aptitude. I would've never made the real effort if I would've had to.

I see the same thing working as an engineer. Our best and most successful ones are the ones that are either freakishly smart, or freakishly driven. No one outperforms by being middle of the road, but we all earn a living.

I do think that if you're one of those people that are all work ethic, you'll succeed at anything. And you might actually be able to partially retire earlier in the trades.

 

[engineerjoe]

Become their bank.

Let them go to college under the illusion they need to get a degree that will pay it back and live a healthy lifestyle. After they graduate, pay off their debt and have them make payments to you with a much lower interest rate.

When it's time to buy a house, pay the down payment (or entire house) for them and have them pay you back with less interest than a real bank.

Everyone wins.

This.
My parents had me take out as much subsidized loans as possible every semester, then they paid the rest. I worked part time jobs the first couple years for spending money (cell phone, car insurance, etc.). Then Junior/Senior years I was working full time and I didn't need my parents help to pay the un-subsidized portion any more. When I got out, I had $17k in student loans, which I started paying on.
After graduation my Dad became my bank - sort of. He and I researched the foreclosure system and he ponied up the money to buy a house. After purchase, I immediately did a home equity loan (it's way easier to get than a straight up mortgage) and paid him back.
I sold the house after 3 years and paid off the rest of the student loans and had enough for the down payment of my next house.

 

[Poke]

I never went to college. I liked messing around with car so after high school i got a job washing cars in a body shop. Paid attention, started working in the shop and learned fast. Changed jobs and went to another shop when I was 21 years old. Worked hard and 25 years later I owned the place. I have 14 employees and am doing pretty well.

My wife went to college for 11 years and got her PhD. She's now a college professor and does pretty well too.

We have two kids, 6 and 9 years old. We are militant savers and will have $300k+ saved up for college for each of them by the time they need it.

We're paying off our house this week and I got to thinking....If I had the choice when I was 18 of money for college or money for a house I would have taken the house. Not having to pay a mortgage for the past 25 years would have opened up a whole bunch of options for me.

I think there is too much emphasis on college these days and not enough on trades. If my kids want to go to college, great, but I think there is just as much opportunity working with your hands and learning a trade. And if they already had a house paid for, it would be huge leg up.

Given the choice when you were getting out of high school, would you have taken college 100% paid for or a house free and clear?

I love this thread. My plan is very simple. Offer the kids to pay for their college OR buy them a duplex move them in one side and help them rent the other.