1969 Camaro build

SHARPMACHINE said:
^^^ Seems wild to me. A drop out modern Camero drivetrain can be north of 650 hp stock, with many mods available. Something like that would be how I would do it. But I do enjoy following along and trying to imagine a build like this.
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Boring:flipoff2: Everyone has one of those.:flipoff2::flipoff2:

Honestly, I had planned to use this engine in my '72. That's a tube chassis car though and needs a **** ton of work. The '69 needed a serious refreshing. I decided to combine the two and put this engine in the '69 and make it a pro touring type ride.

And here we are. I don't have the desire to buy everything twice like I did/are doing on the Jeep, so this thread exists.

As annoying as SLOWPOKE693 can sound:flipoff2:, he's not wrong and I really appreciate his input. Everyone's input is much appreciated. That why this site is so awesome.
 
gt1guy said:
Boring:flipoff2: Everyone has one of those.:flipoff2::flipoff2:

Honestly, I had planned to use this engine in my '72. That's a tube chassis car though and needs a **** ton of work. The '69 needed a serious refreshing. I decided to combine the two and put this engine in the '69 and make it a pro touring type ride.

And here we are. I don't have the desire to buy everything twice like I did/are doing on the Jeep, so this thread exists.

As annoying as SLOWPOKE693 can sound:flipoff2:, he's not wrong and I really appreciate his input. Everyone's input is much appreciated. That why this site is so awesome.
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You should drop the 72 off at my house. Between the Jeep and this Camaro you have a lifetime of projects left to do and no time for that car. It needs a new home... :flipoff2:
 
gt1guy said:
Neg-a-tive.

When I type in Trick ***anium bell housing and the first hits are Tim McAmis and Jerry Bickel, that tells me I don't need that stuff. :flipoff2:

I simply don't want an alum bell housing, I want steel. The standard R07 bell housing is alum and seems to work fine for them at 950hp.



What's the difference in cam profiles between a NA engine and a turbo engine for ANY given max RPM?

Did you know that the M190 ECU can store multiple maps and change them basically on the fly?

Did you know that on pump gas I don't plan on going over 8-9lbs of boost?

I have a much better chance of getting this thing to do what I want simply because it's boosted and will have a much milder cam profile than it's NA brothers. The .5" stroke increase will help a ton too.
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I don't know of many (if any at all) V8s with twins spinning anywhere near 9k rpm. The LS guys running 427s with twins these days are running hydraulic roller cams and spinning 7500rpm while making 40lbs of boost and close to 2k horsepower. Sticking turbos on an engine that was capable of spinning 10k rpm NA is going to be a huge exhaust restriction. You will be dumping 10x more out of the waste gates than you will be pumping psi into the engine when on pump gas, if you expect it to make big power on race fuel. Think giant hat soaked part in your intake track...

I wouldn't even consider pump gas as an option with that combo. E85 for the street, methanol when you want to have serious fun. That engine won't make anymore power than a small block with twins on pump gas and the intercooler setup is going to have to be massive to do race car things when you want to make all the boost.

Seriously.... Why not just build it as an NA engine and run it on E85. A 9000+ rpm NA engine on the street that makes 800-900hp will be more than enough for anything you will ever do with the car, and also be cool as ****. This twin turbo RO7 thing sounds like a really really stupid idea and a great way to **** up a badass engine.

Have you ever driven anything with 700+ horsepower thats not a modern car full of nannies?
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
You should drop the 72 off at my house. Between the Jeep and this Camaro you have a lifetime of projects left to do and no time for that car. It needs a new home... :flipoff2:
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Screenshot_20260327_141500_Maps.jpg


Round trip doable in a day.....
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
You should drop the 72 off at my house. Between the Jeep and this Camaro you have a lifetime of projects left to do and no time for that car. It needs a new home... :flipoff2:
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This is true and I know it.

But why would I drive all that way, just to give away a real 1972 RS/SS split bumper Camaro for free?

:flipoff2:
 
There's no E85 anywhere around me. I looked. And, I don't want to have to buy drums of it as the only fuel I use. Race gas is fine as long as I can run pump gas too.
 
American Powertrain Billet Steel Flywheel #FWCV-11004N
For 1pc rear main SBC, 153t, neutral balance.

McLeod RTX HD Clutch #6923-07HD
9.5" twin disk, 1200hp capable, cerametallic friction disks, streetable.
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Just ordered and shipped to Weddle.
Got a email from Ron saying Albins was finalizing on their end and wanted to make sure everything would play nice together.

Never fails that nothing move until I leave the country. I just got back to Saudi last night.

Last up will be the hyd release bearing. But that should be pretty easy to nail down.

I think this next time home is going to be contact with RCR and getting some rotating parts ordered.
 
Weddle has the clutch and flywheel now, so he should be sending Albins the last bits of info the need the finalize things.

Hopefully I'll have a really big invoice to pay here in the next few months. Oh joy.
 
Did you order the Anvil carbon fiber yet?

I did all their stuff on a 73 I built, sold and boomeranged back to me. It took me 1.5 years to get it, back in 2016.

It's sub-framed in the front with C6 stuff and rear Gen5 Camaro IRS (with all DSE stuff). It fits a front: 285/30ZR19 and rear: 335/25ZR20

Since I got it back, I am doing a lot of changes, and it includes more Anvil products, which are listed as out of stock, but when you call them, they're made to order. Still takes about 9 months.

You should send me the 72 :) - I already have a bunch of carbon fiber for it... and I already know how to wide body the back to match the front Anvil fenders.
 

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Grendel said:
Did you order the Anvil carbon fiber yet?

I did all their stuff on a 73 I built, sold and boomeranged back to me. It took me 1.5 years to get it, back in 2016.

It's sub-framed in the front with C6 stuff and rear Gen5 Camaro IRS (with all DSE stuff). It fits a front: 285/30ZR19 and rear: 335/25ZR20

Since I got it back, I am doing a lot of changes, and it includes more Anvil products, which are listed as out of stock, but when you call them, they're made to order. Still takes about 9 months.

You should send me the 72 :) - I already have a bunch of carbon fiber for it... and I already know how to wide body the back to match the front Anvil fenders.
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No, I haven't ordered the Anvil bits yet. Haven't even called them yet. It sucks to hear about the timeline. Hopefully they sell more first Gen stuff and they can be had quicker. Though, it sounds like I should get the ball rolling sooner than later.

Definitely, planning on the DSE front subframe. Was also thinking about their 4-link in the rear due to it not being a gigantic job to install. There was a guy that used to be on Corner-Carvers that made a awesome 3-link w/ watts kit for first gens, which I would have gone with, but he's long gone.
 
gt1guy said:
No, I haven't ordered the Anvil bits yet. Haven't even called them yet. It sucks to hear about the timeline. Hopefully they sell more first Gen stuff and they can be had quicker. Though, it sounds like I should get the ball rolling sooner than later.

Definitely, planning on the DSE front subframe. Was also thinking about their 4-link in the rear due to it not being a gigantic job to install. There was a guy that used to be on Corner-Carvers that made a awesome 3-link w/ watts kit for first gens, which I would have gone with, but he's long gone.
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It's worth a 10 min phone call to find out.

I did a build-ish thread on the 73
 
Grendel said:
It's worth a 10 min phone call to find out.

I did a build-ish thread on the 73
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I'm in Saudi right now, so can't call, but I did send off a email to him. He got right back. Saying to call him with my list of parts I wanted and we could talk timelines. Also said he had a extraction hood with a blemish he'd make a deal on.
I need to get back to him to ask if the blemish is just cosmetic. I'm going to paint all the outside body panel stuff body color anyways, so a cosmetic blem doesn't matter to me.
Damn list I made of what I want just from Anvil was 22k. That's just a little less than the transmission cost and I still need to pay that off when it ships.

Pretty sure my desire to finish the 72 will have evaporated by the time this pile is running.
 
yeah, I already have a bunch of Anvil stuff and my new list is still over $5K.


Blems mean they can be covered in paint. I have a set of 2nd gen blem inner fenders... that if painted, you'd never know. I wanted to show the carbon fiber, so I bought a second set and will install them this go around.


This is a blem:

1779811350310.png


It's in below the clear coat and completely smooth.

Funny thing, they sent them to me as if they were not blem's.
 
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Grendel said:
yeah, I already have a bunch of Anvil stuff and my new list is still over $5K.


Blems mean they can be covered in paint. I have a set of 2nd gen blem inner fenders... that if painted, you'd never know. I wanted to show the carbon fiber, so I bought a second set and will install them this go around.


This is a blem:

1779811350310.png


It's in below the clear coat and completely smooth.

Funny thing, they sent them to me as if they were not blem's.
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I received a email from Emmanuel at Anvil. Seems pretty honest about their timelines.
Read below...

If a part is out of stock and made to order, depending on our current production cycle, it can take 3 to 4 months at the earliest, or 5 to 6 months at the latest. This also depends on how many customers are ahead of you for a specific part, but this usually only matters for larger items like hoods and outer fenders.
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So I'll figure 6 months to get stuff. I just need to push that stuff to the front of the line for ordering parts.
Most of the stuff isn't a big deal, but the widebody fenders and the super wide inner fenders are needed to set ride height and select wheel specs.

He also said he'd be sending me pictures of the blemish on the hood they have. I had told them Id buy it if they'd hold it till I get home.

I did also find that Ultra-Carbon makes full doors that use all the factory hardware and take stock glass and regulators.

’67 – ’69 Camaro/Firebird Parts | Ultra-Carbon

www.ultra-carbon.com www.ultra-carbon.com

Already planning a 6 point cage but, I'd think with cf doors, some kind of a door bar might be in order. Or one that can swing open. I'd go with nothing before I'd go with something I had to climb over.


SLOWPOKE693 said:
You and I need to talk about that. I have much desire to finish that car. :smokin:
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My desire is withering like an old mans ball sack.
 
I did a Ride Tech Tiger cage, with door bars.

I want the 72 to build :).
 
Ok, I know knock sensors are a built in part of LS engines (at least the LS3, no idea about the older ones).
I don't really understand them other than they must work off acoustics or vibrations.

How does one go about adding knock sensors to a block that wasn't intended to ever have them and has no provisions for them?

Not home right now so I can't simply pull one from the LS3 in my Jeep and have a look.

The block for the Camaro does have threads where the normal freeze plug holes are.

Any enlightening thoughts on the subject?
 
I may have missed it, but what are you using for engine management? General consensus is that with aftermarket EFI it's usually not worth the hassle to set them up. They need to be tuned for what frequencies to pick up on and that can change quite a bit with where they are mounted. Not saying you can't use them, but it's not a plug in and go thing.

I guess when I say "aftermarket EFI" I'm talking mainly about Holley stuff. Which their logic is fairly simple. Haltech and Link may have better options. I can't imagine that you're going to run a GM ecm, but that probably has the most development behind it.

With early LS stuff, they were in the valley under the intake. Gen4 and later they are down low on the sides of the block. That's where they were on SBC's as well.

The Ls3 in my 70 Jimmy is running on a Terminator Xmax. They are plugged in but not turned on in the software. Took some time to sneak up on the timing and I run good fuel in it. When we take it to the sand dunes I splash some 110 in it and try not to lug it in a high gear.

The 5.3 in my SquareBody has them functional still. That is just a basic cam/headers/rubber mounts build and is running the factory 05 computer. Timing table has been tweaked a little from stock and it gets the cheapest gas I can find for it. I never messed with the sensitivity of the knock sensors in the tune but I know some people like to desensitize them once you start modify stuff.
 
ECU is going to be a Motec M190, which is fully capable of integrating knock sensors into the tunes.Tuning and initial setup will be done by someone waaaay smarter than myself who knows what they are doing.
If I have to haul the thing half way across the country to get it in the hands of a pro, that's exactly what I'll be doing.
 
Just looked through the M190 manual.
There are 4 knock sensors inputs in the ECU.

Going to have the ECU controlling a lot of **** on this car.
Flat shifting through the load sensor on the shift handle.
Rev matched down shifts.
Boost will be controlled through a MAC 4 port boost control solenoid plumbed to the waste gates. That will allow boost by gear and speed or a combination of the two. it will also allow the ECU to limit boost from high IAT or ECT.
 
How much $$ do you think you will have into the car when you're done?
Not asking to be an asshole, just wondering.

Regardless what you spend, still way cheaper than paying someone else to build you one.
 
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