Is there a JK/JL axle bible?

AgitatedPancake said:
I don't think low pinion 30 like my WJ crap are worth doing anything with TBH. I don't think bigger stubs are super important, because that LP gearset isn't good for much more than 27 spline. In fact even just stiffening the housing was polishing a turd lol. Far better to just start with a JK/JL high pinion along with their newer superior gears. Especially with how cheap you can get aftermarket housings, knuckles, and lockers
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I agree, was just talking using outters, but either way JK is better in every way.

AgitatedPancake said:
I know the WJ uses the same ball joints as a JK, but heard somewhere along the line that the actual offset height of the unit bearing on the knuckle is different. I didn't know about a potential KPI difference though, that's interesting.
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I would have sworn it was a different kpi, but you have me 2nd guessing. I know for sure the knuckles won't swap.

AgitatedPancake said:
If a JK/JL could be redrilled for 5x4.5, you could run some ~20lb 17" UTV wheels and tires if ultra-light is still the theme
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17s are gaining popularity in utv's for sure, but there is just so many more options for 15" tires new and used.

I had kinda wondered about rzr pro r take off beadlocks. 15x7 5x4.5
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I agree, was just talking using outters, but either way JK is better in every way.
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For sure, I should have specified but I was more thinking about one of your earlier posts there talking about putting JK UBs on a WJ housing. The ability to drive without a stub would be a sweet upgrade, and the 32 spline would be cool just probably more than that LP gearset deserves lol

YotaAtieToo said:
I would have sworn it was a different kpi, but you have me 2nd guessing. I know for sure the knuckles won't swap.
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I'll admit I'm not saying that with any confidence, just noise I heard somewhere along the line so it's all new to me and the KPI could absolutely be part of it

YotaAtieToo said:
17s are gaining popularity in utv's for sure, but there is just so many more options for 15" tires new and used.

I had kinda wondered about rzr pro r take off beadlocks. 15x7 5x4.5
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I like 15"s too especially when talking small and/or ultra light, just wasn't sure about the brakes. Though some smaller Spydertrax style plate rotors with aluminum hats, small Wilwood calipers on a stock aluminum knuckle would be insanely light, and could be sized for 15"s.
 
JR4X said:
I could go any way on 5 on 4.5 or 5 on 5 or 5 on 5 1/2. But i really want the versatility of the 5 on 5. Basset does make 15” 5 on 5 1/2 beadlocks but not in the light weight. I want the 24 pound ones
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It would be odd but what about going wide 5 pattern wheel and then an aluminum wheel adapter.
These say 23lbs (no center obviously though)

These are 17.5lbs

Then make an adapter kinda like this
 
350TacoZilla said:
It would be odd but what about going wide 5 pattern wheel and then an aluminum wheel adapter.
These say 23lbs (no center obviously though)

These are 17.5lbs

Then make an adapter kinda like this
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The adapter kinda negates the weight savings tho...

AgitatedPancake said:
For sure, I should have specified but I was more thinking about one of your earlier posts there talking about putting JK UBs on a WJ housing. The ability to drive without a stub would be a sweet upgrade, and the 32 spline would be cool just probably more than that LP gearset deserves lol
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Ya, lots of thinking out loud here :laughing:

AgitatedPancake said:
I'll admit I'm not saying that with any confidence, just noise I heard somewhere along the line so it's all new to me and the KPI could absolutely be part of it



I like 15"s too especially when talking small and/or ultra light, just wasn't sure about the brakes. Though some smaller Spydertrax style plate rotors with aluminum hats, small Wilwood calipers on a stock aluminum knuckle would be insanely light, and could be sized for 15"s.
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I wonder how hard it would be to adapt rzr pro r brakes on?
 
YotaAtieToo said:
The adapter kinda negates the weight savings tho...
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You think an aluminum flat adapter like that would weigh 6lbs each? I just meant it gets him back to the light weight wheels he wanted while staying beadlocked. Weld makes aluminum beadlock wide 5 wheels but nothing under 12" wide I think unless they do custom order. Not sure how tough they are either, just spitballing here at 1:21 am
 
350TacoZilla said:
You think an aluminum flat adapter like that would weigh 6lbs each? I just meant it gets him back to the light weight wheels he wanted while staying beadlocked. Weld makes aluminum beadlock wide 5 wheels but nothing under 12" wide I think unless they do custom order. Not sure how tough they are either, just spitballing here at 1:21 am
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Buy why when they make them in 5x5?
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Buy why when they make them in 5x5?
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He just said they don't make the lightweight 24lb ones in 5x5.5? Am I missing something or wasn't that the entire point of his post how he wants light 24lb wheels but they don't come in 5x5.5?
 
If we're bench racing on a rock crawling site...

While not a budget option, 74weld makes 4 gear portals for the JK and the JL/JT inner knuckles.

If you're starting with nothing, probably doesn't make sense to not start with their inners and 2 gear portals or JHF portals, but if you were part way down the upgrade road, maybe there is a buggy axle application with a HP44 front, JL inner knuckles and 4 gear portals, and a LP44 rear steer equivalent.

Budget and bling- f100 31 spline Ford 9 housing and center, free JL inner knuckles, custom inner 1480 shafts, polished Howe ram and 74weld portals. Haha.
 
350TacoZilla said:
He just said they don't make the lightweight 24lb ones in 5x5.5? Am I missing something or wasn't that the entire point of his post how he wants light 24lb wheels but they don't come in 5x5.5?
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Well yes, but the axles were discussing all come 5x5

Opiebennett said:
If we're bench racing on a rock crawling site...

While not a budget option, 74weld makes 4 gear portals for the JK and the JL/JT inner knuckles.

If you're starting with nothing, probably doesn't make sense to not start with their inners and 2 gear portals or JHF portals, but if you were part way down the upgrade road, maybe there is a buggy axle application with a HP44 front, JL inner knuckles and 4 gear portals, and a LP44 rear steer equivalent.

Budget and bling- f100 31 spline Ford 9 housing and center, free JL inner knuckles, custom inner 1480 shafts, polished Howe ram and 74weld portals. Haha.
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Since Jr is a suzuki nerd, maybe he'll not think this is completely ******ed...... Maybe

I want to build some suzuki 3rd member portals using common sxs portals. They have a decent reputation holding much more power and wieght and 35-37s for the 4" version. I'd think rcv would be able to make shafts since they make zuk and sxs shafts.

The price difference is significant from big boy stuff

Polaris RZR Pro R 4" Portal Gear Lift https://share.google/cyGwE0NI4mDdEww2r
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I want to build some suzuki 3rd member portals using common sxs portals. They have a decent reputation holding much more power and wieght and 35-37s for the 4" version. I'd think rcv would be able to make shafts since they make zuk and sxs shafts.

The price difference is significant from big boy stuff

Polaris RZR Pro R 4" Portal Gear Lift https://share.google/cyGwE0NI4mDdEww2r
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I think thats a pretty good idea!

$4200 all in for (4) dual idler billet portals is beyond reasonable. And parts for those are readily available. The Mav Rs and Pro Rs both have more HP than a samurai will ever have and they don't break portals often. The other cool feature about those is that you can make them fit any ball joint spread because the brackets that hold them on the SxS you picked as the doner unbolts. It would be fairly simple to build portal brackets to fit front axle Cs and rear axle flanges. 15 & 30% reduction option is nice too.
 
Brakes could be an issue unless SxS calipers and rotors are enough to get the job done. But Im sure bigger stuff could be fitted if someone tried hard enough to adapt them.
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
I think thats a pretty good idea!

$4200 all in for (4) dual idler billet portals is beyond reasonable. And parts for those are readily available. The Mav Rs and Pro Rs both have more HP than a samurai will ever have and they don't break portals often. The other cool feature about those is that you can make them fit any ball joint spread because the brackets that hold them on the SxS you picked as the doner unbolts. It would be fairly simple to build portal brackets to fit front axle Cs and rear axle flanges. 15 & 30% reduction option is nice too.
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That was my thought.

I envisioned a 1.0 3cyl/th180/sami tcase/aluminum 5.12 tracker diffs in a tiny buggy on 35-37 sxs stickies. I just wish they made them with more aggressive gear reduction without going to a giant mud tard portal. I have thought about a 6" (gets you 1.45 vs 1.3) but I don't know the cog hit would be worth it? Plus forces you to 17s iirc.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
That was my thought.

I envisioned a 1.0 3cyl/th180/sami tcase/aluminum 5.12 tracker diffs in a tiny buggy on 35-37 sxs stickies. I just wish they made them with more aggressive gear reduction without going to a giant mud tard portal. I have thought about a 6" (gets you 1.45 vs 1.3) but I don't know the cog hit would be worth it? Plus forces you to 17s iirc.
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You don't think a 30% reduction with 5.12s would be enough?
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
I think thats a pretty good idea!

$4200 all in for (4) dual idler billet portals is beyond reasonable. And parts for those are readily available. The Mav Rs and Pro Rs both have more HP than a samurai will ever have and they don't break portals often. The other cool feature about those is that you can make them fit any ball joint spread because the brackets that hold them on the SxS you picked as the doner unbolts. It would be fairly simple to build portal brackets to fit front axle Cs and rear axle flanges. 15 & 30% reduction option is nice too.
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I want those on my Lesbaru. :laughing:
 
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SLOWPOKE693 said:
Brakes could be an issue unless SxS calipers and rotors are enough to get the job done. But Im sure bigger stuff could be fitted if someone tried hard enough to adapt them.
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I'm sure whatever sxs brakes would be better than samurai brakes :laughing:

SLOWPOKE693 said:
You don't think a 30% reduction with 5.12s would be enough?
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Gearing would be plenty, it's more the taking stress off up stream stuff. Biggest thing would the diffs I think.

Plus reducing torque twist

Portal buggies run 5.29/5.40 and 1.92 reduction.

arse_sidewards said:
I want those on my Lesbaru.
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Damn it, that actually sounds cool
 
SLOWPOKE693 said:
I see used ones for sale on FBMP all the time for reasonable deals. Because its a Subaru there might even be sets out there with the same spline count and diameter as your stock axles.
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Or worst case run the SxS outer and just do a welded adapter shaft for the inner.

The steering and leverage situation on the struts would be ******ed though. :laughing:
 
arse_sidewards said:
The steering and leverage situation on the struts would be ******ed though. :laughing:
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Replace them with a pair of fat hydraulic cylinders internally limited to keep the travel in check. Fill them with enough fluid to hydro lock them at a reasonable spring rate. Weld the tabs for the spindle on and rock out. :laughing:

Im only like half joking
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I don't know the cog hit would be worth it? Plus forces you to 17s iirc.
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I think the COG wouldn't take too big of a hit. The heavy chassis stuff isn't moving up. And the extra 2" isn't that significant since it's already not that far from the COG.
 
Dumb and pointless thought, but putting it out there to be made fun of anyway. Jk44 guts fit in Dana 44s. So the inverse should also be true. It may open up some oddball locker options.
 
Treefrog said:
Dumb and pointless thought, but putting it out there to be made fun of anyway. Jk44 guts fit in Dana 44s. So the inverse should also be true. It may open up some oddball locker options.
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Actually unless I misunderstand you, thats not correct. The rear non-Rubi (sport and saharah) carriers are interchangable with traditional 44s. The Rubicon front and rear uses different metric carrier bearings that make it unique. Im sure some creative machining and spacers would open up options, but which locker options arent already available for JK Rubicon axles?

Some of the aftermarket front 44s and I believe the actual J8 front 44 used the traditional SAE 44 bearings.
 
gobi_rubi said:
Actually unless I misunderstand you, thats not correct. The rear non-Rubi (sport and saharah) carriers are interchangable with traditional 44s. The Rubicon front and rear uses different metric carrier bearings that make it unique. Im sure some creative machining and spacers would open up options, but which locker options arent already available for JK Rubicon axles?

Some of the aftermarket front 44s and I believe the actual J8 front 44 used the traditional SAE 44 bearings.
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I was talking about the non rubis. I didn't know the carries were interchangeable for the non-rubi. I would have thought that they would have made them slightly different just because.

I don't know off the top of my head, but I'm sure there are some oddball lockers for the Dana 44 over the years.
 
Treefrog said:
I was talking about the non rubis. I didn't know the carries were interchangeable for the non-rubi. I would have thought that they would have made them slightly different just because.

I don't know off the top of my head, but I'm sure there are some oddball lockers for the Dana 44 over the years.
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The only difference in the non-Rubis I believe is the ring gear bolt size, but most aftermarket carriers are dual drilled. Or you could either drill them out or use spacers depending on which direction you are going. The vast majority of the front options are going to fall under the Rubi carrier platform
 
So I looked at Mitchell Diffs sight for the 1480 JL shafts and apparently its not drop in. It requires some machining of the knuckles
 
gobi_rubi said:
So I looked at Mitchell Diffs sight for the 1480 JL shafts and apparently its not drop in. It requires some machining of the knuckles
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What kind of machining? Like opening up unit bearing opening or attacking interference with a grinder?
 
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