Is there a JK/JL axle bible?

Any ideas if the carrier from a FJ100 ( 32 spline) will mesh with a JL inner shaft?

Oh and the JL forged inner Cs are beefy. Very similar sized to stock super duty C.
 
Weasel said:
Hmm, nuts. The FJ80 30-spline diffs fits the JK inner shafts.
Click to expand...

The spline angle is slightly different.
iirc, the metric fits in the SAE, but the SAE doesn't fit in the metric.

Back in the 90's/early 2000s, someone was offering a bolt-in 30 spline D60 axle for Toyota mini trucks that took your original Yota shafts.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Fair points.

32sp stubs? Should be pretty tough, I remember Adamwende having great luck with dodge 32sp outters in his 4ws buggies on 42 stickies.

I'd really be curious how these axles would hold up under a lighter rig. Would there realistically be a giant difference between these and dodge outters besides the wieght saving?

No idea on ball joint size or spacing, but I'd imagine BJE's would solve that.
Click to expand...
That does bring up a good question. Dodge D60 axles are pretty cheap. Wonder how the JL/JT inner C, outer knuckle and UB compare in weight to the Dodge parts? Given the size, I cant imagine it is a ton different. Swapping the Dodge 8lug UB to a JL or something else might be an option to get the brakes and pattern desired? Wasnt there a thread indicating a chevy UB would swap, or was that for the d44 sized stuff?
 
Just got off the phone with Mitchell Diff. They also do 1350 based custom axle shafts in 30, 32,and 35 spline up to about 38" long. That length is important to me. Currie lists a 37" maximum. With my 72" wide jk 44. My long side comes 2 just under 37" with the stock locker. However I found someone selling a brand new 35 spline arb for a pretty heavy discount near me. Due to the design of the jk rubi locker it changes the lengths of the shaft where the long side is a bit shorter and the short side is a bit longer than what other lockers would be. With the ARB the long side works be just over 37".

Another thing he answered without me asking is the spline count vs ujoint size pairing. According to him the 1350 is about the same strength as a 32 spline shaft and a 1480 is about the same as a 35 spline. So to me maybe the 1410 never really makes sense but who knows. Putting a rear jk locker in the front would be a pretty reasonable setup

I went down the rabbit whole of considering cutting off my Cs and switching to JL stuff but Im reeling myself in and sticking to the jk stuff. My jku is on 37s. I might go to 38s but im not planning on ever going bigger than that. I am probably in the 450-500 hp range but Ive been as weight conscious as I can be considering the platform, and Im not doing rock bouncing with it. Im thinking the 1350 with 32 or 35 splines would hold up well for me
 
Ya, I mean, given they use about the same size u joint, wieght can't be too different, unless you plan to run the JL aluminum knuckles.

Then you wonder, why not just go 99-04 ford outters :laughing:
 
So I've gotta admit this is getting pretty interesting, especially with those new shafts. I've got a WJ low pinion D30 that I've stiffened the housing on, but haven't put any fancy guts in it because it's low pinion and 27 spline through and through. Building a JL/JT housing (and retubing/deleting the CAD) with nice shafts would be a perfect match to my 35 spline JK44 rear.

You can get a pair of new aftermarket aluminum JL outer knuckles on ebay for under $300 (depending on how much you trust them vs OEM), or Synergy iron knuckles for $400 per, and empty new aftermarket axle housings for $800. Granted you would still need wheel bearings and brakes, but at least around here used takeout JL front axles seem to start at like ~$1500 and only go up from there. So if the materials and manufacturing quality of these aftermarkets aren't awful, it might not be a big deal to skip the donor axle all together. Too bad they don't seem to sell the inner C's on their own though

The idea of the clamping friction of this style of stub shafts making them a bit stronger than a floating shaft is an interesting theory. If that friction does actually provide some torque transmitting, you could almost add some valve lapping compound between those faces to lock them together when the nut is torqued :laughing: (or would that actually work the opposite direction because less surface area being clamped due to grit?). Granted if there is any movement, that means wear because abrasives.
 
A bit of a side tangent for this thread, but some of the latest generations of CV joint + wheel bearing combos actually do come with a face splined connection. No more stub shafts, just a clamping bolt and direct torque transfer

Face_Spline_ges_.jpg
 
AgitatedPancake said:
A bit of a side tangent for this thread, but some of the latest generations of CV joint + wheel bearing combos actually do come with a face splined connection. No more stub shafts, just a clamping bolt and direct torque transfer

Face_Spline_ges_.jpg
Click to expand...

Probably totally fine for 99% of what's sold today. Can't say I'd want it in an actual offroad rig, but probably makes service easier when the stub isn't siezed in the hub.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Probably totally fine for 99% of what's sold today. Can't say I'd want it in an actual offroad rig, but probably makes service easier when the stub isn't siezed in the hub.
Click to expand...

I haven't decided if I love it or hate it yet. If those splines are like 2.5"-3" diameter, it seems like they might do a better job transmitting torque than a ~1.3"-1.5" shaft. But what downsides come with it?
 
AgitatedPancake said:
A bit of a side tangent for this thread, but some of the latest generations of CV joint + wheel bearing combos actually do come with a face splined connection. No more stub shafts, just a clamping bolt and direct torque transfer

Face_Spline_ges_.jpg
Click to expand...
On one hand **** yeah that's awesome.

On the other hand usually people blow up the CV itself. :laughing:

AgitatedPancake said:
I haven't decided if I love it or hate it yet. If those splines are like 2.5"-3" diameter, it seems like they might do a better job transmitting torque than a ~1.3"-1.5" shaft.
Click to expand...
Absolutely.

AgitatedPancake said:
But what downsides come with it?
Click to expand...
$$$
 
arse_sidewards said:
On one hand **** yeah that's awesome.

On the other hand usually people blow up the CV itself. :laughing:


Absolutely.


$$$
Click to expand...


I bet they're cheaper to manufacture than a CV bell with integrated stub shaft, at least in volume. At small specialty scale those face splines probably suck more than regular shaft splines, unless they were actually castellated like a detroit locker or older Spicer hubs
 
AgitatedPancake said:
Rolled splines ftw. Huge difference in blank size, weight, and preprocessing though
Click to expand...
How so? If it fits it ships.

Rolling is dirt dirt cheap because you can roll any diameter you just set the machine so you only need a different tool for each spline spline profile. 30deg, 45, straight, involute, etc.

Set the machine so that you get a whole number of splines based on the diameter. Same math as knurling.
 
I just mean the CV + stub combos we are used to start with a blank that's what, 8"-10" long, forged (I'm assuming? I wouldn't think they start from solid bar) to have the CV bell on one side and the stub on the other side.

Versus the face splined CV, it's like 3" long, and full diameter for the whole part length, so it could probably come straight from bar stock or much smaller forgings that weigh half as much as the stub version
 
gobi_rubi said:
There might be some truth to that but I bet either way the CV is forged to basic dimensions, so having a stub attached or not wouldn't make to much difference. I could be wrong
Click to expand...
YotaAtieToo said:
What he's trying to say is It's a ~7" long blank vs ~4"

Makes a difference when you're building 10s of 1000s
Click to expand...

Yeah the length + total mass are definitely a factor in my thinking, but I also think that if normal CV + stub configs are probably forged near final size, one by one. With the face splined CVs, I wouldn't be surprised if they just forged barstock and sliced pucks off it to create each CV. But I'm speculating, and we're way the fawk off topic so I apologize.

So actually on topic, here's an ebay link to a pair of generic import aluminum JL knuckles for $282, which seems super reasonable:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/126722547812

And here's a 210mm axle housing for $788:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/397145264177
 
AgitatedPancake said:
Yeah the length + total mass are definitely a factor in my thinking, but I also think that if normal CV + stub configs are probably forged near final size, one by one. With the face splined CVs, I wouldn't be surprised if they just forged barstock and sliced pucks off it to create each CV. But I'm speculating, and we're way the fawk off topic so I apologize.
Click to expand...
Yeah I can see that. I'm not sure it actually saves you anything though. You still need to press a "bolt like" thing inn there to provide clamping force. IDK how the cost vs benefit compares. You can heat treat them differently and use different alloys which could be valuable.
 
AgitatedPancake said:
Yeah the length + total mass are definitely a factor in my thinking, but I also think that if normal CV + stub configs are probably forged near final size, one by one. With the face splined CVs, I wouldn't be surprised if they just forged barstock and sliced pucks off it to create each CV. But I'm speculating, and we're way the fawk off topic so I apologize.

So actually on topic, here's an ebay link to a pair of generic import aluminum JL knuckles for $282, which seems super reasonable:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/126722547812

And here's a 210mm axle housing for $788:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/397145264177
Click to expand...

That's not terrible for a housing

The real kicker would be to get with the dealers that replace housing that fail at the cad. My guess is they're either dropping in a new housing complete c to c, or possibly a full roller.
 
My project started as a dealer swap. Someone had a bent tube. They replaced the housing loaded with a new locker and gears. So they reused the outers (knuckles, ub, brakes) and full shafts. It was kinda dumbfounded they would just toss a working locker but it was a score for me
 
Im sure setting up gears is beyond most techs abilities. I just wonder how many of these lockers ended up in a scrapyard that they were charging like $400 for just the actuator at one time. I get its not part of their business model but its sad
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Back Refresh