The 4xFordYota Franken-Fine Axles!

[Bebop]

i think thats it......

See, what happened was, I listened to the internet and I aired down...

 

[chaplinfj60]

since this pic i have added some bars and such, so i estimate 4200 currently

 

[chaplinfj60]

See, what happened was, I listened to the internet and I aired down...

i remember this story..... but the knuckle held....

 

[Bebop]

i remember this story..... but the knuckle held....

This time it did !

Found the buggy weight distribution pic.

That was before the race brakes and with only 5 gal of fuel.

 

[chaplinfj60]

that is a pretty cool device you got there.

 

[Bebop]

that is a pretty cool device you got there.

Borrowed it from a friend.
It's super convenient for sure.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Not carrying a spare on a trail rig is dumb IMO. I have had people make the case that it weighs too much while popping open drinks that they have in an ARB fridge that's sitting above thier sub box and they have all kinds of shit piled on a roof rack.

I've only had to use a spare a few times in near 20 years, most of which was on junk tires. The one time I couldn't have patched it was my fault. Was running notoriously weak tires (bfg km's) and way too low of pressure (I was used to a 2500 lb samurai, not a 5000 lb loaded 4runner and was running 5 psi) it split the sidewall like 4".

Every other tire failure I've been around was pretty easily fixed with plugs.

I do still have the factory spare on myild 4runner just because it's tucked up out of the way and what's 65 lbs more when you're well over 5500

I mean if you are crawling shit that you need to be at the absolute peak of performance or trail breaking in AZ or sand hollow or something I get it, but on a trail rig, dumb.

I will give you that if I can get to the point of driving a built rig 100s of miles to a trail and then back, I'll probably have a spare tire.

I call BS on some of these truck weights people throw out, myself included until recently. I have a fairly simple ext cab Tacoma on 37s, with a full bed, no cage and simple tube bumpers and I figured it was pretty light, but with a 1/4 tank of gas, no tools, no spare and just me in it the truck weighs 4740 as of yesterday at the dump.

I think some people just pull truck weights out of their ass.

I agree "my buddies truck is pretty similar and it's xxxx lbs"

Or they wiegh it totally stripped down and don't realize how much all the shit they pack wieghs. I'd be curious to see a lot of people's trail ready wieght.

 

['84 Bronco II]

My buggy weights 4450lbs.

Me thinks some of y'all are filling your cages with helium or something

It's those god damned 14 bolts under your rig, you should look into 9" centers

 

[YotaAtieToo]

It's those god damned 14 bolts under your rig, you should look into 9" centers

I actually would like to see a comparable 9" vs a comparable 60 wieght. Same tubes, outters, shafts ect. I don't think there is as much difference there as people think. I believe the "omg so light" came from the stock 9" housings.

 

[Bebop]

It's those god damned 14 bolts under your rig, you should look into 9" centers

Give me the money and I'll swap in a heart beat.

/https://data.irate4x4.com/assets/smilies/laughing.gif

I actually would like to see a comparable 9" vs a comparable 60 wieght. Same tubes, outters, shafts ect. I don't think there is as much difference there as people think. I believe the "omg so light" came from the stock 9" housings.

150lbs difference per axle vs a big tubes 14 bolt.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

Give me the money and I'll swap in a heart beat.



150lbs difference per axle vs a big tubes 14 bolt.

With the same size tube on the 9"?

I can see the 14b being quite a bit more than a 9", but I don't think a comparable 60 would be.

Do the high dollar 10" 3rds hold up to rock bouncing type shit?

 

[Bebop]

With the same size tube on the 9"?

I can see the 14b being quite a bit more than a 9", but I don't think a comparable 60 would be.

Do the high dollar 10" 3rds hold up to rock bouncing type shit?

The whole point of going with fabricated axles is so that you can put some lighter shit. If I were to do it I'd go Spidertrax 4" chromo HT housings to save weight.

Maybe ? I don't know / care much about 60s. Except their outers of course.

Yep. GW and TubeWorx both have options that will hold. Big $ though.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

The whole point of going with fabricated axles is so that you can put some lighter shit. If I were to do it I'd go Spidertrax 4" chromo HT housings to save weight.

Maybe ? I don't know / care much about 60s. Except their outers of course.

Yep. GW and TubeWorx both have options that will hold. Big $ though.

When I talked to ecgs a while back, theyade it sound like 10" stuff didn't actually hold up on that side of the country. There was speculation that the KOH guys just change gears out often to avoid failures.

 

[Bebop]

That's speculation and completely wrong.
Tim Cameron has been using GW third members for the past 2 cars (3 years) without any issues. And you'd be hard pressed to find a better test bed than this guy.

A full KOH is probably more driving time than any of the East Coast buggies will see in a lifetime. You have to make sure not to compare apple to oranges. And I will add that a lot of the top teams are stlll not changing gears as often as you'd think. Regular maintenance / fluxing them absolutely. But they would be dumb not to.

ECGS doesn't make money on 10" stuff which is why they aren't pushing it.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

That's speculation and completely wrong.
Tim Cameron has been using GW third members for the past 2 cars (3 years) without any issues. And you'd be hard pressed to find a better test bed than this guy.

A full KOH is probably more driving time than any of the East Coast buggies will see in a lifetime. You have to make sure not to compare apple to oranges. And I will add that a lot of the top teams are stlll not changing gears as often as you'd think. Regular maintenance / fluxing them absolutely. But they would be dumb not to.

ECGS doesn't make money on 10" stuff which is why they aren't pushing it.

I thought TC had only done 1 10" rig and went back to D80s?

High speed through the desert can actually be very abusive on parts. I remember talking to Shrrererer soon after he won for the first time and he said that was a big learning curve. Parts that used to last years, were toast in a single race.

Ecgs does sell a "competition" 9" 3rd, fwiw.

The problem I found with the 9" was that there was a gap between the regular parts and the big boy stuff, in price and strength. Basically you can do a pretty regular 9" nodular iron 3rd, or go full 10". Not much in between. The big difference is the ~$200 gears vs $1200 gears

 

[Bebop]

I thought TC had only done 1 10" rig and went back to D80s?

Not at all.
I think you're confusing with the Torq 14 bolt drop outs.

High speed through the desert can actually be very abusive on parts. I remember talking to Shrrererer soon after he won for the first time and he said that was a big learning curve. Parts that used to last years, were toast in a single race.

Agreed.

Ecgs does sell a "competition" 9" 3rd, fwiw.

9" only and they're not pushing it.

The problem I found with the 9" was that there was a gap between the regular parts and the big boy stuff, in price and strength. Basically you can do a pretty regular 9" nodular iron 3rd, or go full 10". Not much in between. The big difference is the ~$200 gears vs $1200 gears

That's been my point exactly for the past 5 pages.

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

Bringing this thread back to the top, because I know how much yall love it.

Cut the WMS for the rear axle. 72 7/8" wms. Track width will be just under 88" with a 9" wheel and 4.5" bs.

To finish the rear axle, I just need third member flange studs, axle seals, and to make some custom drive slug spacers... apparently I can't find anyone that makes rear axle application drive slugs for the 05+ UBs... checked with BKOR, brannik, and ecgs.

So I got the front axle application from ecgs which comes with brannik slugs. The brannik slugs are too long and cover the snap ring groove in my axles shafts. So I turned the sluggies down .11" and now need to make custom spacers to keep the slugs seated since the ones that came in the kit are now too short.

Once I get the super kingpins, I'll figure out and cut the front wms and start getting that all setup.

Pic of my front and rear 10.5" drop outs with my Uber sexy e lockers just to piss everyone off 😀

 

[Hartmanb1]

No offense taken. I literally spent the last year or so doing research, only to find out in the past week that the 99-04 UBs had a major flaw that got fixed with the 05+ UBs, so now I've been starting the research all over from scratch to use the 05+ UBs.

The BKOR is maybe $700 cheaper and doesn't come with heavily keyed arms... and is still cast steel knuckles. And given how much I probably won't make full use of the Crane magnums, I probably won't make full use of the BKOR knuckle setup either. So why not overdue it? My goal is to drive this rig anywhere I want in the country, wheel whatever I want to, and drive home. That means hitting the plaque line on sledge, or 9s and 10s at sand hollow, then drive it back to california. If I have the money to overbuild it, why wouldn't i??


BKOR does have a better price on that brake kit though... Do you know if they have a bolt on application for rear axle too? Because from what I can search, it looks like they only have a package for the front axle since it connects to the stock oem cast knuckle caliper holes. Whereas the Crane kit is setup for front or rear (as long as you run their weld cups).

So what's the major flaw with the 99-04 ub?

 

[Bebop]

So what's the major flaw with the 99-04 ub?

It's small


Yo 4x4toyotatyler : Where's the progress on this beautiful disaster?

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

It's small


Yo 4x4toyotatyler : Where's the progress on this beautiful disaster?

I need more time in my life lol... rear axle is pretty much done. Finishing the electric parking brake brackets this weekend. Whoever designed the mounting plate on the calipers did a terrible job. The caliper is so leveraged off the axle I think I'm going to have to gusset the bracket more than the regular brake brackets. Other than that, just need seals and to redo the pvc insert that holds the drive slugs in place.

Picking up the super kingpins from Reid Wednesday this week. Then I'll measure and cut the front wms. Then i can order shafts while the suspension is being built.

My coilovers and suspension joints just shipped today/tomorrow. I have all the brackets already.

Hopefully dropping off the rig with orie (83rickybobby on ig) next week to start cutting off the front frame and putting it all together under the rig! I'm hoping that it will all be done for cruise moab mid April.

 

[Bebop]

So what are you doing for shafts ?

 

[RunningProblem]

Did you machine down the ENTIRE slug 0.11"? Stupid question, and obviously too late to change anything, but why didn't you machine down only the area you need for your axle shaft snap ring?

Perhaps you could make a 0.11" spacer with a larger inside diameter to allow you to manipulate the snap ring.

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

So what are you doing for shafts ?

Rears are rcv 300m 36spl to 35spl custom shafts.

Front, I will most likely be doing custom 36spl to 35spl 4340 inner shafts, with brannik 35spl 4340 1480 yokes and 4340 35spl 05+ UB stub shafts. And then either ctm 1480 joints or branik legacy 1480s. Gotta call branik and ask if their 4340 billet yokes are available in 35spl... looks like they only offer it in 40spl on their website.

Found a guy local to norcal that does custom shafts. He said once I get the measurements for the inner front shafts, he can have them cut in 2-3 days.

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

Did you machine down the ENTIRE slug 0.11"? Stupid question, and obviously too late to change anything, but why didn't you machine down only the area you need for your axle shaft snap ring?

Perhaps you could make a 0.11" spacer with a larger inside diameter to allow you to manipulate the snap ring.

I machined down from the end, just far enough to have the snap ring groove show so that I can put the snap ring on.

And ya, a spacer was an idea... I think I'd rather make a new piece of pvc though than have 2 separate spacers in there.

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

Update! Got the rear axle almost all set. Burned in the brake brackets tonight. Out of everything putting together on these things, these stupid electric parking brakes from wilwood have given me the most trouble lol.

Also got in all the suspension brackets from 4wheel underground, and joints and bungs from summit machining.

Also put the front UBs on the Reid super kingpin knuckles, with the rotor, hubs, and brakes... everything is going to go together easy. Just waiting on the cs from Reid.

Just need seals front and rear, and front shafts, and steer arms.

 

[Bebop]

Front, I will most likely be doing custom 36spl to 35spl 4340 inner shafts, with brannik 35spl 4340 1480 yokes and 4340 35spl 05+ UB stub shafts. And then either ctm 1480 joints or branik legacy 1480s. Gotta call branik and ask if their 4340 billet yokes are available in 35spl... looks like they only offer it in 40spl on their website.

You're gonna spend more doing 35sp when 40sp.
Doesn't make sense.

 

[YotaAtieToo]

I thought the whole point of those baller knuckles was to run 1550s?

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

You're gonna spend more doing 35sp when 40sp.
Doesn't make sense.

Finally was able to get branik on the phone (been a while trying). Going with 1550 forged inners, and 1550 forged stubs. 36spl into the dif, 35spl outers. If I ever get to the point of turning this rig into a trailer queen, then I'll do direct drive outers and skip 40spl.

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

I thought the whole point of those baller knuckles was to run 1550s?

Not necessarily. The main point was to have kingpin steer joints, with unit bearings and no spindle. The 1550s were just a bonus. But, I just got off the phone with branik and I'm gonna be doing 1550 since they have forged 1550 blank inners on hand. So lead time won't be bad.

 

[4x4toyotatyler]

Gawt dammm these are sexy