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Tapping large quantity of holes in overhead steel.

MigGunslinger

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May 21, 2020
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I am thinking about dropping some company coin on improving our overhead tapping speed and capability. We have some products that we install that need a lot of 3/8"-16 threads tapped through steel above ceilings.

As of now we drill the steel from the bottom and hand tap all of the holes, some of the guys will get adventurous and chuck the tap in their cordless drill and use the clutch to keep the tap from breaking. When a tap does break, it is above the ceiling so it is a nightmare to fix and changing the location of the fastener is not possible.

I am considering this tapper tool that I saw on fireball tools:
51+YljavgfL._AC_SL1000_.jpg


Any experience with this thing? I like the flexible head and the auto reverse when you pull back.

The only thing that would be better is a cordless option, my guys run Makita and Milwaukee 18v tools but neither seem to offer a dedicated tapping tool. Is there a similar type of device that you can use with a regular cordless drill?

I know that the impact rated combination drill / tap bits have come on the market, my issues with those are again related to the ceiling. Ideally the steel would be no more than 1" above the sheetrock but sometimes we are reaching 4-5" up through a hole just big enough to fit a long extension socket to tighten a jam nut. Those combo bits are usually short and the above tapping tool could fit our 6" pulley taps.

Couple of notes:

1. I am not necessarily looking for the cheapest solution, with the labor cost we have it would not take many broken taps for a $600 tool to pay for itself.
2. This needs to be something that we can use on a platform ladder and not worry about the contractor's safety guy walking in while my installer is doing an impression of a ceiling fan. :homer:
3. Steel thickness would usually be 1/4" - 3/8" max
 
I am thinking about dropping some company coin on improving our overhead tapping speed and capability. We have some products that we install that need a lot of 3/8"-16 threads tapped through steel above ceilings.

As of now we drill the steel from the bottom and hand tap all of the holes, some of the guys will get adventurous and chuck the tap in their cordless drill and use the clutch to keep the tap from breaking. When a tap does break, it is above the ceiling so it is a nightmare to fix and changing the location of the fastener is not possible.

I am considering this tapper tool that I saw on fireball tools:
51+YljavgfL._AC_SL1000_.jpg


Any experience with this thing? I like the flexible head and the auto reverse when you pull back.

The only thing that would be better is a cordless option, my guys run Makita and Milwaukee 18v tools but neither seem to offer a dedicated tapping tool. Is there a similar type of device that you can use with a regular cordless drill?

I know that the impact rated combination drill / tap bits have come on the market, my issues with those are again related to the ceiling. Ideally the steel would be no more than 1" above the sheetrock but sometimes we are reaching 4-5" up through a hole just big enough to fit a long extension socket to tighten a jam nut. Those combo bits are usually short and the above tapping tool could fit our 6" pulley taps.

Couple of notes:

1. I am not necessarily looking for the cheapest solution, with the labor cost we have it would not take many broken taps for a $600 tool to pay for itself.
2. This needs to be something that we can use on a platform ladder and not worry about the contractor's safety guy walking in while my installer is doing an impression of a ceiling fan. :homer:
3. Steel thickness would usually be 1/4" - 3/8" max
Your application seems to be exactly what tool is made for.
Getting the highest quality spiral point taps and that hand tapper and go for it.

Using a flex arm style was my first thought but that is going to be a cluster fuck I think.
 
This looks like a purpose built tool for your purpose.

Looks like with a couple of batteries and a charger the price is comparable.

The matebo does not have the flexible head but it does have the auto reverse. Not sure how I feel about gripping the tap with a standard drill chuck.
 
Looks like with a couple of batteries and a charger the price is comparable.

The matebo does not have the flexible head but it does have the auto reverse. Not sure how I feel about gripping the tap with a standard drill chuck.
I don't like that either, maybe there is more to it than that?
 
Looks like with a couple of batteries and a charger the price is comparable.

The matebo does not have the flexible head but it does have the auto reverse. Not sure how I feel about gripping the tap with a standard drill chuck.

Looks like there's a special chuck for taps. Still a jacobs style grip but it has a square drive hole that actually turns the tap.

1648854153133.png
 
Looks like there's a special chuck for taps. Still a jacobs style grip but it has a square drive hole that actually turns the tap.
Interesting, I wonder how we are supposed to know that size the square is? If I have to buy proprietary taps to fit the square that might be a deal breaker.

Was that a screenshot from a review video? I have looked a few today and most have been youtube tool guy wankery.
 
I have used one of these for a couple of years. I have not used it for 3/8" but mostly 1/4" and smaller. I got one used with a full collet set. It has a planetary gearbox inside and you need to be able to use both hands.

Sorry just looked and it says for up to 5/16
 
Alright, thanks got the matebo cordless tapper coming. If it sucks I’ll take it home and get the champion corded one for the company lol.

I’ll update the thread either way.
 
What you bolt to the ceiling?

Rivet nut an option? Drill hole, install rivet nut via a rivet gun, done….?

Nuts, Open End, 3/8"-16 Interior Thread,.150"-.312" Material Thickness
 
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Hanging and leveling a product using 3/8-16 all thread.

The steel is anywhere between 0”-6” above finished Sheetrock so no way to get a rivet nut in there.

I could tell you what I am hanging it’s not exciting or top secret or anything but we are a niche trade and between my location and that information it would be pretty easy to figure out my company and I talk a lot of shit in GCC political threads.
 
Stripper poles ?

What you bolt to the ceiling?

Rivet nut an option? Drill hole, install rivet nut via a rivet gun, done….?

Nuts, Open End, 3/8"-16 Interior Thread,.150"-.312" Material Thickness
 
Step one is to gain an understanding of why taps break, and learn about the different kinds of taps and where to use which.

Get the right size drills and use a form tap in a good chuck in a battery drill....no more broken taps ever.
 
You mean, access hole can’t be any larger than 3/8”?

3/4” wide access hole would really be pushing it. The product covers the hole but only so wide. The ceilings are finished taped, mudded, and painted. if I can’t cover the hole another trade will have to fix it and I will be backcharged.
 
3/4” wide access hole would really be pushing it. The product covers the hole but only so wide. The ceilings are finished taped, mudded, and painted. if I can’t cover the hole another trade will have to fix it and I will be backcharged.
I'm curious what kind of "structural steel" you're drilling into. If it's the bottoms of steel trusses or beams, how do you know locate to avoid the webbing or angle iron flanges (on trusses)?
 
I'm curious what kind of "structural steel" you're drilling into. If it's the bottoms of steel trusses or beams, how do you know locate to avoid the webbing or angle iron flanges (on trusses)?
The steel is usually angle iron or C channel suspended from the deck above with vertical pieces welded to plates cast into the upper deck. The whole support structure is either welded or bolted together. This is all coordinated before framing even starts and is usually installed by the misc metals sub.

We avoid webbing and flanges by coordinating and field measuring before the ceiling is finished. We used to install the bolts before Sheetrock but my crew would always spend hours trying to clean mud and shit out of the all thread because the guys finishing the ceiling would pull off the tape we wrapped them with. Drilling and tapping after finish also allows us a little more leeway to make small adjustments in the field.

Edit: Obviously, trying to tap into the webbing will break a tap every time. Ask me how I know.
 
We used to install the bolts before Sheetrock but my crew would always spend hours trying to clean mud and shit out of the all thread because the guys finishing the ceiling would pull off the tape we wrapped them with. Drilling and tapping after finish also allows us a little more leeway to make small adjustments in the field.
Sounds like you need to make it clear to the sheetrock sub that they will be back charged if your guys have to clean mud out of the threads because they removed the protective tape that you put on...
Then perhaps a angle grinder with a wire wheel in it to clean the mud off faster
Or perhaps put on covers like this instead of tape:
Or option 3 (assuming that the finished ceiling height is known ahead of time), set a length of all thread with a coupling nut and a lock nut so that the bottom of it is at finished ceiling height and then put a piece of all thread out of it that will stick out below the ceiling to keep the mud out and make sure it doesn't get lost.

Aaron Z
 
Interesting, I wonder how we are supposed to know that size the square is? If I have to buy proprietary taps to fit the square that might be a deal breaker.

Was that a screenshot from a review video? I have looked a few today and most have been youtube tool guy wankery.

Square drive should be consistent on 3/8" taps unless you're buying something really goofy or really Chinese.


Not sure what the drive size actually ins on the chuck though. Doesn't seem like they have different sizes....but it does look about right for your 3/8".

My benchtop hand tapper has different collets with square drives for different size taps. Same concept on the Lisle 3/8" drive tap sockets I use.
 
Square drive should be consistent on 3/8" taps unless you're buying something really goofy or really Chinese.


Not sure what the drive size actually ins on the chuck though. Doesn't seem like they have different sizes....but it does look about right for your 3/8".

My benchtop hand tapper has different collets with square drives for different size taps. Same concept on the Lisle 3/8" drive tap sockets I use.
Agreed on all points, with matebo being German I figure there is a chance it is some eurotrash spec horseshit. We shall see.

Really appreciate all of the input from you guys. I’ll update the thread within a couple of weeks with actual tech.
 
Agreed on all points, with matebo being German I figure there is a chance it is some eurotrash spec horseshit. We shall see.

Really appreciate all of the input from you guys. I’ll update the thread within a couple of weeks with actual tech.
You know it might be a Hitachi tool made in Asia right? All Hitachi tools are now Metabo, nailers, drills, saws everything...

Hitachi Power Tools is Now Metabo HPT
 
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