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lpukas2

lpukas2

Maintains those stupid things that fly
Joined
Jul 8, 2021
Member Number
4166
Messages
118
Loc
Vail, AZ
Well I'm finally getting ready to close on the new house in a few weeks and due to the great rates and only having to put 5% down, get to start planning for a shop. I will be down in Vail Arizona on an acre of land. Most people down here put up prefab metal buildings, being original from Minnesota I'm used to wood structures. What is everyone's opinion on the two with current material prices aside? Looking to put up something around 30x40x14, smallest would be 36x36x14. It will only be used for a shop, no parking. Plan on doing all the electrical, insulation, etc... myself. The only reason I'm not building myself is I don't have trusted bodies to help me.
 
1- when I built my shop the pole building was the best bang for the buck
2- I built it entirely by myself minus one afternoon of help from a 12 yo little brother
3- Your shop isn't nearly big enough, not trying to be snarky, you will out grow that fast
 
Pre-fab metal or metal built on site.

I have no wood experience but it seems to hinder the ceiling height and is a lot more work for the same envelope.
 
The only recommendation I have is height is cheaper than square footage. If you are looking at off-the-shelf building plans, you can get a lot more height for a little more money. Price difference in my area between 40x40x10 and a 40x40x16 seems to be a couple of grand. If you are okay with pallet racks (go buy a cheap forklift, you won't regret it. Even one of the Costco ride behinds, they won't take up much room in the shop.) you can store much vertically. If you are in a hot climate and no AC the extra air space keeps ground-level air cooler. Now, if you need to heat the damn thing height is a problem, but insulate the crap out of the ceiling and buy a pair of uninsulated work overalls.
Being able to go vertical on your storage frees up floor space. I know guys with snowmobiles and jet skis that just strap them to a pallet off-season and put it on the rack. Lawn mowers and snow blowers too.
Of course square footage is great, but if you just can't do a 40x60, look into adding height.
Also, build on a common truss, then you can just take off the back and add length when you outgrow the building.
 
IowaOffRoad said:
The only recommendation I have is height is cheaper than square footage. If you are looking at off-the-shelf building plans, you can get a lot more height for a little more money. Price difference in my area between 40x40x10 and a 40x40x16 seems to be a couple of grand. If you are okay with pallet racks (go buy a cheap forklift, you won't regret it. Even one of the Costco ride behinds, they won't take up much room in the shop.) you can store much vertically. If you are in a hot climate and no AC the extra air space keeps ground-level air cooler. Now, if you need to heat the damn thing height is a problem, but insulate the crap out of the ceiling and buy a pair of uninsulated work overalls.
Being able to go vertical on your storage frees up floor space. I know guys with snowmobiles and jet skis that just strap them to a pallet off-season and put it on the rack. Lawn mowers and snow blowers too.
Of course square footage is great, but if you just can't do a 40x60, look into adding height.
Also, build on a common truss, then you can just take off the back and add length when you outgrow the building.
Click to expand...
All excellent points.

We call them light and heavy end walls but common truss might be the correct term.
A light end wall is made of purlins and light materials to support the wall/roof where as a heavy end wall is made with a I-Beam truss like the center bay and allows the wall sheets to be taken off and the building extended with no loss of materials.
 
Prickly bylaws and building dept ruled out steel for me. Built with wood and wrapped the whole thing in metal.
 
I'm sort of in the same boat. People have me convinced with metal.
 
CarterKraft said:
All excellent points.

We call them light and heavy end walls but common truss might be the correct term.
A light end wall is made of purlins and light materials to support the wall/roof where as a heavy end wall is made with a I-Beam truss like the center bay and allows the wall sheets to be taken off and the building extended with no loss of materials.
Click to expand...
I was using common English, not job-specific english :laughing:. I meant to say common span trusses, something that's readily available. Some builders spec a stupid span to tie you to them. Though, I hadn't thought of using a load-bearing truss for the end. That's a great idea :beer:. Probably worth the time to add purlins for the steel to screw to for an easier time adding on later.

OP do it this^ way. Build as much building as you can afford and lay the groundwork for future expansion.
 
I was in Phoenix and Bunger Steel Buildings in pheonix did my building BUT with the crazy metal prices AND lead times now it's gonna be more than double what it was a year ago atleast. and my 10 week lead time years ago is more like 6 months now.
 
Steel, and you can do it yourself to avoid lead times. Just knowing it won't burn down is reason enough. Check out my canopy build thread for ideas, it's close to the size you want. Simple and cheap.
 
^this, but be careful who you get the building from if you go this way. I've known a few people that were told 'delivery in 2 weeks' for over a year. Then when they got it holes were drilled wrong and pieces were missing.
 
SomeGuyFromOlympia said:
1- when I built my shop the pole building was the best bang for the buck
2- I built it entirely by myself minus one afternoon of help from a 12 yo little brother
3- Your shop isn't nearly big enough, not trying to be snarky, you will out grow that fast
Click to expand...
Ill have to read up more on pole buildings but aren't the posts set into the ground?
IowaOffRoad said:
The only recommendation I have is height is cheaper than square footage. If you are looking at off-the-shelf building plans, you can get a lot more height for a little more money. Price difference in my area between 40x40x10 and a 40x40x16 seems to be a couple of grand. If you are okay with pallet racks (go buy a cheap forklift, you won't regret it. Even one of the Costco ride behinds, they won't take up much room in the shop.) you can store much vertically. If you are in a hot climate and no AC the extra air space keeps ground-level air cooler. Now, if you need to heat the damn thing height is a problem, but insulate the crap out of the ceiling and buy a pair of uninsulated work overalls.
Being able to go vertical on your storage frees up floor space. I know guys with snowmobiles and jet skis that just strap them to a pallet off-season and put it on the rack. Lawn mowers and snow blowers too.
Of course square footage is great, but if you just can't do a 40x60, look into adding height.
Also, build on a common truss, then you can just take off the back and add length when you outgrow the building.
Click to expand...
Some good points here!

I looked up the prices of prefab 30x40x14 yesterday and they have gone up 10k:eek:. I knew steel went up but damn!
 
If you're finishing out the inside, just build wood in the first place rather than doing a structure out and then still framing the inside.

Two foot concrete stem walls and then 12 foot studs give you a solid 14 foot internal height, enough for most lifts and other shenanigans. Storage trusses if you want extra space up in the rafters.
 
Dethmachinefab said:
Steel, and you can do it yourself to avoid lead times. Just knowing it won't burn down is reason enough. Check out my canopy build thread for ideas, it's close to the size you want. Simple and cheap.
Click to expand...

The problem with doing that is getting it permitted since most places want engineered plans and that wouldn't happen if you built it yourself
 
TTMotorsports said:
The problem with doing that is getting it permitted since most places want engineered plans and that wouldn't happen if you built it yourself
Click to expand...

I had an architect work with me on mine, so it's got a set of prints. Something simple like that cost should be minimal, can save you money in sizing steel properly and avoiding mistakes.
 
I went 16ft walls on my last shop and it was awesome to have 12ft pallet racking with a $1000 forklift I got online. I also knew how far in I would put the lifts so I had concrete guys make a 18" wide 8" deep row for the 2 lifts to go if I wanted some in the future, which I quickly added since I hate working under a vehicle when it's not on a lift now. Also with 16ft eves 2 4x8 sheet of wood for interior wall fit perfect height wise with the roof insulation to not have to cut them shorter at all.
 
IowaOffRoad said:
Now, if you need to heat the damn thing height is a problem, but insulate the crap out of the ceiling and buy a pair of uninsulated work overalls.
Click to expand...

Insulate the crap out of the ceiling even if you're in a/c territory rather than heating territory. The insulation will keep the heat out as well as keeping it in - and go for a light colored roof if you're in a/c territory.
 
I know its not the cheapest, but my building is ICF.. Its pretty popular in colder climates, but I have to admit that I enjoy this shop space more during the summer than the winter. Its been in the 90s every day the past week and right now, in my shop space that is not conditioned by any source, not even a dehumidifier, its 74 degrees in there, and I have had the shop door wide open 2 days ago. The concrete slab and level of insulation just keep it totally comfortable in there. During the winter it never drops below 50, even when it was in the teens a few nights in a row and highs around 30F. The strips imbedded into the SIP blocks make attaching things super easy. The concrete walls make attaching structural things really nice as well, such as my way overkill storage racks that hang from the walls.
Again, its not going to be the cheapest option, but if you find yourself space limited, spend the difference on quality.
Also agreed, the taller the walls the better in most any application.

Ohh, if you go the pole barn route (I designed on for my old place before I moved but it never got built), look into the foundations where you drill a hole and pour a pier, then sink a steel bracket to set your posts on. That way its an engineered foundation and a LOT of municipalities and states will totally go for that vs a regular pole barn. Most gov entities when they see "pole barn" they think of a machinery shed on a farm with telephone poles sank into the dirt. I was then using steel pre-fab trusses, timber purlins, and metal roof sheet to frame out mine. Still have the posts and the trusses.
 
AlxJ64 said:
I know its not the cheapest, but my building is ICF.. Its pretty popular in colder climates, but I have to admit that I enjoy this shop space more during the summer than the winter. Its been in the 90s every day the past week and right now, in my shop space that is not conditioned by any source, not even a dehumidifier, its 74 degrees in there, and I have had the shop door wide open 2 days ago. The concrete slab and level of insulation just keep it totally comfortable in there. During the winter it never drops below 50, even when it was in the teens a few nights in a row and highs around 30F. The strips imbedded into the SIP blocks make attaching things super easy. The concrete walls make attaching structural things really nice as well, such as my way overkill storage racks that hang from the walls.
Again, its not going to be the cheapest option, but if you find yourself space limited, spend the difference on quality.
Also agreed, the taller the walls the better in most any application.

Ohh, if you go the pole barn route (I designed on for my old place before I moved but it never got built), look into the foundations where you drill a hole and pour a pier, then sink a steel bracket to set your posts on. That way its an engineered foundation and a LOT of municipalities and states will totally go for that vs a regular pole barn. Most gov entities when they see "pole barn" they think of a machinery shed on a farm with telephone poles sank into the dirt. I was then using steel pre-fab trusses, timber purlins, and metal roof sheet to frame out mine. Still have the posts and the trusses.
Click to expand...
Never thought of doing a shop with that stuff and that would keep it cooler in the summer. I did build a foundation out of that stuff years ago in MN
 
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