Project Siclone

[ProjectTwin]

Turn the whole vehicle into a 6th order bandpass

In my head, that's what I'm imagining. Remove rearr seats, cut out entire floor from front seats to rear door, reinforce everything, build a panel of 2 walls and a new floor to separate the cone from the driver's, make it all swoopy and shit with pretty colors, replace windows with sheet metal and black paint.

Park in front of congress during budget negotiations

I’ll have to draw up the plan. I told Provience and the guys about it at the meet.

Imagine a five-sided box in the vehicle that takes up everything from the rear hatch to the B-pillars.

When you open the hatch there’s an acrylic wall there that is the back of the enclosure. Then there’s top/bottom and left/right enclosure walls. You’ll see two vertical walls towards the center of the enclosure as well that divides the enclosure into three chambers.

Move into the cabin and those two vertical walls in the center are X distance apart from one another. On each vertical wall four 24s will mount. Two deep, two tall. The 24s on each wall will be mounted dual-opposed, with the cones facing one another into that common center chamber.

Last, that common center chamber will have an acrylic window on the cabin side that seals that chamber off from the cabin of the vehicle. The bottom of that chamber is cut out and open to the environment.

This creates two left/right sections of the enclosure that are cabin space and one center section that is outside air.

The LARGE majority of the “enclosure” is just to contain pressure and direct it forward into the cabin in front of the B-pillar.

That common center section is just a slightly complicated IB baffle.

Having the subs mounted dual opposed eliminates vibration that would be induced by all of the moving mass. Since each set of four subs will be moving in opposite directions, the effect of their moving mass is cancelled out and you’re left with pressure and sound.

 

[ProjectTwin]

When I drove it home the high beams were on when low beam was selected at the stalk. Switching to high beams turned the low beams on in conjunction with the highs.

It was the LED bulbs the PO had installed, but I swapped in new headlights and added fogs.

Looks better.

 

[ThePanzerFuhrer]

It's just kind of frustrating to post/share info and people always find something to bitch about.



It's not. It's just going to take a while to make it happen. Too many things happening and I can only do so much.

Don’t worry about it and just keep on doing what you do. They are just jealous/don’t have the skills to do what you do.


I had it pictured just as you have stated above. In my head I was picturing motors together in the environmental chamber and cones in the car.

Will you lose spl by having it motor side into the car, because of the % loss of cone area do to the motor? I’m just a dumb rock breaker so sorry for the stupid questions.

 

[Romogo]

I don't know shit about fuck when it comes to this stuff, but I am very interested in your builds. Keep up the good work!

 

[DWT]

Those are the same headlights I put in the ex's car. The low beam projectors are decent but what a prick to adjust.

The high/low issue is probably due to most Toyotas switching ground NOT power for headlights. Check the plug it probably has a constant hot and two grounds that switch back and forth. It's been too long since I messed with her car to remember WTF I had to do to make it work.

 

[2big bronco]

Are keeping the side windows in 1 piece and still attached to the vehicle a concerne with the subs facing out?

 

[ProjectTwin]

Don’t worry about it and just keep on doing what you do. They are just jealous/don’t have the skills to do what you do.


I had it pictured just as you have stated above. In my head I was picturing motors together in the environmental chamber and cones in the car.

Will you lose spl by having it motor side into the car, because of the % loss of cone area do to the motor? I’m just a dumb rock breaker so sorry for the stupid questions.

Having the motors together increases the width of that chamber which MAY make the side chambers so narrow that I can't load the subs in from the left/right chambers. I can have the subs built two ways - one where I can face mount them, the other where I mount them conventionally like in the Audi. I'd rather mount them conventionally and have the nice appearance with the surround clamps vs having them built for face mount without the clamps and end up in a situation where I want to have the clamps. I could still use them but they'd just be cosmetic at that point.

If I put the motors in the two chambers that are part of the cabin space that means my center chamber width needs to be the mounting depth of the sub plus a couple of inches to account for having one sub loaded while loading the opposing sub.

Since the left/right chambers are cabin space, shrinking the left and right "chamber" volume by increasing the width of the center chamber decreases overall cabin volume - which increases SPL. With the level of overkill I'll have with cone area and excursion, it really won't matter which way the sub are oriented as far as output. I haven't measured SPL in a vehicle with a sub mounted in both orientations, but any change should be miniscule.

Since I plan on driving the thing it makes sense to have the center chamber house the cones and have the motors on the left/right. That way I can actually see behind me with the rearview instead of needing to install a rearview camera that's always on and having a rearview camera that's a monitor.

I don't know shit about fuck when it comes to this stuff, but I am very interested in your builds. Keep up the good work!

Thanks. Will do.

Those are the same headlights I put in the ex's car. The low beam projectors are decent but what a prick to adjust.

The high/low issue is probably due to most Toyotas switching ground NOT power for headlights. Check the plug it probably has a constant hot and two grounds that switch back and forth. It's been too long since I messed with her car to remember WTF I had to do to make it work.

The high/low was the LEDs they had in for bulbs.

Are keeping the side windows in 1 piece and still attached to the vehicle a concerne with the subs facing out?

No. There will be left/right/top/bottom external walls for the "enclosure" behind the B-pillar. The bottom of the common center chamber will be cut out and vented to the environment.

That leaves to "chambers" on the left/right sides of the center chamber that are part of the cabin space.

All acoustic energy/pressure will be playing into the cabin from the B-pillar forward. No pressure exerted on the rear hatch, rear side windows, or rear doors/windows. I'm actually thinking about removing the rear side glass, rear door glass, and welding the rear doors and all of the side window openings shut and making it a 2-door van.

Acoustically, it'll be like having a 2-door pickup with 8 24s.

 

[ProjectTwin]

Yanked the rear seat and ran the Shop-Vac over everything behind the front seats all the way to the cargo area.

Stuffed a Limitless Lithium Cyber 12k under the rear seat. With the one under the seat I laid out some tape and, with the one under the seat, found I can fit two more of them in the passenger rear footwell for a total of three. When combined with a good alternator, I should have plenty of power on hand for the SALT-12.

Also got out a couple of 24" baskets to help mock things up and get a clearer plan of attack.

This is the think, design, re-think phase that takes for-fucking-ever.

From this point forward I'll be without a rear seat.

 

[ProjectTwin]

Mostly stripped.

Stripped well enough for me to be able to start mock-up.

Need to get a small 3-gallon tank to go under the thing. This pancake tank in the cargo area blows.

 

[bigun]

That's a fuel tank I thought it was a prototype nuclear reactor

 

[vetteboy79]

That's a fuel tank I thought it was a prototype nuclear reactor

Air tank for the bag system.

 

[plym49.2]

When too much is not enough.

 

[bigun]

Air tank for the bag system.

 

[Hooligan]

You need to weigh this before and after.

 

[bdkw1]

Small, boxy, lots of speakers, been done.

 

[ProjectTwin]

Small, boxy, lots of speakers, been done.

Alma.

 

[Java230]

This should be fun.... I know almost nothing about audio. But sometimes I miss my Zapco and 12's from my old Audi too.

 

[bdkw1]

Alma.

I liked to original PPI version. I had one of the amps from it when they switched. Then some fucking tweeker stole it and the sub out of my Bronco.

 

[xr-nut]

I should have plenty of power on hand for the SALT-12.

 

[Saloon65]

Needs more triangulation.

 

[plym49.2]

I am having trouble visualizing it. The speakers are inside, outside, motors, five-sided wall, circles and arrows.

Please just post a sketch or get the hell working on it, already, dammit!

 

[budget76]

8 of those, in there, is going to be Love the pic of just the baskets sitting behind, really gives a sense of the ridiculousness of the cone area you're squeezing into that shoebox

 

[ProjectTwin]

I am having trouble visualizing it. The speakers are inside, outside, motors, five-sided wall, circles and arrows.

Please just post a sketch or get the hell working on it, already, dammit!

Have gone through several design ideas. The 5-sided enclosure with the two vertical walls wouldn't give me enough surface area under the car for each pair of four 24s (four per wall) to vent to the exterior of the vehicle.

I'm now noodling an idea that's a split V setup while I work on other stuff.

Stripping it down and doing some piecemeal sound treatment right now. Started applying some Second Skin to the roof above the front two seats a little while ago. Once that's wrapped up I'll be making templates of that area so I can bond some plywood into all of the areas between the roof supports to reinforce the whole roof. Another layer of ply will go on over those. Basically going to build the roof first then work on sound treatment of the rear quarters and get the thing ready for side walls to go in. Roof strength will be important for two reasons - the pressure it'll be generating and the amp (see below) that'll be mounted to the roof.

It's a big project, but I'm basically just building a big sub enclosure that fits the vehicle. No worries about air space requirements, just physical packaging. In that sense, it's easy.

I also need to make a template for the amplifier so I can weld up the mount that will allow me to attach it to the roof.
Oh...the amplifier.

I know I mentioned before what was going it, but this picture is a better representation of the thing.

This 40+lb monstrosity is what's going on the roof between driver and passenger.

Overall length is about 39 1/2" and it's about 10" wide.

There will be a decent amount of metal work to make sure that shit doesn't come down from the roof. I want to create a lot of surface area at the attachment points for the roof braces and windshield brace.

8 of those, in there, is going to be Love the pic of just the baskets sitting behind, really gives a sense of the ridiculousness of the cone area you're squeezing into that shoebox

It's a build where I won't even have to try to be loud. It'll be effortless.

Take a look at the pic above of the amp that'll be the overhead console.

Nothing about the sub portion of this build is small. Big subs, big power, small vehicle.

Looking forward to the pallets of subs arriving. That'll be a fun video and having all eight on hand will really give a good visual of the absurdity of the whole thing.

 

[ProjectTwin]

Since the Siclone and the Bucs van will be sharing a lot of the same build processes I'm going to be tag-teaming them and going through a few of the initial build stages at the same time.

Namely putting a SALT-12 in the roof of both vehicles.

Mounting an amp that weighs over 40lbs to the roof of a vehicle presents a bit of a safety issue if things aren't built right.

Both vehicles can use the same basic amp mount, but I want to get everything sorted to make sure it's 100% safe for Will and his family. Lots of surface area for the brackets/welds to the roof supports and plenty of roof reinforcement to not only make them strong for amp mounting, but also able to deal with the SPL both vehicles will be generating with the 24s.

The roof of Will's van is fully deadened, so I just need to get an amp mount built for the Siclone, mount the amp, and get some road miles on it.
Basically using it as a test mule to make sure the Bucs van is safe.

If the amp mount somehow fails (which I seriously doubt), I’d rather it fail in my vehicle

Stripped the factory jute insulation from the roof skin and bonded the roof supports to the roof skin with Loctite PL Max.

A knuckle knock/fist bang test is already showing an audible difference in roof reverberation/resonance with the supports bonded to the skin. You’ll see that in an upcoming video.

I still have to do some final clean-up of the roof skin on the rear sections, but I did get a little ahead of myself and apply two sheets of Second Skin’s Damplifier Pro up front. I’ll clean the rest of the roof skin and get Damplifier Pro installed when the PL Max is cured.

 

[ProjectTwin]

I should probably drop this here.

I think a 2-door van would be

 

[plym49.2]

Since the Siclone and the Bucs van will be sharing a lot of the same build processes I'm going to be tag-teaming them and going through a few of the initial build stages at the same time.

Namely putting a SALT-12 in the roof of both vehicles.

Mounting an amp that weighs over 40lbs to the roof of a vehicle presents a bit of a safety issue if things aren't built right.

Both vehicles can use the same basic amp mount, but I want to get everything sorted to make sure it's 100% safe for Will and his family. Lots of surface area for the brackets/welds to the roof supports and plenty of roof reinforcement to not only make them strong for amp mounting, but also able to deal with the SPL both vehicles will be generating with the 24s.

The roof of Will's van is fully deadened, so I just need to get an amp mount built for the Siclone, mount the amp, and get some road miles on it.
Basically using it as a test mule to make sure the Bucs van is safe.

If the amp mount somehow fails (which I seriously doubt), I’d rather it fail in my vehicle

Stripped the factory jute insulation from the roof skin and bonded the roof supports to the roof skin with Loctite PL Max.

A knuckle knock/fist bang test is already showing an audible difference in roof reverberation/resonance with the supports bonded to the skin. You’ll see that in an upcoming video.

I still have to do some final clean-up of the roof skin on the rear sections, but I did get a little ahead of myself and apply two sheets of Second Skin’s Damplifier Pro up front. I’ll clean the rest of the roof skin and get Damplifier Pro installed when the PL Max is cured.

You just squirt the PL in between? And the factory uses cardboard egg crates up top?

 

[ProjectTwin]

You just squirt the PL in between? And the factory uses cardboard egg crates up top?

Yeah, shooting PL in on both sides of those roof supports. Basically filling the gaps where they should meet.


Factory stuff I took down was a jute type material.

 

[Gregj50!!!!!]

How/where will it vent outside???
Out the side, bottom….


Maybe a cool chrome diesel style exhaust stack out the top????

 

[ProjectTwin]

How/where will it vent outside???
Out the side, bottom….


Maybe a cool chrome diesel style exhaust stack out the top????

The fuel tank on these things is under the rear seat.


Aside from the EVAP canister, there's nothing under the floor of the rear cargo area.

I can cut that out and put in a grid to attach the hydrophobic mesh and other materials.

 

[swtfman]

I looked at the SALT-12 specs and found it calls for a 2000A fuse on the power input

So how do you accomplish that? A short run of 12AWG as a "fuse"?