ORI Struts in Ultra 4 and Similar?

KrisKYK

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It seems like coilovers and bypasses are definitely the way to go but it seems like every now and then you see a couple go fast rigs running ORI Struts but not much conversation around them or how they worked out?


Just wondering if it's one of those things that looks good on paper but never really ends up working and switching to coilovers and bypass shocks?
 
"Go fast rigs" do not run ORIs.

Discuss.
 
I would add that they are starting to be more popular in the UTV and Formula Offroad crowd as well
 
They offer them with reservoirs now, but they still only have a 2" piston and a 1.75" shaft which cuts down on their damping ability compared to larger conventional shocks. You can't fine tune the dampening for different zones in the travel like you can with bypasses either.
 
Has anyone one run ORI Struts instead of coilovers but with bypass shocks?
 
I was under the impression that the benefits are more about they don't unload like coilovers and more stability?


Just like when you run coilovers with bypasses often times they remove the dampening or run a much smaller coilover and let the bypass do the dampening work in this case it would be an Ori strut and just using it for his dynamic spring capabilities
 
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how much is unloading coilovers a concern on a high speed rig? I'm not sold on the more stability claim, but sure, maybe.
 
how much is unloading coilovers a concern on a high speed rig? I'm not sold on the more stability claim, but sure, maybe.


Pretty sure you want things to unload at high speeds within reason. slow speeds is where you want things to not unload and more stability.


From what I've read on ORIs, they have velocity sensing to unload a high speeds but not to at low speeds

Supposedly ORI have built in, bump stops, possibility to adjust spring rates via pressure change, etc ...

This might make a lot of sense for what I'm doing which is kind do it all rig
 
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Not having zones just makes ORIs crap if you want to tune them for high speed with high travel compared to anything with bypass zones.

The integrated bump stop is nice but everyone racing is running air bumps anyway.

They're a nice well rounded easy to set up solution for trail rigs and weekend warriors but they guys who want to race competitively just need more flexibility than the design provides.

Did ORI ever solve the hydro-locking thing that someone on the old board was fighting?
 
It seems like coilovers and bypasses are definitely the way to go but it seems like every now and then you see a couple go fast rigs running ORI Struts but not much conversation around them or how they worked out?


Just wondering if it's one of those things that looks good on paper but never really ends up working and switching to coilovers and bypass shocks?

ORI and go fast? Nope.

ive seen them work well on a trail bouncer and crawlers. But nothing that builds heat or requires precision tuning.

they are a good slow speed option because of their size and bump stop
 
I was under the impression that the benefits are more about they don't unload like coilovers and more stability?


Just like when you run coilovers with bypasses often times they remove the dampening or run a much smaller coilover and let the bypass do the dampening work in this case it would be an Ori strut and just using it for his dynamic spring capabilities

You actually tune the unloading aspect with them. You could drop a tire of a ledge and the rig will level itself back out 2-3 seconds later, not that one wants that but that's what you're tuning around. It took a bit of effort to get a buddy's rig to drop a tire and level out fairly equal and quick. I can't imagine the effort to make response times fast enough for a competitive racer but I could be wrong.

While you could go fast in them long term speed may become an issue with heat buildup. Ori's had that issue early on and fixed it with the external res. But I've yet to read how far that allowed them to be pushed and for how long. I would personally call them the best air shock available and a better option than a cheap coilover but I personally wouldn't throw them into a ring with kings and bypasses.

They do have a 1,900lb weight capacity so I'd assume the lower you come to that weight the more you'd be able to get away with.

You mentioned an all around rig you're building, I'm in the process of collecting parts to do the same (axles are all that's left) and I'll be using 16" ori's on all 4 corners, 4link. You could go fast with them so if you're not racing all day you'll be fine. They make quick work of setting up, they are compact and put on paper you don't need to buy sway bars, bumps, or limiting straps so the cost of them truly isn't all that bad.

You could run duals on each corner and tune them to work together and probably be fine but at 2k+ a corner other options will start seeming to make more sense.

The thing that contradicts all the speed issues people discuss with ori's are the amount of guys in my area that run them on SxS's in the 8"-10" range (not even sure if they have res at that size) and they tend to run the trails faster than trail rigs. And I'm not in dune land, the SxS in my terrain are cycling their suspension everywhere.
 
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What makes you say that?

the premise of ORIs is to put air chambers at war with each other, with little to no control over the dampening characteristics. my observation is that people use them as a band aid for garbage geometry.
 
The thing that contradicts all the speed issues people discuss with ori's are the amount of guys in my area that run them on SxS's in the 8"-10" range (not even sure if they have res at that size) and they tend to run the trails faster than trail rigs. And I'm not in dune land, the SxS in my terrain are cycling their suspension everywhere.

The biggest thing I remember from when a bunch of crawling guys tried to start going fast on ORI's is that we could never get them to drop out fast enough and they'd end up packing in the whoops. If you did manage to get the rebound fast enough you lost all the stability stuff and the spring rate got wonky so you'd end up having to run swaybars and bumps anyway and lose all the packaging advantage.

A SxS running an 8"-10" travel on an A-arm with 1:2? 1.5:2? motion ratio is going to have an easier time dropping out than a solid axle rig with a 16" ORI on the axle at 1:1. Does that mean you could run them on a trailing arm on a fullsize rig? Maybe, but while you'd be gaining an advantage in rebound, I have a feeling there would be tradeoffs in other areas.

I agree that they are a pretty good solution for a weekend rig doing crawly type stuff, and where 'go fast' is mostly dirt roads, but there is a reason why basically no Ultra4 teams use them now.

A couple other side things...generally a bad idea to have your bumpstop act on the same pair of bolts that hold your rig up. We took many bent bolts out of those ORI rigs trying to go fast. Also we had a couple instances where they unscrewed internally during a race and they don't work so well as a limit strap when that happens.

So for a race rig, where I'd still want a separate bump stop and limit strap...the advantages start to go away quickly.
 
Thank you all this is all very helpful
Also also doesn't look like they have any major level of tuning support whereas with coilovers and bypasses there are a number of shops and teams available for tuning sessions
 
Rock bouncer on ORIs, interesting.
50809324197_df1052cdc6_b.jpg
 
Just finished U4 nationals on ORIs on an IFS and trailing arm car, Kevin Taylor and Heath Day also finished on ORI in the same event. They worked great. Here is a video of us getting the checkered flag.
 

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Just finished U4 nationals on ORIs on an IFS and trailing arm car, Kevin Taylor and Heath Day also finished on ORI in the same event. They worked great. Here is a video of us getting the checkered flag.
Specs plans and goals? I looked at it before the race, was curious how the rear worked with 2 per corner. Equal valving in both? All compression in one and all rebound in the other? One do most the suspending and the other handle most the damping?

Congrats on the first finish in a new to you car.
 
I went back and forth on ORI's or a traditional coilover for my Tacoma that mostly sees SE wheeling. I don't doubt that the ORI's would have worked well for me but ORI's lead time has been iffy at best pre-covid, coupled with worries about parts availability years down the line and the ability to rebuild them myself was enough to push me into a traditional coilover.
 
H

Specs plans and goals? I looked at it before the race, was curious how the rear worked with 2 per corner. Equal valving in both? All compression in one and all rebound in the other? One do most the suspending and the other handle most the damping?

Congrats on the first finish in a new to you car.
The rear was experimental. The reservoir struts were carrying most of the load, the STX strut was only partially pressurized for a little additional support. The bumps that were already on the car were completely depressurized so they were not doing anything. They are both set up to compress and rebound as normal.
 
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