JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
I have a couple infrared heaters in it now. Don't use them much because there's still a bunch of openings in the bus that allow air to flow through. Makes just about any heater useless with as much wind as we get.
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MCI 102-C3 coach to RV - General/Floorplan
- Thread starter JNHEscher
- Start date
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Fantastic weather today. Got out to put most of my friend's car back together and get another floor sheet in the bus. That was the tenth sheet. The top of the eleventh sheet is around 75% stripped already. Should be able to flip it tomorrow.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Kinda putting off the bus some more. Another strong blizzard today and we're off to OKC on Saturday. I have a drop of 14 gauge to finish off the back of the floor with and another sheet is ready to pull out of the tray. Just waiting on this high wind and precip to go away. Every time I think about slapping together some temporary shelter for the bus, the weather clears up. Might have to buck up and get it done. Got a truck to haul the lumber with now.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Flushed the vinegar tray yesterday. Pulled the wind-shredded tarp off to see it mostly dried up with orange sludge at the bottom. Time away from home and blizzards took a toll. The rust is all cleared off now and one side of the drop is stripped. Should be getting around to cutting the drop and tacking it tomorrow.
The weather is going to be pretty nice for a while, aside from a few bursts of high wind and snow. Uncovered the rear of the bus to get back on the floor. Marked and cut the excess where l didn't measure correctly before. Got all those edges prepped for welding.
I'm at one of those stupid places where I'm torn on which to do first -
Burn in the floor sheets, or tack all the washers?
If I burn in the sheets, the weld penetration maps out every support beneath the steel sheets, which gives me the perfect visual for washer placement so that the washer bores land where I want them to. I'll be using wheel studs to press through the washers from underneath for walls and such to fasten to and would like the studs to pass through the floor support structures.
If I tack washers down where they are placed over top of where floor sheet welds would be, the weld penetration from burning the sheets in will also penetrate into the washers a bit, adding a tiny bit of strength and eliminating the need for me to grind down any of the penetration high spots prior to tacking washers down.
Like I said, dumb conundrum.
I bought a pack of rectangular neodymium magnets a while back to lay out the floorplan. Most people use masking tape on the plywood floor. We have oiled steel. Magnets and elastic string make for some relatively infinite adjustability. Me like.
The weather is going to be pretty nice for a while, aside from a few bursts of high wind and snow. Uncovered the rear of the bus to get back on the floor. Marked and cut the excess where l didn't measure correctly before. Got all those edges prepped for welding.
I'm at one of those stupid places where I'm torn on which to do first -
Burn in the floor sheets, or tack all the washers?
If I burn in the sheets, the weld penetration maps out every support beneath the steel sheets, which gives me the perfect visual for washer placement so that the washer bores land where I want them to. I'll be using wheel studs to press through the washers from underneath for walls and such to fasten to and would like the studs to pass through the floor support structures.
If I tack washers down where they are placed over top of where floor sheet welds would be, the weld penetration from burning the sheets in will also penetrate into the washers a bit, adding a tiny bit of strength and eliminating the need for me to grind down any of the penetration high spots prior to tacking washers down.
Like I said, dumb conundrum.
I bought a pack of rectangular neodymium magnets a while back to lay out the floorplan. Most people use masking tape on the plywood floor. We have oiled steel. Magnets and elastic string make for some relatively infinite adjustability. Me like.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
bigun said:
Will you need the extra strength that welding on the washers first might give you?
Definitely not, since both the sheets and washers will be fully welded anyway, hence the notion is an overthought. More of a contemplation about what might make for a smoother assembly. Wife and I will be marking off the floorplan to see where walls and appliances land before any further welding takes place.Will you need the extra strength that welding on the washers first might give you?
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Java said:
Floor first. Seeing the members will make placing washers much easier.
And a welded floor will have a lot more stability. Got to thinking about it when I woke up. How often are the washers really going to cross over floor welds? And even if they do, they're only a fraction of the total area.Floor first. Seeing the members will make placing washers much easier.
Floor first. But before that, I'm going to finish tacking in the first layer and start shoving in the PVC conduits so that I can mark where to cut holes for the conduit stubs. Those big washers will get tacked first because they have to go where the conduits land them.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Almost there. The last two sheet sections are ready to tack. Got another full sheet pulled out of the tray, oiled, and shoved into the bus.
I think I'll either start TIG welding the floor seams up or my wife and I will start shoving conduits in tomorrow. I'm going to look at cutting a notch in the fiberglass nose so that the PVC has a straight shot into the center chase. I have a post in here somewhere that shows where I cut out some bracing where the HVAC stuff used to be that would allow us to feed a full length of PVC towards the front and then slip it along the chase. May still play with that.
I think I'll either start TIG welding the floor seams up or my wife and I will start shoving conduits in tomorrow. I'm going to look at cutting a notch in the fiberglass nose so that the PVC has a straight shot into the center chase. I have a post in here somewhere that shows where I cut out some bracing where the HVAC stuff used to be that would allow us to feed a full length of PVC towards the front and then slip it along the chase. May still play with that.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Java said:
Why tig the whole floor? Unless you enjoy punishment?
Just look at this build. I live for punishment Why tig the whole floor? Unless you enjoy punishment?
For the purpose of flexibility and sealing, tig is my way to go. Love tig anyway. The ESAB welder has been pretty badass in terms of what it can do in such as small package. Although, the mig portion needs some work. The mig welds can have the tiniest bit of porosity and the heat can warp more. I can flow tig far easier and ensure a much higher chance of a leak-free floor.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Java said,
I get its easier to be leak free with tig, but it has to take 10x as long.... Are you planning seam sealer of any kind?
JNHEscher said:
Just look at this build. I live for punishment
For the purpose of flexibility and sealing, tig is my way to go. Love tig anyway. The ESAB welder has been pretty badass in terms of what it can do in such as small package. Although, the mig portion needs some work. The mig welds can have the tiniest bit of porosity and the heat can warp more. I can flow tig far easier and ensure a much higher chance of a leak-free floor.
Oh I know you do Just look at this build. I live for punishment
For the purpose of flexibility and sealing, tig is my way to go. Love tig anyway. The ESAB welder has been pretty badass in terms of what it can do in such as small package. Although, the mig portion needs some work. The mig welds can have the tiniest bit of porosity and the heat can warp more. I can flow tig far easier and ensure a much higher chance of a leak-free floor.
I get its easier to be leak free with tig, but it has to take 10x as long.... Are you planning seam sealer of any kind?
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Java said:
Oh I know you do
I get its easier to be leak free with tig, but it has to take 10x as long.... Are you planning seam sealer of any kind?
It can actually be quicker on sheet steel in some cases. Any mistakes can be fixed immediately. I might use the lay wire method since I have a consistent gap between every piece.Oh I know you do
I get its easier to be leak free with tig, but it has to take 10x as long.... Are you planning seam sealer of any kind?
I don't really plan to use any chemical sealers. The floor will get pressure tested prior to filling it. Still tossing between painting it with POR-15, Eastwood Rust Encapsulator, or VanSickle implement paint. POR-15 makes a super tight film. VanSickle flows on like normal paints and holds up really well. Haven't used the Eastwood stuff yet.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Easy enough. Aluminum rivets, plastic, then batting. And it's not a proper insulation removal job without rodent turds. Gonna hop back out and cut the notch in the nose. I'm sure I'll incorporate some kind of hatch in the nose to keep conduit removal access available.
Flipped the sheet in the vinegar. Might pull and oil it tomorrow. Have to see what the wind is like. Forecast says high wind. When they say 25mph in Springs, it's 50mph out here.
I tacked the last floor sheets while using the Miller weld mask II for the first time. Hooooly shite does that mask make a world of difference. I'm so used to having to flip my mask after every weld to inspect what I've done. No more. You can see perfectly in any shade. Welding is even so much better. The only complaint I have is the fitment.
Flipped the sheet in the vinegar. Might pull and oil it tomorrow. Have to see what the wind is like. Forecast says high wind. When they say 25mph in Springs, it's 50mph out here.
I tacked the last floor sheets while using the Miller weld mask II for the first time. Hooooly shite does that mask make a world of difference. I'm so used to having to flip my mask after every weld to inspect what I've done. No more. You can see perfectly in any shade. Welding is even so much better. The only complaint I have is the fitment.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
bdkw1 said:
Since this isn't structural per se but sealing is important, stainless filler flows much better.
It sure does. I've got a stack of 309L. Might make one more run in to town to stock up on fab supplies before every place boards up.Since this isn't structural per se but sealing is important, stainless filler flows much better.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Got a good start. Ran out of daylight. Rigid conduit run is sitting in place, power steering conduits are where they need to be, and a couple 2" conduits are in. Might get a little time to put some more in tomorrow.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Wife and poked around last night at the floorplan on SketchUp a little more for some finally say in where conduit stubs and walls would go - prior to a random dude arrested for assault coming into the house at 2am to ask if the bus was for sale. 2020 is certainly shaping up to be a depressing thrill of year, ain't it?
The partition wall between our bedroom and the laundry/shower room is going just ahead of the rear roof hatch. I don't want any wall set in the middle of either hatch because I would like the hatches to remain accessible and usable. Checked front to rear level - 0.45 degrees from level which is just fine. The plumb bob stops at 48.75" from the edge of the engine bay hole. Fudged it to 48.5". That's about 6" further forward than we came up with last night and about a foot forward of what I had thought previous to last night, so the bedroom will be roomy.
You can see the string dropping from the rear of the roof arch. I can bump it back 2-5/16" to the edge of the hatch frame, but something tells me that I would much rather attach to the roof arch.
The partition wall between our bedroom and the laundry/shower room is going just ahead of the rear roof hatch. I don't want any wall set in the middle of either hatch because I would like the hatches to remain accessible and usable. Checked front to rear level - 0.45 degrees from level which is just fine. The plumb bob stops at 48.75" from the edge of the engine bay hole. Fudged it to 48.5". That's about 6" further forward than we came up with last night and about a foot forward of what I had thought previous to last night, so the bedroom will be roomy.
You can see the string dropping from the rear of the roof arch. I can bump it back 2-5/16" to the edge of the hatch frame, but something tells me that I would much rather attach to the roof arch.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Revised. 69" between the wall and edge of the engine bay. This puts the wall in line with the upright between windows, lands right over top of the battery/inverter bank which allows electrical conduits and such to pop straight up, and makes room for a bedroom office.
This move sacrifices 3' of living room space, but we agree that the living room is nothing more than a chill spot for TV and seating for road time.
One of our ideas behind the floorplan has been to align interior structures with window posts, roof hatches, and piping so that all windows and hatches are functional and that pipes/conduits/wires aren't stapled to walls or hanging from zip ties in plain sight. Not the easiest thing to do while accommodating a family of four. I think we got it, though.
Now I have an absolute longitudinal position for the rearmost conduit stubs.
This move sacrifices 3' of living room space, but we agree that the living room is nothing more than a chill spot for TV and seating for road time.
One of our ideas behind the floorplan has been to align interior structures with window posts, roof hatches, and piping so that all windows and hatches are functional and that pipes/conduits/wires aren't stapled to walls or hanging from zip ties in plain sight. Not the easiest thing to do while accommodating a family of four. I think we got it, though.
Now I have an absolute longitudinal position for the rearmost conduit stubs.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Five of eight sheets are out and oiled. High 30's for the next three nights so I'm gonna try to get the last three sheets stripped down and shoved into the bus before we freeze again. This high wind is putting up a fight to work on large sheets of materials, but it sure dries the vinegar off the steel in a hurry.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Gonna have to rattle can NOT FOR SALE on it before long. Too visible from the highway, I guess.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Wife and shoving more conduit in today for mock-up. We have a couple of these Charlotte Pipe Connectite fittings I've been wanting to use instead of glued fittings. They're slightly longer in each flow direction - and no, believe it or not, I didn't measure the differences with 0.001" accuracy like I usually do. I removed the stainless clutch rings from them all so that they wouldn't lock. Started using petroleum oils to lube the o-rings. Bad idea and I knew better than that. Coconut oil works incredibly well.
I was attempting to find a way to stub four pipes through the floor. The fuels conduit was directly beneath the two power steering conduits, causing quite a bit of interference. I'm ditching the side exit I put in for the diesel lines and swapping the rain water pipe with the fuel conduit. The rain water does not need to stub through the floor at any point.
From left to right in the drawing: Fuels (green), Air (white), Filtered Water (blue), Drain (gray), Rain water (white). Fuels for propane and maybe diesel appliances share the same conduit. Air because why the hell not. Stubbing the air up came to mind a couple months ago and I told my dad about it. Never know when you might want compressed air in your kitchen. 3/8" PE-RT running to each of the four fixtures - water gets heated at the fixture. Still building gray water gardens for every drain water source, but keeping a full drain system with a gray water tank because people waste more water than plants can use.
I was attempting to find a way to stub four pipes through the floor. The fuels conduit was directly beneath the two power steering conduits, causing quite a bit of interference. I'm ditching the side exit I put in for the diesel lines and swapping the rain water pipe with the fuel conduit. The rain water does not need to stub through the floor at any point.
From left to right in the drawing: Fuels (green), Air (white), Filtered Water (blue), Drain (gray), Rain water (white). Fuels for propane and maybe diesel appliances share the same conduit. Air because why the hell not. Stubbing the air up came to mind a couple months ago and I told my dad about it. Never know when you might want compressed air in your kitchen
. 3/8" PE-RT running to each of the four fixtures - water gets heated at the fixture. Still building gray water gardens for every drain water source, but keeping a full drain system with a gray water tank because people waste more water than plants can use.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Ah, Colorado.
Hanging my head in shame for not accounting for evaporation in this terribly arid environment. When I started on this vinegar table, evaporation never crossed my mind. We've averaged a loss of four gallons of vinegar per 24 hours throughout the duration of the process. Freezing temperatures were about the only saving grace. I had a total of ten gallons in the table yesterday. Came home from errands today and the table was was bone dry. Full sun, high wind, and 5% or less humidity. We've been under a red flag warning for a while.
I started filling the table with water to submerge the three sheets again. The sludge that had crusted onto the top sheet scrubbed off, so the wife and I cleaned it, pulled it out and oiled it as fast as we could. Two sheets left and there was no more vinegar to be found at every store we stopped at today. I filled the table with water just to slow down the oxidation for the time being.
Hanging my head in shame for not accounting for evaporation in this terribly arid environment. When I started on this vinegar table, evaporation never crossed my mind. We've averaged a loss of four gallons of vinegar per 24 hours throughout the duration of the process. Freezing temperatures were about the only saving grace. I had a total of ten gallons in the table yesterday. Came home from errands today and the table was was bone dry. Full sun, high wind, and 5% or less humidity. We've been under a red flag warning for a while.
I started filling the table with water to submerge the three sheets again. The sludge that had crusted onto the top sheet scrubbed off, so the wife and I cleaned it, pulled it out and oiled it as fast as we could. Two sheets left and there was no more vinegar to be found at every store we stopped at today. I filled the table with water just to slow down the oxidation for the time being.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
[486] said:
got anything else acidic?
hell, tip a bit outta an old battery in there, after cooking the fuck outta it with the charger, of course
A gallon of muriatic. Debating on adding that to the water. Not sure I want that whipping across the yard and inadvertently splashing the kids. That'd be highly diluted, but I've never played with this volume of acid. Muriatic foams like crazy when it hits the ground here.got anything else acidic?
hell, tip a bit outta an old battery in there, after cooking the fuck outta it with the charger, of course
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
CarterKaft said:
10:1 ?
Muriatic acid vs acetic (Vinegar), and relative strength - Reef Central Online Community
Enough M and water to cover the last two sheets is what I'm about to do. I'll keep topping it off with water to keep the sheets submerged. Just gonna have to wing it. Wife might look for more vinegar tomorrow if we're in need. I guess somebody let out the secret that vinegar is a household cleaner.10:1 ?
Muriatic acid vs acetic (Vinegar), and relative strength - Reef Central Online Community
Edit: It's sizzling away. DO NOT STAND DOWN WIND. I repeat - DO NOT STAND DOWN WIND.
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
[486] said,
yup
and it works FAST
JNHEscher said:
Edit: It's sizzling away. DO NOT STAND DOWN WIND. I repeat - DO NOT STAND DOWN WIND.
Edit: It's sizzling away. DO NOT STAND DOWN WIND. I repeat - DO NOT STAND DOWN WIND.
yup
and it works FAST
JNHEscher
Red Skull Member
Indeed. I've only ever used it for cleaning or stripping metals at full strength in small quantities. The ratio is roughly 1:2 right now and the mill scale comes off within a minute or two.
Wouldn't have done this without a second person here. Wife is home so I'm having her hose the sheets down as I lift them out of the tray. What's crazy is the wind has been moving at around 30mph all day, but I've been spinning the sheets up on top of the tray edges to squeegee them off and the wind dies off completely for just under a minute right when I need to flip the sheet. Only burns incurred were some vapor creeping up my jacket sleeves.
Last sheet should have stripped in the amount of time it has taken to type this. This job is about to be complete, my friends. There are certainly better ways that I could be going about some of these sub-projects if I had a helping hand for a certain amount of time. When you're on your own and working outdoors, sometimes you have to take it easy.
Wouldn't have done this without a second person here. Wife is home so I'm having her hose the sheets down as I lift them out of the tray. What's crazy is the wind has been moving at around 30mph all day, but I've been spinning the sheets up on top of the tray edges to squeegee them off and the wind dies off completely for just under a minute right when I need to flip the sheet. Only burns incurred were some vapor creeping up my jacket sleeves.
Last sheet should have stripped in the amount of time it has taken to type this. This job is about to be complete, my friends. There are certainly better ways that I could be going about some of these sub-projects if I had a helping hand for a certain amount of time. When you're on your own and working outdoors, sometimes you have to take it easy.