Intra-Afghanistan talks in Qatar set for Sept 12th

[Provience]

Rejecting U.S. peace plan, Afghan president to offer election in six months — OAF Nation

Rejecting U.S. peace plan, Afghan president to offer election in six months



By Hamid Shalizi

KABUL (Reuters) - Afghan President Ashraf Ghani will propose a new presidential election within six months, under a peace plan he will put forward as a counter-offer to a U.S. proposal that he rejects, two senior government officials told Reuters.

Ghani will unveil his proposal at an international gathering in Turkey next month, signalling his refusal to accept Washington's plan for his elected government to be replaced by an interim administration, the officials said.

Washington, which agreed last year to withdraw its troops from Afghanistan by May 1 after nearly two decades, is pressing for a peace deal to end war between the government and the Taliban. Talks between the Afghan sides in Qatar have stalled.

U.S. Special Envoy Zalmay Khalilzad has been circulating a proposal which would replace the Kabul government with an interim administration. But Ghani has voiced vehement opposition to any solution that requires his government to step aside for unelected successors.

"The counterproposal which we are going to present at the Istanbul meeting would be to call for early presidential elections if the Taliban agree on a ceasefire," one senior government official said on condition of anonymity.

Another Afghan government official said: "The president would never agree to step aside and any future government should be formed through democratic process, not a political deal."

A third senior official also said Ghani's proposal would include possible early elections, although he did not specify the exact time frame for the vote. The third official said Ghani had already shared his road map with Khalilzad.

FILE PHOTO: U.S. troops stand guard during a handover ceremony of A-29 Super Tucano planes from U.S. to the Afghan forces, in Kabul, Afghanistan September 17, 2020. REUTERS/Omar Sobhani

U.S. SEEKING SUPPORT

With just weeks left before a deadline it agreed with Taliban last year to end the longest war in U.S. history, Washington is seeking regional backing for its approach to push the Kabul government and insurgents to share power.

But diplomats and foreign officials have said it will be difficult to move forward with the U.S. plans without Ghani's support.

During a visit to the region, which included stops in Doha and Islamabad, Khalilzad pushed for a conference to be hosted by Turkey with involvement from the United Nations next month.

The Afghan officials said that as part of Ghani's counter-proposal, his government would ask the U.N. to closely observe the new election to ensure it is accepted by all sides.

A presidential palace spokesman declined to comment.

Peace negotiations between the Afghan government and insurgent Taliban in Qatar's capital Doha have made little progress, while violence has increased.

The Taliban -- fighting the foreign-backed government since being ousted from power by Afghan opponents and U.S. air strikes in late 2001 -- have so far rejected a ceasefire and said they would not directly join an interim government.

Ghani was sworn in as president for a second five-year term in March last year after a disputed presidential election.

The new U.S. administration led by President Joe Biden is reviewing its plans before May 1, the deadline agreed last year under the Donald Trump administration for the last 2,500 U.S. troops to leave Afghanistan. Biden told broadcaster ABC last week that it would be "tough" to meet the deadline.

The Taliban say there will be consequences if the United States does not meet the deadline to pull out.
https://www.oafnation.com/news/23ma...bhdhrwgntHkCk5Qm6AgZ5jKHTDGl-Li6i_McKMIwwgKFo

https://www.oafnation.com/news/23ma...bhdhrwgntHkCk5Qm6AgZ5jKHTDGl-Li6i_McKMIwwgKFo

i'm surprised they proposed new elections. seems like very little upside

 

[clodhopper]

Did Biden claim it as his yet?

 

[Kyle]

Rejecting U.S. peace plan, Afghan president to offer election in six months — OAF Nation



i'm surprised they proposed new elections. seems like very little upside

They can pick the winner themselves...

 

[rockota]

They can pick the winner themselves...

Just like the US!

 

[Provience]

Did Biden claim it as his yet?

May the Second he'll be able to whatever happens past them will solidly be in the Biden administration camp. sort of an interesting note, i believe this is the 3rd president that the US Special Envoy Zalmay Khalilzad has worked for.

talk about a job that is unenviable! he's worked something like 5 different promising peace deals over the past, what 8 years? all while trying to maintain optimism and sailing the winds swinging across the globe.

that man deserves a Klondike

 

[Provience]

They can pick the winner themselves...

either way, the taliban is highly unlikely to participate much less recognize whatever changes may occur.

 

[petro812]

Just like the US!

They've only got like five months to set up a fully functioning postal service and secure voter identification.

At least they don't have windows that would need to be covered up.

 

[Provience]

Biden to withdraw US troops from Afghanistan by September 11

The US will not meet the May 1 deadline agreed upon by the Trump administration and the Taliban.

www.aljazeera.com

We don't want an arbitrary timeline like TRUMP set, so let's just pick a new date

Biden to withdraw US troops from Afghanistan by September 11​

The US will not meet the May 1 deadline agreed upon by the Trump administration and the Taliban.


United States President Joe Biden will leave US troops in Afghanistan past the current May 1 deadline but will withdraw them by September 11, US officials said Tuesday.

“After a rigorous policy review, President Biden has decided to draw down the remaining troops in Afghanistan and finally end the US war there after 20 years,” a senior administration official told reporters.
The new withdrawal date is the 20th anniversary of al-Qaeda’s attacks on the United States, which triggered the war in Afghanistan. The Washington Post and New York Times have also reported on Biden’s modified withdrawal date.

Biden, who will lay out his plan during a speech on Wednesday, has been signaling that he would likely miss the May 1 deadline negotiated by the Donald Trump administration and the Taliban as it became clear that withdrawing the remaining 2,500 troops would be difficult and potentially unsafe.
US officials have also blamed the Taliban for failing to live up to commitments to reduce violence and some have warned about persistent Taliban links to al-Qaeda.

In a statement last month, the Taliban threatened to resume hostilities against foreign troops in Afghanistan if they did not meet the May 1 deadline.

But Biden will still set a near-term date with withdrawal, potentially allaying Taliban concerns that he would drag out the process.

The senior Biden administration official stressed that the pullout would not be subject to further conditions.

“The president has judged that a conditions-based approach, which has been the approach of the past two decades, is a recipe in staying in Afghanistan forever,” the official said.

The ultimate withdrawal would be based on certain security and human rights guarantees, sources told the Reuters news agency, speaking on condition of anonymity ahead of the formalization of the decision.

“The president’s approach and his decision that he made was done through close close consultation with military leaders, with his national security team, with partners and allies around the world, and with his objective in mind of ensuring we are focusing on the threats were facing, we’re doing that in close coordination with our partners and allies,” White House press secretary Jen Psaki told reporters Tuesday.





Play Video
US Secretary of State Antony Blinken and US Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin are expected to brief the decision to NATO allies in Brussels on Wednesday.

Turkey announced on Tuesday it would host an Afghan meeting from April 24 to May 4 to jumpstart efforts to end the war and put together a possible political settlement.

The United Nations and Qatar are included in the event, and Turkey’s foreign ministry said the Afghan government and the Taliban will attend, but the Taliban said they had not committed to those dates.

On Monday the Taliban pulled out of an April 16 conference that was to have been held in Istanbul.

There are only about 2,500 US troops in Afghanistan currently, down from a peak of more than 100,000 in 2011. About 2,400 US service members have been killed in the course of the Afghan conflict and many thousands more wounded.

Then-President George W Bush sent American forces into Afghanistan in 2001 to topple its Taliban leaders just weeks after the September 11 attacks. US forces tracked down and killed al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden in Pakistan in 2011 during the presidency of Bush’s successor Barack Obama.

With a US-led invasion of Iraq in 2003 ordered by Bush, the American military began a period lasting years of fighting two large wars simultaneously, stretching its capabilities. US troops left Iraq in 2011 under Obama, though some were later deployed under President Donald Trump in response to the threat posed by Islamic State fighters.

 

[Provience]

I really, REALLY hope the taliban doesn't take their "year of peace" against the US/NATO forces and turn it onto it's head over this

 

[bigun]

Okay I ain't military, never have been. The only total withdrawl I remember was from Viet Nam and we have all seen the pictures of the guy hanging on to the Huey skid as they fly off from the embassy.
How difficult can it be to remove the last 2,500 troops? set your supplies to blow load up on planes while bombers and fighters fly overhead and when the last plane flys off destroy the base!

 

[Filthy McChevy]

Like I've been saying for years, we're going to leave sooner or later, might as well be now.

 

[Provience]

The taliban will overthrow the government we installed and have control of Afghanistan again inside of 3 years. Right back where things started 20 years ago. 100s of thousands of lives lost, billions of dollars wasted, all for nothing.

The only hope anyone had of keeping them out of power was installing the northern alliance in their place, and that ship has long since sailed. But hey, Pakistan should be happy because their tribal buddies get to be in power again.

I dunno, i'd certainly say it hasn't been for nothing in afghanistan. they are going to have a helluva time once we pull out but that is pretty common.

 

[mobil1syn]

Okay I ain't military, never have been. The only total withdrawl I remember was from Viet Nam and we have all seen the pictures of the guy hanging on to the Huey skid as they fly off from the embassy.
How difficult can it be to remove the last 2,500 troops? set your supplies to blow load up on planes while bombers and fighters fly overhead and when the last plane flys off destroy the base!

the goal with the withdraw is not leaving a power void undoing everything you have done up to this point

 

[Provience]

Like I've been saying for years, we're going to leave sooner or later, might as well be now.

it's absolutely comical all the screaming they did about the May 1 deal to then turn around and say "well, we can't stay here forever, let's kick it a couple months out and call it a day"

but that means they can stamp the deal as "theirs" politics...

 

[arse_sidewards]

The taliban will overthrow the government we installed and have control of Afghanistan again inside of 3 years. Right back where things started 20 years ago. 100s of thousands of lives lost, billions of dollars wasted, all for nothing.

Not for nothing. The taliban is likely to be far more picky about their house guests going forward.

 

[Provience]

The Afghans will cut and run the first time they see a serious assault from the Taliban without the backing of US troops, armor, artillery, and air power. It’s in their nature. They grew up either hearing stories of taliban reprisals or experiencing them first hand. They are not going to risk having their family/tribe/village pay for their opposition. Not for a paycheck.

It’s not exactly like the quality of life for most Afghans has increased since the US invasion. They’d just like all the bombings and gunfire to stop, they don’t really care who’s in power

depends on who you talk to, I personally believe that the average quality of life has gone up. sure, there are still plenty of completely wrecked households, there is a massive issue with city migration and shantytown-ism in kabul/jalalabad, and there is large segments that are the same now as they were before which is pretty much all the region the taliban "currently controls" i.e. dispersed people who don't give much of a fuck about outside their holler.

with the US/NATO involvement has come massive increases in education and basic medicine and at least a recognition for the validity of private business. There are places that will never be reached, though it is tough to argue that AFG isn't currently much closer to, say, northern south american countries today than they were central african countries 20 years ago. just with islamist terrorism instead of communist.

despite being propped up by the USSR they never really did do well with violent communism

 

[bigun]

the goal with the withdraw is not leaving a power void undoing everything you have done up to this point

What have we done so far, that won't be undone as soon as we pull out.
The Pashtuns were shooting at the Russians as they drove back over the bridge.
Our guys would be even more vulnerable taking off in airplanes
As for destroying material we can't bring it back so destroy in place or the Talliban will be moving in as we leave

 

[Provience]

Fair point

But are guys who fought the USSR and the USA until they withdrew really all that concerned if we take another shot at them?

it's always been an anarchist haven, the USSR was there in support of the communist government of afghanistan and the USA tried to work with the taliban government to hunt out al-queda and is currently working with the elected afghanistan government.

pakistan, india, afghanistan need to figure some shit out even if, and almost hopefully if, it results in redrawing some lines. I liked the previous admins tougher stance regarding foreign aide money, they flat out told the afg government "you are having issues and are too corrupt, we can't keep paying you" even while we continued to work with their security efforts. I hope that continues, because if we leave and say "in our place, we will feed you pallets of cash" it isn't going to help anything.

 

[Provience]

What have we done so far, that won't be undone as soon as we pull out.
The Pashtuns were shooting at the Russians as they drove back over the bridge.
Our guys would be even more vulnerable taking off in airplanes
As for destroying material we can't bring it back so destroy in place or the Talliban will be moving in as we leave

during a recent polio vaccine drive, there were 3 women nurses killed in jalalabad (out of the thousands working the drive) and it made international headlines. That is a good sign.

yeah yeah, the communists also "empowered women" but they did so with a more atheist penchant. This recent government showcases the brutality that isn't remotely based on islam and non-violence against muslims. ISIS has also done their part to harden the resolve against the notion that islam must be extreme. I do believe that there is a stronger yearning for both peace and some more liberty there now from under the US umbrella.

 

[Roc Doc]

I feel bad for the Afghans that don't want to live in the middle ages, but the Taliban is determined to re-create that, and they'll fund their operations with poppy fields. Stop the distribution of Narcan and the market will decline, or shit, just give it out for free and take the market completely away from them.

I personally offended that the administration is using 9/11 as the withdrawal date.

 

[Provience]

well it was europe more than the US that did the colonialism redrawing over there, so tell them to pound sand with their "we" bullshit

we were busy colonizing the USA still

The kurds are in much better spot now than they were 20 years ago, sure kurdistan still isn't a place, but they are a semi-automous region within iraq with their own government and everything with substantial regional control. that is what has the turks so freaked out about it, the more kurdistan stands up, the more likely they are to "reclaim" a good chunk of turkey similar to what russia did the other day (well, a few years now) with crimea in the urkraine.

and frankly, that is a good option for afghanistan. the more we funnel money to the current centralized partially corrupt national state rather than direct projects, the more it will continue to be corrupt.

the great thing about a republic is that it allows for decentralized local responsibility. we all know it to be true, here in the US, the more sway that DC holds over the rest of the states for uniformity, the more corrupt it is in trading favors for cash etc. and the worse state autonomy is. I don't know what a spread out afghanistan would look like, but a central government with not much more than a uniting vision of the country and heavy local control that can share that broad vision, but is able to say "we need help" and get it on a short term from central would be good. Currently the outliers have strong regional control but zero loyalty, and not much reason to have it, to the recognized government. I'd like to see the government back off and say "we don't even control kabul, we just live here" and empower regional control and regional variation without the triple taxing effect of pay the government, pay the locality, bride the tribal fights to get anything done.

rome was bringing conquered lands into the fold, the US has rarely done so. I mean hell, if half the damn country wasn't going on and on about blackwater and dick chaney and crying about "why is the US Geological Society researching/mapping/exploiting AFG!!!" for 7 damn years things would have been different. Even if the USA had taken a stance similar to, say, Guam i.e. We are here now, you use our money, we have near free travel, we will give you near free travel, let industry have at it and bring their own protection, then afghanistan today would be significantly more open and free....even if "the little people are oppressed!" and "wealth inequities!!"

 

[Provience]

I feel bad for the Afghans that don't want to live in the middle ages, but the Taliban is determined to re-create that, and they'll fund their operations with poppy fields. Stop the distribution of Narcan and the market will decline, or shit, just give it out for free and take the market completely away from them.

I personally offended that the administration is using 9/11 as the withdrawal date.

behind heroin, the Number 2 source of income is.....illegal Talc mining yup, baby powder

 

[Roc Doc]

behind heroin, the Number 2 source of income is.....illegal Talc mining yup, baby powder

Apparently there is a good amount of mineral wealth in that shithole, but again the Taliban would take it away from any foreign investment.

 

[Provience]

Apparently there is a good amount of mineral wealth in that shithole, but again the Taliban would take it away from any foreign investment.

it's poised to be their only multi-billion dollar industry, the fine line will be keeping in the hands of afghani business/entities and not flowing it all to china.

if the US were Rome and all that, then we would well have been extracting and refining it over there, but we are not and never have been. China doesn't have those same social qualms (see africa/southeast asia) and the taliban have a valid claim to be countering communism.

I hold out hope that a violently defensive and resolute afghan moderate "party" or "political will" can come to fruition though.

 

[Provience]

Taliban Launches Huge Afghan Offensive After Deadline for U.S. Pullout — OAF Nation

LASHKAR GAH (Reuters) - Afghan security forces fought back a huge Taliban offensive in southern Helmand province in the last 24 hours, officials and residents said on Tuesday, as militants launched assaults around the country following a missed U.S. deadline to withdraw troops. Al

www.oafnation.com

well, here we fucking go!!

LASHKAR GAH (Reuters) - Afghan security forces fought back a huge Taliban offensive in southern Helmand province in the last 24 hours, officials and residents said on Tuesday, as militants launched assaults around the country following a missed U.S. deadline to withdraw troops.

Although the United States did not meet the May 1 withdrawal deadline agreed in talks with the Taliban last year, its pull-out has begun, with President Joe Biden announcing all troops will out by Sept. 11. Critics of the decision to withdraw say the militants will try to sweep back into power.

"There was a thunderstorm of heavy weapons and blasts in the city and the sound of small arms was like someone was making popcorn," Mulah Jan, a resident of a suburb of provincial capital Lashkar Gah, told Reuters.

"I took all my family members to the corner of the room, hearing the heavy blasts and bursts of gunfire as if it was happening behind our walls," he said. Families that could afford to leave had fled, but he had been unable to go, waiting with his family in fear before the Taliban were pushed back.

Attaullah Afghan, the head of Helmand's provincial council, said the Taliban had launched their huge offensive on Monday from multiple directions, attacking checkpoints around the outskirts of Lashkar Gah, taking over some of them.

Afghan security forces had launched air strikes and deployed elite commando forces to the area. The insurgents had been pushed back but fighting was continuing on Tuesday and hundreds of families had been displaced, he added.

RESONANCE

A Taliban surge in Helmand would have particular resonance, as the opium-growing desert province was where U.S. and British forces suffered the bulk of their losses during the 20-year war.

As part of the pullout, U.S. forces handed over a base in Helmand to Afghan troops two days ago.

The Afghan defence ministry said that in addition to Helmand, security forces have been responding to attacks by the Taliban in at least six other provinces, including southeastern Ghazni and southern Kandahar in the past 24 hours.

The defence ministry said just over 100 Taliban fighters had been killed in Helmand. It did not provide details on casualties among Afghan security forces. The Taliban did not immediately respond to request for comment.

The May 1 deadline for U.S. troops to pull out was agreed last year under former President Donald Trump. The Taliban rejected Biden's announcement that troops would stay on past it but withdraw over the next four-and-a-half months.

The deadline has been met with a surge in violence, with a car bomb in Logar province killing almost 30 people on Friday evening. At least seven Afghan military personnel were killed when the Taliban set off explosives smuggled through a tunnel they had dug into an army outpost in southwestern Farah province on Monday.



(Reporting by Zainullah Stanekzai and Kabul newsroom; Writing by Charlotte Greenfield; Editing by Peter Graff)

 

[bigun]

Anyone surprised

 

[Provience]

Anyone surprised

this is 100% why the "well, just delay and do a no conditions withdrawl later on" was possibly the worst option possible.

I've yet to hear any sort of rationale for delaying May to Sept.

 

[bigun]

this is 100% why the "well, just delay and do a no conditions withdrawl later on" was possibly the worst option possible.

I've yet to hear any sort of rationale for delaying May to Sept.

To celebrate 9/11? Hell I don't know makes no damn sense to me, if we going to leave. leave scorched earth behind us , drop bunker busters on the runways as the last plane leaves, destroy everything we can't bring back

 

[Provience]

To celebrate 9/11? Hell I don't know makes no damn sense to me, if we going to leave. leave scorched earth behind us , drop bunker busters on the runways as the last plane leaves, destroy everything we can't bring back

that seems to be the "official reason" that should be enough to piss off everybody in this country, alas; apathy wins the day.

the obvious not-stated reason is "well, trump was involved in the other date, can't have his name get any credit" because it would fit with the purge actions that took place during the first 100 days. even at that, really seems kind of off the wall.

if you are going to leave without changing conditions, why change the date just pop out a few months earlier, on time.

if you are going to skip that date, why not state a change in conditions at least try and fucking justify it or something

 

[bigun]

that seems to be the "official reason" that should be enough to piss off everybody in this country, alas; apathy wins the day.

the obvious not-stated reason is "well, trump was involved in the other date, can't have his name get any credit" because it would fit with the purge actions that took place during the first 100 days. even at that, really seems kind of off the wall.

if you are going to leave without changing conditions, why change the date just pop out a few months earlier, on time.

if you are going to skip that date, why not state a change in conditions at least try and fucking justify it or something

The problem is we don't think like career politicians