What's new
By:
Filters

front axle swap -05+ superduty axle in 3rd gen dodge DRW

Fredycruger

Fredycruger

Today
Joined
May 22, 2020
Member Number
1185
Messages
107
Loc
MA
anybody done it ?
im not looking forward to rebuild the AAM thats in my truck.
it need bearings and ball joints control arm bushings and track bar

might be easier to swap in the 05+ SD front axle in :lmao:
cant find any links of it being done
 
I like the sound of that, i was thinking of swapping for Reid 60 C's, but this sounds smarter. I just did ball joints on my 04 and that whole telescoping business bothers the hell out of me. Seems like a lazy solution.
 
Dumptruck.the.wookie said:
I like the sound of that, i was thinking of swapping for Reid 60 C's, but this sounds smarter. I just did ball joints on my 04 and that whole telescoping business bothers the hell out of me. Seems like a lazy solution.
Click to expand...

im going to do some measuring later to see how close the mounts are
mine is DRW so i gotta see if i can get adapter thatll change bolt pattern from ford to dodge
 
Fredycruger said:
anybody done it ?
im not looking forward to rebuild the AAM thats in my truck.
it need bearings and ball joints control arm bushings and track bar

might be easier to swap in the 05+ SD front axle in :lmao:
cant find any links of it being done
Click to expand...

whats your plan for arms....I think it would be fairly easy to use a ruffstuff radius arm kit and swap it in that way....shoot maybe you could adapt custom links to the stock suspension arm mounts...Either way its a much better upgrade than the stock dodge crap.
 
The big question for me is coil spring spacing and track bar mounting. Control arms should be simple enough if the coil springs and trackbar can line up.

I have planned to do this swap at some point, but with coilovers. If the coil springs will line up, that might make the swap happen alot sooner.
 
Fredycruger said:
i didn't get that far yet LOL ruffstuff arms would probably work


now... is the 10 bolt bolt pattern same from dodge to ford? F-450 axle?
Click to expand...

2005-2010 F450 & F550 used 10 lugs, 10x170mm (same as 8 lug's 8x170 bolt pattern, but with 2 extra lug studs)

F250/F350 unit bearing will swap right in, but I can't say about brake, although worst case scenario is to re-drill the 10 lug rotor to go on 8 lug hub.
 
jasonmt said:
Nope: 2005+ F450/550 are 10 x 225mm bolt pattern with a 170.1mm center bore, exact same as Dodge/Ram/Sterling 4500/5500 so wheels interchange (and are in fact the exact same Accuride PN in many cases).

2005+ F-350 DRW are 8 x 200mm bolt pattern with a 5.6" center bore vs. the SRW 8 x 170mm bolt pattern with a 4.93" center bore.
Click to expand...

may want to clarify on what you're talking about... Wheel unit hub bearing & spacer/adapter. What I listed above is for the wheel unit bearing itself.
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
The big question for me is coil spring spacing and track bar mounting. Control arms should be simple enough if the coil springs and trackbar can line up.

I have planned to do this swap at some point, but with coilovers. If the coil springs will line up, that might make the swap happen alot sooner.
Click to expand...

Has anyone had a chance to measure this?
 
I had a friend measure his 05+ f250 D60 coil spring spacing. He said the buckets were 46.5" center to center. The SD coils are small at the base too, which could complicate the swap.
 
I have a 3rdgen axle sitting under a 2ndgen frame chunk. Those, of course, line up well.

Measuring that against my '07 SD60, I think the thing to do is mount a dodge coil perch on the SD60's bumpstop area. Its basically inline with the radius arm. And the radius arms are spaced similar to the dodge frame rails under the cab. I don't see the need for a link kit.

edit: There was a 79 Bronco build on the old site using a 05+ SD60. He spanned the knuckle boss to the bumpstop with plate, and put the coil pad there. IIRC, he also built his own links before ruffstuff started making them.

edit: found it
www.pirate4x4.com

79 Bronco 05+Superduty Tons

www.pirate4x4.com www.pirate4x4.com
 
Last edited:
u2slow said:
I have a 3rdgen axle sitting under a 2ndgen frame chunk. Those, of course, line up well.

Measuring that against my '07 SD60, I think the thing to do is mount a dodge coil perch on the SD60's bumpstop area. Its basically inline with the radius arm. And the radius arms are spaced similar to the dodge frame rails under the cab. I don't see the need for a link kit.

edit: There was a 79 Bronco build on the old site using a 05+ SD60. He spanned the knuckle boss to the bumpstop with plate, and put the coil pad there. IIRC, he also built his own links before ruffstuff started making them.

edit: found it
www.pirate4x4.com

79 Bronco 05+Superduty Tons

www.pirate4x4.com www.pirate4x4.com
Click to expand...
Well, I just did EMF ball joints and a CAD delete on my 2001 Dodge Dana 60... would yank it all out for a Ford axle pair.
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
The big question for me is coil spring spacing and track bar mounting. Control arms should be simple enough if the coil springs and trackbar can line up.

I have planned to do this swap at some point, but with coilovers. If the coil springs will line up, that might make the swap happen alot sooner.
Click to expand...

I was going to say the same thing.

Myself, I would just use the factory ford radius arms and add mounts under the frame, but I guess it might be slick to make links that go from the dodge frame mounts to the Ford axle mounts.

For the dually adapter. It should be fairly simple to either adapt the dodge adapter to the Ford axle with a little machining or machine the 8x6.5 pattern into a Ford adapter.

I don't think a F450/550 axle would work well unless you want to put flairs on the truck like the 4500/5500 dodges. Brakes might be too big for 17s. Gearing might be too low as 4.30 and 4.88 is very common in that size. Also I doubt there is enough meat on the adapter for 8x6.5 as the center bore is very large. If you wanted a F450/550 front, I think you may as well grab the rear also.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
I was going to say the same thing.

Myself, I would just use the factory ford radius arms and add mounts under the frame, but I guess it might be slick to make links that go from the dodge frame mounts to the Ford axle mounts.

For the dually adapter. It should be fairly simple to either adapt the dodge adapter to the Ford axle with a little machining or machine the 8x6.5 pattern into a Ford adapter.

I don't think a F450/550 axle would work well unless you want to put flairs on the truck like the 4500/5500 dodges. Brakes might be too big for 17s. Gearing might be too low as 4.30 and 4.88 is very common in that size. Also I doubt there is enough meat on the adapter for 8x6.5 as the center bore is very large. If you wanted a F450/550 front, I think you may as well grab the rear also.
Click to expand...
Only thing I'll add here is that you can convert the 450-550 front axle to 8x170 easy then just use a 8x170 to 8x6.5 adapter that is hub centric but yeah the brakes might clear 17s but probably looking 18-19.5-20. If 19.5 is goal then just leave it the ford 10 lug and grab a matching rear. Both the f450-550 and ram 4500-5500 are same 10 lug pattern but don't know about the centerbore between the two.
 
350TacoZilla said:
Only thing I'll add here is that you can convert the 450-550 front axle to 8x170 easy then just use a 8x170 to 8x6.5 adapter that is hub centric but yeah the brakes might clear 17s but probably looking 18-19.5-20. If 19.5 is goal then just leave it the ford 10 lug and grab a matching rear. Both the f450-550 and ram 4500-5500 are same 10 lug pattern but don't know about the centerbore between the two.
Click to expand...

Yes that's all possible, it will still end up much wider than even a standard dually.

I haven't been able to nail it down 100%, but even 18s may not fit, depending on the year.

The adapter "centerbore" I was referring to was the actual hollow space in the adapter, no way 8x6.5 will fit. It's probably close to a 6" hole.
 
YotaAtieToo said:
Yes that's all possible, it will still end up much wider than even a standard dually.

I haven't been able to nail it down 100%, but even 18s may not fit, depending on the year.

The adapter "centerbore" I was referring to was the actual hollow space in the adapter, no way 8x6.5 will fit. It's probably close to a 6" hole.
Click to expand...
The UB on the 450/550 axle is the same as the 250/350 except for the pattern. If you want to go 8lug, just swap to the 8lug UB and run an adapter.

I will be staying SRW, for now, and like to have off the shelf brake parts. Will likely run 8x170 to 8x6.5 adapter in the front or rear, to match up the width/pattern. Not sure if I will stay with the 17" dodge wheels or grab some SD wheels to run. I currently have a d80 in the rear, so not planning to swap that out unless I went 10 lug dually with the s110


For the front swap, my plan/goal was to run the SD steering and trackbar to fit the axle. The Ford buckets are small at the bottom, so I have considered running the SD front springs, if they are long enough. I might run the SD radius arm, as the Dodge arms are too steep currently. If not, I will build a long arm setup for it.
 
ParadisePWoffrd said:
The UB on the 450/550 axle is the same as the 250/350 except for the pattern. If you want to go 8lug, just swap to the 8lug UB and run an adapter.
Click to expand...

Yes, but it will still be way wider. I think it's 6-8" wider than a regular 250/350 axle. Then you will most likely be stuck with 20s.

ParadisePWoffrd said:
I will be staying SRW, for now, and like to have off the shelf brake parts. Will likely run 8x170 to 8x6.5 adapter in the front or rear, to match up the width/pattern. Not sure if I will stay with the 17" dodge wheels or grab some SD wheels to run. I currently have a d80 in the rear, so not planning to swap that out unless I went 10 lug dually with the s110


For the front swap, my plan/goal was to run the SD steering and trackbar to fit the axle. The Ford buckets are small at the bottom, so I have considered running the SD front springs, if they are long enough. I might run the SD radius arm, as the Dodge arms are too steep currently. If not, I will build a long arm setup for it.
Click to expand...
 
I’ll look hard at 2013 or 2014 and newer Rams’ front axle if I’m to swap it into older Ram 2500/3500. Big brakes, 8x6.5 bp and true cross over steering linkages. Biggest drawbacks are no locking hubs and CAD, but both can be remedied if desired.
 
TrailTamer said:
I’ll look hard at 2013 or 2014 and newer Rams’ front axle if I’m to swap it into older Ram 2500/3500. Big brakes, 8x6.5 bp and true cross over steering linkages. Biggest drawbacks are no locking hubs and CAD, but both can be remedied if desired.
Click to expand...
How long did Ram keep 8x6.5" I thought everyone had transitioned to bigger stuff by now.
 
My coworker has an 05 super duty in his 3rd gen, check out glakeler_ on instagram
 
As some of you may know I completely taco'd my AAM having a little too much fun in the dunes. This was my way of trying to make the ram platform a little better for high speed and much stronger.

Truck info:
2003 Ram 2500 CCSB
5-speed NV4500 trans
NP 271 transfer case

Previous Set up:
AAM 9.25 w/ thuren truss and Synergy C gussets
Synergy long arm kit
Synergy Steering
Synergy track bar
16" Fox 3.0 IBP coil over
Cheapo daystar poly bumps

New Set up:
Ford Super Duty 60 w/ custom truss
Radius Arms, my own design (little chunky, will likely trim down the profile of the arms for V2)
Custom Steering using Synergy drag link for 14+ Ram and Synergy Ford 05+ Super Duty tie rod (all heims)
Custom track bar and mounts
Same 16" Fox IBPs
2.5x2.5 Fox bumps

Design:
I've been planning on trying this swap for about a year now so I had plenty of time to sit and stare at the computer to get the system all laid out. Goal was to retain all of the uptravel and gain a ton of droop to fill in the holes in the dirt that seem to get bigger every year. Started with axle placement and made sure that I could fit it all under the truck without any major conflicts for space at bump (things get very tight ^smiley27) then moved to arm design. Due to the super short length of my front drive shaft I landed on a radius arm platform to keep the pinon pointed at the t-case output to keep the angles down and reduce driveshaft plunge. another plus to the radius arms if the inherent bind that the system presents, I'm hoping that the binding will act as a sway bar and keep the truck stable enough that I don't have to package a sway bar in the future, but we'll see. Wanted to keep the pivot as high and tight to the frame as possible, this dictated a lot of the arm design. Couldn't use the traditional singe bend arms as the transmission crossmember hangs down enough on these trucks that the arm would contact it at bump, this is where the more complex bend profile of the arm came from. Synergy double adjuster assemblies were used on the upper links to easily dial in the caster on the truck without a need to remove links.

The truck can cycle the full 16" of the shock with room to spare however I strapped it at 15" to be safe. The axle moves just under 2" to the driver side at full droop, but there is very little bump steer. Once I get the new pitman arm fabbed up there will be ZERO bump steer through the travel. Ended up loosing .5" of uptravel but that's still less than an unchained kit lol.

Currently the travel numbers are just that, numbers. After Hammers I will be able to come back with actual seat of the pants and driving info as to how the kit actually functions. Believe me I will be the first to call something out if it doesn't perform how I like.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1823.jpg
    IMG_1823.jpg
    2.4 MB · Views: 90
  • IMG_1828.jpg
    IMG_1828.jpg
    3 MB · Views: 88
  • IMG_1848.jpg
    IMG_1848.jpg
    2.5 MB · Views: 87
  • IMG_1851.jpg
    IMG_1851.jpg
    1.8 MB · Views: 87
  • IMG_1854.jpg
    IMG_1854.jpg
    1.6 MB · Views: 93
  • IMG_1857.jpg
    IMG_1857.jpg
    2.6 MB · Views: 92
  • IMG_8572.jpg
    IMG_8572.jpg
    5.1 MB · Views: 93
  • IMG_8576.jpg
    IMG_8576.jpg
    2.2 MB · Views: 91
Mattygwheeler said:
I put 05+ axles in my gmc, i did a 3 link with barnes truss, coil springs from a 6.2 superduty
IMG_3008.JPG

IMG_3078.JPG
Click to expand...
fuck yea! do you have a build on here about it?? i would like to see your 3 link. i want to get rid of my radius arms and do a 3 link. how does it handle on the street?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Back Refresh