Big Equipment Company releasing new Big Bud Tractors!

[Seubs070]

Big boy farming is big boy farming. We had a customer with a 42' mower, pulled it with a 450 hp track tractor.

IMO I can't see this selling, just my gut feeling.

Agreed. I see this as a cool niche product but nothing more than that. Theres to much money on the line that farmers aren't fixing shit when it breaks. They are calling the dealer and getting a tech to the field that can troubleshoot and get that thing back running as soon as possible. They can't stop planting or harvesting for a few days to drag something into a shop and fix it themselves.

 

[Lee]

Here's a decent article from a few years ago. Guys gave up on new equipment and have been rebuilding and upgrading '70s-80s equipment for full time service.

Misfit Tractors a Money Saver for Arkansas Farmer

Nathan Reed’s misfit tractors are purchased for pennies on the dollar, and his fleet is a lesson in savings and an acknowledgement of the harsh realities of new equipment costs.

www.agweb.com

 

[aczlan]

Agreed. I see this as a cool niche product but nothing more than that. Theres to much money on the line that farmers aren't fixing shit when it breaks. They are calling the dealer and getting a tech to the field that can troubleshoot and get that thing back running as soon as possible. They can't stop planting or harvesting for a few days to drag something into a shop and fix it themselves.

That depends on the size of the farm, most of the bigger farms I see around here have their own service trucks and will handle anything the dealer isn't required for as getting a dealer tech out the same day is unlikely and if you are racing the rain to get hay, haylege, etc in or to plant you can't afford to wait.

Aaron Z

 

[HillbillyDeluxe]

Agreed. I see this as a cool niche product but nothing more than that. Theres to much money on the line that farmers aren't fixing shit when it breaks. They are calling the dealer and getting a tech to the field that can troubleshoot and get that thing back running as soon as possible. They can't stop planting or harvesting for a few days to drag something into a shop and fix it themselves.

What? Anyone with an operation large enough to use equipment that size usually has their own mechanic(s) to keep stuff going. Its cheaper to have your own guy than to have a dealer guy come out and get raped with the service call fees.

 

[Clastic]

Agreed. I see this as a cool niche product but nothing more than that. Theres to much money on the line that farmers aren't fixing shit when it breaks. They are calling the dealer and getting a tech to the field that can troubleshoot and get that thing back running as soon as possible. They can't stop planting or harvesting for a few days to drag something into a shop and fix it themselves.

Homie, we had to take the Deere to the dealer to fix an injection pump line because their crew couldn't get to it in time before first cut with a service truck. I mean, we have the 776 and 986 in a pinch to bale but neither have a front end loader

 

[bigun]

What? Anyone with an operation large enough to use equipment that size usually has their own mechanic(s) to keep stuff going. Its cheaper to have your own guy than to have a dealer guy come out and get raped with the service call fees.

Most of the work I see done is by the farmers, they only call for a dealer on stuff they can't do

 

[87manche]

Most of the work I see done is by the farmers, they only call for a dealer on stuff they can't do

which in the case of a new john deere is everything.

at least now they can acquire the software, but i's still an additional cost.

Honestly I think the largest problem with all of the electronics and software and the like is that these machines aren't cars. They're not getting replaced every 5 years. At least not around here on average 200 acre farms. What happens when a tractor manufacturer simply doesn't have new electronics? Or new software? Or just drops support for it as a forced obsolescence?

I think an old school mechanical tractor with a modernish powertrain for fuel economy and power is a great solution. Just enough technology to get huge benefits in running cost, but not so much that when something breaks in a field it's unlikely you can't fix it with a hammer.

 

[Pony_Driver]

I enjoy Welker Farms videos. This one was cool, two tractors ripping a big trench. Their old big bud was putting in some work.

I like their videos. The scale of what they are working is nuts.

 

[MuntCuffin]

Agreed. I see this as a cool niche product but nothing more than that. Theres to much money on the line that farmers aren't fixing shit when it breaks. They are calling the dealer and getting a tech to the field that can troubleshoot and get that thing back running as soon as possible. They can't stop planting or harvesting for a few days to drag something into a shop and fix it themselves.

Uhhhhh. No.

Farms that can't find skilled mechs may outsource, but big farms have highly skilled and paid mechanics that fix shit ricky tick. I put an engine wiring harness on a freightliner semi this past harvest.
And rebuilt a solution pump and its hydraulic drive motor for the sprayer during spring burn down 3 years ago. I think the turnaround on that job was 20 hours, from broke dick to fixed. Faster than the dealer could have even had a "tech" to come "troubleshoot."

A lot of dealer techs aint worth the ink that signs their paychecks. Only surpassed in incompetence by freightliner techs.

 

[MuntCuffin]

which in the case of a new john deere is everything.

at least now they can acquire the software, but i's still an additional cost.

Honestly I think the largest problem with all of the electronics and software and the like is that these machines aren't cars. They're not getting replaced every 5 years. At least not around here on average 200 acre farms. What happens when a tractor manufacturer simply doesn't have new electronics? Or new software? Or just drops support for it as a forced obsolescence?

I think an old school mechanical tractor with a modernish powertrain for fuel economy and power is a great solution. Just enough technology to get huge benefits in running cost, but not so much that when something breaks in a field it's unlikely you can't fix it with a hammer.

Its not "everything". You can dead reckon a lot of stuff on newer tractors.


But the problem is everything has a module on it. So even if you do the work yourself to replace the turbo on your 4930, you still gotta pay a "tech" to come out with his laptop and tell the machine its ok to use that turbo.

 

[Stix]

Yup. Our 8520 got a long block. Had to tell the computer it had new injectors

 

[bigun]

Tony Fast just built a new equipment building watch him park his air seeder and cart starts around 11:00 You can see it working in the opening of the video

 

[CarterKraft]

I worked for 7 years on 100% ag machines. Mostly self propelled sprayers but many row crop tractors.

All of that work across 4 states was for big AG customers, some had elaborate shops and capabilities but especially in Precision AG there is a lot to know weather it's guidance, VRA, direct injection, rate control, combines and choppers is a whole different game as well.

These customers prefer to have people who know how to repair their fancy shit, quickly and correcty, or add options/equipment/capabilities to their operations.

Fixing the usual shit is cake for a farmer,
It's ALL the extra shit they need help with.
The extra shit is stuff they want because it allows them to be more productive, more economical and efficient and more profitable, it's that simple.

If we're talking high HP tillage then sure throw a light bar on the windshield and let the $15/hr school kid drive it, that's not what I experienced.

 

[MuntCuffin]

I worked for 7 years on 100% ag machines. Mostly self propelled sprayers but many row crop tractors.

All of that work across 4 states was for big AG customers, some had elaborate shops and capabilities but especially in Precision AG there is a lot to know weather it's guidance, VRA, direct injection, rate control, combines and choppers is a whole different game as well.

These customers prefer to have people who know how to repair their fancy shit, quickly and correcty, or add options/equipment/capabilities to their operations.

Fixing the usual shit is cake for a farmer,
It's ALL the extra shit they need help with.
The extra shit is stuff they want because it allows them to be more productive, more economical and efficient and more profitable, it's that simple.

If we're talking high HP tillage then sure throw a light bar on the windshield and let the $15/hr school kid drive it, that's not what I experienced.

Yes. Planters are a completely different animal and only qualified personnel fuck with the brain boxes on those. Lotta stuff going on there. Our corn planter has electric drive, hydro down force, the really accurate nsk or other some bullshit deere guidance system of its own, with its own autosteer separate from the tractor, and the starter fertilizer delivery system. Yes, I put light bars on it. With the most pimpin shit mounts and control module.

 

[Gbkeith]

The northern plains states are not Texas. You people are as bad as commiefornians when it comes to projecting your environmental conditions on everywhere else.

What’s really bad is they do it to other parts of Texas also. North of Plainview basically is a plains state.

 

[Gbkeith]

Agreed. I see this as a cool niche product but nothing more than that. Theres to much money on the line that farmers aren't fixing shit when it breaks. They are calling the dealer and getting a tech to the field that can troubleshoot and get that thing back running as soon as possible. They can't stop planting or harvesting for a few days to drag something into a shop and fix it themselves.

That’s the problem with a lot of the new stuff though. The dealers take days to fix it so it’s sitting in the field while nothings happening.

 

[Tin Roof]

Here's a decent article from a few years ago. Guys gave up on new equipment and have been rebuilding and upgrading '70s-80s equipment for full time service.

Misfit Tractors a Money Saver for Arkansas Farmer

Nathan Reed’s misfit tractors are purchased for pennies on the dollar, and his fleet is a lesson in savings and an acknowledgement of the harsh realities of new equipment costs.

www.agweb.com

This spawned some used only lots and auctions here. There’s one lot that’s full of 70’s - 80’s tractors that moves a lot of equipment. Here we have guys running 1000-2000 acres, but it’s split up in 80-100 acre fields so the older 140hp tractors make sense. In the central - western part of the state it’s flat and open so they prefer the bigger equipment.

 

[bgaidan]

Tony Fast just built a new equipment building watch him park his air seeder and cart starts around 11:00 You can see it working in the opening of the video

That building is sweet. Wonder what the cost of that is vs. a traditional steel frame.

 

[Aggie06]

This spawned some used only lots and auctions here. There’s one lot that’s full of 70’s - 80’s tractors that moves a lot of equipment. Here we have guys running 1000-2000 acres, but it’s split up in 80-100 acre fields so the older 140hp tractors make sense. In the central - western part of the state it’s flat and open so they prefer the bigger equipment.

Yup. It’s the same way in parts of the Rio Grande Valley south of me. Guys still use 8 row or 12 row planters.

 

[bigun]

That building is sweet. Wonder what the cost of that is vs. a traditional steel frame.

Not sure I know they have been saving to buy it for some time

 

[bigun]

Farming pod cast with Bob Brown of Brown's farming, remembering how farming has changed over the years

 

[ANGRYBLACK]

It sounds like the owner of this company has had enough of the big tractor companies screwing farmers

How long before he gets bought out by a red or green company or suicides himself and this plan never comes to fruition?

That Brother depends directly on if the tractor companies "Strategic Operations and development" wants to pay payroll to have a dead mouse dropped into the coffee pot at his house and office. After that it's just good ole Serpant and the rainbow type shit. They never commit suicide.....

 

[aczlan]

Its not "everything". You can dead reckon a lot of stuff on newer tractors.
But the problem is everything has a module on it. So even if you do the work yourself to replace the turbo on your 4930, you still gotta pay a "tech" to come out with his laptop and tell the machine its ok to use that turbo.

True, but there are 2 caveats:
1. If you pay for a subscription you can access a lot of dealer functions, at very least for diagnosis (as I understand it, with the green version you are locked out of changing anything emissions related, but short of that you can do almost anything a dealer can), if you have a couple million in any one color iron and a couple of full time shop guys you likely have a subscription.

2. When you can call the dealership service manager and say "we need a tech here with a laptop after X time tomorrow to program the new turbo we bought from you today" you are more likely to get someone (just need someone with a laptop and wheels) vs "I need someone come out and fix my tractor that will start but has no power" (which would require a full service truck, diagnosis, etc) ESPECIALLY in the busy season.
Such discussions go much better when you spend a couple hundred thousand a year at said dealership.

Also, on equipment the size of Big Bud, odds are really good that it will get fixed on site vs hauling it to a shop for most anything short of an engine rebuild no matter who is fixing it (and even on an engine rebuild, it may get pulled, rebuilt in the shop and brought back to be installed).
If it's a Cat engine/transmission like someone said , they would likely have a Cat dealer come out if it needs a dealer to work on it.

A local large orchard near me has a 4 row tree planter (has 4 guys riding it who plant a 6-8' tall "bare root" fruit tree every x feet) that they pull behind a large tracked tractor. The controls guy at work setup a PLC for it that reads a wheel speed sensor on the planter and it tells them when to plant a tree.
The tractor has GPS and some kind of input from the PLC so when they plant a tree, it also marks the location of all 4 trees in the GPS map of the field.
Something like this, but 4 rows instead of 2:


Aaron Z

 

[speed bump]

I have to admit its cool that someone is trying to build Big Bud tractors but a weird thing I have noticed (or at least contrary to what the internet tells me). Is those fancy smancy pieces of equipment with all those electronics seem to have the same or better uptime and better production than our simpler equipment (based on Cat stuff), granted all of our equipment is ran all the time but we are pushing 22k hours on our 980k and other than a midlife haven't done shit to it and its ran by retards. Looking back at our service records our average loader life was 20-25k hours (this is stretching back to 1990 or so and encompassing Cat, Komatsu, and Terex loaders). Same across most of our plants, 15 years ago the average loader design life was 20-25k and now we are 40k on newer than 2010 equipment.

For personal use something like the big bud and other simpler equipment makes me happy knowing I can probably fix it easily but business experience says uptime and efficiency is king so you do what you need to to make that happen.

 

[Wades_76_cj7]

here is the video of that huge planter in Australia. this fucker has 2 seed tenders on it and is actually pulled by a Big Bud.

 

[aczlan]

I have to admit its cool that someone is trying to build Big Bud tractors but a weird thing I have noticed (or at least contrary to what the internet tells me). Is those fancy smancy pieces of equipment with all those electronics seem to have the same or better uptime and better production than our simpler equipment (based on Cat stuff), granted all of our equipment is ran all the time but we are pushing 22k hours on our 980k and other than a midlife haven't done shit to it and its ran by retards. Looking back at our service records our average loader life was 20-25k hours (this is stretching back to 1990 or so and encompassing Cat, Komatsu, and Terex loaders). Same across most of our plants, 15 years ago the average loader design life was 20-25k and now we are 40k on newer than 2010 equipment.

For personal use something like the big bud and other simpler equipment makes me happy knowing I can probably fix it easily but business experience says uptime and efficiency is king so you do what you need to to make that happen.

The problem is that in many cases that uptime is not there with AG equipment, the electrical stuff is causing failures, I was watching someone who said that they had spent $10k on variable speed fan controllers between 3 Deere tractors and one (as of that video) had failed for the 2nd time after replacing all the parts the first time.

Aaron Z

 

[bigun]

here is the video of that huge planter in Australia. this fucker has 2 seed tenders on it and is actually pulled by a Big Bud.

You're going to replace this with animal manure based holsitic farming methods!

 

[MuntCuffin]

here is the video of that huge planter in Australia. this fucker has 2 seed tenders on it and is actually pulled by a Big Bud.

Wow....and I thought our db120 was a monstrosity.

 

[Wades_76_cj7]

how much fuel do you think is going up the stacks every hour on that tractor?

 

[ThePanzerFuhrer]

how much fuel do you think is going up the stacks every hour on that tractor?

When it’s on the gas 60-80 gallons a hour I bet. My 800 hp genset burns like 40-50 gallons a hour depending on the load.