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Adira press brake help

Fl-Krawler

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 3, 2020
Member Number
3107
Messages
75
Loc
Cookeville, Tennessee
Anybody in here have any experience with an Adira press brake or a CNC brake that runs a Cybelec modela 10s control? Backstory: In August I bought a used 230ton 14ft 3axis press brake (Y,X,R) that I paid pretty much scrap price for (I also got 6 pallets worth of various punches and dies with it). The brake had been sitting dormant in the shop I bought it from for almost 2yrs. The shop owner said the guy that ran it quit and they were unable to find a replacement who could run the brake so it just sat. When I went to inspect the brake before purchase I was able to make the backgauge move as programmed and the main beam did index to the top (it was in the all the way down position). I wasn't able to make the beam move downward and the employee with me said it was because the tooling had to be programmed into the machine. Not knowing anything about the tooling and not having anything to measure the die, I avoided the risk of crashing the beam and assumed that because it went up, that it would go down as well. Also while there looking at the machine I asked what voltage the machine ran on as my shop is 3ph 240v. The employee indicated that the machine was on 240v. I didnt verify in the control cabinet it was on 240v (more on this later) but the data plate indicated the machine was able to be wired 240 or 480v. Satisfied with what I saw I made an offer on the brake and they took it without much haggling.

Fast forward to September and the brake is finally delivered to the shop and ready to be powered up. I run 240v into the control cabinet and power up the computer but when I try to power up the hydraulic pumps..nothing. When I got the brake I got no manuals or other info on the brake so I was pretty much flying blind. It took me about a month to source the manuals for the control and brake itself. I discovered the brake was originally wired for 480v so I went through the process of switching everything over to the correct breakers and moving various jumpers on the hydraulic motors where it appears everything is wired correctly.

I fired the brake up and I was able to get the machine to index on all 3 axis, but the beam would still not move down manually. The next day while away from the shop, my son spent a few hours trying to work with it and somehow managed to get the x to stop moving entirely and throwing several error codes. I'm in a facebook group for press brake operators and a guy chimed in stating he was a service rep for Adira. I was able to get him on the phone to walk me through diag'ing what was going on with the brake. We were able to get the correct die and punch programmed in (turns out he had serviced my brake in the past or so he says) and he then instructed me to change the key to manual inch mode. The key selector was froze up which he stated was common and he wanted to send me another to the tune of about $180. I declined as I was confident I could get this one working with a little work. He basically said that until that was fixed we could not go any further with diagnostics.

The following week I fixed the key switch (just needed to be cleaned and lubed) and messaged the service guy. He said he was busy and would call when he had time to go through the rest of the steps with me. After 2 weeks and him being busy on 3 occasions (I even offered to pay for his phone time, but he seemed to want me to pay for him to make the trip from Maryland to Florida to look at it in person) I gave up on him being of any help. I found a broken belt on the x axis which I replaced and followed the instructions in the manual on how to reindex the back gauge.

I can now make the backgauge move manually but when I try to do the startup index procedure, the backgauge will not move saying x is over traveled and the position for Y (the beam) is running but the beam will not move. The beam will also not move manually, but when stepping on the manual foot control you can hear solenoids clicking off in the back, just no movement. I just don't know what my next step would be? I'm assuming I should be looking for hydraulic pressure but the only gauge on the machine is for bending force. I'm kinda scared to pop loose a hose given their size and the pressure that is potentially behind them.

To be honest I'm sure at this point I need a repair tech but financially I'm not in a spot to do that at the moment. Is there any insight to what my next steps should be or is there anybody with experience on this brake that could help me?
 
I'm not much help with the control side, but when swapping from 480 to 230 did you check rotation? The solenoid valves are switching, is the pump running? If it is maybe its running reverse, I've seen it happen often.
 
That only applies to single phase motors in the system. The pump should be 3ph and not care. Same with the stepper motors on the back gauge.

If it saying over travel on X, does it have actual limit switches or is it based off encoder readings?
 
That only applies to single phase motors in the system. The pump should be 3ph and not care. Same with the stepper motors on the back gauge.

If it saying over travel on X, does it have actual limit switches or is it based off encoder readings?
Why would the pump rotation direction not matter? I guess if it's a piston pump it could be reversed, but then you may have a charge pump that is still usually directional.
 
Good luck man. This is exactly why I got told to buy a limit switch machine and not a cnc. When they work they work, when they don’t they are just a paper weight.

As dethmachine said I would make sure the phase is correct. I hooked my brake up backwards and it would not move at all either. Swapped the phases and bingo.
 
That only applies to single phase motors in the system. The pump should be 3ph and not care. Same with the stepper motors on the back gauge.

If it saying over travel on X, does it have actual limit switches or is it based off encoder readings?

I'm not much help with the control side, but when swapping from 480 to 230 did you check rotation? The solenoid valves are switching, is the pump running? If it is maybe its running reverse, I've seen it happen often.
The machine uses a combo of limit switches and encoders for location . The way the brake works you power on the control, then power on the pumps. the pumps run continuously, regardless of if the brake is moving or not. When I first rewired it the rotation for one of the motors was backwards, but I corrected that quickly and verified that all the motors are rotating correctly. I'll try to upload some pics later today of the machine
 
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So it looks like imgur cut the video down from 7min to one. Here is a link to the video on book of faces

Back when I had a facebook the group press brakes anonymous seemed to have a good bit of knowledge on controls. Are you in it?
 
Is it homing the axi to know where it is?
I was able to get it indexing today and able to get the main beam to move about 2" down and up under manual control. I also got the backgauge working as it should and properly indexed. I'm at a loss of why the beam will only travel 2" but its a small step in the right direction. Messing with it tonight was cut short due to it shredding the R axis drive belt
 
Is there any chance the machine had light curtains at one time? If it did and they were removed, it is possible the machine wouldn't operate.
 
Is there any chance the machine had light curtains at one time? If it did and they were removed, it is possible the machine wouldn't operate.
it has safety laser beams.Odly enough when I disabled them was when I was finally able to make the beam move a few inches
 
I wouldn't say it was odd. After moving it, there is a pretty good chance that things are out of alignment. Removing the "safety features" tends to point me further in that direction.
 
I wouldn't say it was odd. After moving it, there is a pretty good chance that things are out of alignment. Removing the "safety features" tends to point me further in that direction.
Its a non factory laser beam, and I was told by 3 different repair people they are nothing but problems
 
holy batshit wiring mess that thing brings........... maybe an MIT professor machine engineer could fix it....... i'd look at ways to
completely eliminate all the CNC crap and make it a full manual machine.......... adjustable limit switches for depth...... a manual-drive
for back space hard stop.......... bingo riffic.
 
I have an older Wysong CNC hydraulic press brake. I bought it with control problems, thinking there was a 50/50 chance of getting it working.
We never succeeded, and I ended up buying a retrofit CNC controller for it. It is light years ahead of the controller it came with, but it was about $15k all in and done.
 
I have an older Wysong CNC hydraulic press brake. I bought it with control problems, thinking there was a 50/50 chance of getting it working.
We never succeeded, and I ended up buying a retrofit CNC controller for it. It is light years ahead of the controller it came with, but it was about $15k all in and done.
which retrofit controller did you buy? We have an old All Steel (Piranha) that has some backgauge problems and i'm thinking of just doing a full controller upgrade on it.

I spoke to the guys at PC Controls at a trade show and they seem to have a decent system. CNC Press Brake Control Upgrade | PC Controls

thanks!
 
which retrofit controller did you buy? We have an old All Steel (Piranha) that has some backgauge problems and i'm thinking of just doing a full controller upgrade on it.

I spoke to the guys at PC Controls at a trade show and they seem to have a decent system. CNC Press Brake Control Upgrade | PC Controls

thanks!
I'm planning to upgrade my control and backgauge to a 6axis from enutron. They want $60k to retofit my brake
 
I'm planning to upgrade my control and backgauge to a 6axis from enutron. They want $60k to retofit my brake
Is a full control system really needed for the parts your building? A simple controller for the back guage, and limit switches for ram travel.

Cheap and making parts. 60k f-that.
 
Is a full control system really needed for the parts your building? A simple controller for the back guage, and limit switches for ram travel.

Cheap and making parts. 60k f-that.
my current 3 axis will get it done for the most part. There was less than a $5k difference in cost as most of the money was in the controller.
 
Mine is a Fasfold by CNC Automation. It is pretty cool, uses a touchscreen to draw the part, keypad to enter important data and saves the file for repeatable parts.
I talked to the guys at PC Controls also. I agree they have a good product, and probably better service than I got.
 
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