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4x4 Van? I need one…

truckin222

Highway Miles
Joined
May 22, 2020
Member Number
1145
Messages
61
So I need a van for work.
I don’t technically “need” it to be 4wd but I’m pretty determined that it will be.
Basically I’m a mobile mechanic but work for the movies… gotta haul tools and spares and bs and be a spot to work out of the elements sometimes.
Ideally it would replace my 2wd 7.3 F250 as a tow rig also. But you never see people towing with a van. Why?
Doubling as a camp spot when wheeling would be a big bonus too, but not looking to fckn live in it or anything…
Anyway, who’s had a 4x4 van?
I’ve looked at a bunch of Quigly converted vans online but none are local so…
Looked at some individuals conversions also but the “engineering” was a bit dodgy.
Looking for any feedback/experiences/pics whatever…
 
If you do Picture Cars, please make sure you have room to carry extra batteries :flipoff2:
 
Most don't tow big with vans because they don't have the wheelbase for heavy towing.

But I remember being a kid we had two late 80s early 90s econoline club wagons and towed a 30 foot camper all over Canada.


But vans are ghey!
 
4x4 vans prices are insane, you need to build one!

just so happens,
i have a '98 e350 7.3l psd. 220k mi and about 3k on a new trans. has a little lift and a winch hid behind the front bumper.

also have a '10 4x4 superduty with a bad motor. so the axles and tcase needed.



buy the van i'll thsrow in the sd for free! haha. then start a build thread, slap it together and profit:smokin:





edit* the extended van towing suffer from its big ass end. the hitch is about a foot further behind the axle than it would be on a truck. and the brakes aren't as great as a newer superduty... but you going to put sd axles in so that solves the brake problem, and a ballanced load or a load leveler setup sovle the issue of too much rear overhang.


i used my van for everything and if it weren't that i need a rig i can easily forklift thing in and out of, i would still use it. but it just sits maybe gets driven once a month or so when my main work truck is loaded down with a project.
 
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Where are you located? Building one isn’t out of the question.
 
Ford is coming out with a factory 4x4 transit. If you got the long wheelbase without the extended body and an eco boost it would be a legit tow rig/ work vehicle within reason.
Its been out for 2 years or so however its not showing up on the build and buy section of ford right now.
 
Local brown people that make badass tacos outta a trailer, have a lil longer than normal van. 3/4 or 1 ton i dunno. Has a v10 in it! I keep trying to buy the damn thing
 
Jeffh555 has a multipurpose 4x4 van as his "do everything" thing

Prepare for a long post with lots of van opinions:

I have a 01 7.3L E350, 4x4 on 37s, with a pop top. I tow my JK with it, camp out of it, do Home Depot runs with it, etc. I love it, and would build another if I had to replace this one. I'm not sure I'd build it exactly the same, more on that later.

It “does everything” that my 1ton JK doesn’t do, and there’s some significant overlap. I’ll take the van on a mild local wheeling trip (Hollister Hills) if I don’t feel like loading the trailer and nobody is bringing any built trucks/buggies.

I love that I always have my camper. On Rubicon/Fordyce trips I'll sleep in the van at the trailhead on the first and/or last night of the trip. On Sand Hollow trips I'll break the drive in half and camp on BLM land in the Mojave desert. With the power pop top I have camp set up in a couple minutes, without getting out of my seat, and without waking the kiddo. I'm going to JV for the first time with the pop top and kid in 6 weeks, we'll see how that goes. For mountain bike rides, I always have cold beer in the fridge for after ride, and I can put a bike inside the van and not worry about it getting stolen off the rack.

It tows plenty well for me, with about 7k behind it. I can't comment on more weight. Flat ground it'll do 75-80 no problem. I can hold 55-60 all the way to Fordyce. Here's some comparisons from my experience. We had a '16 Duramax 2500 at my last job and pulled a 28ft box trailer that weighed about 7k, and I'd say it was maybe 20% nicer to drive. A buddy's '19 6.7L PowerStroke was roughly similar to the Dmax. My buddy had a 2V V10 F350, and I'd say it was maybe 10% nicer to drive towing than my van.

I used to DD it, then got a shitbox DD. It wouldn't be any worse to DD than any similar era/spec truck. Firing up a 7.3L diesel to drive 9 minutes to work gets old.

I agree the pricing on 4x4 vans is dumb, and you pretty much have to build your own. Most of the factory converted ones are borderline junk. I used the U-Joint Off-road conversion kit, which uses 99-04 super duty axles and leaf springs. It’s been on there for over 4 years and it has been flawless. It drives and tows better than stock, but the stock parts had 250k+ on them. I did the conversion in my driveway with a few buddies working casually, and it took 3 days, including the transmission swap and t-case install.

In the years since I did my conversion, ExpoVans and Colorado Campervan have also started doing 4x4 conversions, I believe both with 05+ Super Duty axles and coil springs. Neither list DIY kits on their site, but it would be worth a call.

IMO, if you want a 4x4 van and want to tow with it, a converted E350 with a 7.3L or V10 is the way to go. E250 would technically be the same, but I find most have 5.4L V8s. 6.0L PowerStroke was available, and are, well, 6.0s.

Chevy Express and Dodge Ram van require all custom work to convert, and have worse engine/trans options. You might be able to make an argument for a Duramax or 6.0L gas Express van, but they also have tiny wheel wells. The AWD Express was only offered as a 1500 with a 5.3L.

Here's some of the downsides of towing with a 4x4 E350 that I see.

Your friends will make free candy jokes for at least a decade

The E-series was released in '92, and Ford refreshed them in '97, and '08, ending production in '14, so they're all nearly 10 years old. If you want a 7.3L, it's 20 years old. You get to enjoy 10-20 years of wear and tear. You also get all the creature comforts available in what was basically a work truck 10-20 years ago. You want adaptive cruise control and heated seats, good luck. Door seals that were designed in the last quarter century, not gonna happen.

The 7.3L PowerStroke didn't get an intercooler, and there's only a few people that I've found that have done custom intercooler setups on them.

Ford never put the 3V V10 in the e-series, so even if you get a late model V10, it's got the motor they stopped putting in the trucks in '04.

They're loud. You're sitting on top of the motor in a vehicle with minimal sound deadening and 15 year old seals. I'm working on gradually improving this, but it's never gonna match what a new truck does.

In my opinion, if you’re going solid axle under an E-series, you need 6” of lift to get enough front suspension up travel for it to work well. 6" lift on 35s or 37s is tall. My wife and I are tall, and our 4 year old has figured out how to crawl in/out, so it's not an issue for me, but my my MIL couldn't get in if she needed to. Maybe that's a benefit.

The extended body is worth it for the extra room in side, but it does tow a tiny bit little worse. I had a 5.4L regular body before this one. Both length vans have the same wheelbase. The Chevy extended body has a longer wheelbase, one more point for GM.

No "dirty" cargo space like a truck. I have a tarp, a hitch mounted cargo rack, and a trailer and can usually move whatever I need with a combo of those 3. Occasionally I'll borrow my dad's beater pickup, but it's pretty rare.

If I were to do it again, I'd probably do the same thing, but I'd think hard about a few other options:

When I built it, I was riding a motorcycle most days, then driving the van if I was being too much of a bitch to ride in the rain. Since then, I had a kid, and have to pick him up from daycare every day, so I got a DD. Now the van is just used for towing/camping. I might build a short bus for that.

The 7.3L is loud and the leaf sprung solid axle isn't fast off-road. I might prefer a V10 and TTB swap it, so I have something that can eat up dirt roads better. I also might look at a 05+ Super Duty 60 coil sprung swap, but I think the real issue is up-travel.

Buying a brand new E350 cutaway with the Godzilla 7.3L gas motor for about $45k and grafting the back of a donor van onto it would be a rad project that I would love to see done, but I don't know I want to undertake it.
 

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Prepare for a long post with lots of van opinions:

I have a 01 7.3L E350, 4x4 on 37s, with a pop top. I tow my JK with it, camp out of it, do Home Depot runs with it, etc. I love it, and would build another if I had to replace this one. I'm not sure I'd build it exactly the same, more on that later.

It “does everything” that my 1ton JK doesn’t do, and there’s some significant overlap. I’ll take the van on a mild local wheeling trip (Hollister Hills) if I don’t feel like loading the trailer and nobody is bringing any built trucks/buggies.

I love that I always have my camper. On Rubicon/Fordyce trips I'll sleep in the van at the trailhead on the first and/or last night of the trip. On Sand Hollow trips I'll break the drive in half and camp on BLM land in the Mojave desert. With the power pop top I have camp set up in a couple minutes, without getting out of my seat, and without waking the kiddo. I'm going to JV for the first time with the pop top and kid in 6 weeks, we'll see how that goes. For mountain bike rides, I always have cold beer in the fridge for after ride, and I can put a bike inside the van and not worry about it getting stolen off the rack.

It tows plenty well for me, with about 7k behind it. I can't comment on more weight. Flat ground it'll do 75-80 no problem. I can hold 55-60 all the way to Fordyce. Here's some comparisons from my experience. We had a '16 Duramax 2500 at my last job and pulled a 28ft box trailer that weighed about 7k, and I'd say it was maybe 20% nicer to drive. A buddy's '19 6.7L PowerStroke was roughly similar to the Dmax. My buddy had a 2V V10 F350, and I'd say it was maybe 10% nicer to drive towing than my van.

I used to DD it, then got a shitbox DD. It wouldn't be any worse to DD than any similar era/spec truck. Firing up a 7.3L diesel to drive 9 minutes to work gets old.

I agree the pricing on 4x4 vans is dumb, and you pretty much have to build your own. Most of the factory converted ones are borderline junk. I used the U-Joint Off-road conversion kit, which uses 99-04 super duty axles and leaf springs. It’s been on there for over 4 years and it has been flawless. It drives and tows better than stock, but the stock parts had 250k+ on them. I did the conversion in my driveway with a few buddies working casually, and it took 3 days, including the transmission swap and t-case install.

In the years since I did my conversion, ExpoVans and Colorado Campervan have also started doing 4x4 conversions, I believe both with 05+ Super Duty axles and coil springs. Neither list DIY kits on their site, but it would be worth a call.

IMO, if you want a 4x4 van and want to tow with it, a converted E350 with a 7.3L or V10 is the way to go. E250 would technically be the same, but I find most have 5.4L V8s. 6.0L PowerStroke was available, and are, well, 6.0s.

Chevy Express and Dodge Ram van require all custom work to convert, and have worse engine/trans options. You might be able to make an argument for a Duramax or 6.0L gas Express van, but they also have tiny wheel wells. The AWD Express was only offered as a 1500 with a 5.3L.

Here's some of the downsides of towing with a 4x4 E350 that I see.

Your friends will make free candy jokes for at least a decade

The E-series was released in '92, and Ford refreshed them in '97, and '08, ending production in '14, so they're all nearly 10 years old. If you want a 7.3L, it's 20 years old. You get to enjoy 10-20 years of wear and tear. You also get all the creature comforts available in what was basically a work truck 10-20 years ago. You want adaptive cruise control and heated seats, good luck. Door seals that were designed in the last quarter century, not gonna happen.

The 7.3L PowerStroke didn't get an intercooler, and there's only a few people that I've found that have done custom intercooler setups on them.

Ford never put the 3V V10 in the e-series, so even if you get a late model V10, it's got the motor they stopped putting in the trucks in '04.

They're loud. You're sitting on top of the motor in a vehicle with minimal sound deadening and 15 year old seals. I'm working on gradually improving this, but it's never gonna match what a new truck does.

In my opinion, if you’re going solid axle under an E-series, you need 6” of lift to get enough front suspension up travel for it to work well. 6" lift on 35s or 37s is tall. My wife and I are tall, and our 4 year old has figured out how to crawl in/out, so it's not an issue for me, but my my MIL couldn't get in if she needed to. Maybe that's a benefit.

The extended body is worth it for the extra room in side, but it does tow a tiny bit little worse. I had a 5.4L regular body before this one. Both length vans have the same wheelbase. The Chevy extended body has a longer wheelbase, one more point for GM.

No "dirty" cargo space like a truck. I have a tarp, a hitch mounted cargo rack, and a trailer and can usually move whatever I need with a combo of those 3. Occasionally I'll borrow my dad's beater pickup, but it's pretty rare.

If I were to do it again, I'd probably do the same thing, but I'd think hard about a few other options:

When I built it, I was riding a motorcycle most days, then driving the van if I was being too much of a bitch to ride in the rain. Since then, I had a kid, and have to pick him up from daycare every day, so I got a DD. Now the van is just used for towing/camping. I might build a short bus for that.

The 7.3L is loud and the leaf sprung solid axle isn't fast off-road. I might prefer a V10 and TTB swap it, so I have something that can eat up dirt roads better. I also might look at a 05+ Super Duty 60 coil sprung swap, but I think the real issue is up-travel.

Buying a brand new E350 cutaway with the Godzilla 7.3L gas motor for about $45k and grafting the back of a donor van onto it would be a rad project that I would love to see done, but I don't know I want to undertake it.

How do you feel about the pop top vs a fixed high top after having it for 2ish years? Would your opinion be any different if you wernt like 7' tall?
 
I have a quigley box van, I really want to build another near the exact same but with a u-joint kit or Superduty radius arms (and mainly newer/no rust). But a van you could stand up in with bench/vice/toolbox inside would be a nice work rig. A 10' box would have minimal rear overhang if you were after better towing attributes.
 
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Allegedly ford makes a factory 4x4 Ecoboost transit (service docs indicate it exists) but I've never seen one. Current biggest engine offering in a T350 is the 3.5 Ecoboost AFAIK. Want bigger, get an E450 (good luck) but that gets you a lot more truckish (frame, V8, heavier rear suspension, not sure if you can get a 4x E450 though) of a vehicle. Transits are unibody, which I'm not a fan of for towing.
For dirt road and snowy road "wheeling" go for it. For much more than that, there is a lot hanging very low under there.
 
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How do you feel about the pop top vs a fixed high top after having it for 2ish years? Would your opinion be any different if you wernt like 7' tall?
I think it comes down to what you’re gonna use it for.

We went to the Adventure Van Expo and looked at a lot of vans and talked to a lot of people before deciding this direction. We found that the fixed high tops all felt claustrophobic and dark inside. The pop top walls are vertical and there are windows all around. My wife’s primary hobby is reading (good balance for my dumb expensive hobbies) so her main request was that she could sit up in bed and read. We also want our son’s bed to require next to no setup time, for when we pull into camp at midnight. Right now he just has a foam mattress on the floor, next to the dog crate, behind the 2nd row bench, but I want to build a bunk over a dog crate to reduce their footprint.

If I were young and didn’t have a kid, I’d probably go fixed roof. Guerrilla camping after bars/parties is fun. We don’t do that anymore anyway.

If I didn’t have a kid, I like the layout that has a “garage” in the back for bikes and other outdoor gear, and a fixed bed over it. The garage can be completely sealed and a “dirty” area. I think that layout goes well with the high fixed roof.

If you’re using it as a work vehicle and have a bench or parts bins in the back, you’re probably on your knees a lot. BedRug makes custom molded foam floors that make it so much more pleasant. You can get carpet or vinyl. If you were building a bangbus, it would also be a good application.

I’m 6’7”, I can stand inside the van with my hands over my head with the top up. I might feel different if I was an Oompa Loompa and could sleep across the van instead of front to back.
 
I have a quigley box van, I really want to build another near the exact same but with a u-joint kit or Superduty radius arms (and mainly newer/no rust). But a van you could stand up in with bench/vice/toolbox inside would be a nice work rig. A 10' box would have minimal rear overhang if you were after better towing attributes.
My last job also had a duramax box van with a workbench in it. It was a complete shit box of a vehicle, but I don’t think it was the vehicle’s fault, it was just ridden hard and put away wet.

I didn’t mind working out of it, but one thing to pay attention to is there’s a pretty big step up from the ground to the box van floor. Shorter or older guys hated using it because it’s so much work to step up and down all day long.
 
If I were you I would watch the classifieds and auctions and buy the first 4x4 ~10ft box truck or service body that comes up at the right price/milage/condition point regardless of truck or van.

But you never see people towing with a van. Why?
Because you're only paying attention to what rich suburban douchebags are doing. People who need to get shit done with a van have no problem towing with them.

Hire the local messicans to paint your manufacturing facility and I bet twelve of them show up in an airport van towing a trailer of supplies.

Ford is coming out with a factory 4x4 transit. If you got the long wheelbase without the extended body and an eco boost it would be a legit tow rig/ work vehicle within reason.
Do not get a euro van unless you just intend to depreciate it for tax purposes while riding the warranty and then sell it when one of those two is up. They drive like cars but they are absolutely dog shit as work vehicles unless your work involves hauling packing peanuts and even worse to work on.

I didn’t mind working out of it, but one thing to pay attention to is there’s a pretty big step up from the ground to the box van floor. Shorter or older guys hated using it because it’s so much work to step up and down all day long.
Not hard to build a step bumper.
 
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Has anyone done Isuzu NPR? Seems the Isuzu Turbodiesel with the Aisin trans should be adaptable to a newer Ram T-case (the Aisins in these are part of the same family) with a driver-drop front axle swap. 1 Ton Jeep FC!!!!
 
Have seen 4x4 vans on richie bros lately. Brought a reasonable price, if close enough . Shipping killed it for me. Guessing they were oil field stuff.
 
One of the tv wheelers did a cab over Ian or Fred . I do remember. It looked pretty straight forward.
 
If you want to DIY it, here is my write up on how I did my RV. A van is almost the same, different trans and you need to cut the gas tank, but it will give you an idea how easy it is to swap the front suspension, no kit needed.
RV.jpg



Here is the old Quigly, it was a 5.4 with sliding door, it was a good van, but gutless, really only ever towed a boat to Baja and was never happy about it.
van.jpg


New V10 van with hightop for wheelchair access and barn door, this has been awesome! BUT, the small cut fuel tank with a V10 is horrible in BAJA, you have to stop and find fuel a lot.
The wheelchair cut out is great as you don't bump your head getting in and out.
hightop.jpg
 
If I were you I would watch the classifieds and auctions and buy the first 4x4 ~10ft box truck or service body that comes up at the right price/milage/condition point regardless of truck or van.
That is pretty much what Java230 has isn't it? A F350 with a 10-12' box on the back.

Because you're only paying attention to what rich suburban douchebags are doing. People who need to get shit done with a van have no problem towing with them.

Hire the local messicans to paint your manufacturing facility and I bet twelve of them show up in an airport van towing a trailer of supplies.
Can't disagree with that, growing up we had a 1999 E350 with the 7.3 and it would pull anything we put behind it.
I have also towed with a 2004ish 15 passenger Chevy Express 3500 and I would take the Ford any day of the week.

The Ford had better mirrors and was more maneuverable (I also fit better in the Ford seats, the Chevy seats were sized for my 5' 3" 110# boss at the hotel that owned the vans) .
Edit: also worth noting that the Chevy had 3 in of carpet pad on the floor so the "floor" was even with the top of the seat brackets well the Ford just had the carpet below the brackets, so you had a little more headroom in the Ford as long as you were between the seat brackets.

Aaron Z
 
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That is pretty much what Java230 has isn't it? A F350 with a 10-12' box on the back.


Can't disagree with that, growing up we had a 1999 E350 with the 7.3 and it would pull anything we put behind it.
I have also towed with a 2004ish 15 passenger Chevy Express 3500 and I would take the Ford any day of the week.

The Ford had better mirrors and was more maneuverable (I also fit better in the Ford seats, the Chevy seats were sized for my 5' 3" 110# boss at the hotel that owned the vans) .

Aaron Z
Basically. I have a 450 with everyone's favorite 6.4 :lmao:box is 12'2 inside. And really tall.
 
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