Build Cuz I want a BUID Thread of my own! 76 F100 LB/360/C6/9"

So that didn't go as expected.

Pulled the intake and it has the full valley pan that I haven't seen in the motors I have done (admittedly ones produced nearly a decade prior) which explains the pushrod on sheet metal sound...

Pulled the 'offending' lifter....It was amazingly symmetric... and concave... to the point it had eaten thru the entire base of the lifter to wear a hole in the lifter into that area that is supposed to be pressurized... and then wear the camshaft to where the bumpy bit wasn't so bumpy or lumpy...

So... Melling cam, summit lifters and gaskets are on their way.

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And yes, that is a cart from Jegs, but their Paypal wouldn't work, so got essentially the same thing from Summit, but the cam is the same part number....

The owner wants to 'help' so he is coming over on Wednesday/Thursday. I know it means it will take twice as long and be twice as frustrating, but if he wants to learn I can't say no.

I will hopefully have the radiator out and measure to see if I have to pull the grill to get the cam out...

Anyway, one step forward and 5 steps back...
 
rattle_snake said:
Pull the heads and port the exhaust side, 'while you're in there'.
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Not mine.... I told him the head with the thermactor bump were not a performance head, and he wants more than that will do... and I know if I redo the top end the bottom end is soon to go...

i just want this thing to go away for a while so I can get my own **** done and it quits taking a parking space...
 
Owner is coming over today to work with me on the cam swap. Gonna make him take the PS, water pump and alt off and then get it to TDC, and finally pull the balancer.

Rad is out already, intake and valve train is already out.

So it should probably take twice as long as doing it myself...

But hey, he is bringing pizza, so all is good.
 
71PA_Highboy said:
Owner is coming over today to work with me on the cam swap. Gonna make him take the PS, water pump and alt off and then get it to TDC, and finally pull the balancer.

Rad is out already, intake and valve train is already out.

So it should probably take twice as long as doing it myself...

But hey, he is bringing pizza, so all is good.
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are you just there for moral support? :laughing:
 
So the owner came over the last 2 nights...

The good: He is truly happy and excited to work on his turd. He takes advice well, always willing to 'just do it' and enjoys learning different tips and tricks I can show him.
The bad: We are working on a 360..
The ugly: It is getting worse the farther we get into it.


He knows this thread is here... i told him to sign up and take over this thread... we will see if he does... (Hint hint)

Anyway, lifter doesn't , the cam lobe isn't and when we rock the crank back and forth we can see and hear a wristpin sliding around and 'clanking' . Gonna borrow a friend's Borescope to REALLY get a better look, but I have written this engine off.

So, I have a 390 I have been sitting on for 20+ years. valve cover sticker says it is a 1970. Was in a truck and I picked it up and set it aside for when I 'got around to it'... and it was still sitting there. I had assumed it was all original, no knowledge of the mileage.

Since we need an engine we started disassembling it last night, and it is ALL ORIGINAL. Aluminum/plastic timing gear with a sloppy stamped link timing chain, original gaskets, water pump, fuel pump....

Goal here is to get the 390 running as a temp engine with some slight upgrades and reliability parts replacement. This truck is a nostalgia driver, not a pavement pounder or racer, an occasional trip to the big box store, etc.


Gonna do new rods/mains (just polish the crank), new rings with just enough crosshatch to make them seat, no new pistons unless we show more than .020 over, new oil pump, new water pump (could probably use the one off the 360) and since we have it, new cam and lifters.
New 4v intake and new Holley carb. Move the Duraspark over, new fuel pump. Hopefully just lap the valves but once we get the heads off we will see.


Engine goal is to just put something running into the truck that will allow him to use the truck for whatever he wants to for a couple of years while he builds out the long term plan. Knowing this is a nostalgia build really changes timeline and finances, so a bit of flexibility is in there as well.

I am 'donating' the engine as a temp use for him with the agreement that when it comes back to me it is complete and running.... so I will have a freshened up 390 as a real spare instead of an unknown anchor in the corner of the shop.

working down the list of parts to order (rock auto listings):
Timing Chain CLOYES C3029
Oil Pump MELLING M57
Gasket set ( Head gaskets and valve stem seals included) FEL-PRO 2601035
Balancer sleeve BCA NS88187
Cylinder head dowel pins PIONEER S1113
Fuel pump DELPHI MF0064
Oil pressure sender STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS TS58T
Temp sender STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS TS58
Brass freeze plug set MELLING MPE110BR


Summit parts
Intake Edelbrock Performer Intake Manifolds 2105
Carb Holley 4160 Part# 0-80457S


So who can explain to me the differences between the old school Holley, the Brawler and the Quick Fuel carbs - all of which are made and sold by Holley.


bearings and rings will come later once we get the rest of the engine torn down, but those are some of the cheaper pieces....


Other parts:
Header gaskets
Main bearings
Rod bearings
Rings
5/16 Stainless tube x 4' or (instead of pre-bent new fuel line)
 
Well, he told me to sign up, so here I am. Figured I better get in here before he tells y'all about the time I put the balancer on backwards.

For the record, I did NOT just "help" — I also provided world-class flashlight holding. The man said "hold the f***ing flashlight so I can see" and I delivered. Minimal flinching. Only pointed it at the ceiling twice, and one of those was a sneeze.

As for the 360... yeah. I'm not gonna lie, hearing "wristpin clanking" wasn't on my bingo card. I showed up Tuesday thinking cam swap, hold the flashlight, home by 9. Instead I'm standing there watching a grown man stare into my engine like a doctor about to tell me the patient didn't make it. He didn't even have to say anything — the silence and the slow head shake told me everything. That engine didn't just die, it wrote a note first. I left with a parts list longer than my marriage certificate and a 390 I've been told I'm "borrowing." I'm pretty sure that's how you end up building someone else's engine for free, but the man's letting me learn on his dime and his patience, so I'm not asking questions.
 
I dunno about the carb differences, I think they are minor features just to have multiple product lines. Parts should interchange. Like Ford Lincoln Mercury.

but

I can't see buying a new carburetor at EFI prices.
 
76FE_WIP said:
Well, he told me to sign up, so here I am. Figured I better get in here before he tells y'all about the time I put the balancer on backwards.

For the record, I did NOT just "help" — I also provided world-class flashlight holding. The man said "hold the f***ing flashlight so I can see" and I delivered. Minimal flinching. Only pointed it at the ceiling twice, and one of those was a sneeze.

As for the 360... yeah. I'm not gonna lie, hearing "wristpin clanking" wasn't on my bingo card. I showed up Tuesday thinking cam swap, hold the flashlight, home by 9. Instead I'm standing there watching a grown man stare into my engine like a doctor about to tell me the patient didn't make it. He didn't even have to say anything — the silence and the slow head shake told me everything. That engine didn't just die, it wrote a note first. I left with a parts list longer than my marriage certificate and a 390 I've been told I'm "borrowing." I'm pretty sure that's how you end up building someone else's engine for free, but the man's letting me learn on his dime and his patience, so I'm not asking questions.
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welcome and congrats!
 
71PA_Highboy said:
So who can explain to me the differences between the old school Holley, the Brawler and the Quick Fuel carbs - all of which are made and sold by Holley.
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Adjustability for sure.
That style holley has little to none besides primary jets, powervalves & secondary springs. The street warrior is just the same old classic 1850 600 holley that has been around for decades.

QFT version such as THIS has an awesome vacuum secondary pod adjustable with screw, changable air bleeds, idle feeds, primary and secondary jets, clear sight glass for float height etc..

Quick fuel and brawler are more performance oriented so you may need to lean out the IFR's or play with air bleeds to get idle and cruising fuel right. the 1850 style holley will be a bolt on and go for stock/mild engine.
 
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76FE_WIP said:
For the record, I did NOT just "help" — I also provided world-class flashlight holding. The man said "hold the f***ing flashlight so I can see" and I delivered. Minimal flinching. Only pointed it at the ceiling twice, and one of those was a sneeze.
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Someone has taught you well
 
Not that I am going to use it but I have never seen a timing chain with these marks...

1778792001426.png
I am assuming that you line them up with the mark on the cam gear to set cam timing, but when we got in there it looked waaaay off.

And with the tooth count it makes no sense in my head.

I am used to the old style that you could set for +2 or -2 that were keyed differently, but nothing like this.

Going to a nice Cloyes double roller in the next iteration so no worries, just wondered.
 
76FE_WIP said:
Well, he told me to sign up, so here I am. Figured I better get in here before he tells y'all about the time I put the balancer on backwards.

For the record, I did NOT just "help" — I also provided world-class flashlight holding. The man said "hold the f***ing flashlight so I can see" and I delivered. Minimal flinching. Only pointed it at the ceiling twice, and one of those was a sneeze.

As for the 360... yeah. I'm not gonna lie, hearing "wristpin clanking" wasn't on my bingo card. I showed up Tuesday thinking cam swap, hold the flashlight, home by 9. Instead I'm standing there watching a grown man stare into my engine like a doctor about to tell me the patient didn't make it. He didn't even have to say anything — the silence and the slow head shake told me everything. That engine didn't just die, it wrote a note first. I left with a parts list longer than my marriage certificate and a 390 I've been told I'm "borrowing." I'm pretty sure that's how you end up building someone else's engine for free, but the man's letting me learn on his dime and his patience, so I'm not asking questions.
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I will send ya a fin, if you flash the light in his eyes for me.
 
So here is the update:

The 390 I have had sitting around for 15-20 years (I know - hoarder) became the donor as I suspected it was in better shape than the one I bought last year.

To supplement his flashlight holding skills (Not sure I would call them 'world class') I made 76FE_WIP do all the disassembly and play 'baby catcher' to the pistons as I drove them out.

Turns out it was in PHENOMINAL shape. It was completely original, everything is original FOMOCO parts.

Here is what we found:
very little rust... mostly in the water jacket
Almost no measurable ridge in the bore.
Original timing chain with very little wear and no cracking on the plastic teeth.
Pistons are remarkably clean and the rings have zero carbon buildup.
Valves are tight and the OEM valve stem seals are still pliable.
The usual broken exhaust bolts.

The rod bearings all had the same wear pattern with a small amount of copper showing... Not sure why but I am suspecting either a thrust bearing issue (and those LOOKED fine, but....) or a manufacturing defect on the bearing babbit thickness on that production run. It was from a manual trans vehicle, so I will look again to see if it might have been from clutch pressure.

Mains all looked really good, no copper showing.

The engine had an asphalt film from probably using Pennzoil (it was from Oil City PA after all) and infrequent oil changes.

After we get everything cleaned up and mic'd out I am expecting to use stock sized rod and main bearings and stock piston rings... it is just amazing for a 56 yo engine.

Gonna do a little purple power and pressure washing cleanup tomorrow, then off to the machine shop for a hot tank.

All the parts on the above parts list are here, gonna need some permatex #2b, some right stuff, some rtv, and then we should be good to go as soon as we get the heavy bits back from the machine shop.... I am sure I am forgetting something....
 
71PA_Highboy said:
So here is the update:

The 390 I have had sitting around for 15-20 years (I know - hoarder) became the donor as I suspected it was in better shape than the one I bought last year.

To supplement his flashlight holding skills (Not sure I would call them 'world class') I made 76FE_WIP do all the disassembly and play 'baby catcher' to the pistons as I drove them out.

Turns out it was in PHENOMINAL shape. It was completely original, everything is original FOMOCO parts.

Here is what we found:
very little rust... mostly in the water jacket
Almost no measurable ridge in the bore.
Original timing chain with very little wear and no cracking on the plastic teeth.
Pistons are remarkably clean and the rings have zero carbon buildup.
Valves are tight and the OEM valve stem seals are still pliable.
The usual broken exhaust bolts.

The rod bearings all had the same wear pattern with a small amount of copper showing... Not sure why but I am suspecting either a thrust bearing issue (and those LOOKED fine, but....) or a manufacturing defect on the bearing babbit thickness on that production run. It was from a manual trans vehicle, so I will look again to see if it might have been from clutch pressure.

Mains all looked really good, no copper showing.

The engine had an asphalt film from probably using Pennzoil (it was from Oil City PA after all) and infrequent oil changes.

After we get everything cleaned up and mic'd out I am expecting to use stock sized rod and main bearings and stock piston rings... it is just amazing for a 56 yo engine.

Gonna do a little purple power and pressure washing cleanup tomorrow, then off to the machine shop for a hot tank.

All the parts on the above parts list are here, gonna need some permatex #2b, some right stuff, some rtv, and then we should be good to go as soon as we get the heavy bits back from the machine shop.... I am sure I am forgetting something....
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Phenomenal engine condition AND you forgot to mention I have to source a whole new cab because the original is a rust-riddled bucket masquerading as sheet metal. Sure, I'll just add 'Indiana Find a Cab Jones' right between 'baby catcher' and 'world class flashlight holder' on my resume. At least the engine has better bones than the truck it's going into. Also, 'not sure I would call them world class' — I held a flashlight while you swung things at pistons. That's not assistance, that's a trust exercise. I want a raise!

All jokes aside — I know I lucked out finding someone willing to teach instead of just DO. Every busted exhaust bolt and copper-kissed bearing is a lesson I'll carry into the next build. And the one after that. And probably the one where I finally find a cab that isn't held together by memories and tetanus.
 
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