67 C10 with Camaro running gear

All of these threads probably get more views than you realize. I don't typically post many comments or "likes", but that doesn't mean I'm not looking. Even if it isn't wheeling related its still fun to go through someone's thread and see the progress they've made or how they have overcome different problems. I pick up a lot of ideas just looking through all the build threads.
 
We have been doing other **** because the weather has been nice but have slowly chipped away at it. He is also officially on Christmas break now until the sixth so hopefully a lot of progress is coming up. Did get the cab mounts finalized and we got the front frame horns to hold the core support tacked on before we went to shoot clays this afternoon
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Off the table and on the lift to start running system/plumbing. Front half of shaft needs 2.7”.
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Love this shot, keeps me motivated
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Wish the long tubes I bought didn’t hang down below the frame. There is no reason for it on Camaro or this.
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Here is first stab at bed support and carrier bearing mount. First real non temporary crossmember the frame gets as well
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For some reason they changed the way the back of the transmission mounted between the 10 to 15 and the 16 and up TR6060. I bought a motor mount and transmission mount kit, but this later model transmission does not match the earlier model mount. The later model mount is two large cast aluminum pieces with three little rubber snubber between them and they only sell the three little snubbers. I’m not going to try to replicate that out of metal I will just throw it on some poly leaf spring bushings or something. They obviously want more torsional control than the old single post 4L 60 mount or otherwise, both of the outer bushings are on an upward slope. I will throw something together and it will be good enough for the amount of time this thing will ever be together
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Weather has been unreasonably amazing for KC, we have been outside soaking it up. Cold front just blew in, shop time is back.
Took way too long making the carrier bearing and bed mount. Also got the crossmember rear of that cut to length and ready to weld in. One more at the front and it’s back off the table and on the lift.
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All crossmembers welded in, table out and it’s on the lift where we can run it up and down. Putting in oil and harness etc and running fuel lines here in a bit to see if we can hear it fire.
 
I guess I didn’t take a single picture today. After the fabrication mentioned above, the boy installed the headers and had to weld up the dipstick tube, installed the starter and put oil in it as well as running some other wiring. We messed around with the tank for quite a while trying to get it in such a spot that it is up out of the way and not going to be too close to the exhaust. We got the main pressure fuel line ran to the engine and then started trying to figure out this harness and PDC that I bought secondhand. When the guy took it out of the roadster it was in he used a wire cutters in several spots. As of tonight I have figured out everything I need to to make it run hopefully tomorrow.
 
Ok, lots going on and crunch time is looming, he will be back to school on the 6th.

Brakes. I've only plumbed from scratch things that are offroad. Both front and rear cradle retained their soft lines and holders, just need to run hard lines to them from the factory master cylinder. Prop valve? Just Tees? Good cheap all in one kit I can flare and install with what I need you've used before? ETA, master has 1/4 leaving both ports. All 4 wheels are 3/16 hard line.

Slave cylinder lines. Has stock '10 master and '18 slave. It is a push in and wire keeper fitting on both ends. Do I convert to AN and go from there with a custom SS braided line, or other stock style solutions? Never messed with this before.

Current harness from a street rod does not have an alternator plug. Will this thing need triggered to charge or does it talk to the ecm (E67 gen IV), internally regulated? Getting close to ditching this harness for a cleaner one with a better fuse block.

Anyone have an opinion on whether I should run my manual trans fluid through a cooler or just loop it input to output? Can order rad with internal cooler. Don't plan on tracking the **** out of this thing. Fittings on the trans look like auto tranny cooler line fittings with the little wire clip, they are 6 ORB into the case. Thinking just go ORB to an, likely 6 as I have a bunch of -6 builder kits from various stuff.

Several other things on the list, heard it fire twice today but doesn't seem to want to hit and run. No MAF currently, I seem to have misplaced both intake systems with MAF in them somehow. Couple vacuum leaks, otherwise its all hooked up. 62 psi of fuel at rail. Good hot spark, new plugs. No way to tell injectors are firing, plug smells faintly of fuel.
Reply with recommendations of what you've used (if you purchase like a poor person) I need to get some **** coming.


Also, was having beers in the shop last night under it on the lift. Grabbed the drivers tire and was ripping forward/backward on it and the passenger seems to be locked to it, no slip apparent. Grab driveshaft, immobilize it, see if I can get it to act like a differential, seems locked. Go to pass side, hold driveshaft, spin tire........clunk clunk clunk. Tire goes around with some force, pinion and other tire do not. OK, **** it I'll look at it tomorrow. Today the boy is there with more hands and eyes, I hold pinion, he turns pass tire, shaft is turning, inner cv is not, has a blown cv but the shaft is still centered and not swimming or flopping, so I assume splines stripped on shaft or star of cv. Oh well, we have a spare rear. You can see this diff as out recently on the yellow car, witness marks on all bolt heads, plus new yamabond on the rear cover look quite new. Wonder if someone put in a locker, broke and axle and wrapped it around a tree, or they swapped in broken junk and got the insurance payoff? Time will tell, but I'm planning on running the blue car rear cradle and tearing into the yellow car one that's currently under it to see what we are dealing with.
 
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Java230 said:
Hard lines with prop valve. Ni-copper lines are pretty easy to use.

Get a good flare tool. I have this one and like it https://amzn.to/491KSMu
Click to expand...
I have a Mastercool version of that and its nice, but it pales in comparison to my Eastwood flaring tool:

www.eastwood.com

Eastwood Professional Brake Line and Tubing Flaring Tool

Create 3 kinds of precision flares, in 5 sizes of tubing
www.eastwood.com www.eastwood.com

These are just easier to use and you get perfect, leak free flares 100% of the time. I don’t even get the Mastercool out anymore.

You can get a 37 degree flare kit for the same frame as well.
 
Blacksheep10 said:
Have decent flare tool, looking at NiCopp lines, curious on prop valve and getting from 1/4 to 3/16 downstream
Click to expand...
I would change to 3/16 at the master also.

I used a willwood prop valve last time, simple and cheap.
 
Blacksheep10 said:
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From what I understand, the 2 pin is for having the ECU run it PWM. So without a 2 pin alt plug in the harness, there's no communication with the ECU obviously.

Not the end of the world though.

Read this.....

speedmaxinnovation.com

Almost ALL the late GM Alternator Information you could need!!

ALTERNATOR INFORMATION. So let's get this ironed out now. I see so many questions about alternators, and honestly, I see a LOT of wrong answers. I'm not the most informed on the situation, but I will share all the data I have to help some of you guys out. The LS engine came with many different...
speedmaxinnovation.com


And then have a look at this....

speedmaxinnovation.com

(SMI-ALT44C) 2 Pin GM Alternator Control Module

Extremely backorder right now. Delays are over 2 months Do you have the new 2-pin style alternator in your swap application? These alternators take a certain PWM signal to make them charge correctly. they are a variable voltage unit, and can command anywhere from 12v to 15.3v output from the...
speedmaxinnovation.com
 
Lots more today. Still not running. We have spark as stated, injectors aren't firing. Hooked up a buddy's laptop with HP, it sees the pedal sweeping 20-100% throttle, the throttle blade is not moving with it. When you key on the throttle blade flaps several degrees then back, assuming it finds zero each time or something. When you manually manipulate the throttle blade, the ecm and HP see the position. So the motor is working commanded by ecm, the TPS is working, so I have a hard time thinking I have a hard parts/wiring problem. When cranking it sees rpm so good crank signal. All the injector values are set to zero, even when we dropped the tune from another 6.0 gen 4 e67 ecm with identical parts.. This is a GMPP connect and cruise ls3 E67 harness and ecm. Not sure what the hell we don't have hooked up or calibrated properly. My buddy and I are walking around in the dark as neither of us know what we are actually doing when it comes to engine management computer stuff.

Trans isn't going to work without more money/work. The 10-15 TR6060 has a fully splined input, the 16-24 has a shoulder off the end where the splines don't go as far toward the engine. All the 16 up units had dual disc clutches. The flywheel is maybe also spaced different on the LT platform. The LT flywheel is 8 bolt, the LS is 6. Mcleod said $1500 plus shipping for a flywheel/clutch/spacer for under the slave. I've found some info searching around about guys getting away with various mixes of stuff, maybe some without full spline engagement. I was told this trans from from an 18 1LE, TUET16881. I cant find the specs for this exact trans anywhere on the web, just redirects for the Magnum XL thats a couple digits off. If this is a 650 ft/lb unit and going to a 10-15 TR like the TUET12030 I found in Omaha that's 450 ft/lb rated is a huge downgrade, makes me want to make this work. I can buy the early fully splined input but don't really feel like swapping inputs. If its a big upgrade for less money, I might lean that way. Then I run the brand new clutch I already have and space the slave out and be done. Have an email into Tremec to see if they will tell me the specs.

Bought all brake stuff, the better flare tool recommended, a straightener and prop valve. Probably tink with mounting pedals tomorrow unless somebody feels energetic on computer stuff and stops by.

Alternator, the recommended control unit for $140 or however much it is is backordered for quite a while (months), a replacement alt that bolts in with exciter wire is like $150, in the air on that one. I have some time I guess.

Really wish I have more progress, I can see the boy getting frustrated this last day.5 where it seems we just find problems, order parts, and wait on that item and move onto another problem we didn't expect. Really wanted it running by NYE, but them's the breaks
 
Blacksheep10 said:
Lots more today. Still not running. We have spark as stated, injectors aren't firing. Hooked up a buddy's laptop with HP, it sees the pedal sweeping 20-100% throttle, the throttle blade is not moving with it. When you key on the throttle blade flaps several degrees then back, assuming it finds zero each time or something. When you manually manipulate the throttle blade, the ecm and HP see the position. So the motor is working commanded by ecm, the TPS is working, so I have a hard time thinking I have a hard parts/wiring problem. When cranking it sees rpm so good crank signal. All the injector values are set to zero, even when we dropped the tune from another 6.0 gen 4 e67 ecm with identical parts.. This is a GMPP connect and cruise ls3 E67 harness and ecm. Not sure what the hell we don't have hooked up or calibrated properly. My buddy and I are walking around in the dark as neither of us know what we are actually doing when it comes to engine management computer stuff.

Trans isn't going to work without more money/work. The 10-15 TR6060 has a fully splined input, the 16-24 has a shoulder off the end where the splines don't go as far toward the engine. All the 16 up units had dual disc clutches. The flywheel is maybe also spaced different on the LT platform. The LT flywheel is 8 bolt, the LS is 6. Mcleod said $1500 plus shipping for a flywheel/clutch/spacer for under the slave. I've found some info searching around about guys getting away with various mixes of stuff, maybe some without full spline engagement. I was told this trans from from an 18 1LE, TUET16881. I cant find the specs for this exact trans anywhere on the web, just redirects for the Magnum XL thats a couple digits off. If this is a 650 ft/lb unit and going to a 10-15 TR like the TUET12030 I found in Omaha that's 450 ft/lb rated is a huge downgrade, makes me want to make this work. I can buy the early fully splined input but don't really feel like swapping inputs. If its a big upgrade for less money, I might lean that way. Then I run the brand new clutch I already have and space the slave out and be done. Have an email into Tremec to see if they will tell me the specs.

Bought all brake stuff, the better flare tool recommended, a straightener and prop valve. Probably tink with mounting pedals tomorrow unless somebody feels energetic on computer stuff and stops by.

Alternator, the recommended control unit for $140 or however much it is is backordered for quite a while (months), a replacement alt that bolts in with exciter wire is like $150, in the air on that one. I have some time I guess.

Really wish I have more progress, I can see the boy getting frustrated this last day.5 where it seems we just find problems, order parts, and wait on that item and move onto another problem we didn't expect. Really wanted it running by NYE, but them's the breaks
Click to expand...
Are cam/crank signals in agreement?
Like in sync, does it need a "learn".

Does it show injector duty cycle?

Alternator is OEM to the engine but not the ECM?
A PWM signal should be easy enough to create, id try to use the ECM to do it before anything else.

This do it?
gkgoodcheapparts.com

Widget Man PCA -- PWM Frequency and Polarity Corrector UPC 76757199923

MATCH ANY e-FAN TO ANY ECU or CONTROLLER!PWM isn't really mysterious. It's just a string of continuous pulses at a pre-set rate (frequency, measured in Hz), with the amount of time each pulse spends at 12 volts or 0 volts (duty cycle) determining how fast the fan or pump runs. The problem is...
gkgoodcheapparts.com gkgoodcheapparts.com
 
CarterKraft said:
Are cam/crank signals in agreement?
Like in sync, does it need a "learn".

Does it show injector duty cycle?

Alternator is OEM to the engine but not the ECM?
A PWM signal should be easy enough to create, id try to use the ECM to do it before anything else.

This do it?
gkgoodcheapparts.com

Widget Man PCA -- PWM Frequency and Polarity Corrector UPC 76757199923

MATCH ANY e-FAN TO ANY ECU or CONTROLLER!PWM isn't really mysterious. It's just a string of continuous pulses at a pre-set rate (frequency, measured in Hz), with the amount of time each pulse spends at 12 volts or 0 volts (duty cycle) determining how fast the fan or pump runs. The problem is...
gkgoodcheapparts.com gkgoodcheapparts.com
Click to expand...
The connect and cruise LS3 from GMPP didn’t control the alt for you. No idea why. Still no run. No cam signal. Checked wires, have 5v, good ground, ( checked voltage between ground and 5 V supply to get 5 V plus ohmed ground to the block). Signal wire has 1v. Pulled the plug at the harness and checked through each pin and also verified there were no bent or broken or missing pins. Used a test light to put a load through the wire and it lit it up just fine on all three wires. Tried a different E 67 with an identical tune and identical build list and still nothing. The injectors are showing no duty cycle because it cannot see the cam. I changed the cam sensor and now I’ve taken the timing cover off to verify everything was correct under there, it is. I’ve even tested at the end of the jumper harness that goes to the cam sensor.
While the timing cover was off I went ahead and swapped the cam to the Texas speed stage three and three bolt timing gear as well as double checked everything around the oil pump
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I did run up to Omaha yesterday morning early and got that other transmission so I can run the clutch and flywheel I already have laying around out of the donor vehicle that looks like it isn’t even broken in yet.
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Got the pilot bearing knocked in this morning and then just lots of other little **** that I am finding to work on. Tomorrow morning when a couple wiring places open I am going to order a new standalone harness for an E38. Just sell this E 67 because only a few people make an LS three harness for this naturally aspirated engine and they are a fair amount more money for similar quality. On this harness I will also make sure it controls the alternator so I don’t have to buy another unit or buy some Band-Aid controller, just let the computer do it

Should have it dropped back in tomorrow and get that transmission crossmember built so I can throw the exhaust together. We also cut a large square out of the firewall where the pedals go, the front to back spacing for the factory Camaro pedal hanger and booster was off by about 2 inches so it is getting a bump out
 
I guess I also cut the driveshaft in half and got the tubing size, very oddball size so I ended up with thicker DOM but it is only a 22 inch long piece. I will put it in the lathe and indicate it in true and then spin it in the truck with a piece of chalk near it and weld some weights on if it vibrates too much
 
Ordered a PSI harness and e38 this morning, going to have to buy some credits to drop a stock tune on the ecm, then hope it runs good enough to get it to a tuner that can dial in the cam etc. Tons of other stuff in the mail, but today is his last day of winter break. We are hanging pedals today, getting close to an idea of what will work exactly and drawing up the plate as soon as we walk back out there after lunch.
Flywheel is on, found an alignment tool at a buddy's shop, can't find any pressure plate bolts so need to get out and find or buy something so the trans can go in for good.
 
Well, after lots of negotiating with how the brakes and steering shaft are going to play in the same area, I think I have a solution I can live with (there isn't anything structural near where the column hangs, and it need a U joint after about 6" of outer tube) The tuner I'm going with spends a half a day between dyno and driveability stuff and is $650 with credits. I'm close enough that instead of trying to email tunes back and forth and whatnot, I'm just taking my buddy's HPT dongle and the ecu to him so he can build a base tune off my specs and drop it in the brain and I can bring it back and get it running and shake it down a bit, make sure it will survive some tuning without blowing a hose off or springing a leak etc. I really only want to take it there once and not turn into one of FastSpec's head shaking, "WTF was this guy thinking" moments. I have a very unprepared friend that has been to the dyno 3x and still isn't anywhere near where he needs to be, he has taken it up with a blower that won't keep a belt for even seconds, no IAT in the tube, oil and coolant leaks, Tons of other ****. Clamps blowing off of intercoolers. I don't want to be that guy
 
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